[Deck] Nic Fit (GBx Explorer Zenith Control)

@RandomGestures
That list is pretty similar to the one I've been playing, I've been really liking my 1 Deathrite Shaman so I definitely see why you want a second, but could you explain Abrupt Decay over more copies of Maelstrom Pulse, and the Acidic Slime over Wickerbough Elder (which has usually been the choice as far as I can tell)? I've been very happy with Elder since he offers a clock that can take out a Jace and outsizes most of RUG's creatures while also hitting relevant targets.

The 1-of Diabolic Intent is pretty sweet, but was it good for you? What did you usually get with it?

When did you bring in Golgari Charm?

Congrats on your finish!

@Arianrhod : Actually about the PW thing, I have been thinking a while ago about something like this, packing some Culling the Weak to ramp into Karn, or even Sorin Markov. Cause playin Karn is sooooooooooooo cool :D
I might return to something like this sometime :)

Hi everyone,
Been reading heaps on this deck - seems a nice option, I love G/B.
Might even consider running this over my dredge deck for a while.
I'm hoping you could answer some questions about it.

Considering you're on colour for Griselbrand, why is it I seen barely anyone running a single in their list?
It's a very common card right now, and resolving it usually means "I win" in most other decks.
Having it handy for Show'n'Tell legend rule is obviously not the only reason, but being able to Primeval Titan/Eternal Witness/Explorer ramp shouldn't be impossible....
I understand that 8-CMC can be a turn (or sometimes two) slower in this deck than Grave Titan, but isn't Grisel soo0O0oo much better than Grave Titan, because instant removal like Swords to Plowshares doesn't completely negate playing it?

4x Veteran Explorer. Quite a lot of the lists I've seen, seem to assume that the opponent is going to be the primary source of it's demise.
Against decks like combo and control that don't necessarily want it dead, what would be your standard line of play?
And are you running enough of your own removal to waste targetted removal on it yourself?
Would including 3 Diabolic Intent in the deck be a good number to work with this? Too many?

I like Liliana of the Veil, in Pox & Gate, but does it work really well in this deck with so many singletons?
Is Liliana Vess a worse option, even if only for it's tutor abilty, playable in this deck, considering the ramp available here?

Cheers.

Hahaha it's finally up;

MDSS Deck Tech:
http://mdss.manadeprived.com/deck-te...cent-durocher/

It looks alright, some of my words were a bit changed though (Two Towers for Phyrexian Tower and the bit about linear gameplan..)
Oh yeah lol, the deck has 60 cards but somehow its posted as 63.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by slave

Hi everyone,
Been reading heaps on this deck - seems a nice option, I love G/B.
Might even consider running this over my dredge deck for a while.
I'm hoping you could answer some questions about it.

Considering you're on colour for Griselbrand, why is it I seen barely anyone running a single in their list?
It's a very common card right now, and resolving it usually means "I win" in most other decks.
Having it handy for Show'n'Tell legend rule is obviously not the only reason, but being able to Primeval Titan/Eternal Witness/Explorer ramp shouldn't be impossible....
I understand that 8-CMC can be a turn (or sometimes two) slower in this deck than Grave Titan, but isn't Grisel soo0O0oo much better than Grave Titan, because instant removal like Swords to Plowshares doesn't completely negate playing it?

4x Veteran Explorer. Quite a lot of the lists I've seen, seem to assume that the opponent is going to be the primary source of it's demise.
Against decks like combo and control that don't necessarily want it dead, what would be your standard line of play?
And are you running enough of your own removal to waste targetted removal on it yourself?
Would including 3 Diabolic Intent in the deck be a good number to work with this? Too many?

I like Liliana of the Veil, in Pox & Gate, but does it work really well in this deck with so many singletons?
Is Liliana Vess a worse option, even if only for it's tutor abilty, playable in this deck, considering the ramp available here?

Cheers.

---

Griselbrand is just overkill. You wont always hit 8 mana, and having cards that are useful at lower mana costs is just better. Grave titan is not very good either though in my opinion.

Most of the time you will have to find a way to get your own explorer dead (before he gets exiled with StPS). Only decks like RUG, BUG, or tribal can you actually plan on them having to attack into your explorers.

Against combo and control (and goblins) you have to be a bit more careful when you sac your explorers. Just wait till you actaully have something relavent to do with the mana your going to get THAT turn.

