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Relic already deprived him of threshold, so I didn't see any reason to crack it. Drawing a card is nice, but there is always a chance to draw a counter an expose it to discard. I won't generally not crack a relic until I'm forced to, but maybe that's just me.
Hi all,
i'll play tomorrow in the SCG open in NJ, let me know if you're around!
I'll report afterwards
cheers!
So, dinosaurus, are you one of those 3 Merfolk players from day2?
Miracles and Grixis Delver are the most played decks, how is it possible that Merfolk does nothing in Open?
Was at the Open in NJ this weekend, heres my brief report. (Been lurking on this thread for a while now, figured I would contribute a little!)
Round 1 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 Burn 1-0
Standard "I don't play legacy but borrowed burn from a friend" situation.
Round 2 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 Burn 2-0
Much more solid player, very tight match. Chalice was an all star as always.
Round 3 WIN 2 - 0 - 0 Miracles 3-0
Fairly standard Miracles list. Chalice was fine as was Cavern. Aggressively Phantasmal Imaged my Mutavaults and just ground it out.
Round 4 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 Miracles (Joe Lossett) 3-1
Very easy game one, was able to go the distance with a True-Name. Games 2 & 3 I didn't see a Lord or TNN once and the Mutavault plan didn't work against Joe's slightly more creature heavy list. This was the only loss of the day that I felt was winnable had I drawn slightly better (or if I hadn't been playing one of the better Miracles players in the world)
Round 5 LOSS 0 - 2 - 0 Painter’s Servant 3-2
Rough matchup and the games showed that. Wasn't able to land a chalice before the 5+ pyroblast/REB started hammering my guys. The upside was that the match was over so quick I had time to go eat some food finally :)
Round 6 WIN 2 - 1 - 0 Sneak and Show 4-2
Bounced back in a matchup that I have a lot of experience with, which felt nice. Gilded Drake out of the side was an all star. Stole an Emrakul off of Show and Tell and also vialed it in to snipe sneak attack targets. (On a side note, Gilded Drake has been over performing for me lately in a bunch of different matches. Taking Marit Lage tokens, Blightsteel Colossus etc. have made it a nice little toolbox option.
Round 7 LOSS 0 - 2 - 0 MUD & Round 8 LOSS 1 - 2 - 0 MUD 4-4
These matches hit me right in a sideboard blind spot which was pretty frustrating. Back to back MUD matches sealed the deal and I ended the day at 4-4. Out of our small group, Elves and S&T made day 2. Didn't see a single delver or storm deck all day which was too bad.
Congrats on the strong start and sorry bout the double MUD thing. We can be the founding members of the consecutive-losses-to-MUD-knocked-my-fish-deck-out club.
Not to exaggerate the threat here, but does it make sense (at least in a meta-dependent way) to devote some board space to MUD and similar decks? While Ensnaring Bridge is often used against us and our lord-pumping, it would help against Wurmcoil, Emrakul, etc. I know this goes against our aggro role in this matchup though. Just wondering what in the side would help most.
Thanks! I can't help but feel the rough ending was partially due to mistakes in my sideboard build. I had 2 echoing truth to swing for lethal after building a critical mass of fish, but left out a pithing needle/null rod option to combat metalworker/forgemaster etc. Looking forward I will be including some number of pithing needles in the side, got a little too cute with hibernations and tower of the magistrate in there instead. (Although I suppose if I had taken those out I would have gotten blown out by elves all day :) )Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbysdl
Hey guys,
I'm currently looking to get my first serious legacy deck (besides burn) and I'm thinking maybe this could be a good choice? I'm wonder how hard this deck is to pilot with very limited legacy knowledge and how good it is in the current meta? Also how linear is merfolk, as it feels pretty linear from my testing and I'm not sure I like that. Those are the main things I'm looking for in a deck, as well as maybe future options to build from it. I'm on an about $1,500 budget. Thanks!
Merfolk was my first serious Legacy deck years ago. I've been through a couple of different delver variants, infect and others over the years but I keep coming back to Merfolk. If you are just getting started playing legacy I think its important to note that as crucial as it is to know your own deck, understanding the field is an equal priority. In that sense, I think Merfolk is a fine starting point. You're right, it can be a linear deck, but as you gain understanding of specific matchups it is a deck that can grow with you. As a side bonus, it can be ported to Modern relatively easily should you want to run side events or whatever. Also, merfolk fits with a $1500 budget with most being in the 1300-1600 range.Quote:
Originally Posted by Figurative
We had an impromptu Legacy event this past Saturday. I decided to take a break from Jund and run the Fish and made top 4. Pretty standard list:
4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 True Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Harbinger of the Tides
4 Aether Vial
4 Force of Will
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Echoing Truth
12 Islands
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mutavault
1 Mishra's Factory
I don't remember my board, but I know it lacked Back to Basics which really ruined my chances to go the distance. I played against a rogue brew (2-1), Jund (2-0), 12 Post (1-2), and then top 4 12 Post (0-2).
