[Deck] GW/x Maverick

Hey guys,

I ran vial mav through a league this morning, and I recorded videos.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...vk4V8qJLBuZ5vF

I forgot how hard it is to record videos and talk while also playing well, so I make a couple of misplays.

I also recorded the last match of my previous league with Zenith:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PJevulVAtw

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For future uploads, do you guys think I should upload a league in it's entirety (~2 hours a lot of the time)? Or is it better to just upload each match individually?

Also, what would you guys like to see next? Vial, Zenith, Punishing, Coralhelm, straight GW?

Just let me know :) Hope to finally get a good wealth of Maverick content.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ironclad8690

Hey guys,

I ran vial mav through a league this morning, and I recorded videos.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...vk4V8qJLBuZ5vF

I forgot how hard it is to record videos and talk while also playing well, so I make a couple of misplays.

I also recorded the last match of my previous league with Zenith:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PJevulVAtw

---

For future uploads, do you guys think I should upload a league in it's entirety (~2 hours a lot of the time)? Or is it better to just upload each match individually?

Also, what would you guys like to see next? Vial, Zenith, Punishing, Coralhelm, straight GW?

Just let me know :) Hope to finally get a good wealth of Maverick content.

---

Do that P-Fire thing, fam.

Hey guys,

I was playing Zoo for a while and have been working on my list after the TOP ban.
The original post from the zoo section is deleted cause i figured out that my zoo has transformed to a more Maverick than Zoo deck.

This is the List:

//Lands (22) 1 Forest 1 Bayou 1 Savannah 1 Scrubland 2 Plateau 2 Taiga 1 Karakas 2 Wasteland 3 Grove of the Burnwillows 4 Windswept Heath 2 Wooded Foothills 2 Arid Mesa

//Creatures (25) 1 Aven Mindcensor 1 Gaddock Teeg 1 Scavenging Ooze 2 Qasali Pridemage 2 Knight of the Reliquary 2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben 2 Kavu Predator 3 Recruiter of the Guard 3 Mother of Runes 4 Deathrite Shaman 4 Wild Nacatl

//Enchantments (2) 2 Sylvan Library //Planeswalker (2) 1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant 1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance //Instant / Sorceries (9) 1 Fiery Justice 1 Zealous Persecution 3 Punishing Fire 4 Swords to Plowshares

//Sideboard SB: 1 Fiery Justice SB: 1 Ethersworn Canonist SB: 1 Zealous Persecution SB: 1 Spirit of the Labyrinth SB: 2 Pyroblast SB: 2 Grafdigger's Cage SB: 2 Thorn of Amethyst SB: 2 Mystic Crusader SB: 3 Surgical Extraction

So lets talk a bit about my choices.
The creatures are all well known good guys, but wait, who the fuck is this Kavu Predator?
I love him. He is the better Gofy 2/2 trample and growing with each Swords, or grove activation.
Come on, attack me with your Batterskull, Kavu is growing.

About the rest, there is nothing much to say.
Nacatl, DRS, Knight are bringing preasure to the board.
Mother protects them all and some Hatebears like Pridemage, Thalia, etc...

Sylvan Library nothing to say, everyone know the power.

Instants and Sorcerys:
Fiery Justice: YAY Kavucombo removal
Persecution (We hate this True-Name Nemesis and even good against Elves the new rising deck)
Punishing Fire, go home creature decks and Kavu growing with the grove <3
Swords: Again removal and Kavu growing. (Swords on Griseldaddy > Trigger > Kavu is 9/9 Trample, WOW I love this guy)

And put some Planeswalker on Top of it.
Elspeth give me some flying cats.
And This new Chandra, she is doing so much, an additional card to cast, if not, shock the opponent or take the spot removal and if you manage to ulti her = GG


So lets talk about something more interesting.
The Sideboard:

Really hard decisions had to be made and the TOP ban makes it harder cause noone knows what the new meta would excatly look like.
I think there will be more Combo, so take some hate against it, and these reanimator guys i dont like, some hate for them.
2 Pyroblast against this TNN, i dont want do be the choosen player, dont enter the battlefield please. But if he did, one more persecution wich is still good against Elves.

Lets talk about the more interessting guy you may not know:
Mystic Crusader

This guy is immune to most removal spells, good protection colors.
I loved the Aggro Loam player reading it again and again,
Marit Lage, iam ok with this, Mystic Crusader, best Crusader.



I think i like to bring some more Thalias into the deck,
cause the MTGO 5-0 List are too much Combo Decks.

I maybe cut a Recruiter and one Library...

I've just realized we can start running chokes again! Goodbye wear/tear snap wear/tear.

Maybe you guys can help me brainstorm but I feel like I have found the fundamental problem that I have with beating elves.

It's that they almost always win G1. I just don't have enough cards that interact with any of their multiple axis to win by. MD I have two THC and we have Gaddock Teeg to slow them down. The other best bet is to win the die roll, T1 play dork, T2 sfm, and T3 equip and swing with jitte.

So they usually win G1. Post board I bring in 10 cards. Some better then others but they at least all interact on some level with them vs playing a 2/2 bear that they giggle at all the way to hoof town.

G2 on the play I feel like I have a lot of avenues to win by. It definitely feels winnable to an acceptable degree if this is supposed to be one our worst MU.

However the typical G3 on the draw feels miserable. Many times they just are able to get ahead much much further being on the play. Being one turn behind in this MU feels huge.

I see 2 ways to resolve this problem.

