[Deck] Dredge

Well, Stax is definitely an uphill matchup. If he doesn't have a Trinisphere, reanimating Woodfall Primus or Angel of Despair will do the job on his Ghostly prison. If he has a trinisphere and a Prison, you're probably in trouble. Unless you can go completely broken T1 with LED, you can try saving one to punch through his defense with a giant Grave-Troll or cast a key flashback spell.

Postboard, the matchup is worse because now they have GY hate. My advice is to board in your counter-hate, whatever it might be, and pray.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FloSun

Hi!
This is my first post. I'm from germany.
I've played LED-Ichorid for a while with the list from Parcher's Primer. I did well most of the time, but there is one player who's playing MONO W Armageddon stax. He plays 3-4 Magus of the Tabernacle, 3-4 ghostly prison, 3-4 chalice of the void and 3-4 trinisphere in his maindeck +3-4 orb of dreams in his sideboard.
Now my question: How can I fight this deck with that my list? I've only won, if i was on the play and had two discarder first turn, or he was holding the wrong lock-pieces. And then, if he topdecked ghostly prison, i couldn't win anymore, because of wasteland, smokestack or armageddon.
Is there any way to beat this deck before and after sideboarding?

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Woodfall Primus could probably get you out of a few tricky situations. Against Chalice you have to Draw-Discard-Dredge.

I imagine chain of vapor and wispmare being important in this matchup, if you are on the play, i assume you try to hit the problem cards with therapy or unmask and like previously stated... pray

hi guys, im new to playing ichorid. let's say you're playing g2 against counterbalance, and you're on the play with a hand of land, pimp, breakthrough, LED, pithing needle, and dredgers. you know he most likely boarded in rebs, crypts and/or relics. what's your play?

Play LED to bait FoW. Then play Land -> Putrid Imp. Unless they counter both or play Crypt/Relic, you should be able to go insane next turn with Breakthrough. If they do play Crypt or Relic, play Needle and try to win the next turn.

This is seriously the best hand you can hope to have against them. They need double countermagic or countermagic + Crypt/Relic to have any chance of beating you. The worst that happens to you is that they FoW LED, StP Imp, and then play Tormod's Crypt. That's pretty unlikely.

Somebody tried Mindslicer?

Worse than Sadistic Hypnotist.

Ok, I played 2 tourneys (the 1st on MWS, the 2nd Reallife)

// Lands
3 [OD] Cephalid Coliseum
3 [AN] City of Brass
4 [JGC] Gemstone Mine
1 [VI] Undiscovered Paradise*

// Creatures
4 [DDC] Stinkweed Imp
4 [TO] Putrid Imp
1 [RAV] Flame-Kin Zealot
1 [FD] Eternal Witness
4 [FUT] Narcomoeba
4 [TO] Ichorid
4 [RAV] Golgari Grave-Troll
3 [RAV] Golgari Thug

// Spells
4 [FUT] Bridge from Below
4 [TO] Breakthrough
4 [MI] Lion's Eye Diamond
4 [FNM] Cabal Therapy
2 [TSP] Dread Return
2 [FNM] Deep Analysis
3 [MM] Unmask
1 [ON] Chain of Vapor*

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [MM] Unmask
SB: 3 [ON] Chain of Vapor
SB: 4 [WL] Firestorm
SB: 1 [10E] Ancestor's Chosen
SB: 1 [LRW] Wispmare
SB: 1 [JU] Ray of Revelation
SB: 4 [TSP] Greater Gargadon*

(*all those cards where testcards, and I’m not happy with all of them, the list I play atm is on the bottom)



Note: the SBings of G3 are seen from the original deck configuration, not from G2.

Round 1: Trollwarrior_666 playing GB Control

Hmm, unfortunately I closed MWS before I started to write this, so it’s without game-log.

