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I don't see any advantages to running a UB list over a WUB list. Ethersworn Canonist is an incredible force against combo decks, and there's so many mana fixers available in the forms of Mox Opal, Glimmervoid, and Springleaf Drum.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crysthorn
Well, almost every Affinity build has some number of Canonists in the sideboard but since nobody seems to run any white spells main (aside from occasional Thopter Foundry, which is usually treated as UB spell) or any Ancient Dens, I decided to cut this splash from deck descriptions as fairly obvious. But yeah, if you want to be precise, these builds should be UBGw, UBRw/UBw and UBw respectively.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Big Ragu
It's not trivial to run white in Tezz Affinity, at least not as a main color.
Let's take Blake McCracken's list as a reference, you can't cut the indestructible lands!, they work wonders with tezz 5/5 ability, and also are resilient against wasteland ( which a lot of decks are running main )
I'm playing the exact same list but cut all the diabolic edicts in the SB and did +1 Canonist +1 Thoughtseize +1 Relic of Progenitus, that has been running nicely for me, because with Tezz Affinity, it's VERY HARD to beat combo.
Since it doesn't carry any kind of disruption mainboard, G1 will be very very hard, for example, against High Tide Spiral combo, they can combo out on Turn 3 with a good hand, and quite often in Turn 4. To beat that you'll need to have a great hand, and Tezz is just too slow in this case.
In that match I do +4 Canonist +4 Thoughtseize to bring the disruption count up, but it's still quite hard... overall combo is not favorable. I feel that with galvanic blast I would be able to improve the match, and I'm thinking about running that instead of canonist in the SB. Canonist can be bounced etc, and I think that 4 more damage can be critical to be able to go "all in" and obtain a more consistent ~T4 Kill.
What do you guys think ?
I understandyour thought. Galvanic Blast would make Ad Nauseum a lot less exciting and could surprise an unsafe player. The pros of Cannonist is that he cant be duressed away and is better in other MU'S IMO. I play atm a split of 3 Cannonist and 2 Mindbreak Trap in my build and it works out pretty good. Mindbreak Trap lets you split your hate and can win games outta nowhere against Time Spiral. Drawing into them with the opposing Time Spiral can be damn tough for them and it won me games to have that out. Galvanic Blast is kinda useless in every other MU, because you normally want to lay another robot than shooting down some random dudes (Goofy and KotR are normally Blast proof against Affinity).
And what's your plan against all these slower combo decks - how are you going to beat resolved Emrakul or Progenitus?Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonDark
Early Goyf/KotR isn't always blast proof and in some matchups there's also a pesky Lavamancer to shoot. Besides, Galvanic Blast might as well serve as extra reach - 4 damage to the face is nothing to scoff at.Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the brainwasher
Against slow combo, the plan is to race. Galvanic blast does help that matter, I'm even thinking about Shrapnel Blast, which gives you that extra 1 dmg that can be enough to kill that goyf with a resolved natural order... ( assuming no hierarch ), and now that I think about it, the sacrificed artifact should give the goyf +1/+1, so maybe the extra damage is not actually interesting in that particular case, but it's still good for racing the opponent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crysthorn
Actually, I'm currently playing in MTGO and raced resolved progenitus with ornithopter + cranial plating.
Resolved emrakul == loose, so my plan in that match is thoughtseize to remove whatever is needed.
I will test Mindbreak Trap
After leaving it on the backburner for a while, I came back to it and came up with this list.
4 Seat of the Synod
4 Vault of Whispers
4 Ancient Tomb
3 Glimmervoid
3 Great Furnace
3 Mox Opal
3 Springleaf Drum
4 Memnite
3 Master of Etherium
4 Steel Overseer
3 Etched Champion
4 Signal Pest
4 Ornithopter
4 Thoughtcast
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
4 Cranial Plating
3 Shrapnel Blast
Sideboard
4 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Tormod's Crypt
4 Engineered Plague
4 Chalice of the Void
So far it goldfishes turn 3-4, which isn't that much slower than the all out builds that run Frogmite and Myr Enforcer with Galvanic Blast. Obviously I would love to fit Galvanic Blast in here, but there is no space, and Shrapnel Blast gets rid of extra Mox Opals.
Ancient Tombs are here to accelerate out the significant number of 2 drops, and enables Tezz coming down turn 2-3.
Let me know what you think.
