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Yes, the sideboarded Mountain is def. a valid option - though I didn't test it good enough. Besides forcing the Fetchlandconfig to change (which is no problem) it opens up the possibility to play 1-2 Karakas in the Mainboard, may be worth the idea.
Greetings
On my mobile, forgive my formatting. I think you still want pyroclasm against fast decks thqt cant or wont be playing the new merfolk. Terminus, verdict, and ee still get him. Im still on the e. Tutor build so i can get people with blood moons, and my answer here is Moat. Moat answers most of the format in general, lile Jund, Bug, elves, merfolk, etc. I think if youre not on the tutor builds, packing an extra supreme verdict in the board should be sufficient bringing your total removal count for nemesis to 3 terminus, 1-2 ee, and 2 verdict. Only time will tell how good tnn is, and if it s very good, i think miracles is in the best spot to deal with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Einherjer
You're overly stating Moat just a little. Jund can still punishing fire. Both Jund and Bug still have the possibility of Liliana ultimate to get rid of Moat. Merfolk actually has counter to fight over Moat. Yes, Moat can shutdown elves, but elves have DRS as a backdoor win condition. Goblins can still seige-gang, some now have Wear//Tear.Quote:
Originally Posted by sdematt
Keep it mind, Reverent Silence is still a very real SB card in many decks. Overall, the plus side of Moat is the synergy with Angels, which is very appealing.
Moat has been so good for me against a number of strategies that I'm considering a second copy. I agree with sdematt here too. Just because Pyroclasm doesn't hit Nemesis doesn't mean that it isn't a valid sweeper anymore. Relatively few decks will be able to really utilize him and even those will generally have a ton of other good targets for Pyroclasm. If I'm wrong and Nemesis is literally just everywhere and in really high numbers then I'll head back to the drawing board.
Yes, it really does depend on the appearance Nemesis will make at both, BoM and GP DC. We can only speculate but I'd be very surprised if it didn't power up numerous already exisiting archetypes or even create a new one - but that's another topic.
Without Nemesis I am a big fan of Pyroclasm - always was - since GP Strasbourg. But I really wouldn't include it any more after now. Yes it hits alot of targets that are not called Nemesis, but failing at the "Kill-the-Nemesis"-class is not a good thing to do right now. Yes, we have additional removal, but I really don't want to put all my faith into my 3 Terminus and my 1of Verdict, I really don't want. There is nothing bad by adding more answers to Nemesis, yes they are not as easy to cast but have other application-areas as well - as you all know.
Time will tell, though - but I am pretty sure that my list for GP Paris in February won't contain any number of Pyroclasms. Feel free to call me out on this one.
Greetings
On the subject of True-Name Nemesis, and hard to deal with creatures, Runed Halo, Ensnaring Bridge, Story Circle, and Porphyry Nodes are also possible options to deal with such cards. They each have subtle or not so subtle drawbacks and benefits, but I have used all of them in various decks in the past and been quite happy with them most of the time. That said, I'm not really inclined to go into a debate about the usefulness of these cards at the moment. (Although, I will comment that I like Story Circle and Ensnaring Bridge's ability to deal with Batterskull.) Rather, I thought I would throw some other options out there for people to consider, at least for those who feel like the True-Name Nemesis sky is falling down on them.
I think you're overstating my statement on Moat. I said it answers most of the format, in general. I didn't say you can sit there like a limp starfish if you have a Moat down. Sure, Liliana ultimate is a thing, and so is Punishing Fires, but that's also why I'm running Leyline of Sanctity.Quote:
Originally Posted by twndomn
As I said, Moat helps you stem the tide of many problems while you actually go find a win condition. P-Fires nor Liliana nor DRS are going to mean anything when you end of turn Entreat for lethal damage.
-Matt
I like your ideas sdematt.
mind to share your list?
Meekstone isn't the worst either. I've never played Ensnaring Bridge in Miracles, is keeping our hand in the 1-2 card range an issue?Quote:
Originally Posted by Valtrix
By the time that you've got Bridge out, you can cast every spell you'd draw. Mostly, I bring it in for the real fatties like Grisselb, Emrakul the anus torn, and even a bigger Knight or Goyf.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dzra
To make it doubly excellent in the S&T matchup, it also flips for 3 HASHTAGVALUE!
Sure. It's a bit of an older list, but I've liked it. The Venser is replacing a Clique from my list that I've played for ages, but I'm trying to see how the Venser wagon is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poron
4 Flooded Strand
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Arid Mesa
2 Plains
4 Island
2 Karakas
3 Tundra
1 Mystic Gate
2 Volcanic Island
23
3 Counterbalance
4 Sensei's Top
4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Force of Will
1 Counterspell
2 Enlightened Tutor
22
3 Terminus
1 Supreme Verdict
2 Entreat the Angels
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Rest in Peace
1 Blood Moon
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Snapcaster Mage (new addition, not sure if I'll up him or keep him, etc. This was Elspeth, which was amazing)
16
//BOARD
(My traditional list)
1 Moat
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Wear/Tear
1 Blood Moon (just can't get enough)
3 Red Elemental Blast
1 Ethersworn Cannonist
1 Rest in Peace
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
4 Leyline of Sanctity
or..
(The list I played recently)
1 Moat
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Wear/Tear
1 Blood Moon (just can't get enough)
3 Red Elemental Blast
1 Ethersworn Cannonist
1 Rest in Peace
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
2 Pyroclasm
2 Misdirection
Leylines were good when they were good, but at the most recent tournament, I didn't need them, so I didn't pack them.
Hi guys.
I haven't played my Miracles deck for a while, but i'm considering picking it up again.
I just have some questions:
How is Moat performing? Is it worth the investment?