First is to try to improve chances of winning G1. I don't think I would want to MD Ethersworn/extra teeg but I could see being necessary if elves and storm are the new DTB. I could up the THC/SFM count which seems reasonable but the deck is already so tight that I don't want to hurt the decks overall flexibility. I could also try to add T1 interaction in The form of Thoughtseize/Push. That doesn't thrill me.

Spinning off of that I could try to add more T1 interaction from the SB. Thoughtseize is an obvious choice. There was some talk of Orims Chant which I am open too. We could also throw in a T1 kill spell like darkblast/push. Darkblast/push could be used in other MU but none that I think we want or need the extra spot removal.

Time will tell how important it is to be prepared for elves. Right now though it doesn't feel good and I want to believe there's a strategy we can capitalize on that doesn't hurt us overall.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

I've just realized we can start running chokes again! Goodbye wear/tear snap wear/tear.

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I'm not quite sure Choke is a good sideboard card right now. I mean think about it, none of these drs shaman decks are gonna care too much, it's bad against combo and the 4c pile decks, and miracles is no more. Choke is at it's best against slow and durdly blue decks.. which is what exactly now?

And if your reason was wear/tear-snap-wear/tear, UWR stoneblade is probably gonna reappear in some amount so it'll happen again.

I know I took mine out of the board and you should probably consider it too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cpt-Qc

I'm not quite sure Choke is a good sideboard card right now. I mean think about it, none of these drs shaman decks are gonna care too much, it's bad against combo and the 4c pile decks, and miracles is no more. Choke is at it's best against slow and durdly blue decks.. which is what exactly now?

And if your reason was wear/tear-snap-wear/tear, UWR stoneblade is probably gonna reappear in some amount so it'll happen again.

I know I took mine out of the board and you should probably consider it too.

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I replaced chokes with Winter Orbs a while ago, as Nic Fit, Miracles(RiP), Lands, Eldrazi and many other decks struggle when they can only untap one a turn. With Noble + Scryb Ranger we hardly skip a beat.

Some notes from this weeks testing, heading into a tourney tomorrow.

1. People need to be on the Sanctum Prelate train. She has uses against every deck, and absolutely crushes others. She also ensures we beat any slow combo draw, which is all a GW deck can ask for.

2. DRS is not what we need to be doing as our main source of dorki-ness, maybe as a 1 of for grindy games and to shut off opposing DRS. Heirarch lets us play more aggressive and ensures we hit our curve.

3. Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is amazing in the current meta, he hard counters -1/-1 effects permanently with his ult in addition to making 2/2's and himself being a 5/5, he ends the game fast, using any of his abilities, he is immune to Toxic Deluge(which is everywhere)

4. Pridemage is a big deal right now.Vials, Alurens, Food Chain, Equipment, Blood Moons, Sylvan Libraries... so many things that need to be killed....

Anyone having success with any other builds?

Hopefully this week carries into tomorrow!

IMO Deathrite Shaman is even better now than before as we're playing more black cards in our sideboard for elves//combo as well as there's more Deathrites for ours to fight and we play more lands // virtual copies of DRS in Zenith // scryb ranger so it doesn't hurt us as much to have ours sit back to contest theirs.

List I'm playing is pretty close to what I've been on before and I still want the decays as more catch-all removal spells never hurt. The basic swamp has been really nice in having a B source that doesn't get answered. I added Renegade Rallier because there's been times where my Scryb/Ooze etc was dead and I was like "man I wish I played 2 so I can zenith for it again" he does that but also double wastelands, gets back jitte, pridemage, etc.

My 4th Knight is a Tireless Tracker atm and it's been really nice, hard to notice the 4th Knight gone when you have 4 Zenith's and 3 Knights tbh and I like having the option to go for something that gets value even when answered pretty quickly.

Sideboard is changing a bunch time after time- ATM it's mostly streamlined for decks I'm pretty bad against but none of the cards are overly narrow, I do like to add a cheeky card to test from time to time.

4 Deathrite Shaman
1 Noble Hierarch
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
3 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Renegade Rallier
-25-

4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
-12-

2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Karakas
4 Wasteland
-23-

2 Sanctum Prelate
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Zealous Persecution
1 Toxic Deluge
1 To The Slaughter (have yet to draw this, iunoo if it's good lol)
3 Thoughtseize
2 Inquistion of Kozilek
2 Surgical Extraction
-15-

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rascalyote

IMO Deathrite Shaman is even better now than before as we're playing more black cards in our sideboard for elves//combo as well as there's more Deathrites for ours to fight and we play more lands // virtual copies of DRS in Zenith // scryb ranger so it doesn't hurt us as much to have ours sit back to contest theirs.

List I'm playing is pretty close to what I've been on before and I still want the decays as more catch-all removal spells never hurt. The basic swamp has been really nice in having a B source that doesn't get answered. I added Renegade Rallier because there's been times where my Scryb/Ooze etc was dead and I was like "man I wish I played 2 so I can zenith for it again" he does that but also double wastelands, gets back jitte, pridemage, etc.

My 4th Knight is a Tireless Tracker atm and it's been really nice, hard to notice the 4th Knight gone when you have 4 Zenith's and 3 Knights tbh and I like having the option to go for something that gets value even when answered pretty quickly.

Sideboard is changing a bunch time after time- ATM it's mostly streamlined for decks I'm pretty bad against but none of the cards are overly narrow, I do like to add a cheeky card to test from time to time.

