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Seems to me that counter/top has started running main deck firespout, rhox war monk, and even extra path to exile in some cases. I think landstill has also picked up more paths and it looks like a 1- of humility is now played.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacosnape
I'm failing to see how clique doesn't help against this. It strikes me that in any deck that runs bombs with CC >= 3, clique is going to help you out... Am I missing something here? Obvoiusly against zoo, which runs lots of 1cc pains, it's not going to help as much, but even there, they get rid of their best card for something worse...Quote:
Originally Posted by Phoenix Ignition
Wait, what? I wasn't arguing against clique at all in my response (although, now that you bring it up, I do not like it) .
Doesn't this just prove the above argument that clique is only good in already favorable matchups...?Quote:
Originally Posted by tivadar
Hmm, ok, wasn't thinking, fair enough. Sorry, my only point is that the advantage of clique over an army of merfolk is nonsusceptibility to mass removal and the ability to gain some card quality. But you're probably right, not the best of choices.
How do you feel about the Ichorid matchup?
It seems Ichorid players find the matchup easy, but when I played Merfolk I always found it to be favorable toward Merfolk, depending slightly on the build.
I think Ichorid is not a bad match-up, but you have to run some sideboard hate. Echoing Truth, Crypt, Relic, Cursecatcher, and counterspells help out a lot, but it's not a pushover match-up or anything. I don't reallytest enough to safely call a %, but to me, Storm is a harder combo deck to play Merfolk against.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbiddian
As far as all this "the sky is falling" talk, I think it's inevitable that Merfolk is going to go through occasional dry patches where none of the cards from the new sets help us. This is because it's a pretty linear strategy: the cards we want to see printed are good Merfs, super-cheap super-effective blue disruption (I'm not holding my breath on this particular one), splashable cards in other colors, or dope artifacts.
Right now, the recent cards which have arguably affected the format the most are (and I'm probably still gonna catch heat for saying this)... Wild Nacatl and Qasali Pridemage. They just printed two bomb ass Zoo creatures in the last few sets, so yes, now isn't the best time to play Merfolk. But it's far from being a dead archrtype, we just are currently in need of a boost.
Perhaps R&D will give Merfolk the real deal "Colbert bump" pretty soon instead of the crap they just printed for our tribe.
The matchup depends on your racing abilities, possibly mainboarded echoing truth, and the MVP is easily Cursecatcher.
He lets you blow up the bridges so you can just trade blows back and forth with them, but you have bigger creatures than their 2/2s (and hopefully more if you can take out their bridges before they go nuts).
Out of the board obviously relics, Jittes, Propagandas, Echoing truth, or whatever else you may be packing help a ton.
I've always found Dredge to be a pretty 50-50 match up maybe with a slight edge to 'folk. You have quite a bit of relevant cards. Countertspells, Cursecatcher, Stifle, STP(on Icorid/Bloodgasht) and Wasteland all help buy enough time to get some 3/3's out and take over.
None of this is particularly frightening except for Firespout, which is admittedly a huge pain in the ass. The worst part about the Firespout is that they barely have anything else Red, making boarding against it a pain.Quote:
Originally Posted by Phoenix Ignition
I know it's not a Merfolk and everything, but do y'all think Burrenton Forge-Tender might be a good sideboard option for the white splash? I've been trying to put together a list to test the white splash in the current meta, but it's sort of dumb-founding trying to put together a sideboard I feel like I could recommend.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacosnape
So I thought I'd ask if we can discuss the white splash just a little more. What white cards are good these days for our sideboard?
Basically, I figure 4 Path to Exile (4 StP in the main) is pretty much how I would start out building the white splash list these days, but I'm a little unsure of what else the sideboard should contain, and I don't want to lean too heavily on my splash and then be super-exposed to land denial strategies.
Maybe stifle need to come back to help against ee(landstill mu) and to mantain cb out of red source with stifle and erial (cb mu)?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacosnape
I can tell you that I'm an ichorid player, and I do not find this match up easy at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbiddian
Out of combos and prison deck, it's the deck that I do not want to face. I'd say it's like 55-45 for merfolk.
If you are on the play, you have daze and FOW to counter my discard outlet. You even have cursecatcher for other discard such as breakthrough and daze. You can waste our land, and this can make you win games if the player don't have another land.
Also, curscatcher can counter Therapy and dreadreturn and it can remove bridge. On top of that, you run jitte, which is one of the best card agaisnt ichorid. You can consistantly destroy 2 ichorids per turn and your own creatures, an online jitte is often a win.
You might even have STP for the ichorids, which can be destroying or stifle for the narco/ichorid trigger or cephalide coliseum.
However, if a discard outlet such as Tireless pass on first or 2nd turn you can be in deep trouble. Everything depends if you have your counters waste and jitte. It's nowhere from an easy match up for ichorid.
I decided I'd show where I'm at with the white splash list and ask for feedback instead of just trying to illicit a bunch of theorycrafting. Here's what I got so far:
White Splash Merfolk:
...So. Please give me some feedback, especially thoughts on the sideboard. What cards should go in those five open slots? Is Pithing Needle still good these days? Also, do people find that 4 fetches and 4 duals is generally enough to support a splash in Merfolk? I'm not sure if I might need one more fetch or something.Quote:
4x Cursecatcher, Silvergill Adept, Lord of Atlantis, Merrow Reejerey, Merfolk Sovereign
4x Aether Vial, Standstill, Daze, Force of Will, Swords to Plowshares
4x Mutavault, Wasteland, Flooded Strand, Tundra, Island
SIDEBOARD:
4 Path to Exile
3 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Tormod's Crypt
(5 open slots)
Where is absolute law? It is a house against goblin and firespout/pyroclasm.Quote:
Originally Posted by DukeDemonKn1ght
I absolutely agree on that apart from Jitte part. Jitte is slow and makes zombies if you still have bridges. It's not a dead card for merfolk obviously but it's not as annoying as cursecatcher, fow, daze, wasteland or even stifle can be. Also, you can destroy em with ancient grudges post-boarding.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guitar
Also, you're running 12 blue sources with the fetches. I thought the default was 13 for monoblue. With the splash, I might even do 14 (with 3 wasteland 3 mutavault).Quote:
Originally Posted by hyc8028
With monoblue, my mana base is always 12 Islands, 4 Mutavault, 4 Wasteland. But I suspected the splash might require a little more color support; that's why I was asking.Quote:
Originally Posted by tivadar
Personally I havent been that impressed with Absolute Law. Pro red is good (although path/swords is still there) but its not a dude so you have to get it before spout, botl w/e or its pointless. Also, pridemage is there in zoo. I think Nightmare had his a few pages back if you want heavy anti zoo.
On forge tender: seems like it could be ok, it beats and blocks all day vs gobs especially against piledriver.and its good vs ichorid as well.
Well, jitte can be equiped on turn 3. MErfolk are pack a lot of counters, so most of the time, by turn 3, I won't have a lot in graveyard except if I had a really good hand or if they had a bad hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by johanessen
Also, it kills their own creature to remove bridge and after this, you will have a lot of problems to combo out with a jitte online. If you dredge a bridge, it gets removed by them saccing their creatures, if you have a narco, they can remove a counter, and you need to have more then 2 ichorids per turn to do them damages with a jitte.
It's one of the worst card agaisnt us if you don't have a good board position when it gets equipped. Everytime I haven't had a big board when jitte came online, I lost.
But yes, it gets better game 2 and 3 because of grudge. Although, they still have wasteland, and counters to make you have difficulty playing it.
Anyway, that's my thought on jitte. I usually name it with therapy if I know that I won't combo out really soon.