[Deck] Elves Combo

Mono green still works very well. It doesn't perform much differently than a fully optimal Elves list. You lose some sideboard options and the flexibility of Deathrite Shaman without black, but the Glimpse chain and Natural Order plan aren't weakened by being mono chromatic. A lack of fetchlands will hurt the NO plan so I recommend you get fetches even for the mono-g version as they'll help to find Arbors and thin your deck of lands during a Glimpse chain.

4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Misty Rainforest
4 Forest
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Gaea's Cradle

4 Glimpse of Nature
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Natural Order
2 Crop Rotation

3 Llanowar Elves
3 Fyndhorn Elves
4 Quirion Ranger
4 Wirewood Symbiote
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Heritage Druid
4 Elvish Visionary
1 Birchlore Rangers
1 Priest of Titania / Wirewood Hivemaster
1 Regal Force
1 Craterhoof Behemoth

//Sideboard
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Natural Order
1 Progenitus
2 Thorn of Amethyst
4 Mindbreak Trap
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Bojuka Bog
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg

Thanks to GSZ, I think it's wise to keep Pridemage and Teeg even without a Savannah. So there you go. It definitely would compete.

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Originally Posted by Absolutflipz

Why did you make a swap with Glimpse, and not play both together so as to have 5+ copies of "glimpse"...

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It felt best not to 'dilute' the deck with too many non-elf cards. As Elves! is a highly synergetic deck, it felt as if taking out a single elf would make it worse. If the added value of the card you put back is very high it's worth it, but I think we shouldn't commit to much of the mainboard to combo.

Remember, just as Chris Anderson said: the deck is not a combo deck. It is a (very!!) effective midrange deck with an option to go nuts. The name of the deck is (at the moment) somewhat of a misnomer.

That being said, you can always test! Just make any configuration and play a bunch of games. That the card didn't work out the way it did for me, doesn't say that it doesn't for other people. And i might be wrong alltogether. Perhaps Beck // Call should be in the board, to board in against decks where we absolutely want to combo (to get 5-8 glimpses, as you mentioned).

I would probably cut down on Quirion Rangers in monogreen builds - a big part of the card's value is protecting duals and twiddling Deathrite. Another Hivemaster or a maindeck Viridian Shaman would be preferable to Ranger #4, IMHO.

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Originally Posted by Zombie

I would probably cut down on Quirion Rangers in monogreen builds - a big part of the card's value is protecting duals and twiddling Deathrite. Another Hivemaster or a maindeck Viridian Shaman would be preferable to Ranger #4, IMHO.

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I wouldn't cut Quirion Ranger. It act as a Maze of Ith for Dryad Arbor IMO.

Yeah it's good. Just saying that it's not 4 of good in monogreen. 3 is a perfectly fine number, especially if you're running Hivemaster.

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Originally Posted by Zombie

Yeah it's good. Just saying that it's not 4 of good in monogreen. 3 is a perfectly fine number, especially if you're running Hivemaster.

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And I have really noticed that Hivemaster is a boss.

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Originally Posted by Hencules

And I have really noticed that Hivemaster is a boss.

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For you people that are running Wirewood Hivemaster...

How does one effectively use it?

I know that he is good at generating chump blockers... but in which situation one would want to GSZ for it instead of any other creature (e.g: instead of the interaction Symbiote+Visionary; or Quirion Ranger+Dryad Arbor)?

Even in mono-green versions, I think hivemaster is win-more. He doesn't help any of the bad matchups and we should beat all the fair decks (assuming you play tight) aside from CounterTop anyway. If you're going to cut quirion ranger, I would cut it for utility like viridian shaman, scavenging ooze, gaddock teeg, or elvish archdruid in that order. Scavenging ooze might even be more important than shaman because -4 DRS really hurts the reanimator matchup.

I have Ooze in my main anyway (i prefer it over priest of titania). The use of hivemaster allows for a way more potent beatdown plan. You'll hardly ever see me zenith for it, that's why I play three of them.

The thing about the deck is that we use elves for combo and beatdown. But when you want to use to elves for beatdown, some of them will die in combat. That will diminish our possibility of effectively going to combo.