4 Deathrite Shaman
1 Noble Hierarch
4 Mother of Runes
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Scryb Ranger
3 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Renegade Rallier
-25-

4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
-12-

2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Karakas
4 Wasteland
-23-

2 Sanctum Prelate
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Zealous Persecution
1 Toxic Deluge
1 To The Slaughter (have yet to draw this, iunoo if it's good lol)
3 Thoughtseize
2 Inquistion of Kozilek
2 Surgical Extraction
-15-

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What's the advantage of Rallier over SoLaS or EWitness?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lavafrogg

I replaced chokes with Winter Orbs a while ago, as Nic Fit, Miracles(RiP), Lands, Eldrazi and many other decks struggle when they can only untap one a turn. With Noble + Scryb Ranger we hardly skip a beat.

Some notes from this weeks testing, heading into a tourney tomorrow.

1. People need to be on the Sanctum Prelate train. She has uses against every deck, and absolutely crushes others. She also ensures we beat any slow combo draw, which is all a GW deck can ask for.

2. DRS is not what we need to be doing as our main source of dorki-ness, maybe as a 1 of for grindy games and to shut off opposing DRS. Heirarch lets us play more aggressive and ensures we hit our curve.

3. Gideon, Ally of Zendikar is amazing in the current meta, he hard counters -1/-1 effects permanently with his ult in addition to making 2/2's and himself being a 5/5, he ends the game fast, using any of his abilities, he is immune to Toxic Deluge(which is everywhere)

4. Pridemage is a big deal right now.Vials, Alurens, Food Chain, Equipment, Blood Moons, Sylvan Libraries... so many things that need to be killed....

Anyone having success with any other builds?

Hopefully this week carries into tomorrow!

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When I first played Maverick the meta was super heavy in D&T and running 0 black and 4 Heirarchs allows you to really punish them. Only one deck forced me to splash any black card--and that was Miracles. I played Orim's Chant over thoughtseize and it got the job done vs combo majority of the time. When Miracles became prevalent, the first card that was forced to go was Heirarch since exalted is bad versus terminus...

With Miracles gone, I have to make that decision again of strong mana base versus DRS.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

What's the advantage of Rallier over SoLaS or EWitness?

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I've been intending to mention this but scrap my comment every time I try to write something. Anyway, I changed my third copy of Abrupt Decay into a Renegade Rallier since it can bring back a Qasali Pridemage and destroy similar things. The upside is that it's card advantage and even more importantly you can bring back the important Jitte, as a bonus you can also bring back Sylvan Library, Scryb Ranger, Thalia, Gaddock Teeg, Ethersworn Canonist and you have the tempo play of double Wasteland turns or ramping with a fetchland. But basically, bringing back Qasali and Jitte are probably the main advantages in my opinion, that way you get to play a second Jitte and a third Decay in one card that is Green Sun Zenithable.

Edit: the comparison with those cards is actually really relevant, I just wrote quickly since I wanted to comment on Rallier anyway, sorry! I guess the difference is that Rallier brings tempo and a larger body. Witness does very similar things, but without tempo and it's a 2/1 not a 3/2. Also the opponent won't know what's happening when you GSZ for the Rallier and put desired permanent into play, that can be useful in corner cases; especially in my list that currently has two Vials (should probably remove them now that Miracles is changed, but I'll try them a while longer), when using Vial the opponent won't be able to interact with counterspells on the returned permanent.

I would love to go straight GW but I think Black is more important than ever. I think there will be a resurgence of TNN from not just BUG decks but stoneblade decks ported from Miracles. That + more elves means having sweepers in the SB matter. Not to mention zealous persecution can also be used to counter other sweepers played against us.

This is also why I am leaving DRS in. He dodges -1/-1 effects and helps fix colors for when the black mana is crucial.

On the topic of rallier, I like him. He is a very grindy card and gives something unique to Maverick. I cut him however because he was a flex slot and he doesn't help in MU that I feel like Maverick needs to start hedging against.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

Maybe you guys can help me brainstorm but I feel like I have found the fundamental problem that I have with beating elves.

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Aven Mindcensor can be main boarded and has applications against both Elves and Storm. It should be easy enough to shave an extra SFM, Pridemage, or even a DRS to make room depending on what you're comfortable doing. Obviously Teeg stays and additional room for Canonist can be made in the main if you're really concerned about these match ups, but that may be overkill.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by menloe

Aven Mindcensor can be main boarded and has applications against both Elves and Storm. It should be easy enough to shave an extra SFM, Pridemage, or even a DRS to make room depending on what you're comfortable doing. Obviously Teeg stays and additional room for Canonist can be made in the main if you're really concerned about these match ups, but that may be overkill.

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I didn't think about mindcensor. That's a great suggestion. It's good vs fetches and flying matters. Would also be quite reasonable vs Stoneforge decks. Shutting down entomb is also a plus against reanimator.

The 1 toughness hurts but I could see mindcensor being another good inclusion for sure.

Any other MU he puts work in?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

I didn't think about mindcensor. That's a great suggestion. It's good vs fetches and flying matters. Would also be quite reasonable vs Stoneforge decks. Shutting down entomb is also a plus against reanimator.

The 1 toughness hurts but I could see mindcensor being another good inclusion for sure.

Any other MU he puts work in?

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You hit the big ones. Intuition, Eye of Ugin, and Godo?

Flying does matter and an Aven Mindcensor wearing a knife is sweet.

Punishing Maverick deck tech and first 2 matches.

I will try to finish the league tomorrow.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...Y2wYN94ULaak4A

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ironclad8690

Punishing Maverick deck tech and first 2 matches.

I will try to finish the league tomorrow.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...Y2wYN94ULaak4A

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Cheers m8 I'm gonna watch em.