Cliques against 12 Post, instead of Harbingers, could at least nab a threat out of their threat light deck.
What did Harbingers do for you at this tournament?
It was alright. It bounced a Spitemare and a Boros Reckoner in my first round, bounced a DRS eot into Chalice @ 1 game 1, bounced a Goyf game 2, which he followed next turn by playing two Goyfs, which got Truth'd the following turn and by then he was too far behind.
12 Post was rough because of both Elephant Grass and Ensnaring Bridge to play around. Those just slowed me down too much and let him get his combo's online.
Hey,
I was talking to someone who knew more about me at legacy yesterday and he suggested that merfolk isn't a great choice for a big event as it has trouble with many tier 1 matchups which you are more likely to encounter. Would you guys say this is true? I really am looking to do good at the upcoming Card Kingdom 1Ks and don't want to have a deck that will underperform at them.
It might not be as great as it was when everyone was packing on the cantrips to power their Digs, but I still feel it's pretty solid. It seems the overwhelming majority of decks doing well are Miracles (34% of the T32 decks at Somerset were Miracles), Grixis, and some Shardless. Merfolk should have a great match against Miracles and Grixis. I'd say if you expect a large concentration of those decks at your tournaments, Merfolk seems like a fine choice.
I'd just be sure to get a lot of practice in with the deck before the 1k's against the popular matchups and get really familiar with them. Of course, that should go without saying, but the deck does have a bit of intricacy about it. Someone just picking it up and expecting to herp-derp-fish-army-go! everyone might be disappointed.
Yeah that makes sense. Been testing online and have been having fairly good runs with it. I like the way it plays too, and it's nice and affordable. I just worry about how good it is, and whether something else would be a better $1,500ish deck -- DnT could be strong, though I would need some legacy experience to pilot it well, and some people (including Gerry Thompson, who sometimes shows up at local events in my area) have liked the idea of a slightly suboptimal infect list, maybe with some breeding pools. What would you say is the strongest? I also currently have legacy burn, but I really don't like the way it plays.Quote:
Originally Posted by Anarky87
You're going to have a bigger impact on your event result than your deck.
But let's say you have the finest ability in the world. Miracles in the hands of a true expert can dominate a GP, and it has. Miracles in the hands of a true expert can scrub out of a GP on the first day, and it has. (See Bonanni/Schönegger at GP Lille 2015.) Similar statements can be made about other competitive deck archetypes, especially as the size of the event decreases and variance plays a greater role in the outcome. This means that even if you hone your skills, factors outside your control (matchups, topdecks, recovering from a cold, etc.) play an important role.
But first you need skills, and that comes from practice. If you spend half your time choosing the perfect metagame-busting deck, you've lost important playtesting time that might end up being more significant than choosing a deck that shaves a couple points off matchup win percentages. You admit that some decks "need some legacy experience to pilot it well." To be honest, the same is true of every deck.
tl;dr If you as a Merfolk pilot is as strong as Merfolk is as a Legacy deck, you can get there. Even if Merfolk isn't the strongest Legacy deck, you can still get there with stronger skills and a bit of luck.
Yeah I guess you're right. Merfolk seems like a really good fit in terms of legacy decks, as one of my friends has a modern merfolk deck he'd trade off, I already have some of the cards, and it seems like a nice deck for learning the format. Lately I've been obsessively grinding on cockatrice trying to find the right deck and it's been stressing me out a ton, but I think I just need to chill out and pick a goddamn deck. However, is merfolk a good choice? I am a bit worried about competitiveness as I'm a pretty big spike and it looks solidly tier 2.5 right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by kirbysdl
Also, you were talking about practicing and getting skills with it. Are there any specific tips you think I should do with folk? Thanks.
One of the most powerful, if not the most, cards in Legacy is Chalice of the Void. A deck has to pay the cost to play it.
We are easily doing that while many decks are close to a scoop on turn 2 Chalice.
That alone makes it better than tier 2.5.
I am so satisfied with how Merfolk plays that my Snapcasters and Mystics are in the mail right now (selling them), as there is no need to have multiple decks anymore.
