Modified my list a bit. Will play a few tourneys, probably one at Gencon, if there is one. And I will give you guys a few reports + the list .
Printable View
Modified my list a bit. Will play a few tourneys, probably one at Gencon, if there is one. And I will give you guys a few reports + the list .
My list:
4 [LG] Karakas
3 [MM] Rishadan Port
2 [TSP] Flagstones of Trokair
9 [DDC] Plains (1)
4 [REW] Wasteland
2 [PLC] Stonecloaker
3 [TSP] Mangara of Corondor
3 [EVE] Flickerwisp
3 [CHK] Isamaru, Hound of Konda
4 [TSP] Serra Avenger
2 [CS] Jotun Grunt
3 [ALA] Ethersworn Canonist
2 [EVE] Figure of Destiny
3 [ALA] Oblivion Ring
4 [CST] Swords to Plowshares
3 [BOK] Umezawa's Jitte
2 [EX] Cataclysm
4 [DS] AEther Vial
// Sideboard
1 [CS] Jotun Grunt
1 [ALA] Ethersworn Canonist
1 [EX] Cataclysm
2 [CHK] Samurai of the Pale Curtain
2 [NE] Seal of Cleansing
3 [LE] Glowrider
4 [LRW] Burrenton Forge-Tender
I've found figure of destiny to be great. Especially with vial out the 4/4 pump can easily be done.
Still not sure about the mana base. I might switch to 4 port / 3 waste. Sometimes it's not worth it to use waste because you need the mana yourself.
Main feels quite solid, but I'm not sure about the SB. Neither am I sure if I should move cataclysm entirely to SB, I guess thats a metagame question.
Any thoughts?
I have also liked Figure of Destiny. The deck needs some help versus Zoo, and this is just the sort of fellow to do it. I think you should up the count.
One funny idea: Ring of Brightheart. It works with so many cards in the deck, so I decided to try it. Here's what I have now:
LANDS (21):
4 Karakas
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
2 Plateau
7 Plains
Red splash wtf:tongue:
Wastes and fetches work with Ring.
1-DROPS (13)
3 Isamaru, Hound of Konda - Obv
4 Aether Vial - works with Ring :tongue:
4 Swords to Plowshares - Obv
2 Enlightened Tutor - 'cause I like tollbox and >1 Ring is too much
2-DROPS (12)
3 Serra Avenger - Obv
2 Jotun Grunt - Obv
3 Ethersworn Canonist - Obv, tutorable
2 Umezawa's Jitte - Obv, tutorable, works with Ring
2 Lightning Helix - I found this card to be subpar in pure aggro 'cause 3 life are irrevelant there, but in slower decks like this... It kills almost any creature in Zoo and Tribal and lifegain really gives a space to breath vs :r:-based aggro.
3-DROPS (11)
4 Flickerwisp - Obv
3 Mangara of Corondor - Obv, works like hell with Ring
2 Kitchen Finks - Test creature, kinda hot with Flickerwisp, fits the antiaggro role, great with Jitte.
1 Ring of Brightheart - I like unusual cards and I like to find home for them. Howewer, this one does nothing without other cards, so only tutorbox singleton...
1 Oblivion Ring - Extreme situation insurance.
4-DROPS (3)
3 Ajani Vengeant - Hell Yeah! Planeswalkers are the best cards to abuse Ring of Brightheart.
SIDEBOARD
4 Orim's Chant - Obv
1 Ethersworn Canonist - Obv
1 Absolute Law - Obv
1 Tormod's Crypt - Obv
1 Relic of Progenitus - Obv, works with Ring
1 Sacred Ground - Wastelock/Geddon/... insurance
1 Seal of Cleansing - Art/ench hate, works with Ring
1 Aura of Silence - Special art/ench hate, works with Ring
1 Jotun Grunt - Very underplayed card, you need 3rd against a descent number of tier decks.
3 Free Slots
The basis is the old MD Cataclysm list. The first change is boot to Stonecloaker to add Finks. The second is E-Tutor to fit in Ring. And the third is Planeswalker instead of Cataclysm to abuse Ring. I choose Ajani Vengeant 'cause I wanted :r: to work for DnT and I like Helixes very much in this deck, but Elspeth is as broken with Ring as AV.