Most of my wins against elves involves resolving Teeg, making a 20/20 flyer in the two turns it takes them to get around him, and killing them. Matchup is fine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

Most of my wins against elves involves resolving Teeg, making a 20/20 flyer in the two turns it takes them to get around him, and killing them. Matchup is fine.

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I don't run depths often so that is good to know. Without depths it does not feel nearly as good imo at the very least.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

I don't run depths often so that is good to know. Without depths it does not feel nearly as good imo at the very least.

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The point of depths is not that you need to run it--the point is that I want to clarify that the issue with elves is not that we don't have hate cards, but that we don't have an evasive clock. Anything we do elves will find a way out of it. You need a clock that has some form of evasion or all the hatebears/discard in the world is for naught.

Fogs are better since it stops their craterhoof trigger. But fogs are bad vs everything else--except for Orim's Chant, which is both fog (for elves) and countermagic (for storm). Its bad vs damn near everything else--but if you're looking for a card to help against storm and elves, that's a good go to.

Just go play New Thalia against elves and see how it goes. Card is pretty nuts in the match

Hey guys, concluded my Punishing Maverick league:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...Y2wYN94ULaak4A

And started a league with a standard GWb Zenith list.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...zDbbnPL4F1hrqc

Let me know if you think I should have played any differently in any of the matches, or if you have any feedback in general.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Megadeus

Just go play New Thalia against elves and see how it goes. Card is pretty nuts in the match

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Unsure if a 3cc spell you can't search for is the best thing against elves--but if the plan is to get lucky I can understand.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

Unsure if a 3cc spell you can't search for is the best thing against elves--but if the plan is to get lucky I can understand.

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Teeg is the only tutorable hate bear so I don't know what you mean here, also, we should have 3 mana turn two every game against a combo deck.

From a previous post I would have to say that Dark Depths is a terrible card against Elves and would only become active if they had a bad draw/unlucky. Turn 2 Teeg, Turn 3 knight is a turn 6 win which is pretty weak against Elves as they really just need 1 glimpse of nature to win by then.

Your best bet game one is Teeg and Jitte, game two you can get any number of options to slow elves down, Cage being one of the best if you are really worried... Containment Priest stops Zenith and Order while Canonist stops Glimpse. Still Jitte is going to be how you beat them most of the time. Still not a very good match up, but our best combo weapon(Thalia) does nothing against them.

@ironclad do you think Punishing Fire will be good in a meta where Leovold is going to see tons of play? Lands is going to get a huge boost with counterbalance gone but if BUG can play a UBG 3 drop through wasteland/port then I think it will be GG.

Eh, not really, but I think fast decks will keep Leovold in check. Leovold decks lack enough meaningful interaction to consistently beat strong ANT/Sneak and Show/Elves players. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I just dont see it happening.

Meanwhile, I think if someone can figure out the new gold standard for gwb zenith, that person could be significantly rewarded. Maybe Josh Katine's deck with 3 THC is the way to go. I am looking forward to trying this and other things out. I could see Bant splash doing work right now too. You get TNN and Spell Pierces. I want to try coralhelm again as I found it to be great against combo by speeding up your clock. So much room for innovation in this new meta :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lavafrogg

Teeg is the only tutorable hate bear so I don't know what you mean here, also, we should have 3 mana turn two every game against a combo deck.

From a previous post I would have to say that Dark Depths is a terrible card against Elves and would only become active if they had a bad draw/unlucky. Turn 2 Teeg, Turn 3 knight is a turn 6 win which is pretty weak against Elves as they really just need 1 glimpse of nature to win by then.

Your best bet game one is Teeg and Jitte, game two you can get any number of options to slow elves down, Cage being one of the best if you are really worried... Containment Priest stops Zenith and Order while Canonist stops Glimpse. Still Jitte is going to be how you beat them most of the time. Still not a very good match up, but our best combo weapon(Thalia) does nothing against them.

@ironclad do you think Punishing Fire will be good in a meta where Leovold is going to see tons of play? Lands is going to get a huge boost with counterbalance gone but if BUG can play a UBG 3 drop through wasteland/port then I think it will be GG.

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In my experience, Teeg into Jitte does nothing but you watching elves draw cards. Many running needle, null rod, and masses of abrupt decays. Jitte only wins you the game if elves draws nothing.

Its more important to have evasive kills since its reliable. I run 2 Teeg, 3 Revoker, 2 Sanctum Prelate in my 75. Unlike Thalia, Revoker is useful against a much wider range of decks, prelate actually stops many more lists, and teeg is much more impactful in the elves matchup overall. For evasion I run 1 scryb, 1 birds of paradise, and KotR searching for marit lage. That means I have potential 10 evasion creatures not counting mother of runes.

Evasion means my jittes/Sofies actually hit, or I kill them outright with knight. If you run Orim's chant over thoughtseize the matchup would be close to a sure thing as now they can neither lean on Glimpse or Natural Order. Your bears hurt them, you'd have countermagic, and hoping they forget to bounce after blocks no longer becomes your plan A.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

In my experience, Teeg into Jitte does nothing but you watching elves draw cards. Many running needle, null rod, and masses of abrupt decays. Jitte only wins you the game if elves draws nothing.

Its more important to have evasive kills since its reliable. I run 2 Teeg, 3 Revoker, 2 Sanctum Prelate in my 75. Unlike Thalia, Revoker is useful against a much wider range of decks, prelate actually stops many more lists, and teeg is much more impactful in the elves matchup overall. For evasion I run 1 scryb, 1 birds of paradise, and KotR searching for marit lage. That means I have potential 10 evasion creatures not counting mother of runes.