You usually dont need to use your own target removal on explorer. Very rarely you have to, and it doesnt feel good. He usually dies as a blocker, or you find one of the ~8ish sac outlets. Also deeds and sweepers in the SB, hit explorers. In GB, id suggest MD to have 1 Phyrexian tower, 1 diabolic intent, 4 therapy, 1-3 innocent blood.

3 Diabolic intent is way too many. I tried one and really liked it in GB. One would be good.

Im a big fan of liliana in GB, but people are pretty polar about her. She is a playstyle choice I think. She is definitely good, if you like what she does to the game (make it a topdeck battle). I run 3 when I play GB nic fit. Pox, vess, etc, dont seem very good here.

I actually think the problem with Griselbrand isn't so much his cost, but the amount of black he requires. He requires 4 swamps or 2 swamps, a Phyrexian Tower, and a creature. Also, his big ability doesn't do us much good: -7 life might get us all the resources we could ever want, but it's useless until we untap, and that big of a life swing that late in the game would really hurt more than help.

And my thoughts on Lili: she cannot be played by herself: she needs either a Thrun or JMS or Elspeth or some combination to work alongside her to cause some real damage.

^This. It's not that Griselbrand is bad in this deck, it's just that there are others more better than him in the role. When you hardcast him, you're left with no way to use the cards you drew.

You seem to have forgotten that Vet Ex's main source of demise is Cabal Therapy. :) Especially against the decks you've mentioned.

Lilliana OTV is a playstyle choice. Personally I like to drop her as early as possible to maximize her. You really have to try her first to realize how good she is in the deck.

Hey guys, long time no post! It's good to be back at a computer!

As RandomGestures has informed you all, I recently won a GPT for Denver with GB Nic Fit. Here's the list for reference:

Deck (61):

Lands (23):
4 Bayou
4 Forest
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Phyrexian Tower
4 Swamp
2 Treetop Village
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Volrath's Stronghold

Creatures (14):
1 Acidic Slime
2 Deathrite Shaman
2 Eternal Witness
1 Grave Titan
1 Primeval Titan
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Thragtusk
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
4 Veteran Explorer

Spells (24):
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Cabal Therapy
1 Diabolic Intent
2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Hymn to Tourach
1 Liliana of the Veil
2 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Sensei's Divining Top

Sideboard (15):
3 Carpet of Flowers
1 Cranial Extraction
1 Damnation
2 Duress
3 Extirpate
1 Golgari Charm
1 Memoricide
1 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Thoughtseize

Here's a short matchup run-down:

R1 vs Miracles 2-0
R2 vs Junk 1-1-1
R3 vs The Epic Storm 2-1
R4 ID into Top 4
Semifinals vs Elves 2-0
Finals vs Dredge 2-1

I can go into more detail about card choices, the matchups and/or sideboarding later if anyone is interested!

Holy crap: your creature base is exactly like mine with the exception of the Grave Titan . . . and I can chalk that up as being JMS since they both win games on stabilized boards.

I don't know why, but that alone gives me confidence that my list will do well at SCG Cincy in February ^_^

Also: how did the Abrupt Decay/Maelstrom Pulse split work out for ya?

@honeyt

Id love to hear more about the matchups, especially the elves one in top8. I always find it hard to win against them, playing without swords doesn't make it any easier

2x Garruk - How well did he preform?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vilnico

@Yoric: I promise you, if I have a DRS on board, and you have a Rector on board, I will NEVER let you resolve the trigger. No matter what. +2/-2 life is nothing compared to a boarded Deed or Future Sight.

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... And I said I'm fine with that.

Our deck is one that thrives in the late game. We even use two-sided ramp to get the late game going faster. If you're telling me that if I have a Rector on board you're going to stop making me lose 2 life each turn, thus allowing this deck to develop further, I am completely fine with it. Give me more turns to naturally draw that Deed, or an Abrupt Decay or Swords or whatever it takes. The longer the game goes, the more favored I am; and if you're holding back on your DRS because of my Rector, so be it.

The point about DRS being worse because of his prevalence is well taken. I just don't have the fear you all seem to have.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HoneyT

Hey guys, long time no post! It's good to be back at a computer!