Have anyone tried to use Planeswalkers instead of Cataclysm (if anyone still try to play Cataclysm here)
Firemind:
I'm running cataclysm, and for a monowhite build elspeth could be something to test out instead of cataclysm. I'm not sure how well it fits the gameplan though.
Finks seems to be descent, but I'm not sure I'd like another 3-drop(maybe instead of cloaker in that case).
What about the manabase? In mono-w I'm not sure about wasteland because the deck is mana intensive, but with a splash, doesnt the situation get worse?
Any results you have hade with the green and red splash versions would be nice to know of.
Pump flyers for win I think.:smile:.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtreme
Yeah, that's right the thing I've done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtreme
In :g: spalsh, there's fucking Noble Hierarch and no problems at all (even beter than mono-:w:).Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtreme
<EDIT>: No, wait, this is how it must look like:
FUCKING NOBLE HIERARCH
</EDIT>
:r: variant is just an idea for now, the key change is to improve aggro MU with Helix and Ajani and do some broken things with Ring of Brightheart (like double-Helix from Ajani V. or +8/+8 from only 2 Jitte counters or double Wasteland/fetch...), but mana can be an issue. Weathered Wayfarer maybe(also usable with Ring), but the space is already very tight...
Unfortunately, no. 11-hours workday all summer :cry:. Maybe in september...Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtreme
But I done some tests and for me :g: splash is superior to mono-:w: 'cause Noble Hierarch is a powerhouse.
Living Wish was bad only very very few times and was almost always good to awesome, so I'll keep it. Most wishable cards: Karakas, Mangara, Jotun Grunt, Gaddock Teeg. Just keep in mind that if you don't need something special, just wish to sculpt your hand/find creature with right CMC for Vial(i.e. use it like Thresh uses Brainstorm). Don't wait for the situation, play YOUR game - and you'll perform fine.
Most sideble card: obv 2 Krosan Grip. Split Second Disenchant is aldo great addition :g: provides to the deck and, combined with acceleration provided by Hierarch this increased game against our bad opponent: Landstill. Something about 45/55 pre- and 55/45 postboard vs Landstill(depends on particular builds of 'Still, UWx without Deed is easier 'cause of 2 Gaddock Teeg MD).
Changes:
-3 cataclysm -> sb
-1 Wasteland
+2 Elspeth
+1 Figure of Destiny
+1 Plains
I wanted to have less 4 drops, so after first adding 3 elspeth I cut one.
ANT seems to be gaining polularity so I really would like to fit 4 chants in sb, not sure what to cut though.
The deck runs very smoothly atm with very little mulliganing. Ofcourse Elspeth and cataclysm dont mix so if cataclysm is sided in, Elspeth goes out. I'm quite happy with the main so I guess it's time to go to test a tournament with it
EDIT:
I need help against counterbalance. Any suggestions?
If the opppnent gets counterbalance working you could be in trouble. The best defense you have is aether vial. But if you are encountering a lot of cb, I might try pithing needle set to divining top. I play wasteland and port, so I commonly have my threats in place before thresh can make cb pay off. But not always. When that happens I find myself baiting him so I can land an O. Ring.
Hey guys - long time lurker, been playing and loving D & T for a while now...!
Just a random idea, since we're considering Figure of Destiny (I have a few copies on order to test out), what about a copy or 2 of Gargoyle Castle? It almost seems like FoD in land form, giving that late game knockout blow. Vulnerable to Wasteland of course, but I can't see it being a giant target...and if they nuke it, great - one less Wasteland to get at Karakas. Of course tapping for colourless isn't amazing, but with the current land mix I never feel stuck for white mana...
Probably a ridiculous idea, but seems like it could be a semi-fun/effective addition :laugh:
I almost never have 6 lands, so I would go with Mishra's factory before castle
True, but I don't mind forking out a few extra mana for the fact that this + Stonecloaker would make it the closest thing to a Gargoyle tribal deck in existence! +10 Style points... :laugh:Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtreme
I went 5-0 in the swiss round robin last week and then lost to this piece of jank in the first round of the top 8. Unreal! I cannot believe how tech mana tithe can be if you aren't expecting it! I thought it was a terrible and unplayable card that does not belong in this deck or any other for that matter. I am still probably right because I see most players here are not using it. However, the element of surprise on a pivotal game breaking play can sometimes mean all the difference.
