[Deck] GW/x Maverick

I mentioned it before, yes Orim's Chant and Silence are interchangeable. The Silence effect is the important part, not the fog effect.

Faerie Macabre over Surgical is strictly for Dredge matchups, since Surgical isn't enough against a fast Dredge LED opener. Macabre can usually stop it by eliminating a few dredgers to give give for the deck to setup an Ooze. Ooze is the main way to beat Dredge, but you need a way to survive to turn 2-3 to get it active. It's also better against Reanimator. (both these decks are present in my metagame)

Storm is fairly straightforward to beat. Thalia backed with Silence is more or less better than Surgical.

The key with sideboard cards is that they need to serve multiple purposes across multiple matchups. We don't have the luxury of playing with Angel's Grace anymore.

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Originally Posted by Koby

I mentioned it before, yes Orim's Chant and Silence are interchangeable. The Silence effect is the important part, not the fog effect.

Faerie Macabre over Surgical is strictly for Dredge matchups, since Surgical isn't enough against a fast Dredge LED opener. Macabre can usually stop it by eliminating a few dredgers to give give for the deck to setup an Ooze. Ooze is the main way to beat Dredge, but you need a way to survive to turn 2-3 to get it active. It's also better against Reanimator. (both these decks are present in my metagame)

Storm is fairly straightforward to beat. Thalia backed with Silence is more or less better than Surgical.

The key with sideboard cards is that they need to serve multiple purposes across multiple matchups. We don't have the luxury of playing with Angel's Grace anymore.

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Though I understand your reasoning, I can't agree with it. Sitting with silence against storm is the worst thing I can imagine. Today they play 10-12 ways to look inside your hand. On the other side, what's your plan? Do you pass the turn if your starting hand is silence, mother of runes, noble hierarch, green sun and lands? I'd rather play Mindbreak Trap which is 100% better and can be played on your turn 0. Because Silence against Miracles is even more strange to me. Additional Gaddock Teeg and/or pithing needle for their Top are better all the way in the early and late game. Would you play surgicals, they'd surve you really well in Miracles match-up as well. But I guess dredge is more dangenerous in your meta.

First: they board out half the 'look at your hand' stuff. And if they have you discard the Chant, you might get Zenith into Teeg through.
Second: when has Mindbreak Trap ever done anything for us against Miracles?
Trap is extremely narrow, that's why some people are now trying Chant effects.

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Originally Posted by door

Though I understand your reasoning, I can't agree with it. Sitting with silence against storm is the worst thing I can imagine. Today they play 10-12 ways to look inside your hand. On the other side, what's your plan? Do you pass the turn if your starting hand is silence, mother of runes, noble hierarch, green sun and lands? I'd rather play Mindbreak Trap which is 100% better and can be played on your turn 0. Because Silence against Miracles is even more strange to me. Additional Gaddock Teeg and/or pithing needle for their Top are better all the way in the early and late game. Would you play surgicals, they'd surve you really well in Miracles match-up as well. But I guess dredge is more dangenerous in your meta.

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If you peek at the ANT thread, they are formulating a plan to board out the discard in favor for Abrupt Decay and bounce. Effectively all the best SB cards for us are permanents, and they have adjusted for that. They might still bring in discard for Game 3, but it's very likely we might nab game 1 with an early Thalia. Thus, having a hate card that's good vs them naturally and attacks at an angle they aren't preparing for will help to get some free wins. Besides, Time Walk is pretty good when we're wastelanding them.

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Originally Posted by Koby

If you peek at the ANT thread, they are formulating a plan to board out the discard in favor for Abrupt Decay and bounce. Effectively all the best SB cards for us are permanents, and they have adjusted for that. They might still bring in discard for Game 3, but it's very likely we might nab game 1 with an early Thalia. Thus, having a hate card that's good vs them naturally and attacks at an angle they aren't preparing for will help to get some free wins. Besides, Time Walk is pretty good when we're wastelanding them.

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Why would they side in bounce and Decays when a Dread of Night does everything a Decay can do, but extremely better?
A single Dread of Night takes care of all the Thalia and Mother of Runes in your deck, for just 1 (maybe 2) mana.

THAT is the card you have to worry about, NOT Decay or Bounce.
Because double Dread of Night means you can't even play Pride-Mage to deal with them and that none of your hate-bears survives.

