[DTB] Blade Control

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Originally Posted by ljackstar

What are your guy's thoughts on running true name in the deck? I'm considering putting 2 in, and taking out 1 Clique and 1 other card I haven't decided yet. Is it possible I should be replacing the cliques entirely, or moving 1 the the board?

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For a Jeskai build, I think you'd be a fool not to include at least one TNN. I generally play 2, along with 1 Clique main and another in the side.

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And is it possible for us to play 4 digs? Watching Eternal Weekend and the latest SCG Invitational it's clear that dig is simply the most powerful card in the format, and several games seemed to come down to who had more digs in their list. Maybe with Jace looter we can afford to push the dig count to 4?

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I don't think so. You don't fill up your yard as quickly as the decks running 4 digs, because they usually have more cantrips (especially probe), play daze, wastelands, etc. that fill their yard, while you're usually playing Ponders and Brainstorms and a bunch of reactive spells. I'm not sure you can even justify 3 digs. I tend to play 2.

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Originally Posted by CantDecide

Hmm, sad to see the downgrade but honestly its understandable. Hopefully bfz will show us some sweet equipment or synergy. Or just something else broken in the same way its older brother did and promptly gave birth to the x-blade archetype.

On a side-note, what are people's thoughts on baby jace, i see a lot of control or tempo decks run him but obviously results may vary.

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I'm actually surprised. I know they use objective criteria, but looking at mtgtop8, Stoneblade variants were the second most popular deck among top8s (Miracles being first). Not all of those reports may fit the criteria The Source uses, I guess, but the deck has been performing decently recently, and appears to remain a mainstay of Legacy Dailies online.

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Originally Posted by matunos

I'm actually surprised. I know they use objective criteria, but looking at mtgtop8, Stoneblade variants were the second most popular deck among top8s (Miracles being first). Not all of those reports may fit the criteria The Source uses, I guess, but the deck has been performing decently recently, and appears to remain a mainstay of Legacy Dailies online.

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Agreed, proof here (also congratulation everybody on this): http://imgur.com/1HsSsWj

Hey all I'm in a position where except for a couple universal staples I pretty much have all the pieces for both Esper and Jeskai Stoneblade. The only thing that I don't have are the Dual Lands and sadly I don't have the money to buy Tundras, Volcanic Islands AND Underground Seas so I need to pick which version I want to play so I can commit the lands semi soonish.

My question to you my Legacy loving friends, is which version should I play? Or, since that's incredibly subjective, what are the pros and cons of each version. Does one version favor a certain style of play better? What match ups are each version better or worse at? Thanks in advance I really like playing Stoneblade but I need to commit to a versions so I can start testing for GP Tac

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Originally Posted by blubberpompnao

Hey all I'm in a position where except for a couple universal staples I pretty much have all the pieces for both Esper and Jeskai Stoneblade. The only thing that I don't have are the Dual Lands and sadly I don't have the money to buy Tundras, Volcanic Islands AND Underground Seas so I need to pick which version I want to play so I can commit the lands semi soonish.

My question to you my Legacy loving friends, is which version should I play? Or, since that's incredibly subjective, what are the pros and cons of each version. Does one version favor a certain style of play better? What match ups are each version better or worse at? Thanks in advance I really like playing Stoneblade but I need to commit to a versions so I can start testing for GP Tac

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In short, UWR is better against control/combo while esper is better against fair decks. You're often tapping out with Esper to play sorcery-speed interaction while UWR is more reactive. That said, I believe Esper is more versatile than UWR since the main benefit of splashing Red is Pyroblast whereas Esper gets Thoughtseize.

I've been playing Esper and I've had a problem lately with bringing in Rest in Peace with the presence of cards in our deck which rely on the graveyard. If i'm bring in RIP against a fair deck, like Jund or Grixis, should I be siding out a Snapcaster, DTT, or Souls?


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I've been bringing in RiP similar to how I bring in blood moon in modern, where I try not to just bring it in to inconvenience my opponent, and only really bring it in for match ups it actually hoses. Stuff like lands, reanimator or rUG delver, and I think in some of those match ups you'll probably be taking out some of those cards anyways. Dig is just so individually powerful that I really try not to bring it out if it isn't necessary.

That being said, I'm very new to this deck so take all that with a grain of salt.