I echo what kirbysdl and FANAttIC said - practice makes perfect. Specifically practice with mulligans and sideboarding is very important for Merfolk. We don't have cantrips and deck manipulation spells other than Silvergill Adept, so our open hand is what pretty much determines the course of the game. So understanding when to keep and when to mulligan is important. Understanding what to bring from sideboard and what to take from the deck is also critical as Abrupt Decay and other anti-Chalice cards are common responses. This really forces you to acquire a good understanding of different decks and how Merfolk interact with them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Figurative
And speaking about big events, depending on your pairings, Merfolk actually has good chances to do well. Miracles is still the dominant deck with about 30% of the big tournament metagame and Merfolk prays on Miracles. On the other hand, it is much harder to win over Reanimator as it is so damn fast when their hand is good and Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite is a complete devastation of the board.
I'm not trying to sell you Merfolk, however this deck is relatively cheap and many cards from the deck are transferable so definitely Merfolk is a good choice for someone who wants to start playing Legacy. Taking into account that you already have Burn, at some point you will be able to assemble UR Delver-type deck (if you decided to get fetches and duals).
Okay tht makes sense. Could you give examples of specific sbing plans and specific hands to keep?Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronatog
Also I'm gonna be selling my burn deck to pay for Merfolk, so I would be selling my UR Delver stuff. Is UR Delver a better choice then merfolk though? Would you reccomend one over the other?
Thanks.
As a UR Delver player I can confirm that it was a great deck when Cruise was legal.
Now, Miracles is the most played deck and Counterbalance is bad news.
In head to head Merfolk would probably win because Chalice is such a blowout while the only relevant spell in UR Delver is early Delver.
UR has one great card: Price of Progress, but it is not the time for it or at least people know how to play around it.
If you want to play a Delver deck, BUG or BURG are the only viable options because Abrupt Decay is important.
In small environments UR can be good enough, but if you like big events Death&Taxes, Lands and Miracles will make your life hard.
I'll be running fish again tonight if all goes well. Made the changes of swapping Harbinger for Clique MD, and added 2 Back to Basics to the SB. If it fires, I'll report back.
Yeah this makes sense. That's why I chose Merfolk over UR Delver, even though I already got some delver stuff. Abrupt Decay is just an insane card, necisated by an insane deck (miracles).Quote:
Originally Posted by FANAttIC
We had 10 people show up, attempted 4 rounds, but, in typical fashion, the store owner announced after r3 that it was being cut to a 3 round Swiss, with cut to T4. I was 2-1, but missed the cut. However, another Merfolk split the finals with High Tide. There was nothing really worthwhile to report; lost to affinity in 3 games, then beat some random pile, and finally beat a Tron deck that converted to 12 Post before the tournament.
Hi all!
Sorry I didn't post for a while, I had a lot of work this past weeks.
I unfortunately didn't do too well at the NJ open last month (5-4). Overall, I'm not so happy with Chalice MD at the moment; I played too many BUG and Lands deck to my liking.
I'm going to try: -3 Chalice (moved to the SB), +2 Relic, +1 Harbinger.
I was never a super fan of Harbinger, but I'll give it a try. It's fine against delver, lands, elves and Bug; let see how it goes. No big tournament for me until January though.
Cheers!
Looking to sell my legacy merfolk deck with extras. There were several inquires about obtaining one. I am getting out of magic permanently. :frown:
Cards are ins sleeves and in excellent condition.
ebay listing: http://www.ebay.com/itm/281889474388...84.m1555.l2649
Hello Merfolk pilots,
there will be a small christmas tournament going on at my LGS where two 10-player-teams will face off against each other with 10 decks: 4 Standard, 3 Modern, 1 Legacy and 2 THG :laugh:
I have been assigned the Legacy position, and since the opposing team is very likely to bring a blue based deck like Miracles, I think that Merfolk might be a good trump to their plans...
In your oppinion, what are the important SB cards aganst them, how does the Matchup usually play out? I was thinking about bringing something like this:
Lands (21)
12 Island
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Wasteland
4 Mutavault
Creatures (24)
4 Cursecatcher
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Silvergil Adept
3 Phantasmal Image
4 True-Name Nemesis
1 Vendilion Clique
Spells (15)
4 AEther Vial
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Daze
4 Force of Will
SB (15)
1 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Flusterstorm
2 Spell Pierce
2 Echoing Truth
1 Chalice
1 Misdirection
2 ???
Would be happy about any tips for the matchup and sideboarding... thanks guys!
If you have a good read (Miracles on the other side) then yes, Merfolk is a great choice.
Most of us think the matchup is good for us and that Daze is not a part of a stock list anymore.
But if you insist on them then your list is ok and you should win.
I am not going to ramble on this pairing, everything is already said so you can read this board if you have time.
Thanks for your answer. I will read the last couple of pages and write again if I have specific questions.Quote:
Originally Posted by FANAttIC
Hi guys!
