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Hell yeah it is. You will most likely not use the Mask for anything else but the shippy-arrrrrrr.
How can you not count this as a 2for1 if u loose ur Shippy?
Also i dont like the idea of getting the ship daze´d or force´d and do exactly nothing else on Turn2!
You could always play Hunted Horror with Mask, and Stifle as well. Stifle and Mask both combo beautifully with Hunted Horror and Dreadnought and hell, maybe even Hunted Phantasm and Trickbind.
The inclusion of Hunted Horror, Stifle, Mask, and Dreadnaught turn this deck into an entirely different deck with a game plan nowhere in alignment with what The Gate is designed for. I suppose that's an obvious statement.
If people wish to pursue that: well it seems a failing idea to me personally, but by all means test it. I don't want to stem innovation. On the other hand I think it's fruitless to push the suggestion any further in this thread.
You beat me to it Galroth. Reading this thread has been a joy and a nightmare.
It's one thing to say, "Hey! This is a great idea!" It's a whole different thing to come in, ignore the deck's intended design simply because you disagree with it.
I look forward to testing this deck more tonight.
2rach, would you mind pm'ing me your Bw list? I'm curious to take a look at it, if you don't mind, as I have been working on something along those lines, of late. I don't feel this thread is the place to discuss it, but I'm still interested to check out what you've put together, maybe run it a few times to see how it feels.
i only play online in hte tournament practice room so i dont realy get to choose what i face. lately ive been been facing goblins, zoo and merfolk the most followed by landstill decks.Quote:
Originally Posted by sporenfrosch1411
the reason i removed bitterblossom is its not a good top deck but if you feel they are doing the job they can easily go back in place of doomblade or smother. its a good card but im just not sure it right in this deck. there are so many things competing for turn 2 in this deck already and if i have choice between jitte or bitterblossom i want jitte for if nothing else to waste somebody elses jitte.
confidant is not a good top deck. you can crank him up to 3 but i think 4 is too many. out of 50 or so games with this deck i can count the number of times ive gotten a confidant to stick around and actually draw me a card on one hand. top finds an answer quickly and keeps the anwers coming.
this deck desperately needs something to trade with zoo creatures and merfolk lords which is why i maindeck the hand of cruelty. its not optimal but black is severaly lacking in good 2 drops. shade fits better in mono black control with coffers as a end game finisher. pro white is good versus so many legacy decks because most just put in 4x StP/ PtE and call it good on removal.
percy is good. most of the time he ends the game but i have a had a few games where he his drawback has given a control deck time to find answers and turned a sure win into a loss. this deck has enough of an uphill battle without its win condition costing you the game. i think a 2/2 split between percy and tombstalker is worth exploring.
as for the lands the wastelands could be out and id run 15swamps, 4 fetches and 2 mishras factory. i dont really have a problem because this deck can operate on 2 mana for several turns.
On the first page of this thread, I argued that The Gate deserved to be on the N&D forum, rather than Established Decks. After 17 pages, I'm wondering if Established Decks wouldn't be more appropriate. I've seen this deck in live tournaments and it seems to be growing in popularity.
PMed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chubu!
Just to get this out there without all the extra noise:
Quote:
On a more general note, I've been playing a mix between my BG deck(similar to Eva Green) and The Gate, running white; my motivation being Stoneforge into Grafted War-gear for Persecutor. I run the other good stuff with it like StoP, Vindicate, and Jitte. It has been doing well, so I came here to ask if anyone has tried Grafted War-gear? Good on Gatekeepers and Nighthawks and makes your Confidants big enough to kill Goyf.
Could you PM me too? I am thinking about white or green splash.Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Rach
Actually, maybe we can have a separate thread for the white splash? This way we can avoid an argument over whether a splash is necessary. (Though I wouldn't be surprised if Persecutor gets dropped eventually and we end up having an entirely different list.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Osmin
hello
i'm testing this deck, with interesting results, let me show you:
Epidemic Gate (By Daniel Olivares Aka Poxmaster)
Creatures: 15
4 Abyssal Persecutor
4 gatekeeper of Malakir
3 Tombstalker
4 Bloodghast (any suggest???)
Instant 4
4 Dark Ritual
Sorceries 19
4 Innocent Blood
3 Pox
4 Small Pox
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Duress
Lands
4 Bayou
2 Fetchs (marsh Flats...)
1 Tomb of Urami
3 Mishra's Factory
2 wasteland
1 Bojuka Bog
9 Swamp
mmmmm now, I'm trying to change urami and 1 swamp for 2 Phyrexian Tower.
