[Deck] GW/x Maverick

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Originally Posted by Esper3k

I'd personally cut the 1-of SFM for something else since you can't regularly find it anyways. Maybe a Thrun or Sigarda to GSZ for.

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I run 1-of Stoneforge Mystic as Jitte#2 and SoLS#2. He doesn't come up very often, but seems fine when he does.

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@Vandalize's list: Going -2 Krosan Grip, +2 Oblivion Ring would already improve the Show&Tell matchup without really messing up the others that much. Perhaps that's a good change to make.

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Yeah, that should work. Still, Show and Tell is by far my worst matchup. I'll try the O-Rings.

New list:

Lands [23]
4 Savannah
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Forest
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Maze of Ith
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Plains
1 Karakas

Creatures [25]
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mother of Runes
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Qasali Pridemage
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Scryb Ranger
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Stoneforge Mystic

Spells [12]
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Sylvan Library
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Light and Shadow

Sideboard [15]
2 Gaddock Teeg
2 Ethersworn Cannonist
2 Wilt-Leaf Liege
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Path to Exile
1 Thrun, the last Troll
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Umezawa's Jitte

I'll give this baby a spin. In testings, I found that Path to Exile and Bojuka Bog are the most sided-in cards. Followed closely by the other hatebears (Storm is a thing in my meta).

Do you ever use the Liege for its +1/+1 ability? If not, then you could go -1 Thrun, -2 Liege, +3 Loxodon Smiter in the side. This gives you one more dude that comes into play via opposing discard, and two more dudes that are uncounterable. I'm not sure it's the right call, but it seems the sideboard would become more diverse with this change. Smiters are also nice against decks where you want to side out a lot. Three mana 4/4 dude is nothing to sneeze at, and it's easier to cast than Liege and Thrun.

I use wilt-leaf liege and not bad; does not destroyed by abrupt decay, enter the battlefield by discarding and in the marginal situations save the humans for enginereed plague.

loxodon is 4/4 for 3 manas but kill with abrupt and don't cause impact in the battlefield when enter... in G/W It is more important the habilities that the muscle, because of it are not played tarmogoyf

Smiters are more generally useable. They are also strong against TempoThresh (unDazeable).
I'm not saying it's the right call, but it's worth looking at, since Maverick needs to have as many sideboard cards as possible that are useable in multiple matchups. My ideal Maverick sideboard has about 35 cards, so we need to shave off quite a few. :tongue:

The truth is that the option smiter not contemplate, I think with the more ideas the better, I leave my list to see what you think.

3 Mother of Runes
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Noble Hierarch
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Dryad Arbor
3 Savannah
4 Windswept Heath
1 Plains
2 Forest
1 Karakas
1 Maze of Ith
4 Wasteland
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Horizon Canopy
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Sylvan Library
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Path to Exile
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Wilt-Leaf Liege
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
SB: 2 Path to Exile
SB: 1 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 Oblivion Ring
SB: 1 Enlightened Tutor
SB: 1 Garruk Relentless
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 2 Choke
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 Mindbreak Trap
SB: 1 Bojuka Bog

i think the better version of maverick is with red splash for punishing fire.
this is the italian's pro list.

1 Dryad Arbor
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Qasali Pridemage
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mother of Runes
3 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Sylvan Library
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Karakas
1 Plains
1 Forest
3 Savannah
3 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Punishing Fire
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Taiga
1 Plateau
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Life from the Loam
2 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Arid Mesa

I think a B splash is the way to go

- Deathrite Shaman is better than Noble Hierarch. Far better. Exalted is nice, but Shaman is nuts.

- Abrupt Decay is better than Swords to Plowshares. It is a bit more difficult to cast but it kills Sylvan Library, Counterbalance, Jitte, Liliana and Aether Vial. There are pretty much no CMC4+ creatures in the meta.

