Feline has made day 2 of GP NJ with Solidarity.
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Feline has made day 2 of GP NJ with Solidarity.
Just watched her interview ! Keep on Feline. Show them the power of SolidarityQuote:
Originally Posted by astormbrewing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpZrbo3f8kg
Interview. Go get em Feline!!
Go get 'em Feline!
Hopefully she writes us a report on how things went and some insight into her list :)
Her list can be found here:
http://www.starcitygames.com/events/...tide_with.html
Hrm, that's definitely an interesting list, with a full 8 fetches and a 3/3 split on Snapmage and DTT.
You're right indeed. The biggest reason why Scour is unplayable in here is that you can't mill Cunning Wishes otherwise you run out of ways to win the game (this in MD BF-less lists). Repeal is also neat to undo Delvers, Swiftspears, CBs and germ tokens, which is what you have to worry about these days. It does line up poorly against Thalia and Teeg, though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphus
I second your choice of cutting Impulses- just outdated in 2014 Legacy- and go with Opt and Peek. I'd even maximize on those before choosing anything else simply because they're crucial in fueling Digs at the greatest speed avaiable.
Regarding Snapcaster: I'm still unsure if he can coexist with Dig. The advantage of switching to Dig as the graveyard-reliant slot is that you don't lose to wise players using Deathrite Shaman and/or removal on your Snapcaster anymore, which before were in my eyes a huge liability, and still are. I know Snapcaster offers many angles of ups (a body, possibility to attrition decks, flexibility), but Dig is probably the better usage of binned cards. Also, the fact of running both is that delving cards away with Dig becomes a real issue.
"How am I supposed to do it if I were to draw a Snapcaster afterwards? Should I leave the Tides/Resets and exile everything else, or leave cantrips? Should I not cast Dig at all?" These questions may come up and to me are a deterrent from playing both. I'd rather streamline things if possible, anytime.
Last: I'd even consider a single Twincast maindeck in a world of Treasure Cruises and to copy Dig, resulting in a nice quadruple Demonic Tutor-ish.
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I like Feline's list in a nutshell, but it's likely that it can't fight well in a meta filled with Delver- it seems slow-ish.
Sadly no top 8 or 16 for Feline :(
Great run and a nice feature on SCG. Maybe she'll give us a report soon. Her list was great!
7-2 day one, 1-5 day two, still a respectable result. I still don't like her 3 CWish build, although she eventually came closer to "our" lists (as to be expected).
IMO you can use both just know exactly what for you are using them. As I said I tent to use Snapcaster for mana generation and combo pieces (sometimes it's use as 3 mana fluster or if I have some doubts about playing the combo on the next turn 3 mana peek)... We have in my list the following: 3 peeks 2 opt + eventually 3 repeal as a 1 cmc cards we really do not need that much to be in a rush to play Dig.Quote:
Originally Posted by Piceli89
Her list was seriously interesting with a more emphasis of both SCM and Dig and no turnabouts, instead relying on Reset and Snap to get there--1 Turnabout in the board though. Those V Cliques were awesome in the board.
Maybe she found a nice medium with both Snapcaster and Dig?
How exactly is Snapcaster reliable as mana generator? If you mean High Tide I can understand but Snapping Snapcaster seems just the perfect way to lose a match to otherwise dead cards, and I wouldn't lean towards that line seeing how the format was filled with cheap removal (and predictably even more in the near future with the victory of UWr Blade at gp NJ).Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphus
Instead of running 2/3s wouldn't be it better to go full on the cc1 cantrips and maximize Digs? Among other things cc1 cantrips also increase Flusterstorm's effectiveness and help in avoiding to get stucked on 1land hands which is a great problem for this deck given the lack of Preordain and Ponder. Ideally I would like to spend my first 2 turns sculpting my hand/lands and then having Dig active to start chain resources.
You may be right that a halfway configuration with Repeals gives more resistance in the face of the opponent, especially when considering a turn one Delver; on the other hand there are times when Repeal is suboptimal and/or a greater control over our draws would be good.
That's why I'm advocating on this deck to start "imitating" Tendrils' template (more cc1 cantrips, more selection, more hand info, less clunk) by retaining its advantages at the same time.