For that MU I'd much rather side in Gaddocks (you must play at least 3 between MD or SB if you want to have any hope against Miracle, without those leave the deckin your backpack), Canonist, KGrip for Dread of Night and maybe Tormod's Crypt.
Given that Thalia + Mother of Runes is your best bet against them, I really don't see why in the world you'd want to keep 2 mana up at any given time for a Chant when you'd be better served by spending them to try and put a short clock on the table rathen than HELP them by playing the waiting game!

But Storm is NOT the reason why the deck is doing poorly, the reasons are Miracle, Goblins, S&T decks and BUG to which the deck has next to no answers and awful MUs.

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Originally Posted by Jiaozy

Why would they side in bounce and Decays when a Dread of Night does everything a Decay can do, but extremely better?
A single Dread of Night takes care of all the Thalia and Mother of Runes in your deck, for just 1 (maybe 2) mana.

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Miracles have caused Maverick to lose popularity, so Dread of Night is a narrow answer against a seemingly declining deck. Meanwhile, that same Miracles deck plays Counterbalance, which just fucks up Storm players. Abrupt Decay is a general answer that is good for both match-ups.

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Originally Posted by door

Sitting with silence against storm is the worst thing I can imagine.

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Back when I played primarily Zoo and Storm, Orim's Chant was probably the most devastating card that could be played against me as a Storm player after turn 1. Granted, holding up a mana is pretty annoying, but an Orim's Chant prevents ANT from winning and completely shuts off Ill-Gotten Gains even if discarded.

I occasionally ran it in my Zoo deck when Storm was the only bad matchup it had in the metagame, but it was pretty narrow. Not sure Terminus is enough to justify its inclusion.

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Originally Posted by Jiaozy

Why would they side in bounce and Decays when a Dread of Night does everything a Decay can do, but extremely better?
A single Dread of Night takes care of all the Thalia and Mother of Runes in your deck, for just 1 (maybe 2) mana.

THAT is the card you have to worry about, NOT Decay or Bounce.
Because double Dread of Night means you can't even play Pride-Mage to deal with them and that none of your hate-bears survives.

For that MU I'd much rather side in Gaddocks (you must play at least 3 between MD or SB if you want to have any hope against Miracle, without those leave the deckin your backpack), Canonist, KGrip for Dread of Night and maybe Tormod's Crypt.
Given that Thalia + Mother of Runes is your best bet against them, I really don't see why in the world you'd want to keep 2 mana up at any given time for a Chant when you'd be better served by spending them to try and put a short clock on the table rathen than HELP them by playing the waiting game!

But Storm is NOT the reason why the deck is doing poorly, the reasons are Miracle, Goblins, S&T decks and BUG to which the deck has next to no answers and awful MUs.

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Dread of Night also doesn't deal with Teeg and Canonist on it's own?

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Originally Posted by Namida

Miracles have caused Maverick to lose popularity, so Dread of Night is a narrow answer against a seemingly declining deck. Meanwhile, that same Miracles deck plays Counterbalance, which just fucks up Storm players. Abrupt Decay is a general answer that is good for both match-ups.

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They simply can't afford SBing in 7 or 8 cards, with a SB like this one you just need the 4 Dread of Nights for Maverick and can side in the 3 Decays if you feel like taking out all the discard, but they're not needed.

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Originally Posted by lordofthepit

Back when I played primarily Zoo and Storm, Orim's Chant was probably the most devastating card that could be played against me as a Storm player after turn 1. Granted, holding up a mana is pretty annoying, but an Orim's Chant prevents ANT from winning and completely shuts off Ill-Gotten Gains even if discarded.

I occasionally ran it in my Zoo deck when Storm was the only bad matchup it had in the metagame, but it was pretty narrow. Not sure Terminus is enough to justify its inclusion.

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Back when I started playing Type 2 Ishan's Shade was probably the most devastating card you could play against a control deck, should we consider them against Miracle? :really:

A deck with a 3-4 turn clock that played no Thalia and had all of its spell cost 2 or less could afford to play Chant because simply buying a turn by randomly Chanting the opponent could win the game because it could attack for 4-6 damage on turn 3, this deck doesn't have a fast clock AND plays Thalia, so keeping two mana up all the time is pointless because it doesn't help the game plan of the deck.

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Originally Posted by Esper3k

Dread of Night also doesn't deal with Teeg and Canonist on it's own?

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It doesn't but only one deals with Thalias and Mother of Runes for 2 mana (much less than the 6 you'd need to deal with ONLY Thalia if Mom is in play) and finding a second one is very easy playing something between 16 and 20 cantrip and Infernal Tutor.