- gives access to 4 Thoughtseize and some Duress post board for the dreaded combo matchup

- With ~10 fetchlands I think you can play DR Shaman and KotR in the same deck, despite their anti-synergy: because a) often you won't have both b) KotR's tutoring is not impacted by DR Shaman (tutored Karakas, Wastelands have enough impact in the right matchups that you don't need that much power) c) KotR can outgrow DR Shaman's land eating relatively quickly and d) once you have KotR in play you do not need DR Shaman for the mana as much anymore

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Originally Posted by Tao

I think a B splash is the way to go

- Deathrite Shaman is better than Noble Hierarch. Far better. Exalted is nice, but Shaman is nuts.

- Abrupt Decay is better than Swords to Plowshares. It is a bit more difficult to cast but it kills Sylvan Library, Counterbalance, Jitte, Liliana and Aether Vial. There are pretty much no CMC4+ creatures in the meta.

- gives access to 4 Thoughtseize and some Duress post board for the dreaded combo matchup

- With ~10 fetchlands I think you can play DR Shaman and KotR in the same deck, despite their anti-synergy: because a) often you won't have both b) KotR's tutoring is not impacted by DR Shaman (tutored Karakas, Wastelands have enough impact in the right matchups that you don't need that much power) c) KotR can outgrow DR Shaman's land eating relatively quickly and d) once you have KotR in play you do not need DR Shaman for the mana as much anymore

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How many DSR do you plan to add? DSR has a problem with other decks playing DSR, preventing you from using one of it's ability as a mana source. It's also weak to GY removal. It's pretty annoying. But I will agree with you, I do think DSR is better than Hierarch, just not sure how much better.

As for 4+ CMC4 creatures: Tombstalker, Bloodbraid Elf, every SnT/Sneak Attack/Reanimator known to mankind. STP is one of the main reasons to play W over B. Abrupt Decay can find a place, but I would caution against thinking it's an STP replacement.

Duress is arguably better than Thoughtseize in the combo matchup. I wouldn't run 4 Thoughseize main decked. IoK can also be just as good. 3-4 split of Thoughtseize/IoK is probably best and what most people run. Less IoK if you run more Abrupt.

Now the bigger question: What to remove?


Also I just want to add (has nothing to do with B splash), I hate Thalia when I play PF.

- I'd play 4 DR Shaman and 3-4 Decays. Not cut much, just replace Swords with Decay and Hierarch with DR Shaman.

- I don't think you'd ever use Swords against Bloodbraid Elf. " And it certainly isn't good against "every SnT/Sneak Attack/Reanimator known to mankind"... The main advantages are Tombstalker and the Mana cost.

- the mana denial from other DR Shamans is a double edged Sword. It is not only their Shaman denying your mana, it works both ways.

- Thoughtseize / Duress is only SB for Combo matchup. Wouldn't want to play it in the MD.

how is the matchup against esperblade?

Whats the boarding strategy?

Very depends on build of both decks:

I think much better is GW/r then straight GW list in this particular MU. MU is calculated on about tide 50-50. After board its very depends on sb - Zealous Persecution is very nasty, also plague on humans changes tide specially vs straight GW list.

Boarding stategy:
depends on your sideboard - Engineered Explosives and additional Jitte is always worth, also Elspeth, Knight-Errant is good vs heavy removal control. Sometimes recurring wasteland from life from the loam is enough to win this MU. Red Elemental Blast vs Jaces/Cliques and snapcasters (in GW/r list) but MVP are recurring Punishing Fire and Sylvan Library: it kills Liliana, SFM, Tokens, Cliques, and also Jaces second MVP are Qasali Pridemages vs Equipments and Scavenging Ooze which stop (not always) CA from Souls and Snapcaster Mages.

Chokes aren't so effective similar like in BUG MU, since it runs more unblue duals/basics.

Gaddock/MoR/Sylvan Safekeeper look isn't so effective here since it stops only Jaces/FoWs(which they mostly side-out) and some board sweepers like Supreme Verdict, but Esper runs mostly Perish on sb which break the lock - always keep that in mind before goes all-in.

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Originally Posted by pingpong

@ BLack

First off im Tyler *waves*

So how do you feel about light and shadow and why not double jitte or jitte fire and ice ??