Ok, so I know everyone hates these questions, but I'm wondering how playable this deck is with shocklands. I have every other card for esper blade aside from the 2 tundras and 3 Underground Seas, and since I'm out of a job right now, I won't be able to pick them up for another month or so. I know daze decks like RUG delver are completely unplayable with shocks but I'm wondering if the same goes for stoneblade.

As someone who didn't have much in the way of duals, I've definitely done the shockland thing. Of all the decks in competitive legacy, I feel that Stoneblade and Miracles are the most amenable to running shocks due to their naturally high basic count (also, there's a lot of games with both of those decks where you should just flat out never fetch for a dual if you can help it). From my experience, there's a few iron rules to running shocks without getting especially punished for it:
1. Basics are your friends, run a lot of them (like 6). It's really great if your deck can fully function off of just basics.
2. Only 2 shocks max. It's too easy for them to awkwardly start in your opener if you run any more.
3. Run 1 true dual per color pair in your colors. The first dual is mandatory. Yes, this rule also includes stuff like Plateau in UWr or Scrubland in esper.

It's actually reasonably common to fetch, but not need the mana right away. That's the perfect time to get your shock.

The filterlands slot in really well for 1 copy of a dual pair. I used to run Mystic Gate as a budget replacement for Tundra, but it did so much good work for me (esp. vs. choke) that it earned itself a permanent non-budget spot in my deck. Be very careful with how color-intensive your cards are, something like LotV is probably too difficult.

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Originally Posted by ljackstar

Ok, so I know everyone hates these questions, but I'm wondering how playable this deck is with shocklands. I have every other card for esper blade aside from the 2 tundras and 3 Underground Seas, and since I'm out of a job right now, I won't be able to pick them up for another month or so. I know daze decks like RUG delver are completely unplayable with shocks but I'm wondering if the same goes for stoneblade.

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Or you could just play UW stoneblade. Straight up old school classic stoneblade is really underrated. Mishra's Factory is such a powerful card... It is also a great way to become familiar with the deck's fundamentals and get to know which splash you would preffer and appreciate the most.

Just to give you an idea, despite having all the cards and having tried all the variants, I ended up gravitating around the green splash for a long time because:

1) UW was working just great for me and the green splash was so minimal (2-4 cards max)
2) Krosan Grip solved all of my problems
3) Life from the Loam is broken with Intuition, Brainstorm and Jace

What do we put in place of Dig now? Probably a stupid question but I've only been playing this deck post dig meta

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Originally Posted by CantDecide

What do we put in place of Dig now? Probably a stupid question but I've only been playing this deck post dig meta

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UWR is less attractive considering REBs only hit Counterbalance now. If you're looking for an esper list, just pretend the last year didn't happen and add an extra Counterspell, Ponder, and maybe one more TNN or SCM.

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Originally Posted by CantDecide

What do we put in place of Dig now? Probably a stupid question but I've only been playing this deck post dig meta

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more JTMSs obviously

Can someone recommend a good straight UW-list?

I want to play the mishra's Factory/ moorland haunt.
Cards are just insane.. and underrated

I was on ANT since GP NJ but I'm now moving back to Esper Stoneblade. What do you guys think of my initial list? I think I'd like to find room for a Duress and a Darkblast in the SB. Toxic Deluge is probably not needed and I always go back and forth with Surgical but with my high Snapcaster count it is probably good enough.

Creatures (10)
4x Stoneforge Mystic
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique

Sorceries (7)
4x Thoughtseize
2x Ponder
1x Council's Judgment

Instants (16)
4x Brainstorm
4x Spell Pierce
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Force of Will

Artifacts (2)
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Batterskull

Planeswalkers (3)
3x Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Lands (22)
4x Flooded Strand
4x Polluted Delta
1x Marsh Flats
3x Tundra
3x Underground Sea
1x Scrubland
1x Creeping Tar Pit
1x Karakas
2x Island
1x Plains
1x Swamp

Sideboard (15)
1x Engineered Explosives
2x Flusterstorm
1x Path to Exile
1x Pithing Needle
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Disenchant
3x Meddling Mage
2x Containment Priest
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Toxic Deluge

Maybe a Duress instead of the Deluge?

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Originally Posted by gabelmeister

Can someone recommend a good straight UW-list?