As RandomGestures has informed you all, I recently won a GPT for Denver with GB Nic Fit. Here's the list for reference:

Deck (61):

Lands (23):
4 Bayou
4 Forest
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Phyrexian Tower
4 Swamp
2 Treetop Village
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Volrath's Stronghold

Creatures (14):
1 Acidic Slime
2 Deathrite Shaman
2 Eternal Witness
1 Grave Titan
1 Primeval Titan
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Thragtusk
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
4 Veteran Explorer

Spells (24):
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Cabal Therapy
1 Diabolic Intent
2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Hymn to Tourach
1 Liliana of the Veil
2 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Sensei's Divining Top

Sideboard (15):
3 Carpet of Flowers
1 Cranial Extraction
1 Damnation
2 Duress
3 Extirpate
1 Golgari Charm
1 Memoricide
1 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Thoughtseize

Here's a short matchup run-down:

R1 vs Miracles 2-0
R2 vs Junk 1-1-1
R3 vs The Epic Storm 2-1
R4 ID into Top 4
Semifinals vs Elves 2-0
Finals vs Dredge 2-1

I can go into more detail about card choices, the matchups and/or sideboarding later if anyone is interested!

---

Actually, I am very interested :)

If you have time I would like to know your in//outs for each match you played. I have also several questions about your lists:

- How good was Titan + Treetops ?
- Is grave titan good enough to be in the list? It is the only creature that you cannot tutor.
- Why GB without splash? You feel that the GB version does not need it?
- Slime better than Wickerbough Elder? Which land do you fear?

I would have many others, but I don't want to flood you :-D

TW

hello, i'm new here.
i've been playing nic fit on and off since it was a deck, though i'm by no means an expert on it.

i recently decided to make an intuition deck, the way it turned out ended up using the veteran explorer engine to power up its grindy gameplay.

this is the list i'm running currently, its definitely not ideal, i've only played a few games with it. and i want to see what people can do with it as its powerful and very fun to play (if you like grinding)

the manabase isn't ideal, you can lose games to multiple wastelands (weird for a deck with life from the loam and 7 basics :p)

UGBW intuitive wish fit

creatures (6)
1 x eternal witness
1 x primeval titan
1 x qasili pridemage
2 x veteran explorer
1 x wall of blossoms

enchantment (3)
3 x pernicious deed

instant (5)
1 x counterspell
4 x intuition

lands (24)
1 x barren moor
1 x bayou
1 x flooded strand
2 x forest
2 x island
1 x marsh flats
1 x misty rainforest
1 x phyrexian tower
1 x plains
1 x polluted delta
1 x savannah
1 x scrubland
2 x swamp
1 x tanquil thicket
1 x tropical island
1 x tundra
1 x underground sea
2 x verdant catacombs
1 x volrath's stronghold
1 x wasteland

planeswalker (3)
3 x jace, the mind sculptor

sorcery (20)
4 x cabal therapy
1 x crippling fatigue
1 x deep analysis
2 x green sun's zenith
1 x life from the loam
3 x lingering souls
4 x living wish
1 x raven's crime
1 x regrowth
1 x unburial rites
1 x vindicate

sideboard
veteran explorer
eternal witness
shriekmaw
phantasmal image
soul snuffers
spike weaver
quasili pridemage
kitchen finks
phyrexian revoker
grave titan

rest in peace

bojuka bog
phyrexian tower
volrath's stronghold
wasteland

possible sideboard
ethersworn canonist (it is really powerful against you, so maybe not)
kataki, war's sage
mystic snake
grand abolisher
thalia, guardian of thraben
baleful strix
false prophet

lonely sandbar
karakas

+ any one of insta win card you can think of

things of note.
unburial rites doesn't seem very good, but i'm not too sure.

i think the deck only needs 2 lingering souls.

intuition can search for regrowth + witness + any card can get anything. making sideboard cards better
vindicate is incredible in the deck, there should probably be a second (there are a virtual 7 eternal witness's in the deck + 4 intuition)

intuition can get a lot of very powerful situation things, none of which are too bad on their own. (deep analysis isn't very good in hand until late game)

the deck may need extra counterspells and thoughtseize effects.

there mana in the deck is not very good currently, the only game i lost due to this is when i was wastelanded multiple times (other wasteland games i won due to explorer)

give it a try, its fun.

[edits]
rest in peace is terrible to bring in, only bring in for dredge.

ethersworn cannonist is actually very important, it probably should be in the sideboard, just expect a slower and harder game to win.

soul snuffers is GOOD

jace, the mind sculptor, better than all

deathrite shaman is good against this deck.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ugotpauld

i recently decided to make an intuition deck, the way it turned out ended up using the veteran explorer engine to power up its grindy gameplay.

