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Yeah, that was just an outright mistake and me not double counting. What happened was I was going to cut the Mindcensor, but it ended up in the deck anyway it seems. I never run 61, so it certainly wasn't an actual choice.Quote:
Originally Posted by from Cairo
I might go for the Canonist over the Fiend Hunter then, I think I like that change and bring the Hunter to sideboard.
How would D&T perform in the current MODO meta? Basically, you have:
Lots of
- S&T decks (both Sneak & Show and Omnitell variants)
- Storm combo
- Elves
- Miracles
- BUG Shardless
and to a lesser extent:
- Punishing Jund
- Black Maverick
- Painter
- Dredge
- RUG
I just wish a playset of Ports wasn't 400 bucks online... :rolleyes:
Here, Barook. You can decide for yourself. From best matchup to worst of those you presented:Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
(
RUG
BUG Shardless
Miracles
)
; These are very good. They are all grinding with plenty of opportunities for a good player to force the opponent into a losing series of plays/trades sufficient to win well above 50%.
(
Sneak Show and Tell
Dredge
Storm
)
;These are all pretty good. They require just a few tight plays to steal games. The specific build of both sides plays a major role, as this deck has excellent hate available and common in most builds, while the opponents have excellent hate also available, but far less frequent. D&T's primary game plan is still very effective here, and I am personally well above 50% for these matchups also. But I happen to pack more anti-combo hate than most.
(
Black Maverick
Omnitell
Painter
)
;I have a spotty record against all of these. I never seem to have enough removal/hate for Painter decks, but because of the nature of D&T, I squeeze out some games anyway. Omnitell demands that you have the right cards in hand while the rest of them do next to nothing sorta like Solidarity back in the day. If you have them, you will probably win even if you don't play especially well. If you don't, you simply lose. Black Maverick is a little better than the others, but it often comes down to who can get the equipment working first. That is true for Stoneblade decks too, but D&T is much better than those at attaining that. Not so with Black Mav. I clump these together because they all put D&T slightly out of its comfort zone. It's tools are not as effective as they are against most decks, but it can still follow it's primary game plan.
(
Elves
Punishing Jund
)
;These guys have D&T's number. I would not want to play D&T in an environment dominated by either of these.
Have you tried Imposing Sovereign for Elves? I have not, as not many people play Elves in my meta. I am not sure if it does enough, but it seems like it could slow them down some, but I am not sure that's really enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn
Picked up my last Mangara needed to complete my deck today. :)
Deck is conpletely finished now. Now onto taxing people!
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Flickerwisp
4 Mother of Runes
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Mirran Crusader
2 Mangara of Corondor
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 AEther Vial
1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte
10 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Rishadan Port
1 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
3 Karakas
1 Fiend Hunter
SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 Oblivion Ring
SB: 2 Sunlance
SB: 2 Spellskite
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 3 Mindbreak Trap
SB: 1 Gut Shot
SB: 2 Rest in Peace
Yo guys, what do you tihnk about my list? I'm kinda concerned about my side :P
I don't know what field you are preping for, but for average metas I don't feel MBT is needed. Otherwise your SB is also fairly close to the accepted "optimal" configuration.Quote:
Originally Posted by emt37
Only differences one usually sees are:
-3 MBT
-1 Sunlance
-1 Spellskite
+2 Wilt-Leaf Liege
+1 Leonin Relic-Warder
+1 GY hate
+1 Flex (Jitte, SoX&Y, Cataclysm)
Quote:
Originally Posted by from Cairo
Yeah it's kinda meta-dependent, Italy is filled with ANT, Elves, Miracle and BUG decks, I was more concerned about the quantity of these sideboard cards.
Also yeah, I want to put somewhere 2 Wilt-Leaf: Golgari Charm is such a bitch and Honor of the Pure is too suscettible to Decay. I really don't know what to think about it, I guess the only thing I can do is try to put 2 honor of the pure maindeck.
Gotta take out something.
Would you play RiP main? The card is so amazing nowadays, rend DRS/Goyf/Ooze useless, slow down storm combo, deactivate lingering souls, mongooses, snapcaster etc...