I think Galvanic Blast is better than Shrapnel because: You're not even playing 4 Mox. It won't be that often that you can sacrifice a Mox to it and play another one. It's only 1 damage more than Galvanic, but costs so much more mana. But most importantly, Galvanic Blast is amazing for shooting down their first creature so your guys can keep swinging. When you blast a potential blocker, you can make up for the damage with your attack.Quote:
Originally Posted by nwong
Also, I would cut a Glimmervoid for another either Mox Opal or Springleaf Drum. Personally, I think the risk of 4 Mox Opal is worth it, since it mana-fixes and accerelates all in one. Personally, I would cut a Champ for the fourth Master, but that's just because I'm sick of Champ being just a bear vs. Jitte, other artifact creatures and man-lands.
If you're going for the red splash, then I think you should tune your deck to be as fast as possible. Even when compared to decks that run a white splash, your list seems extremely mana intensive.
Galvanic Blast is infinitely superior to Shrapnel Blast. I don't even think Shrapnel Blast is even worth considering playing with anymore.
Okay, So I've been running affinity for a few weeks now, starting out with a slower, more consistent deck, but finally deciding that I needed to make my deck faster. As a result I think I have streamlined Affinity into the deck list below. So far, I have 3 tournaments using it, 2 top 4's (Undefeated twice, in two different locations) and only missed a 3rd top 4 by bad pairings (went 4-1, my opponents scrubbed out...)
So here is the build:
4 Seat of the Synod
4 Great Furnace
4 Vault of Whispers
2 Darksteel Citadel
3 Mox Opal
3 Springleaf Drum
4 Ornithopter
3 Memnite
3 Frogmite
2 Signal Pest
4 Arcbound Ravager
4 Disciple of the Vault
4 Myr Enforcer
2 Master of Etherium
4 Cranial Plating
4 Thoughtcast
4 Galvanic Blast
2 Fling
Does anyone ever consider Second Sunrise, Im not sure if it's good, or if I just want it to be good.
God speed getting the mana base to pull that off. Also, the decks that you want to bring it in against (deed decks) are running wasteland... so even less likely. Sick with ravager, though.
I just wanted to point out Spawing Shell.
~Spawning Shell
3{pg}
Artifact Rare
({PG} may be paid for with either {G} or 2 life.)
1{PG}, {T}, Sacrifice a creature: Search your library for a creature with converted mana cost equal to the sacrificed creature's converted mana cost plus one and put it onto the battlefield. Then shuffle your library. Activate this ability only any time you could cast a sorcery.
Illus. Daarken #104/175
For four mana (can be paid over two turns), it converts your Myr Enforcers into Hellkite Overlords and your Frogmites into Baneslayer Angels/Horde of Notions.
It seems like it could work.
More importantly, I think maindecking Chalice of the Void is worthwhile if you go that route of cutting out 1cc guys and instead playing 0cc cards, and 2cc equipment and 3cc bombs like Spawing Shell and Master of Ephitherium.
The problem with using Spawning Shell is, that you are going to make a nearly entirely new deck with it. It is rather too slow and doesnīt give you the evasive effects of Ravagers / Thopter Foundries due itīs sorcery-speed.
On the other side youīll need Brainstorm to support it, due your creatures youīre supposed to "shell" are dead cards in your hand. And in this artifact-deck cutting the card advantage getting due Thoughtseize (best one in legacy!) and making it more slow with Spawning Shell is a very risky way to try to bring out viable threats like Baneslayer Angel or even a Sundering Titan. You still will lose to combo and will have hard times against control. I prefer affinityīs explosiveness over some comboish cards.
Why doesnt this deck play Gaea's Cradle?
it was in old fashioned atog fling builds when affinity was in standard. But there are better options now.Quote:
Does anyone ever consider Second Sunrise, Im not sure if it's good, or if I just want it to be good.
I don't know if it fits into our Affinity. You want artifact lands to boost your Mox Opal, if you donīt have much :0:-drops like Memnite /Ornithopter or :1:-drops like Signal Pest / Springleaf Drum. I tried this list and was very satisfied the last weeks:
Lands:
4 Seat of the Synod
3 Vault of Whispers
1 Ancient Den
3 Darksteel Citadel
4 City of Traitors
or
4 Ancient Tomb
Artifacts:
2 Thopter Foundry
1 Sword of the Meek
4 Cranial Plating
3 Mox Opal
3 Springleaf Drum
Creatures:
3 Arcbound Ravager
4 Signal Pest
4 Ornithopter
4 Memnite
4 Frogmite
3 Myr Enforcer
3 Etched Champion
Others:
4 Thoughtcast
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
Sideboard:
3 Ethersworn Canonist
3 Pithing Needle
3 Nature's Claim
3 Perish
3 Relic of Progenitus
Iīm just trying, if Sword of the Meek makes some difference in some situations, donīt know, if it has itīs place in the future setup. If not, it will be cut down for a fourth Tezz or the fourth Champion.