---

Welcome :)

If you are interested in BUGw Nic Fit with Intuition, you might want to look at Bruizar's list from a hundred pages ago:

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...l=1#post667371

There was some discussion of the list in the following pages, which I found really interesting. Some disagreed and thought Gifts Ungiven was a better fit (!) for Nic Fit, but I really like Intuition.

Here is a version with Abrupt Decay I was playtesting a few weeks


4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Intuition
2 Diabolic Intent

2 Gitaxian Probe
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Abrupt Decay


1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Recurring Nightmare
1 Unburial Rites
1 Unearth

4 Veteran Explorer
3 Eternal Witness
1 Gigapede
1 Griselbrand
1 Kederekt Leviathan
1 Palinchron
1 Scavenging Ooze


1 Dryad Arbor
1 Plains
2 Bayou
3 Forest
2 Island
2 Swamp
3 Tropical Island
1 Underground Sea
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Scrubland

SB: 2 Kederekt Leviathan
SB: 1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
SB: 1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
SB: 1 Loaming Shaman
SB: 1 Qasali Pridemage
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1 Trygon Predator
SB: 3 Carpet of Flowers
SB: 1 Sylvan Safekeeper
SB: 1 Phantasmal Image
SB: 1 Ifh-Bíff Efreet
SB: 1 Thragtusk


PS: you should consider adding punctuation, I had a hard time reading your post.

Hi Guys,

New GB Nic Fit player here shifting from thresh. Any tips on the sideboarding strategy vs dredge and combo (preferably cloudpost and storm)? Appreciate any inputs. Thanks!

Played the GB version in a torunament yesterday. Got to top 8 where I lost to goblins (!!).

Short report

r1 death&taxes (he won the tournament)

g1 He had revokers on top and deed and I didn't remove them when I would with abrupt decay etc. I played real bad this game
g2 Deeds, darkblast(this card is sick!) and finish it off with a titan
g3 Same as g2
1-0

r2 hightide

g1 He crushed me, couldnt do shit
g2 I boarded in 3 hymn, 3 duress and 4 extirpate. I discarded everything he had, extirpated hightide, time spiral and something more. He couldn't win on storm, but he eventually killed me with Augur of Bolas that he brought in from sb. Yeah, you heard it right a hightide deck won on beatdowns(this guy later lost in finals)
1-1

r3 BW with confidants, lingering souls, stoneforge etc

g1 Deeds + Abyssal presecutor + volrath's stronghold
g2 I remember the stronghold did some work here too, really impressed with that card
2-1

r4 uw miracles
g1 He plays jace turn 5. I cast lots of creatures but he swords/terminus them all. Eventually I get the two towers engine going and this game goes to time without anyone winning haha...
2-1-1

r5 Stoneforge with jace
g1 Thrun gets there! so good against jace
g2 Goes to time, phew.. he would have won if he had one more turn.
3-1-1

top8

r1 goblins
g1 Couldn't find dead. He had many goblins. Lots of goblins..
g2 Engineered Plague + Darkblast :D
g3 Mull to 5 and couldnt find any deed/damnation

3-2-1

Best cards of the day
Volrath's Stronghold
Abyssal Presecutor
Abrupt Decay

Worst:
Kitchen Finks
Thragtusk

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SirTylerGalt

Welcome :)

If you are interested in BUGw Nic Fit with Intuition, you might want to look at Bruizar's list from a hundred pages ago:

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...l=1#post667371

There was some discussion of the list in the following pages, which I found really interesting. Some disagreed and thought Gifts Ungiven was a better fit (!) for Nic Fit, but I really like Intuition.

Here is a version with Abrupt Decay I was playtesting a few weeks

---

that seems really cool, i think i'll give it a try.

would geths verdict be good for the deck instead of leviathon? as it seems like a better card to randomly draw, and instant wins just like kederect leviathon does when you combo.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cheerios

Hi Guys,

New GB Nic Fit player here shifting from thresh. Any tips on the sideboarding strategy vs dredge and combo (preferably cloudpost and storm)? Appreciate any inputs. Thanks!

---

In GB, Id recommend a scavenging ooze maindeck, and possibly 2-3 deathrite shamans. That with the addition of 2-3 GY hate cards in the SB should be more than enough. Deed, and all out sac effects we have make dredge a pretty good matchup. For the GY hate cards, id suggest extipates as they are decent vs combo and even miracles too. Nihil Spellbomb is probably the next best option if you want to do a split between that and extipate.