G1: He wins the die-roll and begins. We both keep our opening seven. My hand was Land + PImp + Some Dredgers + x uninteresting stuff I think. I keep, because If he plays blue I can DDD (draw-discard-dredge) and otherwise I can play the PImp. He opens with Swamp -> go. I draw, play a land, cast the PImp and say go. He plays his second swamp and plays Hymn. My hand is 4x Dredge + Moeba + Bridge ore something, so the Hymn wont hurt me anyway. MWS chooses I’ve to discard a Troll and a SImp. Nice! Then it’s my turn. I dredge, see a Cabal Therapy and a Bridge, discard all my dredgers and the Bridge to my PImp and then flashback the Therapy on the PImp, to get tokens. I don’t know what to name so I choose Tombstalker at random. I see Forest + Deed + Garruk + Chainer’s Edict + ... Next turn he plays his deed ofcourse. Then I dredge + kick for some turns while he is building op. Unfortunately, I can’t find enough Ichorid’s/Bridges and no Dread Return + FKZ/Witness to finish this game. Then, when I have 10 tokens and he is below 10, he plays Garruk, untaps and plays Maelstrom Pulse. In the next turns I kick again with the returning Ichorid’s + Tokens and he is at 1 when he cracks his 2nd deed (he played on his turn) in response to my attack. In his turn, he has to draw something good, because the 1 tokens he gets from his Garruck won’t save his ass against my 2 Ichorid’s. He draws, tapt for 5, and plays Haunting Echoes. WTH, Noo! The only cards remaining in my deck are 2 Cabal Therapy, 2 Putrid Imp, Eternal Witness, 3 Golgari Thug + something else. I curse the time I dredged my single Undiscovered Paradise. Because when the Paradise had survived and was still in my library, I could’ve played Moeba (I hand 1 moeba in hand, and still 1 land in play, FLY FTW!!) and the 3 Thugs (to regain the Moeba when the oppo would have killed it. But this wasn’t the facy, and I had 2 Imp’s in the 8 cards that could save my ass. After 5 turns I drew my 1st PImp and I was looking against a board with Garruk, Deed, and some Beasts. There was also 1 Chainer’s Edict in his grave (I Therapy’ed it before), so the PImp’s came to late and we started game 2.

SB: - 3 LED, -2 DA (I don’t need speed here)
+3 Chain, + 1 Unmask, +1Wispmare (protection against the random hate permanents control can play (I didn’t expected Leyline here, but if he had it, I was prepared 8)), and Unmask because I’m on the play).

G2: I start. He mulls to 6. I keep my opening 7, containing 1 Gemstone Mine, 1 Cephalid Coliseum, 2 Ichorid, 1 GGT, 1 Cabal Therapy and 1 Unmask. Nice hand for G2 on the play against most decks! I start, he doesn’t reveal a Leyline (yay!) and I play Unmask (remove Ichorid 1), seeing 1 Damnation, 1 Deed, 1 Extirpate and 3 Lands. Of course, I remove his Pate so I can go Land -> Therapy myself -> GGT. Next turn I dredge, see new dredgers, play the Coliseum and dredge even more. I have 2 Moeba in play and 2 Ichorid, 2 Bridge, Dread Return, GGT and Therapy in grave. I flashback 1 Therapy on his Dead, gaining me 2 tokens, and sac them immediately together with the 2nd Moeba to Dread Return, giving me 2 tokens and a 10/10 GGT. I pass, he draws and he scoops.

SB: -3 LED, -2 DA,
+3 Chain, +1 Wispmare, +1 Firestorm (instead of the Unmask I boarded G2, because on the draw it looses his power, and because he is on the play, I have a bigger change of seeing that H Echoes, and 1 Firestorm is a good try against it).

G3: He starts, mulls to 5 or 6 agains. I keep my opening 7 again (don’t know what exactly contained, land + Coliseum + PImp + GGT + 3 others). He starts with a land. I start with a land + PImp. He plays waste and wasted my land (damn, can’t activate Coliseum next turn). I discard GGT and dredge it, then I play Coliseum (damn, again) and pass. He plays his second land and says go. I dredge on my turn and get 2 Moeba. Sac 1 to Therapy for deed (I hit and see 1 Garruk, 1 M. Pulse and no lands), gaining 2 tokens of my 2 Bridges. On his turn he used Edict (yay, 2 more tokens!) and passed. Wow, control with no 3th land drop. I win.