Yesterday I won a really nice english Moat at the 2nd Legacy Open Graz. My list was:

4 Savannah
4 Windswept Heath
2 Wooded Foothulls
2 Forest
1 Plains
4 Wasteland
2 Cavern of Souls
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Karakas

4 Mother of Runes
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Thalia
3 Scavenging Ooze
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Gaddock Teeg

4 Swords
4 GSZ
2 Sylvan
2 Jitte
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Path to Exile

SB:

2 Elspeth, Knight Errand
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Path to Exile
1 Ulvenwald Tracker
1 Linvala
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Maze of Ith
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Crucible of Worlds

I played against:

Combo Elves 2:0 - really inexperienced pilot
Belcher 1:2 - I actually won G1 cause I was on the play and he only made 10 Tokens on his first turn, Games 2 and 3 I always had the turn 2 hatepiece in hand, but he made 10 / 14 tokens on his first turn which I could not race this time
RUG Delver 2:1
RUG Delver 2:0
UWr Miracleblade 2:0

So I'm 4th heading into top 8

T8 RUG Delver (same guy as round 4 and actually one of my better magic friends) 2:1
T4 LEDless Dredge 2:1
Finals (Untimed) Esperblade 2:1 - I was too greedy game 1 and got punished for it, won G2 on the back of Elspeth and Garruk, and then G3 was a real grind which took roughly 80 minutes. I had him in a solid lock with Crucible + Waste as well as Thalia and Thorn out. He managed to nuke my board several times, even when I had Teeg later on, since he runs Perish in his SB, and stall the board with Stoneforge/Equipments. He then nearly managed to win with Souls tokens equipped with Skull/Jitte, Maze of Ith really worked overtimes here. After all I was able to punch through exactly for lethal with a Mother protected Ooze. What an epic Game.

As for my list, the Garruk Slot in the MD is still in question, might as well be any other card, maybe there are some suggestions out there (I play in a really blue Meta btw, both tempo and control wise). In the SB the Maze was golden both against RUG as well as against Esperblade.

Regards

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Originally Posted by Philipp2293

Yesterday I won a really nice english Moat at the 2nd Legacy Open Graz. My list was:

4 Savannah
4 Windswept Heath
2 Wooded Foothulls
2 Forest
1 Plains
4 Wasteland
2 Cavern of Souls
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Karakas

4 Mother of Runes
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Thalia
3 Scavenging Ooze
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Gaddock Teeg

4 Swords
4 GSZ
2 Sylvan
2 Jitte
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Path to Exile

SB:

2 Elspeth, Knight Errand
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Path to Exile
1 Ulvenwald Tracker
1 Linvala
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Maze of Ith
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Crucible of Worlds

I played against:

Combo Elves 2:0 - really inexperienced pilot
Belcher 1:2 - I actually won G1 cause I was on the play and he only made 10 Tokens on his first turn, Games 2 and 3 I always had the turn 2 hatepiece in hand, but he made 10 / 14 tokens on his first turn which I could not race this time
RUG Delver 2:1
RUG Delver 2:0
UWr Miracleblade 2:0

So I'm 4th heading into top 8

T8 RUG Delver (same guy as round 4 and actually one of my better magic friends) 2:1
T4 LEDless Dredge 2:1
Finals (Untimed) Esperblade 2:1 - I was too greedy game 1 and got punished for it, won G2 on the back of Elspeth and Garruk, and then G3 was a real grind which took roughly 80 minutes. I had him in a solid lock with Crucible + Waste as well as Thalia and Thorn out. He managed to nuke my board several times, even when I had Teeg later on, since he runs Perish in his SB, and stall the board with Stoneforge/Equipments. He then nearly managed to win with Souls tokens equipped with Skull/Jitte, Maze of Ith really worked overtimes here. After all I was able to punch through exactly for lethal with a Mother protected Ooze. What an epic Game.

As for my list, the Garruk Slot in the MD is still in question, might as well be any other card, maybe there are some suggestions out there (I play in a really blue Meta btw, both tempo and control wise). In the SB the Maze was golden both against RUG as well as against Esperblade.

Regards

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GRATZ Philipp :smile:
Switch the Maze of Ith for Garruk; it can be tutored with knight in many situations, i love it!!!

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Originally Posted by TarmoX

GRATZ Philipp :smile:
Switch the Maze of Ith for Garruk; it can be tutored with knight in many situations, i love it!!!