1w Enchantment Common
When Journey to Nowhere enters the battlefield, exile target creature.
When Journey to Nowhere leaves the battlefield, return the exiled creature to the battlefield under its owner's control.
Discuss!
Minty, I think most players are looking for a replacement for Oblivion Ring. D+T has plenty of really good ways to handle opponent creatures. Oblivion Ring is good because of the array of targets it can nix. It is bad, not because it is too slow, but because it is an enchantment. This card seems to have all of the important weaknesses of Oblivion Ring with none of its important advantages.
Thumbs down for me.
If I wanted more creature removal than 4 swords I would add path to exile.
Sidenotes:
-I tried out honor the pure, and it's horrible.
-Elspeth is superb
Saw this on the MTGS spoiler, immediately thought of Death and Taxes.
Kor Skyfisher 1W
Flying
When ~this~ enters the battlefield, return target permanent you control to owners' hand.
2/3
Thoughts?
That could be nice with vial in play, but without vial it's really not that good. Although 1 mana cheaper, I would run Stonecloaker instead of that any time, as it operates without vial.
In comparison that guy could randomly save a Jitte or o. ring or "reset" a vial, but that's again with vial on board,. Too situational imho
Skyfisher misses the mark just a bit imo. At two mana, he is too cheap to reliably get in from a vial that is stationed at 3 as soon as it can be. That means that you will be hardcasting it most of the time. And then his ability does next to nothing.
Is this worth testing?
Kor Duelist w
Creature - Kor Soldier Uncommon
As long as Kor Duelist is equipped, it has double strike.
1/1
How many equips do you have in your build? 2 jittes?Quote:
Originally Posted by Minty
3 thats enough to test 2-3 of them.
He is a perfect 1cc drop threat combined with Jitte.
I really think its worth some testing!
Lately I have struggled with the manabase. I'm thinking about adding a few utilitylands, probably mishra's factory, and maybe cut the elspeths to get the curve lower. Any ideas? Would fetchlands be that bad?
/me casts Reanimate on the thread…
I don't think fetchlands are a good idea in a mono-W build. Losing life and having your lands go to the bin as a useless victim of Stifle et al. isn't worth the "Library-thinning" effects imho.
Any new developments on D&T, anyone? :)
I haven't had time to test much lately, but I'll be taking D&T to the next monthly local event. We will be around 15 players (so that's not much). Last time there were lots of Zoo, so I'm planning on going with the standard list, but with -1 plains -3 Figure of Destiny +1 wasteland +3 Kitchen Finks.
I would rather play 8 disruptive lands than 7, they really own shaky manabases, such as domain zoo and to some extent landstill.
I don't own any Figures, so I opt to play Finks. I know they make the deck somewhat slower, but I believe the added lifegain and persist from Finks makes them worthwile. Some time ago, I tried playing with Icatian Javelineers, with a pretty standard list. They seem alright, but I'm not sure they're good enough. Also, that was when I was playing 3 stonecloakers, which makes them reusable. They hit Grim Lavamancer and most importantly Dark Confidant. I also used them to great effect against elves, but there haven't been any elves in my metagame, so I don't think they're good enough.
I have been thinking about doing -1 canonist +1 Stonecloaker, but I'm leaning towards not. Stonecloaker saves my guys from removal, but he slows the deck further down, which I'm not interested in.
About the sideboard, I'm not sure I'll include any combohate, unless I see someone with combo. So I think the 7 slots can be used better, but I'm not sure what I want to have yet, possibly more Dredge hate, as we see a lot of that.
We were 33 at the tournament, which was really overwhelming. Anyway, I top8'ed but got knocked out by dredge, which sucked, because I thought noone played it, when I spied before the actual tournament.