1-0-0 (2-1)

Round 2: Den_Rudy playing Aluren

G1: He wins the die roll. I keep the following hand:
Unmask, PImp, 2 Ichorid, GGT, Moeba, LED.
Good hand on the draw against an unknown deck.
I draw 1 Deep Analysis.
I win.

Note: I never played against Aluren before with Ichorid, so I really didn’t know what was good to SB..

SB: -3 LED, -1 DA, -3 Unmask
+3 Chain, +3Firestorm, +1Wispmare

G2: He starts again.
My opening 8 (I don’t know what I drew turn 1)
1 Gemstone Mine, 1 PImp, 1 Ichorid, 1 Golgari Thug, 1 SImp, 1 Coliseum

Turn 1: Gemstone Mine -> PImp -> GO
He played an Wall of Blossoms during his turn. EOT I discard Ichorid an Thug
Turn 2: Upkeep, remove Thug to return the Ichorid. Discard SImp to PImp (LOL)
Dredge the SImp (into GGT).
Mainphase: Play Coliseum -> Activate -> Dredge more.
But I didn’t dredge good enough (not enough Bridges and DR’s), so I’m very slow. And the turn before I could kill him he topdecked a Relic! (I Therapy’ed him the turn before so it was definitely a topdeck). So all my Ichorids and Bridges leave the grave, and I’m left with 2 Moeba’s, 2 Zombie Tokens and 1 PImp. I kick him for some turns (while he blocks my Zombies with a Dream Stalker and a Wall of Blossoms) and then he combos (I try to stop it with my 2 topdecked Chain of Vapors, but it has no effect). The 2nd game in 5 games where a topdeck kills me.. Pff.


SB: -4 LED, -2 DA, -1 Ichorid
+2 Chain, +3 Firestorm, +1 Unmask, +1 Wispmare (don’t know if this was good..)

G3:
I start.
2x Mull. Keep a bad hand, But with a dredger, a land and a Wispmare (so topdeckskills FTW!).
On my 3rd turn, I draw my 2nd land, and the next turn a Breakthough. I cast for x=1 and draw Dredgers+Firestorm+Breakthrough. I keep the Breakthrough, and Breakthrough again on turn 5. In the meanwhile, he is stuck with only 2 lands, and later also 1 Wall of Roots (even after playing Brainstorm + Wall of Blossoms). On turn 6 I attack with 1 13/13 GGT (I had 3 bridges, sacced a Moeba for Therapy on him (naming Relic and missing), gaining me 3 tokens and sac them to DR for a 13/13 GGT) and 2 Ichorids. That’s for 19 lifes. I don’t have a therapy and pass. On his turn, he topdecks his land and has the cards to combo out. Damn, another game where a topdeck costed me the game.. Right know all my 3 games lost (out of 6) are because of topdecks at my oppo.. Unlucky me..

But wait! At the moment, when I’m writing this report, I see Rudy fetched on turn 1, but didn’t payed one life! This means I could have wonn. But it’s to late, I already reported the result. Damn, I’m very very unlucky! I hope the luck will come this tourney, cause I will need it with my deck.

1-1-0 (3-3)

Round 3: Roelke playing ?

During the whole match, I was writing down stuff on a paper so I could use it for this report, but I lost the papers.. I think someone broke in and stole them.

I won 2-1

2-1-0 (5-4)

Round 4: Lord Enumy playing ?

He didn’t had the time to play, so he gave me the win.

3-1-0 (7-5) (I think the win was count as 2-1 for me)


Round 5: Benie Bederios playing Wildfire 8)

G1. He wins the die roll and starts with City of Traitors -> Gruul Signet. I’m happy, because I kept a discard-heavy hand (Gemstone mine, PImp, Unmask, Cabal Therapy, Ichorid, Stinkweed Imp, Lion’s Eye Diamond).