And change the configuration to contamination+Bitterbloosom v/s pox
so...what you think....
Please...if you can write on spanish....sorry about the "tarzan's English"
@Poxmaster:
¿Por qué no simplemente juegas con la lista "estandar" de Pox? Tu lista parece una mezcla de The Gate y Pox. Cuáles son los advantages de tu lista, sobre la de Pox o de The Gate?
Unas listas de Pox emplean Bloodghast y Nether Spirit como criaturas, y usan Entomb para enterrar las criaturas con mas frecuencia. Así, no es necesario tener mas que uno o dos copias de Nether Spirit (para evitar el problema de tener mas que esa sola criatura en el cementerio). Además es posible tener unas copias de Tombstalker, para funcionar como "finisher" y eliminar tarjetas superfluas del cementerio.Quote:
4 Bloodghast (any suggest???)
Chubu!..
yo usualmente juego POX, de manera clasica y con splash, ahora el porque parece una mezcla, es por que me gusta experimentar con diversas estrategias.
me parecio una interesante mezcla, para experimentar, quizas en algun momento, pueda salir un tier1 no crees?
Sobre las ventajas sobre las listas individuales de pox y de gate??
falta experimentar mas y ver contra mas estrategias, pero el dia de ayer jugue un torneo de tienda con esta lista, derrote a Dredge, a white stax, empate con Thopter y perdi contra afownity....
las listas de Pox, las prefiero actualmente con Bloodghast, tambien lo he probado con tombstalker.
Gracias por el Español ;)
Hand of Cruelty does indeed seem interesting. I must test this.
Played my old list :
G/W Aggro --> 1/2, 0/2, but he just drew like a god.
Reanimator -> 0/2 , 0/2 Absolutely no chance. U desperately need Leyline of the Void x4 in the Sideboard (which i did not have until now)
so i tweaked a bit and this is what im playing atm (untested yet):
19 Swamp
3 Wasteland
4 Dark Confidant
4 Abyssal Persecutor
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Diabolic Edict
4 Hymn to Tourach
2 Cabal Therapy
4 Innocent Blood
2 Bitterblossom
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Duress
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
My thoughts after testing:
-TheGate is annoyingly slow
-Iona on Black = gg so Leyline of the Void is a MUST 4 OFF for the Sideboard and u need to mull UNTIL u have it. Simple, but i needed to get my ass kicked before learning that
-Abyssal Persecutur.... i dont know.... he is so freaking expensive @ cc4.......
-Bitterblossom is freaking slow.
How can we add Tempo to this thingy besides from adding Rituals?
What can we do to have a more kickass effect?
In General i think i might add 4 Rituals and 2 Divining Top´s. This Deck srsly needs better starts / speed / consistency
Also this freaking sux (MagicWorkstation Deep Analysis, 500000 Shuffles):
Number of start hands w/o 1-st drops: 20875 (20,88%)
Snuff Out adds tempo and mishra's factory in place of wastelands could help too. if you have sinkhole i would not go that route but since i only play online and we will likely never see that card in that enviroment ive thought about trying the factories.
ive tried tops and they do their job. with very few instants we are fairly passive on our opponets turn so top gives you something to do.
you have come to the same conclusion i did after testing this deck fairly extensively and im now playing around with eva green, loam and rocks lists and all these decks just feel much better.
i think i just prefer mono black control. obviously korlash is a bit too slow for legacy now but the old korlash control decks just felt right. disrupt, disrupt, damnation, korlash, shade pumped by coffers and a massive corrupt...very satisfying and very mono black
this deck has the disruption part down but after that its scramble mode trying to cobble together an aggro win with control cards.
So, this is the MB-midrange thread. The list I'm currently enjoying is VERY close to all these.
I tried to make Pox work for a long time, but I eventually became convinced by the Threats > Answers argument. My idea was to change Pox to a black version of Zoo, using discard instead of removal to clear the way. The main difference in my list and the one's I've found here is, no Abyssal Persecutor, and no Gatekeeper.
This is the current list I have been playing. I've gone 10-1 since settling on this build, losing to a monoblack Rishidan-lockdown deck with the :3: black vise card as win con... probably about 24-9 in those games. The sideboard is the only thing I've been futzing with -- the main is really solid as you would expect from this archetype, except for about 2 slots.