Here's my list, and a small report:
Which is just the standard list, with Finks instead of Figures, and an extra wasteland instead of a plains.Code:4 Karakas
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
10 Plains
4 Ethersworn Canonist
4 Serra Avenger
4 Flickerwisp
3 Jotun Grunt
3 Mangara of Corondor
3 Isamaru, Hound of Konda
3 Kitchen Finks
4 Aether Vial
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Oblivion Ring
3 Umezawa's Jitte
board
3 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Jotun Grunt
3 Glowrider
4 Orim's Chant
3 Cataclysm
Round 1 against one-land belcher 0-2
Match 1: I don't know what he's playing, but I keep a hand with vial, plains, swords, isamaru, karakas and something else irrelevant. I lead with plains, vial, go. He plays Taiga, go. I put a counter on vial, play karakas and go. He combos on his turn 2, with a belcher for 40 or something.
I board chants, an O.Ring, and glowriders, for 4 swords, 1 port, 1 finks, 1 wisp, 1 jitte
Match 2: I mull because I have no hate. I keep a hand with canonist. Put a land into play and pass the turn. He combos on his turn 1 with a tendrils for 20. Sucks.
Anyway. On to round 2. I face a Reanimator deck, and win 2-0.
Match 1: I play vial. Disrupt his mana, while canonist and angel do the job. I was a fairly quick game.
I board in 3 chants, 1 O.Ring and 1 grunt for 1 jitte, 3 finks and 1 wasteland (he plays monoblack).
Match 2: I land a turn 1 dog, disrupt his mana with port, and later mangara tricks. He kept a light mana hand, which makes it quite easy.
On to round 3, against White Weenie. 2-0
He plays without sleeves, so I guess it's a pretty bad aggroish deck, and I was right. I win both matches without much trouble.
Round 4 against goblins. 2-0
Match 1: This was actually a really great game, where Finks and Wisp shined, like nothing I have ever seen. I recieved 22 points of damage, but end the game with 14 life. Throughout the game, he attacks, and attack, but I keep killing his guys with finks, and the wisping it to remove the -1/-1 counter, until he's out of gas (I drew 2 finks, and 2 or 3 wisps), then his life goes 20 -> 18 -> 15 -> 6 -> 0.
I sideboard Forge-tenders and cataclysm in, I can't remember what I took out, but probably canonist and maybe mangara.
Match 2: He get's me on pressure, but I stabilize at 5, with finks, which takes me to 9 again. Then, after some draw go, I find a Jitte for my Forge-Tender, and win from there. I threw an unnescesary cataclysm during the game, which slowed him somewhat. I would've won regardless, I think.
Round 5: 42 lands (controlling version) 2-0
I didn't write many notes on round, but I got it was two great games.
Match 1: I lead with Isamaru on turn one. He plays manabond, but doesn't drop his hand, I can't remember why. The game develops, he gets Tabenacle, which is really annoying, but I have plenty of land, because I can keep him from wastelocking me with a grunt on the table. Together with 3 ports, i keep his relevant lands tapped, and grunt finishes him off.
I put grunts and cataclysm in, and takes mangara, I think, out.
Match 2: This looks like match one, only that he doesn't have tabernacle, and I have vial. I control the entire game.
After the 5 swiss rounds, I'm number 4. The only two dredge decks in the tourney also top8'ed, which sucked, as I thought nobody would play it :( I was knocked out by one of them. The match wasn't really interesting. Although I have to say, that Grunt doesn't do much, unless you can get to turn 3-4 before they put their library into their graveyard, which is not possible, with only forge-tender and grunt as dredge "hate".
I was really surprised, that Finks were that good. Maybe I just played agains decks where he's good, I don't know, he just seems like the perfect fit for the deck. I haven't tried figure, as I don't own them, but I certainly will, the next time i test with my buddies (might be quite a while, Christmas you know :) ).
All in all, I was really happy with how the deck performed.
Nice report, thanks for your insights.
I wonder what you guys think about Isamaru, Hound of Konda these days. When I began playing D&T about a year ago, I was wondering if I wanted four insteaf of the three I played back then; today, there's only one puppy left in my list. I'm running Mother of Runes now, as a full 4-of, and think it's one of the best one-drops ever.
Another thing I'm increasingly worrying about is Oblivion Ring. It's incredibly versatile, and I love to banish Planeswalkers off the battlefield with it, but with Qasali Pridemage and Krosan Grip having found a place in just about any deck or it's sideboard, I'd be happy to see a better replacement with comparable versatility.
Comments and musings highly appreciated!
I agree that kitchen finks is definaly worth testing, its a bomb against zoo and burn decks. (gaining life and able to block their creatures and kill them)
Also when i still played D&T (stopped playing it couse of new rules, and the fact that alot of cards from my D&T got stolen..) i never really liked isamaru much, it always felt like the weakest card in the deck.. especially with the new rules.
And is Burrenton Forge-Tender really that good to be included in the sideboard? (i must admid, i never tested it)
Heh yeah playing D&T against lands is pretty fun. I did it with an older version sporting Stonecloaker to get rid of key threats in the yard and Samurai of the Pale Curtain to prevent recursion. I annoyed him about as much as he annoyed me with his Tabernacle et. al.
Kitchen Finks is getting mighty popular now. To be honest, the green splash is getting a lot of attention, with cards like Knight of the Reliquary (get Karakas etc.), Goyf (beat face), Pridemage, and Finks (though they don't NEED green). I'd suggest trying it out. =)
Isamaru is now oftentimes Figure of Destiny.
@ hjalte: how was playing without Mother of Runes? It seems you performed well even without her backup protection. I'm asking this because I dropped Mom from my Angel Stompy build, and D&T is a much slower deck. I needed someone who could confirm to me that Mother isn't an auto-include.
@ colo: Oblivion Ring's drawback is not a problem. Qasali Pridemage can still be plowed on sight, and even if they crack it without giving priority you can still Flickerwisp the Ring in response. Just remember the importance of this card in the deck, because it solves many problems, and with the stacking trick with Flickerwisp you can even 2x1 your opponent, which is one of the few card advantage resources of the deck.
@ all: how is your feeling about Cataclysm in the sb? Weren't there any situations in which you were desperately in need of a reset button? How does this impact the control matchup?
Re: Cataclysm I haven't played in a while, and my meta was always aggro-heavy, but I've actually never taken it out of the maindeck. I think I just love the card too much: I am also trying to fit it into Stax. =P
Isamaru was quite bad, I have to say. He was ok against goblins, stopping lackey and instigator, but overall I think Mother of Runes is better, however mother does not beat for 2, which was something Dog did quite often. I think, the times I had Isamaru turn 1, he often beat for at least 4, which is alright.Quote:
Originally Posted by colo
I think Digital Devil is spot on, on Oblivion Ring. I also think, that a new creature, along the lines of pridemage would be nice, but I don't think we will get that. Maybe going up to 4 Mangara could do, instead of Oblivion Ring, but I'm worried, that his summoning sickness will be a problem too often.Quote:
Originally Posted by colo
It is great to have another 1-drop against goblins, which is relevant. The worst thing, that can possibly happen against them, is a turn one lackey, that connects. So I was happy in that matchup. I'm not sure, if he is worth it against Dredge. He do remove bridges, which I guess is nice, but he doesn't do enough by himself, we need at least Samurai's and/or something else, like crypt or relic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pienterekaak
I don't have the resources to get Tarmogoyfs (I have, but I don't want to part with my duals :) ) , so I have to stick with the mono white or a white/blue version (I will talk a bit more about that in a minute.). I really do think, that the green splash version looks promising. Pridemage is just the card for Death and Taxes, a really good hatebear, and goyf, who's just a monster, so I think that version is promising.Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbysdl
Mother is definately not an auto include, at least it wasn't necessary yesterday, and I'm not sure she's very much better that the alternatives, however I do think, that she adds something to the deck, that we sort of lost with the M10 rules change. The problem with Mother of Runes is, that she doesn't put pressure on our opponent. She solely protects our creatures, and I'm not sure that's enough for D&T.Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital Devil
I included it in the sideboard, to beat control. The only time I cast it, was against goblins, and there it wasn't necessary. Maybe it was even worse than not having it, as I tried to make him overcommit, but that didn't happen, and I lost a bit of life, and board development because of that. I have never really wanted a reset button, and I think, that with 4 wasteland and 4 port, it's not needed against control, though I might be wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital Devil
I have not been liking Isamaru, I don't think he does enough. The combat tricks is only a fog, and I have not wanted to save him from removal, as I have always had something better, that I would rather cast, when I had the mana on turn 3, so I want to remove him. With Isamaru gone, we only have 3 Mangara for the Karakas combo. So we play 4 waste-able legendary lands, for a combo which we can't even search for, and we do not play any search or cantrips to find it. I think that is very suboptimal.
So I think that we have to options: Incorporate other legends, which supports our game plan, or remove the Karakas/Mangara combo. I would rather go with the first option, so I will try a blue splash for Vendilion Clique, sometime, when I get the opportunity. I won't try the green splash, because I don't have, and have no intention to get, Tarmogoyf. And I have the cards to make a blue/white mana base. So I will probably be inspired by Finns Bag 'o Tricks, without the green cards, and keep it more similar to the traditional Death and Taxes deck, and then see where that takes me. As I said before, I don't have much time to test or develop anything, before i meet with my test buddies, which will be sometime during January, I hope.
I cannot agree here. I've been running Mom in the last 5 or 6 tournaments I've been to, and she's always a winner. If Mother of Runes isn't removed before her summoning sickness is gone, my (non-combo) opponents usually find themselves in boatloads of trouble. Rember she basically reads: "T: Counter target spot removal." This is HUGE. I also like how she's holding off that 6/7 Tarmogoyfs, or that 8/8 Master of Etheriums, until appropriate removal is at hand. I'd rather not have some little 2/2 Isamaru connect two times and win in the lategame, thanks to that tweensy little 1/1-mommy of mine.Quote:
Originally Posted by hjalte
I still think Cataclysm is mandatory in the sideboard. It's the only way out in a match versus landstill, and it gets so many player off guard. I recall vivdly how I turned a game in my favour some weeks ago versus Ultimate Walker (Landstill with Elspeth, Jace and RW Ajani in multiples), and my opponent's overly cool reaction to my resolving Cataclysm quickly turned into shock and awe, as he actually read what the card'd do to his trio of 'Walkers on the battlefield. Priceless! :D It's also one of _the_ punishers for players who overextend. I'm not a malicous person, but I just _love_ doing that.Quote:
Originally Posted by hjalte
I've been running Mangara as a 4-of since the very beginning btw. And I don't think that's a bad idea at all - he's one of D&T's strongest assets. Trades for anything you can find, with potential recursion. I'd probably play 5 or more if it were allowed.
I think you have a valid point. I will definitely try her out. But don't you think, that we get too few Karakas tricks, by removing Isamaru?Quote:
Originally Posted by colo
I would rather have some dredge hate in the sideboard, than cataclysm. How does your sideboard look like? I feel I need more dredge/graveyard hate, than I currently have.Quote:
I still think Cataclysm is mandatory in the sideboard. It's the only way out in a match versus landstill, and it gets so many player off guard. I recall vivdly how I turned a game in my favour some weeks ago versus Ultimate Walker (Landstill with Elspeth, Jace and RW Ajani in multiples), and my opponent's overly cool reaction to my resolving Cataclysm quickly turned into shock and awe, as he actually read what the card'd do to his trio of 'Walkers on the battlefield. Priceless! :D It's also one of _the_ punishers for players who overextend. I'm not a malicous person, but I just _love_ doing that.
Yeah, I think I'll go up to 4 as well. I also think he's that strong.Quote:
I've been running Mangara as a 4-of since the very beginning btw. And I don't think that's a bad idea at all - he's one of D&T's strongest assets. Trades for anything you can find, with potential recursion. I'd probably play 5 or more if it were allowed.
Looks like Mom does the same trick as Isamaru+Karakas (chumpblock Goyf, avoid removal), but just without Karakas. Seems good...Quote:
Originally Posted by hjalte
Also, people hate Mom, so they'll burn her on sight and then you punish them with Mangara...
I'll try 3 Mom + 3 Figure as 1-drops in mono-:w: build.
Also, Elspeth rocks. if you run 4-drop in main, it should be Elspeth.
Sidenote: I had 2 awesome games last week: first against Hexmage Depts, second against Entomb Reanimator. Marit Lage, Iona, meet the Legend Land.
Now THAT was Karakas tricks!
Awesome! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by eq.firemind
@hjalte: I always adapt my sideboard to what I'm about to deal with on a specific day. Last time I went to a tourney, the list read like this:
3 Tormod's Crypt - Obvious.
3 Retribution of the Meek - Handles Progenitus, Tarmogoyf, Tombstalker, Phyrexian Dreadnought, Inkwell Leviathan, …
3 Ethersworn Canonist - A glimpse of hope against storm combo (which I did not expect to actually show up that day - would have been 4 otherwise).
3 Tivadar of Thorn - hoses Goblins. Goblins actually saw play, but I did not face them.
3 Cataclysm - See above.
I also play 4 Jotun Grunt mainboard, so my mainboard yardhate is usually quite strong. I don't think I've rolled over to dredge/chorid more than 25% of all matches (this, however, includes "the old days" pre-M10, when Stonecloaker improved the matchup even further).
I've also exchanged Isamaru for Mother of Runes. The hound is pretty terrible now that combat damage no longer uses the stack. Of course, one might say the same thing about D&T in general.
Indeed. I was so about to start buying the cards for this deck right before the M10 rules changes were announced. Good thing I'm a procrastinator!Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin
...But it sux that such a fun deck got nerfed so hard just because noobies can't understand Mogg Fanatic.
I've been playing with D&T for about 6 months now obtaining mostly greats results in every tournament I have played with it, and I must say regards Isamaru that he accomplish a role that I somehow feel is a necesary evil for this deck, that is to put some kind of pressure early in the game versus some decks, backed up with karakas most people find him quite annoying and I have also been glad for that 4 or 6 points of damage that he can get throught.
I know this deck is far away from a pure aggro but sometimes versus certain decks taking the aggro role is a really good bet, mantaining a clock, combat tricks and a disruption has made this deck my favorite and I don't see mom doing the job, sure she gives a lot of defense making spot removal harder for opponents and can chumpblock all day a lot of threats but I don't think this deck needs more of that, I can see FoD taking Isamaru's spot but I haven't tested him mostly for lack of time as final tests are quite a bitch in that matter.
Some people keep saying that. Yet with the adaptions made after M10, it keeps winning games.Quote:
Originally Posted by DukeDemonKn1ght
I don't miss the combat tricks of days past that much. The D&T engine keeps on doing well, you just need to fine-tune it to develop new strengths that replace, and even surpass, the old ones.
I understand your reasons, and I had the same argumentation 3-4 months ago, but it just seems that with the format shifted to aggro.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blues
I found myself being control far more often than before, thus Mom becomes better choice.
The only opponent I want to bite early is Combo, but the game solves in different plane and doggy is not enough pressure against modern ANT anyway.
The other situation is if Goblins have turn 1 Lackey. But it's 4 of 60 cards and 0-4 of 20-25 players...
All in all, this seems to be metagame choice and Mom looks better in most (but not all) metas of today...
Some months ago I started to play :g::w: DnT with Noble Hierarchs and Living Wishes and it slowly evolved into the thing I posted in GW Bombs thread - :g:-based midrange, completely different deck that has nothing in common with DnT.
So now I'll start from scratch, take the basic mono-:w: list and try to include :g: once again 'cause I'm fan of that color combination. And first of all, I'll try Sylvan Library 'cause I am now very impressed of how much this card can do.
Shhh, don't tell anyone!Quote:
Originally Posted by colo
So here's my new sketch:
LANDS (22)
4 Wasteland
3 Rishadan Port
4 Karakas
6 Plains
2 Savannah
3 Windswept Heath
1-DROPS (13-11)
4 Aether Vial
4 Swords to plowshares
3 Mother of Runes
2-0 Figure of Destiny/Isamaru
2-DROPS (15)
4 Serra Avenger
3 Jotun Grunt
3 Gaddock Teeg
2 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Sylvan Library
3-DROPS (10-12)
4 Flickerwisp
3 Mangara of Corondor
3 Oblivion Ring
0-2 Kitchen Finks
SIDEBOARD
1 Jotun Grunt
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Krosan Grip
1 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Cataclysm
3 Burrenton Forge-Tender
4 Orim's Chant
Mom+Teeg promises lots of fun against board control decks: Mom protects Teeg from spotshot removal and Teeg protects Mom from Damnation/Wrath of God/Engineered Explosives/Humility. Also, Teeg stops NO=>Progenitus.
Also, early Teeg can cool down Dredge by shutting down Dread Return and Breakthrough.
Sidenote: I had my first loss from Dragon Stompy. Sulfur Elemental is a bitch...