Cloudpost I dont really play against ever, but from what Ive hread its pretty unbeatable. Our best way to stop their plan is probably Memocide/cranial extraction on emrakul, then Ulamog. Discard is also a decent way to interact with them.

Against storm the best way to shut them down is discard followed up by a big storm hate card, ideally nether void, but dedicating ~3 slots in your SB for Nether Void probably isnt worth it. While they can still play through Ichneumon Druid, you can use him as a 1 of instead of a 3 of in the SB. Also, cranial/memocide on their wishes, then tutors, if its TES and if its ANT just name tendrils of agony and they lose.

Also, just against any combo deck in general G2/3: bring in every single card that can interact with them and stop them from comboing out. Side out all but one GSZ-able thats only job is a clock (so take out prime titans, garruks, thruns, Garruks, etc). You win by first making it impossible for them to win, and then just beat them down with ewits or a thragtusk.

It depends on your MD but I would use something like this for my SB:
3 Carpet of Flowers
2 Darkblast
2 Extirpate (awesome vs combo of any form)
1 Nihil Spellbomb
3 Hymn to Tourach (awesome vs combo of any form)
1 Ichneumon Druid
2 Cranial Extraction/Memoricide (awesome vs combo of any form)
1 Acidic Slime

Somewhere in your 75, you probably want 2-4 Thoughtsieze, scavenging ooze for combo/GY decks. And to help with UW, garruk primal hunter and phyrexian arena.

So, yeah. I was durdlin =)

Here's the monstrosity. Note before you actually look at it that staring at this much greed for too long might cause blindness.


4x Veteran Explorer
2x Cabal Therapy

2x Pernicious Deed
1x Maelstrom Pulse
2x Abrupt Decay
3x Innocent Blood

1x Life from the Loam
1x Raven's Crime

2x Chromatic Lantern
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Crucible of Worlds
1x Etched Oracle
1x Mindslaver

4x Standstill
3x Gifts Ungiven

1x Unburial Rites
1x Recurring Nightmare

1x Eternal Witness
1x Thragtusk
1x Sun Titan
1x Rune-Scarred Demon

2x Jace, the Mind Sculptor

1x Creeping Tar Pit
1x Academy Ruins
1x Wasteland
4x Mishra's Factory

2x City of Brass

2x Forest
3x Island
1x Swamp
1x Plains

4x Bayou
3x Tropical Island

--SB:
4x Spell Pierce
1x Force of Will
1x Flusterstorm
1x Mindbreak Trap

1x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Extirpate
1x Surgical Extraction

1x Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite

3x Slaughter Games
1x Mountain


I thought I was actually going to have a good day when I beat RUG in round 1. My next four rounds, however, were all combo decks -- and it quickly proved that my sideboard was insufficient. Sneak, Reanimator, Manaless, and TES, in that order. I put up a good fight against all of them, but I just couldn't get there. I ended 2-3 after beating the Reanimator player off of a misplay.

I have a few things to take away from this.

I have -no- idea what the proper shell should look like, but 5-color is probably viable. Chromatic Lantern is real. Gifts Ungiven is as mighty as ever, but it's only good against fair decks. It -can- answer problematic situations if you get yourself into them, (like a Show and Tell'd Emrakul), but it's useless on the stack, and most quality targets, like Innocent Blood, are sorceries.

Now, beyond that: Factory and Standstill were AMAZING. Nic Fit is always ahead on board state, so Standstill is almost never a dead draw. Why put two cards back when you can just draw them? It's not like Nic Fit doesn't have the resources to use the extra cards. It's entirely possible that there is some kind of Veteran-fueled Bugstill list somewhere to be uncovered. Standstill also functions as kind of a back-up ramp engine, in a weird way, since it buys you the time to make your land drops. Or, if they break it immediately, it increases the chances that you'll draw into an Explorer and then get your ramp from there. A lot of the stuff in this list was beyond greedy and meant more for fair matchups anyway -- like I never got to Etched Oracle, and I never got to Mindslaver. But....oh well. I make no excuses nor apologies, because I had fun. I would have liked another fair deck or two, but it's fine. Now I guess I need to do something more serious for Jupiter next week, lol.

Arian, honestly, you just made the deck of my dreams :laugh:
I've been wanting to play Standstills in Nic-Fit for months, but never got around to actually making a list, now i just have to tune it ^^
(Now if there was a tournament that's not too far away more often then once every 2 months i could actually statsify my need of playing DeedStill, Combo and Nic-Fit all the time >.>)