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sorry for the late reply! I've been busy with midterms all week XP.

Well, I've been very happy with the sword actually. The pro white allows creatures to get past lingering souls, which i find maverick has a problem with. the pro black is good? its no where near as good as the pro white imo. as far as the abilities go, jitte does the life gain too, so thats a tie. however being able to bring back creature that got abrupt decayed- pretty good.

i actually used to run double jitte (do you run that?) , but i switched to the light and shadow solely for the pro-white..

never had the chance to run sword of fire and ice. don't know if the pro-colors are that great in the meta?

SoFaI is really good when Merfolk is a big thing in your meta.
I ran it when I first played this deck, and completely killed the Merfs with it.
It's also brilliant against Sligh and Goblins, and good against any heavy control deck.

Thoughts on the other swords:
Against stuff like Bant, the Mirror, Stoneblade and Deadguy Ale, you should use SoLaS.
SoFaF is big against Jund and Team America. The discard can be nice against combo.
SoBaM in my opinion is only good in a deck that doesn't play that many creatures.
In Legacy SoWaP is just worse than the other swords, because of its mostly irrelevant abilities.

I found some solution for most S&T decks.

I was playing some anti-Imperial Painter - used oldschool Gaea's Blessing, but then I switched to Emrakul after I sided it vs S&T MU - and it was deal. Most of times S&T decks aren't S&T->Emrakul vs us since they afraid Knight of the Reliquary on other side which brings them in disadvantage (bounce Emrakul with Karakas and they just waste S&T without any effect - except KotR in-play).

Most of the playline of S&T:

Omni:

S&T -> Griselbrand.
S&T -> Omni -> combo from Bruning with or Grisel/Emrakul - this line of play we can't stop mostly (only with trigger on stack).
S&T -> Emrakul - this line of play they won't make unless they must.

Sneak Attack:

S&T -> Griselbrand.
S&T -> Sneak Attack -> Griselbrand Emrakul similar to Omni.
S&T -> Emrakul - avoidable if they can.

Cloudpost:

S&T -> Green Titan.
S&T -> Fattie - this line of play they avoid vs Maverick.

So basically if we put Emrakul instead of O-ring which resolve most problems but doesn't put us on any advantage (mostly disadvantage since Griselbrand and in Cloudpost MU Green Titan.

So Emmy vs S&T ->opponent Griselbrand is quite nuts - they mostly pass the turn after all, with had of full disruption/permission and next turn kill. Emmy clean their table and punish then enough for Grissly draw - if they use any draw -> Emmy would be leathal :].

Emmy vs Sneak Attack -> If they put Emmy legend rule, if they put Griselbrand from Sneak its not ended yet (depends if they have additonal second red).

If they put Emmy which would mostlu doesn't happend - works like Oring.

I don't have to say how works Emmy vs Green titan -> 2 lands into play -> 6 lands from Anihilator trigger :].


So single dedicated slots for S&T decks would be Emrakuls. - You can't still win via Omni or Sneak with double red open but it doesn't happend to often.

Hi,
what do you guys think about using Imperial Recruiter as an additional tutor for cards that GSZ can't fetch?

I've been thinking about something like this:

3x Savannah
3x Wasteland
4x Windswept Heath
2x Cavern of Souls
1x Maze of Ith
2x Wooded Foothills
1x Karakas
1x Gaea's Cradle
2x Forest
1x Plains
1x Dryad Arbor
1x Plateau
1x Taiga
23 Lands

2x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
12 Spells

4x Mother of Runes
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Birds of Paradise
4x Imperial Recruiter
1x Thalia
4x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Sigarda, Host of Herons
1x Gaddock Teeg
2x Scavenging Ooze
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Mirran Crusader
1x Stoneforge Mystic
25 Creatures


Some Sideboard cards for Imperial Recruiter:

Phyrexian Revoker
Meddling Mage
Phyrexian Metamorph
Ethersworn Canonist
Aven Mindcensor

Edit: Typo (Thx, Esper3k)

I assume you mean Imperial Recruiter :)

I don't think it's that good in Maverick, especially cutting Thalia's for them. Part of the power of Thalia in Maverick is dropping her on T2 and disrupting your opponent early (very necessary against combo), which you're very rarely going to do when you cut her down to 1. Most of the time, you're talking T3 Recruiter, T4 Thalia? Seems a lot worse...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tao

- I'd play 4 DR Shaman and 3-4 Decays. Not cut much, just replace Swords with Decay and Hierarch with DR Shaman.