I want to play the mishra's Factory/ moorland haunt.
Cards are just insane.. and underrated

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I don't mind sharing my list. However, it has a pair of Tropical Islands for utility purposes. You can always use it as a starting point by removing the green. Here it is:


4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Aven Mindcensor

4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
2 Spell Pierce
2 Counterspell
1 Intuition

1 Life from the Loam
1 Council's Judgment
1 Supreme Verdict

1 Engineered Explosives
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull

1 Sylvan Library

3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

1 Karakas
1 Academy Ruins
2 Wasteland
2 Mishra's Factory
4 Flooded Strand
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Windswept Heath
3 Tundra
2 Tropical Island
2 Island
1 Plains

3 Meddling Mage
1 Containment Priest
1 Flusterstorm
1 Envelop
1 Disenchant
1 Krosan Grip
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Pithing Needle
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Humility
3 Rest in Peace

Hello everyone. i registered to The source today so i could start contributing to the developpment of the deck i've been playing for the past six months or so, be it in tournaments ( twice ) or online on cockatrice ( a lot, but i don't know much that counts )

with the ban of dig i've been considering several options for their replacement and came up with this idea :
1 : Since BGx decks are going to come back huge, we can expect more and more decays to blow up our jitte / swords.
2 : These BGx decks are usually weak to EE since they mostly rely on permanents.
3 : If we are going to play EE ( MB or SB ) and our jittes are getting blown up, we should start playing Academy ruins MB

all of this leading us to this : if we are running academy ruins and playing in a grindy meta, why wouldn't we play Baleful strixes main board ?
they are almost guaranteed CA, they are a world of pain when packed with the recursive engine of Academy ruins when playing against fair decks, and i wish you could see the faces of my opponents when they understand that i have recursive equipment AND a recursive body to carry it.

This of course have to have some flaws.
The biggest one i could think about is transforming our deck from a pretty good RiP deck ( if we aren't running Souls MB) to a pretty bad RiP deck. i can see both the engine and RiP coexisiting, but i'm not sure i would want the strixes out when boarding RiP in; this has to be tested more.

To sum it up, i want to play Baleful strixes to carry equipment and generate CA when packed with Academy Ruins. what do you guys think of that ?

ps: i would add a list, but i don't have a full one at the moment, still testing. if it's really needed for feedback let me know and i'll oblige.

pps: i will be cross-posting this on both Deathblade and Blade control threads as this idea could adapt to both decks but i'm not sure wich deck could make the better use of it

Ok, this is what my post-dig list is looking like, any input is appreciated.


Esper Stoneblade

4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
2 Marsh Flats
3 Tundra
2 Underground Sea
1 Scrubland
2 Island
1 Plains
1 Swamp
1 Karakas

2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Liliana of the Veil

4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Counterspell

3 Lingering Souls
2 Ponder
4 Thoutseize

2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Vendilion Clique
2 True-Name Nemesis

1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte

SB:
2 Containment Priest
1 Council's Judgment
1 Disenchant
1 Engineered Plague
1 Flusterstorm
2 Rest in Peace
2 Spell Pierce
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Meddling Mage
1 Enlightened Tutor

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Originally Posted by gabelmeister

Can someone recommend a good straight UW-list?

I want to play the mishra's Factory/ moorland haunt.
Cards are just insane.. and underrated

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I'd look up deck lists on mtgtop8. Joe Bernal's list pre cruise is a great place to start. It splashes black very lightly so there will be a couple substitutions. Alternatively there's the old school uw faeries with mutavalts.

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Originally Posted by ljackstar

Ok, this is what my post-dig list is looking like, any input is appreciated.


Esper Stoneblade

4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
2 Marsh Flats
3 Tundra
2 Underground Sea
1 Scrubland
2 Island
1 Plains
1 Swamp
1 Karakas

2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Liliana of the Veil

4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Counterspell

3 Lingering Souls
2 Ponder
4 Thoutseize

2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Vendilion Clique
2 True-Name Nemesis

1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte

SB:
2 Containment Priest
1 Council's Judgment
1 Disenchant
1 Engineered Plague
1 Flusterstorm
2 Rest in Peace
2 Spell Pierce
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Meddling Mage
1 Enlightened Tutor

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Really like this list outside of the E-tutor in the board. What is it for?

I'm also trying to decide between md strix,ee, ruins package but am on the fence about it. anyone have any thoughts there?