I have to admit I was wrong on Impulse, as suboptimal as it seems to be it's sadly a necessity to put away Brainstorm chaff while comboing.
scenarios: 3 lands: HT+reset+mage(tide)+snap+mage(snap)+mage in resp to mage+bf= bf rsolves for 9 (if a draw spel from op 10) mage resolve target bf+ bf11Quote:
Originally Posted by Piceli89
or 3 lands: HT+reset+mage+reset+meditate -....-you go on
4 lands (would be here all night) what I mean is simple: use snapcaster to generate mana before you use high cost cards or the card drawer card...
during combo you can and will use Dig to get ride off BS crap...
Use capitalization please. Thanks. -zilla
Well I hope those guys from Mtgsalvation see this post, because I can't post over there anymore and it's annoying (Login problems, site too slow, I gave up) Anyhow,
Just got back a couple hours ago, I will likely continue with this deck. I originally wanted to avoid Snapcaster and be "all spells" but after a 3-6 in Minneapolis I realized that Snapcaster > Remand. The issue of "removing a card in my graveyard" almost never came up anyhow other than a deathrite shaman once, and the one time it did I won anyway with their Deathrite shaman triggering my high tide in the graveyard, a scavenging ooze targeting something else in the graveyard, and a mother of runes trigger, all 3 triggers on the stack.
I feel so far that it is important to get to the second high tide resolved / Islands tapping for 3 mana, so I am much more sold on Snapcaster at this point as it was a lot harder to do before without Snapcaster. Snap was really there for tricks with Snapcaster, but 90% of the time or more, I am bouncing my opponents creatures and buying myself time, it's almost dumb to the point of considering a 3rd maindeck snap. Bounce your swiftspear with Prowess triggers, bounce your infect creature in response to +'ing it up, Bounce your flipped delver, etc. etc. etc.
For the 2 Brain Freeze in the Sideboard, because that might seem odd, it's because games 2/3 I wanted a maindeck kill condition incase extraction hit my Wishes, so I would side 1 Brain Freeze in every games 2/3. I wanted to fit all 4 Force of Wills into the maindeck, but I couldn't fit the 4th one in, so I put it in the sideboard. Well it ended up winning me a game against an opponent because I wasn't able to use pact or cast Flusterstorm, but I remembered having a Force in the side and Kabam!
I don't like Peek, and I'm going to wait as long as possible to go off anyway picking up what I need to along the way, so I personally will still not be running the card.
Some of the games I lost I was out counter magic'ed out, some of the games I lost were to just having to mulligan, and some of the games I lost were to me seriously messing up dumb stuff, like not going off in response to the combat step against burn, allowing them to do more damage to me so when I did go off at the end of their turn, they burned me in response. Not making that mistake again. I also blocked a Thalia with a Vendilion Clique thinking they'd trade, oops First Strike!
Awesome things from the weekend:
I won with Snapcaster mage attacking for 2 until they were dead
Brain Freeze your deck in response to -Jace Brainstorm- -Ponder- -Playing Counterbalance- -Playing Thalia- -Activating multiple abilities- -In response to combat, mill you, draw with Blue Sun's Zenith- Etc...
Deck is a blast to play and I hope this gives the deck some new light, I checked and according to many sites, Resets have become sold out, so hopefully everyone has theirs now!
Congrats on making day two! :smile:Quote:
Originally Posted by feline
I have a couple of questions:
1. Since you are not running Turnabout, did you often lack the necessary untap effects?
2. Related, did you have trouble using Snap on Snapcaster because of Snapcaster getting killed in response?
3. Your list seems very weak to Counterbalance. Was this intentional?
4. Against which decks would you side in the Cliques?
5. Do you think any changes to the list would have helped you improve the day two score? Or was that just fatigue, variance, lack of experience?
`Not running Turnabout was never a problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asthereal
`I don't think anyone ever targeted Snapcaster in response to Snap to bounce, though I was using Snap 90+% of the time to bounce opponents creatures
`Omg I won against miracles 2 out of 3 matches, both games were nuts. One of them I remember specifically, Cunning Wish at end of turn, bounce with Wipe Away, then next turn when they went to play counterbalance, I combo'ed off for the win milling their deck, then let balance resolve. I know it's only been 3 matches, but winning 2 out of 3 against miracles blew me away!
`Decks where Flusterstorm was dead I'd bring in Clique, I also almost always auto brought in Clique against any deck with creatures that could block and kill and disruption. Block and trade with Gaddock Teeg while putting a disruption spell from their hand to the bottom is nice.
`I am much happier with the list, most of my losses were to me doing dumb stuff that was fixable, and some mulliganing on day 1. Day 1 I lost to infect game 3 because I had to mulligan a few times before seeing a land, I guess it happens sometimes. I also lost to Death and Taxes in part because of mulliganing one game, and the other game just totally messing up not realizing Thalia had first strike and blocking with V Clique. Day II 2 of my losses were probably unavoidable, they countered me out more than I could fight back. Decks maindecking Pyroblasts are pretty darned intense!
It's worth noting that the maindeck Turnabout also helps with going off at the beginning of a lethal combat step without the need Zenith or bounce all the creatures. Sure, rare, but it comes up and Turnabout also has more utility.
Thanks for the fast response! :smile:Quote:
Originally Posted by feline
Shouldn't you be catching some sleep right now? :tongue:
I must say I really like your list. It's the first proper one that incorporates Snap-Snapcaster with DTT.
I never considered dumping all of the Turnabouts, and it's certainly something I will try.
The only main deck change I would consider is -2 Impulse, +2 Remand. More stalling while digging for land seems fine.
Most here have cut all Impulses from their lists, but I still like to keep a few in to dig for lands, fill the yard and so on.
You could also Snap (-Snapcaster-Snap) a few guys to make sure you don't die to their combat damage, if such a situation comes up.Quote:
Originally Posted by JDK
I'm not sold on that argument alone to keep Turnabout in. Not to mention Seraphus only plays one Turnabout now.
The main argument for Turnabout, in my opinion, is that you have the option to go off on your own turn.
A friend of mine played six rounds of Solidarity yesterday and mentioned he wanted to go off on his own turn quite often.
He now considers moving a Reset to the board and playing 3x Reset, 3x Turnabout, 2x Snap main deck.
I'm not sold on that, but it's an idea. This deck is far from optimized yet. :wink:
I originally had 3 main reset and 3 turnabout, but with snapcaster I just cut the turnabouts from the main and made all 4 resets main.
Snap their guy, play snapcaster, snap another of their guys, that's brilliant! Never thought of that!
I never wanted to go off on my turn with the deck surprisingly, if I ever wanted to do something before the combo turn, I did it on the turn of the opponents where I knew I still had another turn to pass the turn.
I use to have remand but I've since just cut it. If I ran Remand I don't think I'd cut Impulse. Impulse digs deep and I want to get to 3 lands minimum, hopefully 4-5+ and the only dig I have early is Opt/Brainstorm/Impulse & "potentially" Dig through Time, but by the time one can cast a Dig through time, there's likely a few lands in play.
I just hope the spark has been ignited and now we see High Tide making some top 8 finishes more regularly! And of course, this version doing it would just be awesome to see!
That's why I said "without the need [to] bounce all the creatures". Sure, there are several other ways, but usually they involve more cards and mana. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Asthereal
I'm playing 1 MD Turnabout myself (as mentioned), but I'm not proposing Turnabout to go off in your turn. In fact going off in your turn cannot easily be accomplished with just one Turnabout, but I have yet to face a situation where I need to go off on my own turn anyway.
The reason I play Turnabout is, that I want a critical number of reliable untap effects in my deck and Turnabout happens to also be able to do other stuff, like tap your guys, tap your lands, move to next phase/draw a counter (although that's weaker than EOT Turnabout in Spiral Tide). Granted, most of the times I don't need it especially, but in my 1CWish/1BF build I like to be able to deny a lethal attack after milling their deck. In my last two tournaments this situation has come up at least twice.
?Quote:
It's the first proper one that incorporates Snap-Snapcaster with DTT.