Umezawa's Jitte helps against Tribal. Especially on the Best Little Flyer that Could.
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Umezawa's Jitte helps against Tribal. Especially on the Best Little Flyer that Could.
I once ran into a RUG deck with Grim Lavamancers in a Daily Event while on Merfolk.Quote:
Originally Posted by Koby
Turn 1 Grim >> Merfolk.
Off Topic- It was actually Dunkle... And if you're reading this Dunkle, I hope one day someone chucks a minty fresh Grim at your eyeball and you get a paper cut in the eyeball!
Which is ironic, cause didn't Dunkle win some big tourney with Merfolk lolQuote:
Originally Posted by menace13
Hi, everyone. I've been lurking for a while (since page 100, actually) and decided to post.
I've been playing Thresh since 2005. I got the deck back then because it was cheap (how time changes) and fun. I'm introducing myself just to make clear that I'm very used to the archetype, even though I'm not updated on metagaming and stuff, because I don't play very often.
I'm going to play on a champ this weekend and would appreciate some input from you guys.
It will be a blind meta (at least for me), and this is my current list:
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
4 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
-- 19 Lands
3 Vendilion Clique
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Delver of Secrets
-- 11 Creatures
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
-- 8 Cantrips
2 Forked Bolt
4 Lightning Bolt
-- 6 Burn
4 Force of Will
3 Daze
3 Spell Snare
2 Spell Pierce
4 Stifle
-- 16 Permission
Sideboard:
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Submerge
2 Rough/Tumble
1 Sulfur Elemental
1 Sulfuric Vortex
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Krosan Grip
1 Spell Pierce
2 Red Elemental Blast
A few comments:
1) Nope, I can't buy goyfs right now, maybe latter (it's expensive, ya know). It is worst with Ooze, since it is out-of-stock everywhere in my country.
2) I'm not willing to change to UR Delver only, since I miss even more cards from that archetype.
3) I'm more fond on the Stifle plan.
4) Cliques are not goyfs but are better against combo/control and worst against aggro (pretty obvious, though).
5) Sideboard is bad because I'm trying to hit a bit of everything, since I don't know the meta.
Well, I'm considering cutting Spell Snare entirely, because they have been sub-par lately. In its place I'm considering to add +1 Pierce, +1 Dismember and +1 Green Sun's Zenith. The Dismember is mostly to help against aggros, because the lack of goyfs. And since sometimes I miss having more threats, I believe a Zenith as a 5th mongoose will help. However, since I'm a lot more dependent on mongeese, I would like to know if Though Scour is really worth it, and if it is what should I cut to make space for it?
Thanks in advance.
Have you considered Snapcaster Mage over Vendilion Clique? Or a combination of the both of them?
I would go +1 Spell Pierce, -1 Spell Snare.
If you want to run Thought Scour, than +2 Thought Scour, -2 Spell Snare. Thought Scour is good vs. Control decks to grow Mongoose (UW mainly) and it is also good vs. decks like Sneak and Show and Reanimator to speed up the Mongoose beats.
I like your sideboard.
Dismember is good if you are expecting a lot of aggro (as you noted). I like GSZ if you had other green targets (Ooze/Goyf), but it loses some value if you can only pull Mongoose.
I really want to go to Belgium playing RUG in a week but .. I'm afraid of Goblins after the two last faceoffs I had against them.
Should I really have to pack like sweepers in my board? Feels stupid but 5 burn spells just was not enough when they have a cave out and wastelands got scarce.
Suggestions?
Yeah, I tried Snapcaster over Clique, but since I lack strong threats (i.e. goyf), I found that Clique's flying body was more relevant than the Mage card advantage.
About Thought Scour, that is exactly the point. I don't know if I want it or not. Way back in time, I used to play Portent over Mental Note, but things are different now, so I really don't know if the explosiveness of a threshed mongoose is better over more disruption.
I agree with you in the GSZ, the problem is that sometimes 11 threats is not enough. If I use the Thought Scour, 11 critters may be enough, since I'll have more cantrips.
Well, the sideboard was assembled to cover all angles, the backslash is that I'll not be able to truly hate any opposing deck. Glad you liked.
One problem with Thought Scour is that while it is a cantrip, it can put your threats into your graveyard. I run a single Scavenging Ooze and I've Thought Scoured it away before. In theory, Thought Scour should be drawing you more threats. But in reality and depending upon your luck, you may end up binning your threats.
@ useL and about Goblins - I've been having similar experiences. Facing creature decks without forests to allow the use of Submerge is hard. What do you think of adding some number of Blue Elemental Blasts to the board?