I play the land and cast Unmask, removing Ichorid. I see 2xThran Dynamo, Devastation, Gilded Lotus, Sundering Titan. This game goes perfect for me. I pick the Lotus and Therapy him for Dynamo. I have plenty of time =).

He: Draw, Pass.
I: Play PImp, Pass
He: Draw, Pass.
In my upkeep, I discard my SImp and dredge the next stuff; DA (LED on the table =)), SImp, Moeba, Bridge, Breakthough, Gemstone Mine. The game is still going perfect! I play the DA. Dredge. Play my just drawed Unmask, removing a just dredged SImp, see some at-the-moment-not-relevant stuff (ofcourse), choose on of his cards and rip the rest of his hand with Therapy’s on the 2 Moeba’s I dredged. I get 4 zombie tokens. I attack with PImp and pass. On his turn he plays a topdecked Wish into an Pyroclasm, but he cant cast the Clasm because he still only has his land + Signet. Pass.

I still have no Ichorids, no Witness or FKZ, and have just wasted all my Therapy’s on his “not-relevant-atm” stuff to get me tokens, I hadn’t expected the Pyroclasm.

On my turn I dredge, still no Therapys’s. So I kick for 10 and Dread Return and Troll, since he wont be killed by the Pyroclasm.

On his turn, he plays the Pyroclasm and on my turn I win.

SB: - 3 Unmask
+ 3 Chain of Vapor

G2. I Mulligan, he doesnt.

I keep a hand with 2 PImp, 1 SImp, 2 Gemstone Mine, 1 Dread Return and 1 Bridge.

He starts with a Sanstone Needle
I draw an Ichorid and play me first PImp.

On his turn he plays a Relic of Progenitus.

In my upkeep I discard my SImp and he taps his Relic targeting me. I am dumb and not paying attention. So I just remove the SImp, not responding to the Relic activation with discarding my Dread Return so I could just easily win (sounds like a good playstyle to me, maybe I can test it in the next round). I just play my second Mine, play my second PImp and attack with my first. On his turn he plays a Volcanic Fallout. I respond with discarding my bridge, he responds by tapping his Relic and I respond with discarding my Dread Return. I ponder and remove the Dread Return. The Fallout resolves and I look at my hand, where an angry Ichorid looks back at me. We both look to the graveyard, his potential home, and see those Bridge and PImp’s. It should have been a good home for my little Ichi (and if he cracked his Relic it was nice to, because then I didn’t had to worry about it anymore)..
But I have 4 tokens, it’s a begin to victory (a really good topdeck will help better).
I topdeck a Cabal Therapy and play it on my own Ichorid. He removes my grave immediately.
I kick with 2 Zombies
He draws and passes
I draw, kick with 2 zombies and pass
He draws and passes
I draw, kick with 2 zombies and pass
He draws and passes
I draw, kick with 2 zombies and pass
..
I win

4-1-0 (9-5)

Last round:

Merrin playing Countertop

We draw.

4-1-1 (10-6)

With 13 point, I end up 4th.

Top 8

MaartenK playing GoyfSligh.

G1. He starts. We both keep our 7 cards (my hand after my first draw (I don’t know what my opening 7 was): 2x LED, 2x DA, Breakthrough, Chain of Vapor, SImp, Unmask.)
He fetches for a Taiga and drops his Figure.
I draw and play 2x LED. Sac 1 for UUU. Flashback my DA. Dredge SImp into good stuff. Dredge more, and win.