- I don't think you'd ever use Swords against Bloodbraid Elf. " And it certainly isn't good against "every SnT/Sneak Attack/Reanimator known to mankind"... The main advantages are Tombstalker and the Mana cost.

- the mana denial from other DR Shamans is a double edged Sword. It is not only their Shaman denying your mana, it works both ways.

- Thoughtseize / Duress is only SB for Combo matchup. Wouldn't want to play it in the MD.

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I fixed my deck up with Deathrite Shamans because Scavenging Ooze was just too slow dealing with some decks (Reanimator and Oops, All Spells specificaly) and seems to offer a lot more versatility than the Hierarchs, despite losing the Exalted triggers. I left in two Hierarchs and just took out the Oozes because they were just underperforming that much and noticed a huge jump in the deck's performance. I don't know how I feel about Abrupt Decays over Swords, though. 2 CMC vs. 1 CMC and though the Decay can't be countered, it also doesn't hit some of the other problem cards in some of my matchups, like Griselbrand and Emrakul Elesh Norn.

This is my current list:

Land (23)
1x Bayou
2x Cavern of Souls
1x Dryad Arbor
2x Forest
1x Horizon Canopy
1x Karakas
1x Maze of Ith
1x Plains
2x Savannah
1x Scrubland
4x Verdant Catacombs
4x Wasteland
2x Windswept Heath

Creatures (26)
4x Deathrite Shaman
1x Gaddock Teeg
4x Knight of the Reliquary
4x Mother of Runes
2x Noble Hierarch
3x Qasali Pridemage
3x Stoneforge Mystic
1x Sublime Archangel
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

Spells (11)
1x Batterskull
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Swords to Plowshares
1x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte


Sideboard (15)
1x Bojuka Bog
1x Crop Rotation
2x Ethersworn Canonist
2x Kataki, War's Wage
3x Mindbreak Trap
1x Perish (may seem like a nombo but it helps with the combo elves matchups I face)
2x Sejiri Steppe
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Tower of the Magistrate

This week I'm actually going to be testing an Elspeth, Knight-Errant in place of Sublime Archangel (I just picked her up yesterday) and also plan on trying out Rafiq of the Many but adding the Archangel and Deathrites (which I did about two/three weeks ago) really boosted the deck's performance. I also just picked up most of the duals in the last week to really round out the deck (I was running Temple Gardens initially because I was on a budget) so I'm also curious to see how it'll perform with those in place of the shocks. The Scrubland wasn't exactly my first choice but I'm hoping it'll do.

My biggest problem is still some combo decks. Combo Elves gives me a hard time with Progenitus and building a small army that I have a hard time breaking through (hence the Steppes and the Perish in the side) and Belcher is extremely prominent in my meta and is a nightmare for my deck most of the time unless I hit the early Mindbreak Trap postboard. As mentioned before, Oops, All Spells is tough too, but a little easier since postboard approximately 1/4 of my deck can effectively become some form of hate against it.

StP doesn't hit Emrakul either...

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Originally Posted by BlackFlameAshura

I don't know how I feel about Abrupt Decays over Swords, though. 2 CMC vs. 1 CMC and though the Decay can't be countered, it also doesn't hit some of the other problem cards in some of my matchups, like Griselbrand and Emrakul.

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:eyebrow:

Also, the fact that Swords hit Griselbrand is nearly irrelevant, cause either they draw into a counter for it anyway, or if they don't or decide to let it resolve, they basically get a D7 for free.