DnT on stream at SCG vs UWR Delver. Just threw game one by not "vialing" in a batterskull in response to Delvers revealing Stifle off the top. So infuriating, especially cause I saw it coming from a mile away... "drop the batterskull on your turn while he's tapped out, drop it on your turn... damn! Ok you've seen the stifle now, vial it in before he draws it!"... Sigh
Yep, just saw that misplay go down. heartwreching.. prob cost him game 1
Not probably, 100% certainly. The opponent was also low on life and one or two batterskull swings would have been insormuntable.
With Sneak 'n Show back on top and Reanimator placing well lately, I wonder if it's time to go back to 4 Karakases, in light of the new legend rule...
Aside from the financial cost of a fourth Karakas, which is obviously substantial, I never agreed with the reasoning behind cutting one. Use four. It is a major advantage against lots of unfair decks and makes your Mangaras better.
I only got to play a single game vs UW Miracles the other day, but it went pretty miserably for me. I ended up under a Counterbalance, although I locked out SDT with a Revoker, I ended up having all my creatures either swept by Terminus or hit by Swords. Jace and thena few turns later, an Entreat, EOT, ended the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn
I did miss Vial most of the game, but I am curious your approach to this matchup. I felt I could hold him down on mana, but they only run 4 duals and a ton of basics. Even having two Ports most of the game had almost no impact. Granted I have little experience with this deck, but I am unsure how to really beat that deck reliably.
Hope this helps.Quote:
(Matchup analysis by Lormador, Updated 8/27/13)
The three (four) most important interactions in this matchup (pre-board) are the following.
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben with Karakas behind her.
Equipment on the board.
Active Aether Vial.
Aven Mindcensor.
In addition, it's very good to keep a 'surprise' in reserve that can deal with a 4/4 Angel token and get past it for a few points of damage, such as a Fiend Hunter, or of course Flickerwisp out of an Aether Vial.
The way Miracles (and I'm usually working with the RIP-Helm variant) is going to win the game is either via that combo, Jace ultimate, or Angel tokens. The direst threat is actually the Angel tokens. Jace usually just brainstorms as much as possible until he's dealt with, and the combo depends on several moving parts, all of which are subject to Thalia taxation, being Revokered, and remaining in play through Flickerwisp. It's not impossible to pull off and is a threat to be aware of, but mostly what one has to deal with is Angel tokens. Even three of them is a problem, most of the time, given that one suffers a series of Terminus spells beforehand.
I'd put my tips against Miracles into this list.
Above all, don't overextend into a Terminus. If at any time Terminus goes down and you don't have another threat, you're lost.
Most of the time, you should aim Port at white mana. Be mindful of priority in various stages of the game against Top.
Try hard to avoid having to hardcast Batterskull. The opponent will try to force this so the equipment can be countered.
Against an active Top with a Vial, fake the tip a few times to absorb an opponent's mana. Once the Vial resolves, if a Revoker comes out there's no more opportunity to do so in response.
Their manabase is fetchland-heavy, and they may also bring Enlightened Tutor. Aven Mindcensor is a very key player.
[10/4/12 - I have found this matchup much better than 50/50 preboard and at least 50/50 postboard. You do not need or want to commit all your threats to the board in case of Terminus. Revoker on Divining Top with Mother of Runes protection is pretty darn strong. That deck wilts in the face of Thalia mixed with any other mana denial. And Mangara lock is at its best here. Just keep an eye on how many threats you are committing. If you lose two creatures to a Terminus two times in game one, you are probably still in good shape. - Finn]
Yes, this is a blatant attempt for me to improve my game against this deck... But I'm wondering what percentage of Death and Taxes players run Mindbreak Trap in the SB?
Better than half I think. Usually as a 2-of (and not a "2-off", because that phrase makes no fucking sense). Trap is actually under debate at the moment, but with the Balistrade Spy deck adding yet another flimsy turn 1 win, it is gaining acceptance.
Hmmm... That's interesting, I didn't see a single one the last 15 pages.Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn
The best source of info and discussion for this deck is actually the Salvation page. It is too much work for me to keep echoing ideas across the two. There's a link in the OP for this thread.
My working place internet's policy blocks MTGS :( but it lets me post here, so here we go.
Was trying to find some good answers to TNN. I guess lots of people will try it at the BoM and Currently D&T can't do anything against it except racing.
Obviously Serra avenger seems better than Mirran crusader against it because it flies over it.
What about sideboard cards that could get rid of it and be played?
i was thinking about "Marrow shards" since it can be free. What do you think about it?
any other idea?