Evasion means my jittes/Sofies actually hit, or I kill them outright with knight. If you run Orim's chant over thoughtseize the matchup would be close to a sure thing as now they can neither lean on Glimpse or Natural Order. Your bears hurt them, you'd have countermagic, and hoping they forget to bounce after blocks no longer becomes your plan A.

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To clarify.

1) They have to stop jitte 100% of the time of they lose.

2) They usually only have answers to jitte in the sideboard.

Therefore game one, jitte is your best answer to elves.

after that.

1) You run 2 teeg, 3 revoker, 2 prelate to stop them from comboing on your face.

2) After you stop them from winning you run multiple ways to kill them, either, jittes(see point 1 above)

Therefore running dark depths is win more as you already have evasion(scryb/birds/mom/GSZ) and equipment to kill them.

In addition:

Countermagic? Are you considering Orim's Chant countermagic? Are you holding up WW in the early turns of the game?
Orim's Chant has been shown to be ineffective in years of testing, this is why you don't see very many Orim's Chants around. It is a cool idea but if you chant them once, they can just attack you the next turn, or even kill you if they run Shaman of the Pack. Thoughtsieze is miles and away a better card against combo.

You bash teeg and jitte in your first section and then say you play them/they are good in later points so I am not sure if I should tell you other hate bears you could play that are better against elves, or argue that they are good and worth spots in the main deck. Here is a list of things that we can play against elves in the order of importance, please note that this is a quick list and I am speaking in opinion, not fact.

Good
Jitte
SFM for Jitte
Ethersworn Canonist
Sanctum Prelate
Grafdiggers Cage
Containment Priest
Gaddock Teeg
<insert black splash sweeper>
Thalia, Heretic Cathar(this is so low because if you can't clear their board they will untap and do what they want to)
Aven Mindcensor
Phyrexian Revoker
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Orim's Chant
Less Good But Still Have Uses

Please don't assume that I am saying jitte needs them to forget to bounce blockers as my plan A. I do not assume that you are a bad player, why would assume that I am? If you are at a stalemate on the board and you have a jitte that they cannot block or attack into, you are doing just fine. The entire rest of our deck can help us out be it more knights, evasion creatures, more equipment, whatever. We have 4 swords to plowshares and Wirewood Symbiote is pretty much at the top of the list of creatures to send farming.

Finally, I am playing:

4 GSZ + 1 Teeg, 3 Prelates, 3 SFM + 1 Jitte mainboard

and

3 Containment Priest, 3 Enlightened Tutor + 1 Ethersworn Canonist sideboard

just to get even footing with some of these combo decks that are around.

As an elves player I must say that we can play around jitte quite nicely main deck. From Reclamation Sage to Quirion Ranger+Dryad Arbor to Symbiote+any elf. You will need to establish Mother+beater+jitte and that takes a couple of turns to be active. Also we can tutor for Leovold so the Jitte plan usually works when we are already lost in the position. I think the best way to stop elves from your perspective are combinations of spot removal for the first 2 turns while you deploy some hatebear (canonist+containment) and finish things off with a mass removal (perish, sometimes Engineered Plague can do the trick too but be aware that there are DRS, Sentinel, Birchlore (morph), Symbiotes, Leovold, Ooze and of course Decay).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by toletole

As an elves player I must say that we can play around jitte quite nicely main deck. From Reclamation Sage to Quirion Ranger+Dryad Arbor to Symbiote+any elf. You will need to establish Mother+beater+jitte and that takes a couple of turns to be active. Also we can tutor for Leovold so the Jitte plan usually works when we are already lost in the position. I think the best way to stop elves from your perspective are combinations of spot removal for the first 2 turns while you deploy some hatebear (canonist+containment) and finish things off with a mass removal (perish, sometimes Engineered Plague can do the trick too but be aware that there are DRS, Sentinel, Birchlore (morph), Symbiotes, Leovold, Ooze and of course Decay).

---

Agreed. I have seen many D&T players and Junk players just "go for Jitte" and more often than not it leads to them having spent the first 4 turns doing nothing and dying to natural order.

Turn 2 SFM
Turn 3 Jitte
Turn 4 attempt to swing, if you hit you kill up to 2 creatures.

And if you assume you cast Teeg first then you don't kill a creature until turn 5. At which point the Jitte is fairly anemic and elves usually will be about to draw a 1/3 of their deck.

What are some thoughts about Choke? Now that Miracles is gone, I feel that it isn't as powerful from before. Gratned it hits all Delver Decks, but at the same time I would rather run Winter Orb since it doesn't affect us at all with Scryb Ranger.

This is the sideboard that I ran before the ban

3x Thoughtseize
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Qasali Pridemage
1x Gaddock Teeg
2x Zealous Persecution
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Pithing Needle
1x Garruk Relentless
1x Nissa, Vital Force
2x Choke

I'm thinking of moving MB Light and Shadow to the board and include Batterskull as its replacement. I'm also thinking about running another Needle to replace Nissa,

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by toletole

As an elves player I must say that we can play around jitte quite nicely main deck. From Reclamation Sage to Quirion Ranger+Dryad Arbor to Symbiote+any elf. You will need to establish Mother+beater+jitte and that takes a couple of turns to be active. Also we can tutor for Leovold so the Jitte plan usually works when we are already lost in the position. I think the best way to stop elves from your perspective are combinations of spot removal for the first 2 turns while you deploy some hatebear (canonist+containment) and finish things off with a mass removal (perish, sometimes Engineered Plague can do the trick too but be aware that there are DRS, Sentinel, Birchlore (morph), Symbiotes, Leovold, Ooze and of course Decay).

---

Elves is not a good matchup, especially game one.