As far as the no goyf conversation, I would embrace a high count of thought scour and get back to werebear. I prefer 4 goyf main and personally dislike thought scour but it seems completely playable if I couldn't borrow goyfs. Also liking cursed totem sideboard.
4 Werebear
4 Geese
4 Delver
Based on laws of randomization, this is not a factor to consider. I personally think Thought Scour is not as useful as it was, and in this metagame the turbo-Mongoose plan isn't as gamebreaking as it used to be. If you are paranoid, though, hold on to it to pair with a cantrip or to pitch it to Force of Will.Quote:
Originally Posted by Water_Wizard
Thoughtscour reads "Mill 3. Do Nothing."
Well, it's a little better than that, as it accelerates threshold for Mongoose and can also pump Goyf. It's best played following a Brainstorm. Put the two cards you don't need on top and then mill them with Thought Scour. Likewise, if you see one good card and two bad cards off a Ponder, you can draw the good one and Thought Scour away the other two. You can also target your opponet with the mill ability in certain situations (after an opponent drew a card with Top, if you suspect that they're trying to set up a Miracle card, or after Enlightened Tutor). But yeah, more often than not, you will end up milling two random cards. I think that Thought Scour is borderline-playable for this deck, but I've been playing two and like them well enough.
I had similar experience but now my list runs 4 lightning bolt and 3 fire/ice as well as one rough/tumble in the board. I haven't loss to elves, goblins, or merfolk in a while. This deck obviously struggles with creature hordes and I do find sweepers necessary.Quote:
Originally Posted by useL
Thought you guys might be interested in this, it is a primer by teammate and PT Champion Alexander Hayne:
http://manadeprived.com/2012/07/cana...-a-primer.html
Presuming a fairly stock list your maindeck contains 8 1-drops to stop a 1st turn Lackey as well as 4-6 1cmc burn spells. Aether Vial should be countered. If you can't, try to stifle the first one or even two activations. If you're able to counter Vial, safe your Stifles (should you pack them) for creature triggers, mainly Ringleader and Gang-Bang Commander.Quote:
Originally Posted by useL
I used to play Pyroclasm in old Canadian. Nowadays Rough // Tumble should seariously be considered (superior due to not killing your insects) when expecting some numbers of Goblins at a bigger event. Additionally, it's one of your best weapons against Elves and also can also be brought in vs. Merfolk, where you should try to Bolt / REB their lords so that it can kill their team. Speaking of this, I even used to board Clasm against Dredge. As there are also applications against Maverick, Rough // Tumble is definitely not the worst card for a GP Sideboard.
Nice little primer. I look forward to trying a few things he mentioned! Thanks for sharing :)Quote:
Originally Posted by goobafish
The primer suggests Tumble Magnet.
Genius.
@Woe: Well, I don't think goyf/ooze can be replaced. If you are not using it (like myself), I believe it is better to change the role of the replacement. Theses slots are for big bodies and Werebear is bad at it (Quirion Dryad too), I don't recall any 2cc creature able to fill this role. That's why I'm using Cliques, the big problem is the 3cc mana cost, but they are still playable. To be honest, I think I should be playing something else, since I don't own goyf. But that's not possible due to time and money constraints, so I'll stick to use a sub-optimal list with Cliques.
@useL: Two sweepers on the SB, should do it. If you use Stifles, they are nice too, being able to counter Ringleader drawing, Matron tutoring, Piledriver pumping, Vial drops, Siege-Gang tokes etc. (Oh, just realised now that I mostly repeated what Blitzbold said, sorry)
@goobafish: Thanks for the link, really nice primer.
@everyone: I'm considering upping my threat count from 11 to 12. The main candidates were: GSZ (as 5th goose), Phyrexian Dreadnought (mini combo with stifle) or Terravore (bigger than opposing Knights if you have at least 3 lands on graveyard). However, I'll be using a Phyrexian Metamorph, since I already own it and it is very versatile, giving an out to equipments, legends and big creatures. I'll tell you latter how it went.
What are your current threats? You've got 4 delvers, 4 goose, and what else? If you've got a friendly group you can playtest with Goyf proxies, you'll probably be convinced of their necessity :) otherwise, you're right - you'll have to stick to sub-optimal stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by wbw
I would not use Dreadnaught. It was a previous win condition, but now it's just bad IMO. It takes 2 cards to make one fatty, granted - It's really big, but it dies to LOTS of stuff - namely Swords to Plowshares.
Currently, I'm using 4 delvers, 4 goose and 3 Cliques. And I'll have to stick with that, because the champ is tomorrow. Well, I'm not planning winning anyway, I just don't want to be a sitting duck and have some fun.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pherion