Thank you for your advice about D&T matchup, it helped a lot.
This time I would like to ask you about a bit wider about how you think I can handle my local meta, IMO not too good from merfolks' side. Merfolk is my first legacy deck and I am still learning how to approach certain MU.
My meta looks like this
Decks that appear often:
Death and Taxes
Goblins
Burn
Maverick/Junk (sometimes two decks of this type)
Sneak and Show
Infect
Dredge
Punishing Nic Fit
Decks that appear less frequently:
Elves
BUG
Miracles
Jund
Storm
Scapeshift-Nic Fit
As you can see, most of them are non-blue fair decks. Each event for me looks like Abrupt Decay Festival, as many decks are BGx. My current 75:
4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Master of the Pearl Trident
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 True-Name Nemesis
3 Phantasmal Image
2 Harbinger of the Tides
4 Aether Vial
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Force of Will
3 Daze
1 Echoing Truth
12 Island
4 Mutavault
3 Wasteland
2 Cavern of Souls
SB:
2 Spell Pierce
2 Submerge
2 Dismember
2 Pithing Needle (i switch them to Chalices when I know elves will appear)
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Manriki-Gusari
Can you think of any changes that I can bring to my 75? Thank you in advance :)
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year everyone!
Just to report back to say that the opposing team brought Shardless BUG and I managed to win 2-0 with more or less no problems during the games. I really like how the deck plays and will keep it in mind when deciding on a deck for GP Prague next year.
I won't keep it in mind, it is already sleeved for Prague :)
@ spankyourmonkey
This is rather harsh meta and other than recommending some Cliques for taking equipment from D&T, flying over Maverick, stealing stuff from hand vs Show and taking payoff cards vs Fit, I have nothing more to add.
You might want to change Red EB to something else :)
@ FANAttIC
Thank you for advice :) I am surely going to buy some Cliques soon.
Of course I have Blue (not Red...) Elemental Blast in the SB, my little mistake :p
http://mythicspoiler.com/ogw/cards/jorienruindiver.html
New UR Legendary Merfolk...any of you guys gonna give this a shot or is this just EDH only? Thoughts
Quote:
Originally Posted by sigmanugary
I just don't see this as a good tool for us. Doesn't go well with Aether Vial, once we won't be actually casting our creatures, and 3 mana is quite much. If you wanna extra draw engines just go for Sygg, River Cuthroat. Cheaper, doesn't require any splash and trigger easily. I run one MD copy of Sygg in my list, and it fits just fine (it's a more aggro oriented build, without dazes and wastes, only FoWs and Chalices and TONS of creatures).
The only reason for a red splash on fish is for Magus of The Moon... 😁
I have a Rptq in February here: http://spielraum.co.at/de/berichte/l...ecklisten.aspx
so I found some fresh Legacy lists :)
My German is mostly nonexistent so no idea how many people showed up.
Top8 looks ripe for a Merfolk win, except he probably had to play against Elves :D
The number of players was around 30. It was the final event of Austrian legacy series and it was necessary to qualify to play.Quote:
Originally Posted by FANAttIC
In top 4 I was paired against shardless (friend) which was adjusted for creature meta (disfigures main instead of discard, otherwise stock build).
I was able to win the first one (probably luck), the 2nd and 3rd one was disaster.
Peter
Tnx for info!
So this is something like my Modern League, I wish we had that for Legacy.
How is Merfolk positioned in Austrian meta?
There is lot of legacy cards and players in Austria. You can see all popullar decks right now: dnt, snt, infect, shardless, esper, grixis, ur delver, burn, aggro loam, tezzeret, ant, elves, jund, gwx, bug, miracles, painter. Top players are usually playing blue what means miracles, grixis / straight ur, ant.Quote:
Originally Posted by FANAttIC
Peter
http://media.wizards.com/2015/ogw_23...yimcAB2Iop.png
hello...I just went through the spoilers and I am not sure I understand the new colorless mechanic 100%...
if i can use mutavault/cavern of souls/wasteland mana to cast the card above I think this card can see play in Merfolks...
It resolves forever nasty creatures we are used to bounce...basically delver/pyromancer/shaman/stoneforge/mother of runes and any other x/3 we might want to kill...
on the other hand...this is valid for any deck that can afford to produce <> mana (for example is useless in 4color delver)
do you think this card will be played with 4muta/4cavern/2wasteland in a deck of 20 lands? or 50% of the manabase is not enough?
am i interpreting right the casting cost?
It's certainly compelling, but even if running 9 colorless sources is enough to support 1-2 of these (and I'm not sure it's enough), it misses some other important targets like Marit Lage tokens, non-creature permanents, etc. It could merit a look though.