Hivemaster allows you to send the insects (and obviously the expendable elves) in the red zone, while the important elves remain safe. I find playing a pendelhaven besides this plan very usefull. Also, hivemaster supports the abuse of both Order (into either regal force or hoof) and Gaea's cradle.

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Originally Posted by andrebonotto

For you people that are running Wirewood Hivemaster...

How does one effectively use it?

I know that he is good at generating chump blockers... but in which situation one would want to GSZ for it instead of any other creature (e.g: instead of the interaction Symbiote+Visionary; or Quirion Ranger+Dryad Arbor)?

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I have not once used GSZ to find Hivemaster. I didn't do it with Priest either when I had her in that slot. I've always wanted another link of the elf chain more. I'm happiest to see Hivemaster when I'm playing a Glimpse for value only or when I'm digging with Visionary + Symbiote for gas. It just puts out pressure instead of mana in a direct comparison to Priest, which I prefer in a deck already full of mana.

And yes it helps to Hoof people harder or draw more with Regal Force, but those guys were already good enough. That's just icing on the cake.

Has anyone tested multi-Symbiote builds vs. combo?

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Originally Posted by Zombie

Has anyone tested multi-Symbiote builds vs. combo?

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What exactly do you mean with multi-symbiote builds?

Multi-Symbiotes.......I don't understand what you mean...

Hi everyone!

I'd like to ask if Boseiju, Who Shelters All is something that has been tested as a SB option (especially in the lists including Crop Rotation)?

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Originally Posted by Monkey_Island

Hi everyone!

I'd like to ask if Boseiju, Who Shelters All is something that has been tested as a SB option (especially in the lists including Crop Rotation)?

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IMO, Boseiju is not playable in Elves. Yes, you do play around counterspells, but I dont know how many time I played Glimpse to bait them, let them counter it, then play another one.

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Originally Posted by Kayradis

IMO, Boseiju is not playable in Elves. Yes, you do play around counterspells, but I dont know how many time I played Glimpse to bait them, let them counter it, then play another one.

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I think you're right and that this deck lacks of a Terminus-proof target to fetch with Natural Order. I will test it anyway with the new Ruric guy as I feel it could be a good SB option against Miracles...

Multi-Hivemaster builds, I mean. You didn't see anything above, least of all an embarassing brainfart.

I doubt anyone on this thread would ever gsz for hivemaster. In contrast, I can see [multiple] scenarios which merits a gsz for every other creature in the deck. That should be indicative of why the card doesn't add much value to the deck. It's a very fun casual card for sure. However, it doesn't help with our bad matchups and even matchups (i.e. stoneblade). The only decks it really helps against are ones we should already beat.

Sunday I'm gonna use Elves at my LGS weekly. We'll see how it goes...

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Originally Posted by igri_is_a_bk

Mono green still works very well. It doesn't perform much differently than a fully optimal Elves list. You lose some sideboard options and the flexibility of Deathrite Shaman without black, but the Glimpse chain and Natural Order plan aren't weakened by being mono chromatic. A lack of fetchlands will hurt the NO plan so I recommend you get fetches even for the mono-g version as they'll help to find Arbors and thin your deck of lands during a Glimpse chain.

4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Misty Rainforest
4 Forest
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Gaea's Cradle

4 Glimpse of Nature
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Natural Order
2 Crop Rotation

3 Llanowar Elves
3 Fyndhorn Elves
4 Quirion Ranger
4 Wirewood Symbiote
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Heritage Druid
4 Elvish Visionary
1 Birchlore Rangers
1 Priest of Titania / Wirewood Hivemaster
1 Regal Force
1 Craterhoof Behemoth

//Sideboard
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Natural Order
1 Progenitus
2 Thorn of Amethyst
4 Mindbreak Trap
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Bojuka Bog
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg

Thanks to GSZ, I think it's wise to keep Pridemage and Teeg even without a Savannah. So there you go. It definitely would compete.

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Thanks for the list!!!, so combo is a winnable match even without discard?... what hurts me more is the lack of decay, i think...

about hivemaster, I used to run it in previous builds, and it never let me down... so maybe it's time to another test