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Why would you swap a card that is good against Miracle and the Mirror (Garruk) for a card that isn't good anymore due to the heavy amount of Wasteland played in the MUs where it would be useful (Mirror, Blade)?

Care to elaborate a bit?

Short report.
Won tournament last weekend with this list:


3 Noble Hierarch
1 Birds of Paradise
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mother of Runes
2 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger
2 Sylvan Library
1 Path to Exile
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thrabren
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Terravore
4 Wasteland
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Forest
1 Plains
2 Cavern of Souls
4 Savannah
4 Windswepth heath
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
3 Wooded Foothills

SB(15):
1 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Bojuka Bog
2 Oblivion Ring
1 Path to Exile
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Gaea's Blessing


MU played against:
2 BUG Tempo(2-0, and 2-1), Dredge(2-0), BG Middle-Aggro Rock(2-0), ID in 5th round with Imperial Painter.
Top4 2-0 against Goblins Rb
Split with Painter.

Thoughts after tournament:
CotV was very handy vs Tempo beeing on play. Even with ADecay running around, lock with CotV + Thalia + wasteland, lock both opponents.
Changes which should be done - 1 PtE -> 1 Engineered Explosives - Early EtW can be devastating. Bi)rds of Paradise -> 4th Hierarch (BoP is useful only with Sword of X and Y)
Gaea's Blessing was meta call slot.

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Originally Posted by Fatal

Gaea's Blessing was meta call slot.

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...because it helps against Brain Freeze, I suppose? Truth is, in less than 5% of games, Solidarity/High Tide will actually care about Gaea's Blessing. You're much better off, playing something proactive like Ethersworn Canonist or another copy of Gaddock Teeg. In case you are afraid of bounce spells, remember to grant protection from blue in your mainphase. Thus, they will have to bounce on their turn, further restricting their mana and not allowing to resolve a High Tide first. This of course only applies to situations where you have either 2 Mother of Runes or one Mother + Scryb Ranger. It works pretty well, even against Wipe Away.

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Originally Posted by Julian23

...because it helps against Brain Freeze, I suppose? Truth is, in less than 5% of games, Solidarity/High Tide will actually care about Gaea's Blessing. You're much better off, playing something proactive like Ethersworn Canonist or another copy of Gaddock Teeg. In case you are afraid of bounce spells, remember to grant protection from blue in your mainphase. Thus, they will have to bounce on their turn, further restricting their mana and not allowing to resolve a High Tide first. This of course only applies to situations where you have either 2 Mother of Runes or one Mother + Scryb Ranger. It works pretty well, even against Wipe Away.

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You don't need 2 Mother of Runes to protect a hate-bear on your turn. Only the one. They would be required to expend their bounce on their turn to deal with the hate bear, and now they are down 2-3 mana, possibly more with Thalia out as well. I once figured this out, mid-match and it was bewildering!

Yes, Gaea's Blessing is rather poor against High Tide decks. Turns out, it's still amazing against Painter/Stone. :laugh:

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Originally Posted by Koby

You don't need 2 Mother of Runes to protect a hate-bear on your turn. Only the one. They would be required to expend their bounce on their turn to deal with the hate bear, and now they are down 2-3 mana, possibly more with Thalia out as well. I once figured this out, mid-match and it was bewildering!

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Pro blue in upkeep so you can replay it if they bounce it with Wipe Away?

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Originally Posted by Shawn

Pro blue in upkeep so you can replay it if they bounce it with Wipe Away?

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Attack for value (no bounce? OK)
Main Phase 2 - target with Mother of Runes, resolve?
If Yes, pass the turn.
If No, recast.

Obv they can counter it, but that also eats a card in their hand. It's a risk, but they can bounce/counter regardless. This way, it still eats up 3 cards in their hand.

It gets even better once you land Cavern of Souls to completely neglect their countermagic, even if they bounce.

This is the reason why Maverick will not place well on U.S. soil:

http://blip.tv/scglive/20121118-scgs...-eades-6449234


Both the deck list and the plays smell inexperience. When will we see 5-10 experienced europeans travel to a SCG tournament and show whatsup?!

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Originally Posted by useL

This is the reason why Maverick will not place well on U.S. soil:

http://blip.tv/scglive/20121118-scgs...-eades-6449234


Both the deck list and the plays smell inexperience. When will we see 5-10 experienced europeans travel to a SCG tournament and show whatsup?!

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Lots of people see Maverick and are thinking "cute deck, but why u no play brainstorm?". Also, playing Maverick properly needs a lot of experience with the deck and the metagame.