SB: - 3 LED, -1 DA, -3 Unmask, -1 Chain, -1FKZ
+ 4 Greater Gargadon, +4 Firestorm, +1 Chosen

G2: He mulls, I keep my 7 (PImp, Dread Return, Breakthrough, GG (Greater Gargadon), Gemstone Mine, Witness, GGT). He drops his Mountain and Tormod’s Crypt. I go Mine -> GG. He plays a Chain Lightning and passes. GG goes to 9 counters and I draw something irrelevant. I tap my mine for a PImp. On his turn, he burns my PImp. I respond with discarding my GGT, but I forget to sac my PImp to GG ;\ (because I never play GG anymore (I think he is very bad (I will explain at the bottem), and play Tireless Tribe in his play atm)). He sacs his Crypt to remove my Dredger and PImp, and drops his second Crypt (damn, and he only plays 3 ;s…). On my turn, the only think what happens, is that GG loses a counter (8). I pass, take damage from an Magma Jet, and get the turn back. Again, I can do nothing else as changing the note of GG to 7. He plays Marauders on his turn. I draw an Undiscovered Paradise (after GG goes to 6) and play it. I cast Moeba and passes. He plays Grim Lavamancer and attacks with his Marauders. I block with my Moeba and sac it to GG (5). He gives the turn to me. Paradise goes back to my hand and GG goes to 4. Now I play my Paradise again and I pass the turn. Marauders dies and I take 1 damage (I go to 13). He plays his stupid Goyf, who is 5/6, and attacks with Lavamancer. On my turn, GG loses a counter, going to 3, and I play an topdecked PImp. On his turn, he burns my PImp with his Lavamancer (GG -> 2) and attacks with Goyf (I go to 7 lifes). He plays another Marauders (6 life) and passes the turn. On my upkeep, GG goes to only 1 counter. I play my topdecked Mine and tap it (Paradise is in my hand) for a Breakthrough with x=0. I draw 4 cards and discard Eternal Witness, Breakthrough, Dread Return, Narcomoeba, Cabal Therapy, Undiscovered, City of Brass, Ichorid, Ichorid and Chosen. He activated his second Crypt (Goyf becomes 4/5). I pass. When he is going to his attack, I sac mine to GG. It comes into play. He taps a Mounain for Bolt, and I can’t survive this attack anymore..

SB: I change my SB’ing, but MWS sucks and wont change my deck, so I play with the same SB’ings as G2 (so no Unmasks). I see this to late to change it..

G3. This time I mull and he doesn’t. I keep GGT, Mine, Pimp, 2 Firestorm, Breakthrough. Nice hand. I start with Mine -> PImp. He starts with Mountain -> Lavamancer, and again a **** Crypt. In my upkeep I discard my GGT and hope he wont use his Crypt. He does use it. I go to my attack and tap my PImp. I pass the turn (I don’t play Breakthrough, because I think I can stall with 2x Firestorms long enough, to go broken with Breakthrough when there are Dredgers in my grave). He burns my PImp with an Jet on his turn. Then he attacks with his Lavamancer and I use my Firestorm, discarding an Therapy, to kill it. He passes. I draw an Gemstone Mine, cast it, and use Breakthrough for x=1 (cause I also just drawed a Breakthrough, so I could use that one as draw spell when I found some dredgers). I don’t find an Dredger, and discard DA, Moeba, Firestorm, GG, Breakthrough. I keep another Breakthrough in my hand.
He casts a Marauders and a Fanatic on his turn, and passes. I draw (no dredger) and play Breakthrough (x=0, because the other mine had 0 counters last turn). I draw 4. I discard Moeba, Breakthrough, Coliseum, Firestorm and Bridge. No dredgers. His turn, attack with Fanatic and Marauders, pass. I go draw (no dredger) -> go. EOT, he burns me with Magma Jet. 2 turns later he wins. Stupid random crapping Ichorid..

4-2-1 (11-8)

So I end up 5th-8th.