I prefer Perish over Engineered Plague, cause my meta here is showing more and more Zoo... bye bye Goyfs, Hierarchs and co.
I like this setup, because itīs really explosive. I experience not much games without spitting my hand out in two turns to overrun my enemy in a few turns. 1T Champion / 2T Tezz is just going nuts...
Also tried a red-splash for Galvanic Blast and wasn't satisfied. It made the difference in just one out of eleven games (against several decks). Maybe a red-splash will be viable for me, if the new Scrapmetal Fiend ist that awesome like some people are praising him up...
The cradle:
IMO you can't play much more non-artifact-lands. I tried it out while goldfishing and experienced more hands with a T1 dead mox. On the other hand you don't want green mana (in spite of boarding in Nature's Claim / Krosan Grip), maybe if the upcoming Spawning Shell fits into the deck, you can try it out. I don't know, so just put it in, go goldfishing and tell us, if it boosts the first turns in way it's earning it's place MB.
.
http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/3...9rietapgen.jpg
If only other decks had the card choices that affinity takes for granted.
Now thats a Swords to Plowshares!
Dont see it in the current builds but it could be integrated. The question is if the deck needs that card, normally you just outclass other creaturesbased decks.
Maybe its possible to create a some sort of Metal-Zoo with Ardent Recruit and Dispatch as Path to Exile... . Cant w8 to see the whole set:eek:!
I gotta agree here. We already wreck decks with creatures. Besides, we technically have answers to "must kill" threats already, especially in more widely used colors in affinity.Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the brainwasher
I really like it! Seems like a sideboard option, though.
Hello, I'm new to this forum, but definitely not new to this deck and I run the Affinity thread over at MTG Salvation. It's very interesting how in some ways the builds here and there have diverged. It appears that not everyone here loves Signal Pest? I am shocked, it is such a powerful card! Many of us have also dropped DotV entirely. Although it does give us a combo-esque finish and is epic with ravager, it is much worse than other cards if you don't have ravager. I dropped it for a PTQ and never looked back.
On the sideboard, I introduced two pieces of tech that caught on fast. Nature's Claim is a powerful anti-hate card that is useful vs all the obvious cards, but also can give us game vs. Dragon Stompy and Enchantress. Meekstone is a very interesting nitch card that I enjoy vs. Merfolk and Zoo. For reference, my list is:
4 Ornithopter
4 Memnite
4 Signal Pest
4 Arcbound Ravager
4 Etched Champion
2 Master of Etherium
4 Frogmite
4 Mox Opal
3 Springleaf Drum
4 Cranial Plating
3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
4 Thoughtcast
4 Seat of the Synod
3 Vault of Whispers
4 Darksteel Citadel
3 Glimmervoid
2 Ancient Tomb
3 Nature's Claim
2 Meekstone
3 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Engineered Plague
3 Cannonist
2 Tomard's Crypt
I have been working on a new controlling type build. Have done testing against merfolk, tes, burn, dredge, and other hom ebrews. The side board is a work in progress. Just wanted to get some ideas.
4 Seat of the Synod
4 Great Furnace
4 Darksteel Citadel
3 Mox Opal
3 Springleaf Drum
4 Ornithopter
4 Memnite
4 Frogmite
4 Signal Pest
4 Master of Etherium
4 Cranial Plating
4 Thoughtcast
4 Galvanic Blast
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Etched Champion
2 Glimmervoid
side:
4 Force of Will
4 Spell Pierce
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Mindbreak Trap
3 Boil
I really like this deck idea and the new set just leaked.
Porcelain Legionaire, Phyrexian Metamorph and Moltensteel Dragon are all exactly the kick in the pants this deck needed. Metamorph duplicates your Dragons, Wurmcoils and your opponents Dreadnoughts, Tombstalkers, Progenitus and Emrakuls.
Legionnaire is a fantastic two drop due to the first strike.
Moltentail is a solid 4 drop artifact dragon since it flies and you can trade your life to pump it and do the last bit of damage.
Moltensteel Dragon 4PP
Artifact Creature - Dragon
4/4
(P) can be paid with R or 2 life
Flying
P: Moltensteel Dragon gets +1/+0 until end of turn.
Replace the crappier cards with these and this deck is ready to fly.
I too am excited for the deck, not for the big guys but rather the small ones. Flying, base power, and lifeline for {1} is awesome! Legionaire might also be good, but I'm less sure of himQuote:
Originally Posted by Clark Kant
Vault Skirge
1 PB
Flying
Lifelink
1/1
This little guy is just awesome.Give him plating and he fills up your lifecount as fast as possible. You can counter Tendrils with it. I will test out, if it replaces Signal Pest, maybe.