Qty Name
16 Swamp
4 Bloodstained Mire
//\\
// Creatures
3 Dark Confidant
4 Vampire Nighthawk
3 Tombstalker
4 Hand of Cruelty
2 Hypnotic Specter
//\\
// Spells
4 Dark Ritual
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Hymn to Tourach
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Damnation
2 Bad Moon
2 Doom Blade
1 Howl from Beyond
1 Underworld Dreams
2 Bitterblossom
//\\
// Sideboard
4 Leyline of the Void
4 Diabolic Edict
2 Nevinyrral's Disk
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Dystopia
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
The main idea of The Gate is to run double-duties like Faerie and Gatekeeper -- once they're on the board, though, they've already done their important function. This deck is an aggro deck with 16+2 creatures and cards that hurt the opponent and make the creatures better.
Tombstalker -- Abyssal Persecutor bugs me. I don't want to have to win, then do something; I'd rather just win. I've never had a problem casting Tombstalker. I'd like to formally protest Gatekeeper at this time as well. Diabolic Edict does everything you really want him for, cheaper, at instant speed, which is always relevant.
Fetches, Bobs, Tops -- A combo. I've flipped Tomby once since I started testing, back before this exact list, so more like 30 matches. I won that game, though. Only 2 tops means that I can't run Shriekmaw like I'd like, though.
Hypnotic Specter -- Nothing makes Hypnotic Specter a better Legacy creature than 4 Vampire Nighthawks.
Hand of Cruelty -- So nice. Everyone runs Swords & Friends. So nice. If only it flew.
Those Doom Blades were Smother, could be again, but I've been pretty happy with them, especially with the Edicts side.
Two Bitterblossom is the right number. Card advantage, Fog, Jitte carrier -- they do it all. I even tried to fit Oona's Blackguard in here, but that becomes a different, less aggressive deck. Also, the metagame right now is short on flying creatures, except for Thopter/Swords, so having 2 Hyppys and 2 Bitterblossom is helpful.
Two Jitte is the right number. Ends the game if it stays online. Sixteen creatures+Bitterblossom is good times.
Speaking of 16 creatures + Bitterblossom, Bad Moon has been working for me.
Damnation -- great when I need it, not so much when I don't. Maybe this should be another swamp, but it shores up the fact that I'm only running 2 Doomblades as removal.
I had two Duress in place of the Underworld Dreams (such a win vs. Enchantress, Brainstorm, etc. It's probably too narrow, but it makes me giggle when I can shave a whole turn off a kill with 2 or 3 damage from a late Dreams) & Howl from Beyond (always relevant, especially with Bitterblossom, and makes late Rituals non-dead). Just experimenting, as 3 IoK & 4 Hymn have been working well.
Dark Ritual -- O Noes Card Disadvantage -- Let me tell you a story about permanents. 1st turn Nighthawk or Specter or even sometimes Confidant is not a bad deal, even if they get removed -- that is a tempo push, not a loss, because they don't get to spend their mana on a threat. The reward is far greater than the risk against about 100% of midgame decks -- they fumble around while Nighthawk gives a 12-16 point lifeswing, and you drop MORE threats. Even if they remove 3 in a row, more threats keep landing, and they're all must-answers basically.
Sideboard is just an experiment right now. Dystopia should probably be Perish; I hadn't changed that since I put Underworld Dreams main. Kozi is there for mill.
The deck that made me change 11 matches ago was Thopter/Sword. More disruption is only a delay against them -- turning dangerous creatures sideways, quickly, is better, as is GY hate in the side.
So, this is what I've been working on.
Hey, I'm working with the standard list, and I was wondering what would be a decent sideboard for a completely unknown meta? I'm thinking some copies of Perish, Spinning Darkness, and more grave hate.
You're running a deck with a single Howl from Beyond, Bad Moon, Underworld Dreams, and worst of all, four Dark Ritual with two Hypnotic Specter. Please tell me you're not serious. Dark Ritual does not belong in this deck.Quote:
Originally Posted by mujadaddy
we need something broken in the list and right now mono black is lacking something broken.
the power of mono black is supposed to be what you can do with 3 black mana. with no necropotence and underworld dreams lagging a bit behind the times there is not a whole lot worthwhile that can be done with 3 black mana that cannot be done better by splashing.
the gatekeeper is the only thing we are using that requires 3 black and to me that is not a compelling enough reason to not be running eva green/ loam or rock lists.