I didn’t liked the testcards;
1 Chain of Vapor: It’s so bad in your starting hand, and you almost never need it G1, to flashback with Witness. To random.
1 Paradise: Returning a land just sucks sometimes, more then losing a life.
4 GG in the sb: I really don’t see how this card is good against Crypt/Relic. Ok, you get a fat-gut. But after many turns, and he doesn’t have evasion. 1 Goyf + other creature can block him.. STP kills him. FOW counters him. Ofcourse, you have Therapy against those cards, but against a Crypt/Relic, you wont have use of Therapy that much.. So GG is at his best when your oppo doesn’t have Crypt/Relic (Moeba/Thug-tricks also wont work that good with an Crypt/Relic against you). I want a hate cards, that doesn’t lose a part of his strength when the card it is used to hate against, is played. Or do I see it wrong and play GG wrong? I play Tireless Tribe instead of GG now. I also made some other differences. I now play this list:

// Lands
4 [OD] Cephalid Coliseum
4 [JGC] Gemstone Mine
4 [AN] City of Brass

// Creatures
4 [TO] Ichorid
4 [RAV] Golgari Grave-Troll
3 [RAV] Golgari Thug
4 [DDC] Stinkweed Imp
4 [FUT] Narcomoeba
4 [TO] Putrid Imp
1 [RAV] Flame-Kin Zealot
1 [FD] Eternal Witness

// Spells
4 [TO] Breakthrough
2 [FNM] Deep Analysis
2 [TSP] Dread Return
4 [FNM] Cabal Therapy
4 [MI] Lion's Eye Diamond
4 [FUT] Bridge from Below
3 [MM] Unmask

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [MM] Unmask
SB: 1 [10E] Ancestor's Chosen
SB: 1 [LRW] Wispmare
SB: 3 [ON] Chain of Vapor
SB: 4 [WL] Firestorm
SB: 3 [OD] Tireless Tribe
SB: 2 [TSP] Ancient Grudge

I’m very happy with it.

I played 2 tourney’s with this list. A while ago I posted something about the 1st tourney (page 14) and here I will post something about the 2nd tourney.

My MU’s where:

Countertop Japanese Style UGWr: 1-2. (I lose G1 (don’t know how exactly, Firesprout did something I remember), win G2, after an Relic/Crypt (don’t know which of the 2), and lose G3, because I have 2 Ichorids in my deck remaining at some point, and I really needed them (3 Bridges where removed by the Relic/Crypt). I dredge, and dredge, and dredge even more. But I didn’t found them. When I have 2 cards remaining in my library, he attacks me for lethal. I flip my library and see 2 Ichorids smiling at me. Bitches!)

Domain Zoo: 2-1 (G1 I win, G2 Crypt kills me, G3 he doenst)

Merfolk: 2-0 (G1: I win turn 2. G2: I keep a hand with 2 Firestorms, a Therapy, a land, Breakthrough, a moeba and a dredger. I Therapy (naming Cursecather, he started with his Vial), seeing 1 E Truth. Turn 2, I cast moeba and Flashback Therapy naming E Truth. I see 2 E Truths. The next turns I burns the field with my Firestorms and I win.

Rock: 1-2 (G1 I win. G2/G3 look like each other. He gets many Deeds, Crypts, Relics and Engineered Plagues. To much for me. G2 he even started with an Seize. G3, he wins in his last turn of the extra time x( ).

Naya Zoo/Goyf Sligh: 2-0 (I just go broken both games)

Loam meets Enchantress (moat, confinement, sterling grove). (G1, he gets his Confinement the turn before I can win, so he wins. G2 he drops his Moat. I flashback Witness into Chain of Vapor and just draw till I topdeck my land (each turn I get more zombies out of Ichorids). G3, he starts with Chalice at 1 and 0. I just EOT discard. The next 2 turns I play lands and Breakthrough for x=1 (cmc=2). I win)

So I ended 4-2. That’s good for the 10th place. I am happy about my deck and my skills, the 2 games lost where because of 2 opponents who just drew better then me (and Ichorids sticking at the table).. Thats Magic.

Is there much do discuss about Sphinx? It's pretty easy, is it not? If you run Sage, Sphinx is better. But would anyone not running Sage now, run Sphinx? Instead of FKZ or Witness?