I've been following Joe Lossett's streams for a while (on and off) and keep my list somewhat updated based on his list. But i would really like to find place to the 4th Swords to Plowshares
For reference, this is my list:
Land (23)
1x Arid Mesa
4x Flooded Strand
4x Island
2x Karakas
1x Misty Rainforest
1x Mystic Gate
2x Plains
3x Scalding Tarn
3x Tundra
2x Volcanic Island
Enchantment (5)
4x Counterbalance
1x Rest in Peace
Artifact (4)
4x Sensei's Divining Top
Instant (15)
4x Brainstorm
1x Counterspell
1x Flusterstorm
3x Force of Will
1x Misdirection
2x Spell Pierce
3x Swords to Plowshares
Sorcery (6)
2x Entreat the Angels
1x Supreme Verdict
3x Terminus
Creature (4)
3x Vendilion Clique
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
Planeswalker (3)
3x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Sideboard (15)
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Flusterstorm
2x Misdirection
1x Pithing Needle
1x Pyroblast
2x Red Elemental Blast
2x Rest in Peace
1x Sulfur Elemental
1x Terminus
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
1x Wear / Tear
Feel free to come with suggestions :)
/Rook
Lossett streams? Can I get a link for future reference?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rook1e
The guy's been my Legacy idol for a while now, didn't even know he did much like that, so it'd be cool to get a real insight. I've recently switched to a Clique/Venser build over Rip Helm, which is more in line with his style. Playing Creatures just simplifies things. It's fairly similar to your build.
Also, REB is better than Pyro. The split is less effective than slight protection from Misdirection. (They can redirect a Pyro at a FoW to your Counterbalance/Jace/Creature, whereas with REB it's just a counterspell.)
Here is my current list. Moat has over-performed this far, as most decks have 0-1 outs against it. At that point you only need to deal with deathrite or delver, depending on the matchup. Tidehollows have also been spectacular. They're everything and more than meddling Mage hoped to be. An Enlightened tutor may find it's way into my board as it fetches moat, humility, even tidehollow sculler.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rook1e
Creatures:4
3 Vendilion Clique
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
Spells:33
4 Brainstorm
4 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Spell Pierce
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Counterbalance
1 Counterspell
1 Rest in Peace
2 Entreat the Angels
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Moat
3 Force of Will
3 Terminus
Lands:23
4 Flooded Strand
4 Island
2 Karakas
1 Marsh Flats
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Plains
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Tundra
1 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
Sideboard:15
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Celestial Purge
1 Disenchant
1 Rest in Peace
3 Tidehollow Sculler
1 Entreat the Angels
1 Humility
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Force of Will
2 Misdirection
Agreed. Decks like Shardless BUG have to find singleton Maelstrom Pulses or ultimate a Liliana to really deal with it. I've been running 1-2 Humility in the side as well, which, in tandem, is game over for many decks (I'm on a heavier RiP version with Helm/E Field).Quote:
Originally Posted by kaosjr
There is anybody testing "Unexpectedly Absent"? I think this card deserves some attention. It is a flexible removal card that maybe has a place in snapcaster builds.
I thought about using it, and then I remembered my venser does almost the same thing and is reusable with karakas. I could however see my flex spot (currently RIP) changing to this.Quote:
Originally Posted by cschacal
Quote:
Originally Posted by YamiJoey
http://www.twitch.tv/oarsman79
I like a lot of what Lossett does, but I've never been a fan of cutting a Swords. 4 MD sweepers is fine and good, but even still, I'd run the full set of Swords.
I've liked Moat a whole lot. Completely won a game against Slivers all by itself today. He had Crystalline, double Muscle, and Mutavault in play and all my Swords and spot removal were super dead. I drop to like 7 or something. EoT I Enlightened Tutor for Moat. Untap, Moat, win. I've had similar experiences against Death and Taxes and Merfolk.
18-player tournament tonight, went 3-1-1.
Round 1: Lands, 2-0
Round 2: Slivers, 2-0
Round 3: Oops All Spells 0-2 (that's right... wah wah...)
G1, I know what he's on so I mull to 6 looking for FoW. I keep FoW, Jace, Plains, Mystic Gate, Entreat, Terminus. I play Plains and pass. He goes Chrome Mox -> Dark Ritual -> Grim Monolith -> Balustrade Spy. I FoW and he passes. I play Mystic Gate, drawing Jace. I miss my 4th land drop and continue to draw nothing. He eventually refills and goes off again on turn 4 or so? This time he gets there.
G2, I keep a hand of Brainstorm, FoW, Clique, Venser, Counterbalance, REB, Top, Volcanic. Play Volcanic and pass. He goes Street Wraith x3 then Lotus Petal -> Dark Ritual -> Manamorphose -> Cabal Therapy. I BS, drawing Counterspell, Clique, fetchland, putting back CB and Clique. He names FoW and I die. Apparently he also had the Pact of Negation, just in case. Perhaps I should have either FoW'd his Dark Ritual or his Manamorphose, but I'm not really sure.
Round 4: Junk Dark Depths, 2-1
I drew Karakas all three games, which was awesome (props to double Karakas). In two of the games, he played an early Pithing Needle (one on Top, one on Jace). In both Needle games, I was eventually able to get CB on the board and Venser his Needle back to hand, CB locking it from coming back down. I lost game 2 because I boarded all of my FoW's out and didn't realize he was running this card: Rite of Consumption, which allowed him to kill me through Karakas and Swords. G3, I bring back in FoWs and things go smoothly again.
Round 5: ANT, ID
There were multiple occasions when I'm facing lethal on my opponent's next turn, I dig/top and find a Sword, sad face. I wish that Sword's a mass removal. This usually is the case against Goblin/Delver... or any other Vial decks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dzra
If you run snapcasters, you should run 4 Swords. Other than that reasoning, I would just follow what Oarsman does.