Don't thinkt that the dragon or the metamorph will have any place in the classical deck build. Moltensteel-Dragon is just too expensive with itīs four mana, because Tezzeret is rather too expensive either, but when he hits the table und resolves for one round, the game is over. The other three-drops like Master of Etherium and Etched Champion are just more viable than the Metamorph. The only reason for Metamorph is, that it kills Progenitus and Emrakul.
But it is all about testing out if it fits in your meta and if it cuts the explosiveness of your affinity. I don't want that, because I love spitting out my hand in just two rounds :)
That guy should improve the match against burn, but that match is not actually bad.
The dragon is not viable IMHO
Yeah I guess 4 mana is too much. I do think Legionaire and the 2cc 2/1 flyer have potential but maybe there's no room for them.
Do we have room for Mental Misstep to protect big dudes from removal, burn etc? It's free, a fow without the discard, and seems bonkers.
Phyrexian Metamorph is a great sideboard option vs Emrakul, Progenitus etc.
The best maybe the pyroclasm for non artifact creatures for the board. A one sided pyroclasm is great.
I think this deck got nothing from New Phyrexian beyond a couple sideboard options. Dispatch probably makes to strongest case for the main deck, although Galvanic Blast is probably a better removal spell for this deck because it hits players.
The Skirge is way better than every Frogmite, Memnite or even Signal Pest in a couple of matchings. It has 1 / 1 for 1 mana, has evasion and lifelink. What do you want more?
Costing 1 mana is a drawback as soon as Mental misstep becomes legal. [Edit: I forgot it's 1{PB}. So Skrige>Signal Pest with MM around.] Mental Misstep will become widely played, and stompy decks will become much more common (especially Dragon Stompy with it's new tools). Affinity is in an excellent position to take advantage of this by going:Quote:
Originally Posted by clumsylicious
-4 Signal Pest
-4 Springleaf Drum
-4 artifact land
+4 Ancient Tomb - This card is awesome.
+4 Porcelain Legionnaire. 3/1 first strike artifact for 2 mana? Pretty cool. Either him or Steel Overseer (who's pretty awesome with 8 zero cc creatures and Ancient Tomb.)
+4 Paradise Mantle - I really hate to drop Springleaf drum, that card simply won games, but with the soon to be rise of Mental Misstep and chalice@1 decks, let's capitalize on virtual CA. The color-fix is neccessary, though.
The skirge has a CMC of 2, 1 {PB} to be excact.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenpoe
I think it's time the deck moves away from the black 1/1 wizard to cards like master epitherium that are good on their own.
We can play chalice at 1 ourselves. All of our guys can be 0cc or 2cc. The skiege helps with that by costing one mana but having a converted mana cost of two.
If we play the 2cc artifact 2/1 flyer, that plus skirge gives us enough flyers for plating that we can probably cut out Ornithopter (mostly useless outside of cranial plating)
IMO the 2/1 flyer is not viable. What we want is explosiveness, our 2cc-drops are already enough due the 3cc drops like Master of Etherium or Etched Champion. We don't want to put the mana-curve slightly higher with every set that is released. On the one hand this block made this deck much faster (Mox Opal) , but on the other hand we got some threats (Etched Champion, Tezzeret) with higher mana-amounts. I won't risk to lose more explosivness with a 2/1 flyer. We already have a high amount of evasive creatures (Champion, Pest, Ornithopter, Skirge, Inkmoth- / Blinkmoth-Nexus, maybe Thopter Foundry).
And the skirge is fixing the liveloss of the Ancient Tombs and is well fitting in the deck. I will cut the Frogmites for them, cause the Signal Pest is just going nuts in this deck.
The Ornithopter is great cause it is boosting Mox Opal with the artifact lands and Memnites. Just try out how often you get your T1-Mox to work without them. IMO mostly all classical lists have to run four of them.
Frogmite is great against pernicious deed, engineered explosives, etc. I won't cut him at all
I'm really liking Torpor Orb. It's definitely a bit narrow, but will be great against Imperial Painter, Thopter and Aluren decks. I'll run a copy in my sideboard for sure.
http://www.channelfireball.com/wp-co...Torpor-Orb.jpg
painter is like Iona, doesn't trigger.
Recruiters trigger.
Seems good...
In my opinion and coming from a strong combo meta, Mental Misstep is the best thing that has happened to the deck in a while. Will be running 4x .