Well, that was cute. I've cleaned up all of that derailing, and hopefully sorted out the issue. Let's try to act like adults from here on out, ok?

Anything else on the handling of game penalties should be moved to the appropriate forums, or to PM.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Skeggi

Is there much do discuss about Sphinx? It's pretty easy, is it not? If you run Sage, Sphinx is better. But would anyone not running Sage now, run Sphinx? Instead of FKZ or Witness?

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Well, let's be honest here: Sphinx is only marginally better than Sage as a miller. The situations where you will have a Dread Return and a reanimation target, and three dudes out to sac, and have eight or less cards in your graveyard, are few and far between. Granted, the sphinx has a far better body and discards three, but those that run Witness run it because it's flexible, and does a wider range of things than Sage, if not at the same magnitude. So there's not enough of an incentive to replace it.

It's time to make room for some Entombs: http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazin...ly/feature/56d

Not going to allow Ichorid to break the format, but it's a one-mana Demonic Tutor + free discard outlet for this deck. Not much to be said about this versatile card: grab that dredger, Ichorid, Bridge, Dread Return, Cabal Therapy, finisher, or whatever else you might need at the time (Wispmare, Ingot Chewer, Ancestor's Chosen). In my opinion, if nothing else, Ichorid becomes more resistant to hate.

Yeah, Entomb looks like some serious Ichorid love. But what to take out? The deck is crammed. Would you take out your Unmasks?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Skeggi

Yeah, Entomb looks like some serious Ichorid love. But what to take out? The deck is crammed. Would you take out your Unmasks?

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I haven't played Ichorid in a tournament setting yet (I play mostly casual, but under the Legacy "format"), but I'm currently inclined take out my Unmasks and move them to the sideboard for games 2 and 3 where it'd be more useful to get rid of hate spells preemptively.

Entomb means you can probably get rid of a dredger, or a Dread Return (going down to 2), or a single discard outlet (Imp or LED), if you were so inclined to keep the Unmasks in there. I'm not though, at least not game 1.

Something that came to me... Entomb for Phantasmagorian, discard 3.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by alderon666

Something that came to me... Entomb for Phantasmagorian, discard 3.

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...One with Nothing?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lordofthepit

I haven't played Ichorid in a tournament setting yet (I play mostly casual, but under the Legacy "format"), but I'm currently inclined take out my Unmasks and move them to the sideboard for games 2 and 3 where it'd be more useful to get rid of hate spells preemptively.

Entomb means you can probably get rid of a dredger, or a Dread Return (going down to 2), or a single discard outlet (Imp or LED), if you were so inclined to keep the Unmasks in there. I'm not though, at least not game 1.

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Disagree. If you run Entomb, you don't want to cut dredgers. You're going to depend on chaining dredges (because you have no permanent discard outlet), and only running 8 dredgers makes doing so highly unlikely.

I personally don't think Entomb really has a place in the deck. It has a very mediocre effect in your opening hand and does nothing when it sits in your graveyard.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jaynel

Disagree. If you run Entomb, you don't want to cut dredgers. You're going to depend on chaining dredges (because you have no permanent discard outlet), and only running 8 dredgers makes doing so highly unlikely.

I personally don't think Entomb really has a place in the deck. It has a very mediocre effect in your opening hand and does nothing when it sits in your graveyard.

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This is very well said and I completely agree. It is a far weaker play than every other major card in this deck, and I really don't want to cut a card like Unmask for it because I can't think of 2-3 sideboard cards that I would want to cut to put them back there just to run Entomb. Even if I did run Entomb maindeck, I would side it out in almost every situation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheRock

This is very well said and I completely agree. It is a far weaker play than every other major card in this deck, and I really don't want to cut a card like Unmask for it because I can't think of 2-3 sideboard cards that I would want to cut to put them back there just to run Entomb. Even if I did run Entomb maindeck, I would side it out in almost every situation.

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THIS!

I tried to explain this in the SCD thread, but I'm not that good with words :rolleyes: