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@Crich3
Most? you mean Moat?
I'd probably go with Ring of Law in place of nether void.. although nether void is still so much better. It doesn't too matter really if u go null or recycle.. recycle is probably easier to cast cuz of GG but again its cmc is 6 so you should be fine
No one plays hibernation or Dystopia anymore. The GG on Recycle is probably at least a few percentage points easier to cast than the BB on Null. Check out your manabase to be sure.
Huzzah! Welcome to the Moat club =)Quote:
Originally Posted by CRich3
Which SCG are you going to? I've been wanting a 2nd Leyline for a while now, but not at the expense of the Nether Void slot. If you don't have access to a Void, then the next best thing is to run Curse of Exhaustion. It's not as good, but it's the primary alternative. It's >3, so TES and ANT's Abrupt Decays won't kill it, and it's one-sided, so you can still like Witness back an Extirpate and unload it, or whatever. I'm going to be doing some tinkering with Rector in the very near future, as I'm planning on running it in a week at the next Jupiter. I'll share my tweaks -- hopefully we can get you ready to go before SCG.
Here's what my friend from Pittsburgh sent me:Quote:
Originally Posted by Star|Scream
Mr nice guy games runs them monthly like clockwork. MNGG also fires 8 man events anytime there's 8 people interested. The vault in greensburg and empire cards in kent both have them sporadically. And for testing/travel friends CMU has drafts every Tuesday with me, rich, jd, and other legacy players in attendence.
So, there's something like 4 more places that you didn't know about to check into, and then the one you did know. Hopefully that helps =)
I tried out a few tweaks this week, but didn't get to see much of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arianrhod
-1 Eledamri's Call
-1 Recurring Nightmare
-1 Yosei
+1 GSZ
+1 Krond
+1 Eldrazi Conscription
I'm not suggesting anyone make these changes, they were just relatively straightforward 1:1 changes I could make to try out the Conscription. Krond seemed reasonable since I've gotten much feedback over the months about only running one Baneslayer in my list. The CC on Krond is rough, but it's Green Sunnable, so I figured I'd try it out. As a 6/6 flier with vigilance, he has some appeal.
Never did see Krond, nor get a chance to Zenith him in. I was able to Rector in Conscription onto a Witness once. That ended the game in a single blow (he was at 13). Obviously you'd prefer to put it on Sigarda (hexproof, don't worry about the 2-for-1) or Krond (trigger is good), but if the coast is clear to stick it elsewhere... Should anyone try this out, keep in mind that if you Rector in the conscription after declaring your attackers you don't get the Annihilator trigger.
It does need a better spot though. I like Nightmare a LOT, wouldn't want to give it up permanently.
That seems jankier than usual, even for Nic Fit ^_^Quote:
Originally Posted by slikwilly
Steve's been badgering me to try out an Omniscience. I've been pretending that my open slot is one while goldfishing, and I will admit that it does give the deck a legitimate way to kill someone -- once you have Omni and Recycle out, it's almost impossible to not win on the spot -- all you have to do is get to Nightmare, at which point you draw as much of your deck as you want, cast everything, and make your opponent skip their next 3 trillion untap steps.
There are other times where it's completely useless, because you run out of gas once you dump your hand with Omni, and you can't get to Recycle for some reason or another (not drawing a Rector is a big one). So you just topdeck your card directly into play, and it sucks.
We won't talk about what happens when you draw it, or open it in your 7.
At this point, while I am fond of it "when it works," I'm not thinking that it's good enough overall. Note that this is not referring to Viridia's 4-color list which can actually cast the damn thing. I'm just talking about shoehorning it into Rector, in the 1 slot that is currently open maindeck (currently Enlightened Tutor).
Hey there it's been a while
Yes, go try Omniscience (yes I am completely not objective here :D )
Though I find it hard to include it in a "regular" Rector build. I mean if you wanna combo it with Recycle AND Nigthmare, that's quite the impossible setup to me, or too late to be worth doing it because as late gamer the deck should have already won. And anyway, does the deck not already win with Recycle on board ?
I have not tested it yet a lot, but it seems unlikely to lose if you got Top and Recycle on board.
Oh and by the way: Scroll Rack + Enlightened Tutor FTW !!! :p
but that's another story, I don't even play this anymore in my latest list of Omniscience BGw.
about Krond: it is GSZ'able, but for 7 CCM, I would rather play some Karns (yeah ok they can't get tutored, but still)
Hahaha. Yeah, I've just been kinda fishing around for something fun to try the last couple weeks. Ran w/ Souls + Blessings last week, Krond + Conscription this week. The base Rector build has been pretty well set for a few months now, I need to try something new that I actually have the cards for (which rules out Scapeshift since of the many duals I own, Badlands and Tiagas are not in sufficient quantity to say nothing of Huntmasters, Scapeshifts, and who knows what else). I may give UR Delver a crack next week after someone posted a list running Temporal Mastery that seems interesting to me. And then it's back to base Rector so I can get a few weeks of practice in before SCG Indy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arianrhod
Of course, in my fantasy scenario, Boros Charm makes Puresteel Paladin a playable card. I may just decide to screw around with some crazy Boros deck just because Puresteel is my favorite card ever :) (If you ever see someone at an event w/ this playmat, stop and say hi.)
I still can't decide what list to play next week >.>
If i get my Time Warps and such in i'll go ChronoFit, but i fear they might be late.
Actually thinking really hard about going 4-color again, with Rectors and Omniscience and shizzle, because i just love the Control/Combo archetype too much :D
Other options are Jace-Fit or Regular Rector, as my Blessing Token list wasnt performing as well as i hoped vs BUG decks, need to find a way to fix that first.
Tried out HoneyT's punishing fire list from GP Denver and it was amazing. The main is anti creatures and the board becomes just combo and control hate.
Any interesting ideas for a punishing fire list or sideboard strategies?
I haven't posted in here in awhile. I think I have my Old PFire list in here somewhere...
Found it!
4 Veteran Explorer
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Wickerbough Elder
2 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Grave Titan
1 Broodmate Dragon
1 Eternal Witness
1 Thragtusk
1 Thrun The last Troll
2 Senseis Top
4 Cabal Therapy
1 Thoughtseize
4 Green Sun
3 Pernicious Deed
1 Go For the Throat
2 Innocent Blood
3 Punishing Fire
2 Liliana of the Veil
1 Garruk Primal Hunter
2 Maelstrom Pulse
Land:
4 Forest
4 Swamp
2 Mountain
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Wooded Foothills
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
This was pre RTR so Decay and DRS may get in here somewhere.
Edit: I dont remember the SB at all.. For awhile I ran Mindbreak Traps but those are probably horrible. I do remember having a Third Liliana and a Second Thoughtseize. And Red Blasts. I would probably do something like this now:
2 Thoughtseize
3 Red Blast
1 Liliana OTV
1 Pfire
1 Grove (for the creature MUs you get to make sure you draw the combo.)
Maybe a second Garruk for control MU's?
I have a list in my signature with which I did fairly well in Magic League Trials.
SB plans:
RUG:
- 4 Cabal Therapy
- 1 Primeval Titan
- 2 Punishing Fire
- 1 Recurring Nightmare
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
+ 2 Abrupt Decay
+ 1 Go for the Throat
+ 2 Red Elemental Blast
BUG Delver:
- 4 Cabal Therapy
- 1 Primeval Titan
- 1 Recurring Nightmare
- 2 Thragtusk
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
+ 2 Abrupt Decay
+ 1 Go for the Throat
+ 2 Red Elemental Blast
Stoneblade
- 3 Veteran Explorer
- 2 Damnation
- 1 Abrupt Decay
- 1 Green Sun's Zenith
- 1 Punishing Fire
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
+ 2 Thoughtseize
+ 2 Red Elemental Blast
+ 1 Slaughter Games
Miracles
- 3 Veteran Explorer
- 2 Damnation
- 2 Punishing Fire
- 2 Cabal Therapy
- 1 Wall of Blossoms
- 1 Green Sun's Zenith
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
+ 2 Abrupt Decay
+ 2 Thoughtseize
+ 2 Red Elemental Blast
+ 2 Slaughter Games
BUG Control
too many different versions to give a good plan... siding somewhere between BUG Delver and Stoneblade depending on what you see G1
Jund
- 3 Cabal Therapy
+ 1 Go for the Throat
+ 2 Abrupt Decay
Junk: see Jund
- 3 Cabal Therapy
+ 1 Go for the Throat
+ 2 Abrupt Decay
+ 2 Engineered Plague if they have plenty of Confidant and Lingering Souls
Maverick
- 2 Thragtusk
+ 2 Engineered Plague
Combo decks
+ 3 Thoughtseize
+ 2 Slaughter Games
(+ 2 Engineered Plague against Belcher)
(+ 3 Carpet of Flowers and + 2 Red Elemental Blast vs. blue Combo decks)
- there are plenty of bad cards, side out the worst ones
You don't need some janky Krond in Rector, especially not to justify Conscription. Just slot a singleton Conscription in, nothing else, and watch the wins accumulate. Nothing else to it. Conscription doesn't need anything else - it's a tool of opportunity, a way to switch from defense to aggression when you sense weakness (or draw the nuts) and quickly seal the deal. Little else to it.
Thanks for the help. Boarding strategies seem more straightforward then I thought.
@tao how has 2 damnation been in your main?
@Tao,
What's your reasoning to board out Cabal Therapy against RUG and BUG delver? I don't think I've ever boarded Therapy out. Is it because our deck can handle anything they're going to toss out so there's not really a point to taking it from their hand?
Cabal Therapy is not a good card against RUG. They don't have key spellls that you absolutely have to get rid of and you don't rely on a single Damnation/Deed either so you can live without getting rid of their FoW. They also have Brainstorm to meddle with Therapy and they cycle through their deck very quickly so you might not get much on the Flashback. You can trigger Explorer simply by blocking because you can easily kill their Delvers with Decay, REB or the Punishing Fires so they have to attack on the ground.
Against BUG Delver it is the same. If they have multiple Tombstalkers you should keep a few Therapies in the deck though, to trigger Explorer and snipe the FoW on your Tombstalker removal. Fixed sideboarding plans against BUG are impossible because BUG decks scale from hyper aggro/tempo to control and you never know exactly what they play. That is what I would begin with if they try to kill you with Delver, Goyf, DR Shaman, Snapcaster, Clique and/or Dark Confidant.
Though I guess Tombstalker has been more popular than Confidant recently so it is probably better to keep a few in. It really depends on what you see in G1.
What do you think I could cut to trim down to 60?
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Deathrite Shaman (My view on this card is it isn't so much to grind out games, but to stall out if we happen to brick. I have no problems letting him die though if I have something out already.)
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Eternal Witness
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
2 Thragtusk
1 Primeval Titan
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor (An alternative win-condition and a way to keep combo off of their win condition)
1 Liliana of the Veil (Not so much an alternative win-condition, but works very, very well with JMS)
1 Garruk, Primal Hunter (Makes dudes, draws a lot, and acts as a supplemental win condition)
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Pernicious Deed
2 Maelstrom Pulse (PW hate)
2 Damnation (Have yet to test this, but I believe it will keep Emrakul, Progenitus, and Iona-on-Green in the bin/deck)
4 Brainstorm
3 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Living Wish (G1 hate against combo, and random utility against other decks)
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Diabloic Intent
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Volrath's Stronghold (Scoop to TuskLoop)
2 Mishra's Factory (Turns Primeval Titan into a potential 2 turn clock)
1 Bayou
1 Tropical Island
1 Underground Sea
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Forest
2 Swamp
2 Island
--
3 Carpet of Flowers
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Memoricide
1 Cranial Extraction
1 Karakas
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Angel of Despair
With 3 gsz and 2 living wish, move 1 drt to board.
You have UU, BB and GG. I don't like that. Kick out Jace and get rid of those two islands.
You have 60 cards MB and 15 SB, I counted twice.
- 1 DRS
-1 Jace
+ 2 meta depending (I'd say Thoughtseize or abrupt decay)
-2 islands
+ 1 phyrexian tower
+1 swamp
-1 tropical island
- 1 underground sea
+ 1 swamp
+ 1 urborg
Eww, just noticed 2 Tops, I'd wanna think about 3. You aren't Rectorfit and thus have no real access to Recycle so I'd at least pump your card quality.
Always mess up listing the cards >_< will fix shortly
Okay, I've made some changes to Rector, as promised. I'll encapsulate them here, along with updating the link in my sig.
Open/floater maindeck slot: -1 Intent/Omniscience/Arena/whatever, +1 Master of the Wild Hunt.
I like this so much better than Omni.
Omni did have the benefit of allowing you to randomly storm off into a win -- you just had to hit Recycle with Omni out, and then it became a simple matter of finding Recurring Nightmare. However, there were a couple of problems I noticed:
-) You -always- wanted to go for Omni first, because it reduces the chances of you drawing it. Additionally, being able to splooge your hand onto the field. Oftentimes, fetching Moat, Deed, or Recycle is better (or Fetters, situationally), despite being less flashy. And every time you don't fetch Omni is one fewer chance you'll have TO fetch Omni. Remember, Rector can't hardcast it. You have 3 Rectors. That means you have exactly three chances to put Omni out, assuming that your Rectors don't get messed with in any way, and that you find them, and set them off, before you draw Omni.
-) This brings me to flaw 2. Rector CANNOT be messed with. If you're playing against a competent opponent, and there's any of a wide variety of ways of dicking with Rector out, Omni becomes a massive liability because you NEED that Rector to get it out. If they have a Scavenging Ooze, you can't Rector out Omni. Deathrite Shaman. Post-board, any of a huge variety of things. And so on. Obviously you can avoid this problem by not playing to Omni....just play it like regular, but at that point, why are you running Omni at all?
-) Omni is, sometimes, horrible/useless. In my testing, I had a larger-than-I-would-have-expected number of situations come up where I slammed down Omni off of a Rector, and then just sat there, staring at my opponent and asking what do I do now. Once the initial splooge is over with (assuming you had one to begin with), you have -NO- way of regaining momentum aside from hitting Recycle.
So, why Omni is fun, I don't think it's what [traditional] Rector wants. Something that's more attuned to using it, sure -- then we'll talk. Looking right at Viridia here. But, as for a "stock" Rector list, you can't just shoehorn Omni in. Now I can say that I've tried, and as such now I can dismiss it as subpar.
This left me with that annoying, dangling open slot again. I decided that I wanted it to be a removal slot, because fuck Deathrite Shaman. As I was flipping through my binders, I stumbled upon an old favorite of mine from before Griselbrand/Omniscience were printed and drove Show and Tell batshit insane: Master of the Wild Hunt. Master is a savage beating against fair decks assuming that they don't have a sandbagged Swords/Bolt. He's immune to Abrupt Decay (though his tokens aren't, for what that's worth), and generates both a steady stream of dudes which can quickly disassemble a combo player, as well as a never-ending stream of removal that can take out Deathrites, Lingering Souls, and all varieties of other annoyances. He's an additional sac outlet for Rector, should you need to employ that, and is a pseudo-walker for rebuilding a board post-sweep against Miracles or Esperblade. He also fulfills an opening in the deck that had been annoying me for a while now: that of a Green Sun=4 target. He's always been good in the deck, but I believe that the meta has shifted far enough towards the durdle midrange mirror that Master is the nuts again.
---------------
Sideboard: complete restructuring.
I looked very critically at my sideboard, and came to the conclusion that it was in desperate need of some reworking.
The staples: Nether Void, Humility, Cranial Extraction, Memoricide, 3 Carpet of Flowers.
These slots never change. I mean, I guess if Show and Tell randomly gets banned, then Humility could leave the board -- but I don't see Show getting axed any time in the near future, and as such, neither will Humility. Void is the best Rector target for stack-based combo, bar none. Cranial and Memoricide are my favored avenues of attacking combo decks of all types, and the Carpets are necessary to speed up combo hate by a turn or two, as well as subbing in for three Explorers vs blue control decks with a pile of basics, AS WELL as providing me with a means to get around RUG/BUG/UR Delver's taxing counters.
So yeah, once these 7 are set aside, what else do we want?
I knew I wanted a planeswalker of some variety. Elspeth and Garruk Relentless are both crazy good right now -- midrange decks can't punch through Elspeth before she goes nuclear, and Garruk flips himself off of Deathrite Shaman, then sticks around to produce 1/1 Fuck-Your-Goyfs, unless the opponent has a Decay immediately. In the end, I opted for Garruk because of the Master of the Wild Hunt maindeck. Vs Deathrite Shaman decks, this gives me big game. If I managed to assemble Veil-Cursed + Master, and they don't have the removal spell, I wish them the best of luck getting out of that with their board anything resembling intact. Relentless is, of course, a fine gentleman even without Cernunnos chillin' out. I opted for 2 copies.
When I put Relentless in, I decided to take Natural Order out. NO has been fine for me, but there is a serious problem with it that I haven't yet solved: the idea is to board out Rectors + Nightmare for NOs + Prog. However, this all-too-often led me to run short on removal, because it makes my Deeds completely draw-dependent. There were plenty of games where they just didn't have the Deathrite, and I was staring down an ugly-as-sin board state, and I had a NO in my hand with a Tower out, wistfully wishing that it was a Rector instead. I tried a few hybrid board plans, but they never worked, either -- too often I would have a NO when I needed a Rector, or a Rector when I needed a NO, or blah. I believe that NO is a concept to be revisited in the future, and that there is a missing link currently that's stopping it from really working to spec in Rector.
Next up was some more specific combo hate. Just Nether Void/Cranial x2 isn't enough. I've commented several times that I think that Leyline of Sanctity is stupid, stupid good right now. It's good vs combo of almost all stripes, it's good vs BUG/Junk/Liliana.dec, and it's good vs Burn -- which is cropping up more and more as a response to the BUG decks, since BUG can't beat Price of Progress, ever. I believe that 2 is a good number for now. That gives you a reasonable chance of opening one in your 7, or at least of drawing one otherwise if you get a solid grip. They're dead in multiples, and I don't want to dedicate a large number of slots in my board to them -- they're really good, but they aren't strictly better than the entire meta or anything.
I jockeyed back and forth about what I wanted my other combo hate to be. In the end I settled on ole faithful -- Extirpate. I had been thinking about getting cocky and trying something a little more traditional with those three slots, like Canonist or some such, but every hate bear had splash hate on us: Teeg stops Void/Cranial/Leyline, Thalia makes all of our spell-based hate cost more, slowing us down along with them, and Canonist has the most damning effect of all, in that it stops you from slamming Therapy+Flashback, or Rector+Therapy, both of which are critical plays against combo. It's also a worthy consideration that Reanimator is slowly creeping back into the spotlight, and I expect other graveyard decks, like AggroLoam, to make a resurgence as well. People aren't running gy hate anymore -- they're thinking that DRS is enough, and he really isn't. So having some combo hate that doubles as graveyard hate seems like a fine solution.
That left me with one slot open. I decided I wanted something else to tip the fair decks just a little bit more in my favor, and I also decided that I was going to experiment a little. The result: Deathgrip. I have no idea how it'll work, but I'm intrigued enough that I'm going to test it and see what happens.
The final board:
1x Humility
1x Nether Void
1x Cranial Extraction
1x Memoricide
3x Carpet of Flowers
2x Garruk Relentless
2x Leyline of Sanctity
3x Extirpate
1x Deathgrip
Arianrhod, how good in Scapewish Olivia is? In what cases do you want to see her?