Our main form of disruption is Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and she only effects elves minimally game one.

In most instances, Jitte is the card that gives us the highest probability of winning game one.

Game one, game one, game one.

Game two we get more hate bears that I ranked in a handy table a few posts ago.

So unless we want to remove Thalia for a better disruption card, game one we get jitte and game two we get <insert hatebears>. We can't play most sweeepers and especially not Perish. Zealous Persicution is a good board card if you are okay with taking losses to your manabase against PoP or wastelands, as you have to cut basics.

@TMagPie: unlike you, I didn't say I would play Teeg first. I would pray they drew a slow hand, because a fast hand doesn't matter because we are dead, and SFM for jitte first. In a perfect world turn 1 mom, turn 2 SFM, turn 3 Swords Symbiote + teeg, turn 4 play and equip jitte, swing with mom protection.

Even turn 1 Heirarch, turn 2 GSZ for Teeg, turn 3 SFM + Mom, turn 4 play and equip jitte, swing with mom protection is turn 4, but you lose the swords to plowshares option but also about as good as you can hope for.

If you want better options you have to cut Thalia for a better hatebear, or play more hatebears mainboard to have more relevant cards against elves. I have been pushing the use of Sanctum Prelate as the card is viable against most decks even elves.

Turn 2 teeg, turn 3 Prelate on 1 cuts out all combo options... as does turn 2 Prelate on 1 turn 3 teeg.(sprinkling in GSZ and Noble Heirarch where needed) From that point knights + equipment can just clog up the board and take over against their 1/1 and 2/2 team.

Finished my league with maverick:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...zDbbnPL4F1hrqc

I then played another league without recording it, because recording/comrpessing/uploading the videos is actually quite time-intensive. I finished 3-2 in the non-recorded league.

I think the main things I have learned (at least as far as the MTGO meta is concerned):

1) Vial is still quite good. People can play around stuff on board pretty easily, but they can't always play around what you may have in your hand, or if they do it will at least be harder than playing around on-board tricks. This mainly applies to combo matchups, especially sneak and show.

2) Punishing Fire isn't where you want to be right now. It is too much of a liability with so many spell based combo decks in the format. If you do play it, you have to play at least 3 Thalia to stand a chance against the spell-based combo decks.

3) Black splash is mandatory. If you don't have discard, it will be much easier for the combo decks to beat you, and they are a-plenty right now.

Before I record any more videos, I am going to try to get my chops up with the deck again. I feel as though I have made a bunch of mistakes in these videos, and I have thrown away a couple of matches due to rust with the deck. I think I will record more matches once I feel like I am not making stupid mistakes, because no one wants to watch someone fumble their way through leagues.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ironclad8690

Finished my league with maverick:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...zDbbnPL4F1hrqc

I then played another league without recording it, because recording/comrpessing/uploading the videos is actually quite time-intensive. I finished 3-2 in the non-recorded league.

I think the main things I have learned (at least as far as the MTGO meta is concerned):

1) Vial is still quite good. People can play around stuff on board pretty easily, but they can't always play around what you may have in your hand, or if they do it will at least be harder than playing around on-board tricks. This mainly applies to combo matchups, especially sneak and show.

2) Punishing Fire isn't where you want to be right now. It is too much of a liability with so many spell based combo decks in the format. If you do play it, you have to play at least 3 Thalia to stand a chance against the spell-based combo decks.

3) Black splash is mandatory. If you don't have discard, it will be much easier for the combo decks to beat you, and they are a-plenty right now.

Before I record any more videos, I am going to try to get my chops up with the deck again. I feel as though I have made a bunch of mistakes in these videos, and I have thrown away a couple of matches due to rust with the deck. I think I will record more matches once I feel like I am not making stupid mistakes, because no one wants to watch someone fumble their way through leagues.

---

I watched your videos and punishing fires seemed like a liability atm.

Would you consider 4 Vial 4 Heirarch 4 Recruiter?

You could run main board bullet hate bears much easier.

Yes, I have considered this. I will try to test it in the coming weeks. For now I think I am going to try to find the best build of Recruiterless Vial for the current metagame.

Dropped out of the lotus event.

it was quite interesting seeing what people were playing. Decent amount of fair/combo decks. Not much control aside stoneblade but they all play out much more like midrange decks with some permission. Not a ton of BUG Leo either. There was some though.

This was my first irl sanctioned event in 6+ Months (I have friends I test with competitively to try and stay sharp) and I really liked Maverick and would run it again in the event. I had 2 very close matches that one I chalk up to variance (he top decked 2x TNN after I wiped his board with ZP) and one I made an incorrect line.

I have 2 flex slot in my list (very close to the Neeley list)

I was between 2x abrupt decay, dark depths combo, 2x Thalia 2.0, and 2x Aven Mindcensor.

I ended up on Mindcensor for a couple of reasons. I didn't want abrupt decay because I didn't want any MD black cards. It would make fetching basics G1 easier and with CB gone I don't see it as necessary. Still a fine choice.

Darkdepths is another flavor to add that can let you race and add an extra angle of attack. I have had too many times where it was clunky and I don't think it lets you race combo fast enough.

Thalia 2.0 is great against fair creature decks, good against elves and at least has impact on combo decks fetches and can slow them down. However against SnS, Reanimator and Storm it's not that good imo. It's also bad vs karakas. The 2 toughness is nice against -1/-1 effects and it certainly carries equipment well. I felt like I didn't need more percentage points against fair decks and needed something more relevant vs other combo then elves.

IMO abrupt decay, dark depths, new Thalia are all fine choices if the rest of the deck is built correctly.

However I chose Mindcensor because it's good against Elves making GSZ/NO awkward and you can flash it in so you can more or less make them "waste" it. I talked about this with Menloe previously but it also hits entomb/infernal tutor/intuition/gamble/crop rotation/stoneforge mystic/recruiter of the guard/eye of ugin/fetches etc.. what was important to me was that my flex slot would be relevant against many MU and more so against our bad ones.

All in all Mindcensor was a house. Most people did not expect it at all. Not only was it good against the reanimator player I played against but was also very good against the new stoneblade decks. It practically blanks SFM and carries equipment across TNN like a champ. The flying was extremely relevant in carrying equipment across stalled board states.

There were some MU where I sided it out, but overall it definitely put its paces in. I reallly liked it. If -1/1 effects become more prevelant Mindcensor definitely takes a hit. I'd say the same if the meta goes more fair that there are better grinding options (except against TNN stoneblade).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

Dropped out of the lotus event.

it was quite interesting seeing what people were playing. Decent amount of fair/combo decks. Not much control aside stoneblade but they all play out much more like midrange decks with some permission. Not a ton of BUG Leo either. There was some though.

This was my first irl sanctioned event in 6+ Months (I have friends I test with competitively to try and stay sharp) and I really liked Maverick and would run it again in the event. I had 2 very close matches that one I chalk up to variance (he top decked 2x TNN after I wiped his board with ZP) and one I made an incorrect line.

I have 2 flex slot in my list (very close to the Neeley list)

I was between 2x abrupt decay, dark depths combo, 2x Thalia 2.0, and 2x Aven Mindcensor.

I ended up on Mindcensor for a couple of reasons. I didn't want abrupt decay because I didn't want any MD black cards. It would make fetching basics G1 easier and with CB gone I don't see it as necessary. Still a fine choice.

Darkdepths is another flavor to add that can let you race and add an extra angle of attack. I have had too many times where it was clunky and I don't think it lets you race combo fast enough.

Thalia 2.0 is great against fair creature decks, good against elves and at least has impact on combo decks fetches and can slow them down. However against SnS, Reanimator and Storm it's not that good imo. It's also bad vs karakas. The 2 toughness is nice against -1/-1 effects and it certainly carries equipment well. I felt like I didn't need more percentage points against fair decks and needed something more relevant vs other combo then elves.

IMO abrupt decay, dark depths, new Thalia are all fine choices if the rest of the deck is built correctly.

However I chose Mindcensor because it's good against Elves making GSZ/NO awkward and you can flash it in so you can more or less make them "waste" it. I talked about this with Menloe previously but it also hits entomb/infernal tutor/intuition/gamble/crop rotation/stoneforge mystic/recruiter of the guard/eye of ugin/fetches etc.. what was important to me was that my flex slot would be relevant against many MU and more so against our bad ones.

All in all Mindcensor was a house. Most people did not expect it at all. Not only was it good against the reanimator player I played against but was also very good against the new stoneblade decks. It practically blanks SFM and carries equipment across TNN like a champ. The flying was extremely relevant in carrying equipment across stalled board states.

There were some MU where I sided it out, but overall it definitely put its paces in. I reallly liked it. If -1/1 effects become more prevelant Mindcensor definitely takes a hit. I'd say the same if the meta goes more fair that there are better grinding options (except against TNN stoneblade).

---

I love the explanations, could you tell us the matchups you faced and what the outcome was?

I don't want to sound like a broken record but play Sanctum Prelate. The card is really good.

Aven Mindcensor is a good card but it is painfully obvious when telegraphed and I do not remember who said it but the quote is something like "Mindcensor is like the white stifle, everyone remembers the blowouts, but people forget when he just sat in their hands and did nothing".

Prelate is proactive, valid in every matchup(especially our worst), and absolutely auto wins in quite a few match ups.

In addition, new list that I went 4-0 with today. Beat Dragon Stompy, Nic Fit, Delver and Sneak and Show.

Stompy(2-0)
I play basics and answers to chalice of the void that they cant lock out. Mirran Crusader + Equipment happened game one and Mom + Dudes happened game 2.

Nic Fit(2-0)
In a case of bad luck, Mirran Crusader was the latest addition to my main deck, with the goal of Voltron-ing the Knight up. I was able to keep him from doing much of anything with Thalia, Prelate and Mom until an active Crusader came in to clean up. Prelate named 2 and 3 in this matchup for his sweepers and abrupt decays.

Grixis Delver(2-0)
Game one they had no answer for a Sword of Fire and Ice as bolt was their only removal and game 2 Knight of the Reliquary came in big and chained wastelands to keep them off of anything relevant. Prelate on 1 was played game 2 to stop Pyromancer spam.

Sneak and Show(2-0)
Game one was mostly luck as he wound up screwing himself with by Forcing a Thalia and a Prelate early and never recovering from the card disadvantage. Game two was pretty back and forth but I always felt ahead with Prelate/Thalia/Teeg/Tutor/Canonist/Oblivion Ring/Choke/Karakas, really just got lucky here.

Current List:

Noble Prelate Maverick

Creatures(26)
2 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mother of Runes
4 Noble Heirarch
2 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Sanctum Prelate
3 Mirran Crusader
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger

Spells(8)
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith

Things(3)
1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

Lands(23)
2 Forest
2 Plains
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Karakas
4 Savannah
4 Wasteland
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Dryad Arbor

Sideboard(15)
3 Enlightened Tutor
1 Rest in Peace
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Oblivion Ring
2 Choke
3 Containment Priest
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Council's Judgement

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lavafrogg

I love the explanations, could you tell us the matchups you faced and what the outcome was?

I don't want to sound like a broken record but play Sanctum Prelate. The card is really good.

Aven Mindcensor is a good card but it is painfully obvious when telegraphed and I do not remember who said it but the quote is something like "Mindcensor is like the white stifle, everyone remembers the blowouts, but people forget when he just sat in their hands and did nothing".

Prelate is proactive, valid in every matchup(especially our worst), and absolutely auto wins in quite a few match ups.

In addition, new list that I went 4-0 with today. Beat Dragon Stompy, Nic Fit, Delver and Sneak and Show.

Stompy(2-0)
I play basics and answers to chalice of the void that they cant lock out. Mirran Crusader + Equipment happened game one and Mom + Dudes happened game 2.

Nic Fit(2-0)
In a case of bad luck, Mirran Crusader was the latest addition to my main deck, with the goal of Voltron-ing the Knight up. I was able to keep him from doing much of anything with Thalia, Prelate and Mom until an active Crusader came in to clean up. Prelate named 2 and 3 in this matchup for his sweepers and abrupt decays.

Grixis Delver(2-0)
Game one they had no answer for a Sword of Fire and Ice as bolt was their only removal and game 2 Knight of the Reliquary came in big and chained wastelands to keep them off of anything relevant. Prelate on 1 was played game 2 to stop Pyromancer spam.

Sneak and Show(2-0)
Game one was mostly luck as he wound up screwing himself with by Forcing a Thalia and a Prelate early and never recovering from the card disadvantage. Game two was pretty back and forth but I always felt ahead with Prelate/Thalia/Teeg/Tutor/Canonist/Oblivion Ring/Choke/Karakas, really just got lucky here.

Current List:

Noble Prelate Maverick

Creatures(26)
2 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mother of Runes
4 Noble Heirarch
2 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Sanctum Prelate
3 Mirran Crusader
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger

Spells(8)
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Green Sun's Zenith

Things(3)
1 Batterskull
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

Lands(23)
2 Forest
2 Plains
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Karakas
4 Savannah
4 Wasteland
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Dryad Arbor

Sideboard(15)
3 Enlightened Tutor
1 Rest in Peace
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Oblivion Ring
2 Choke
3 Containment Priest
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Council's Judgement

---

Regarding Aven Mindcensor. For now I'm definitely seeing it as a meta call. It definitely caught people by surprise and no one suspected it. I would say the one advantage to it though is that it's a static ability. Obviously you can screw people over by flashing it in which I did a few times but a lot of times I played it at their endstep and once it's resolved there is no playing around it. It's like a hatebear where it's just an annoying creature and to get around it they have to kill him.

I faced 2 DnT which felt like very easy matches. Sword of Light and Shadow is a house in that matchup and qasali Pridemage blows up any scary equipment. Not too much to say there.

I played cloudpost. He got me in G3. I had a slow hand but it had wasteland and knight (to hopefully get more wasteland) but he turned 1 pithing needled....wasteland. Did not prepare for this MU.

I played BR reanimator which there seemed to be quite a few of at the event. I got it in G3 off the back of DRS and Mindcensor.

I played against RUG delver. It was funny. Our fist game my opening hand was plains, karakas, Thalia, stoneforge mystic, sword of light and shadow, Aven Mindcensor. Between maybe 8 turns I don't draw anymore lands and I draw green spells or 3 drops. All he sees is plains, karakas, sfm and a few Thalia's I tried to jam. Bricking on lands was rough but he thinks I'm on DnT. G2 I drop bayou DRS into T2 Prelate on 1. It just goes south from there and he sideboards correctly. At this point I was 2-1 in matches and really excited to get a good MU for round 4 but a little tilted from bricking on lands G1 (it happens, this is magic not chess). I haven't played against RUG in a while and since it's a good MU I did not respect the deck nearly as much as I should have. We get to a board state where he can kill me in 2 turns and off the top of my deck with library I see KOTR and some lands. I misplay by not grabbing one of the lands so I can play around daze and drop KOTR to block the turn he would kill me. I didn't respect his permission enough and should have thought the line through more.

I went to G3 against Dark Bant blade. There were quite a few variants of this deck running around. I know one topped 8. In this game my mana has been hit hard by his wastelands but Scryb ranger helps me out. I zealous persecution his TNN and Vendillion Clique. I try to get Scryb going with a sword of fire and ice but he finds 2x more tnn and kills me. Very close games. Aven Mindcensor was a house in this MU.

I had one Prelate in my SB and I really liked it. Could definitely see bumping up to 2 or 3 and possible MD. I think it depends on your meta and what you want to be shutting down.

I do still see the main problem Maverick has with combo is being on the draw. Against BR reanimator, G2 my hand had a GSZ/Thalia/wasteland/windswept Heath/sanctum prelate/Containment Priest. A hand like that is nuts. There are so many good cards in it. You can go T2 Prelate, T2 Thalia Waste, T2 C Priest. Just so good. So T1 I GSZ for dryad arbor. He then on his T2 is able to reanimate Griselbrand and Sire of Insanity. I realize that is the nature of BR reanimator to have nuts hands that go off T1 or T2 but I realized that on the play I probably would have won that game. And that's the problem I'm having with Maverick is that some of these combo decks are very hard to win G1 especially when you're going in blind and your hand of DRS/SFM/STP/KOTR/3x lands seem sweet but then you're playing the storm guy and get wrecked. G2 you win but then G3 on the draw you get an excellent hand but they go off T2 and kill you anyways.

I know it does not always go this way. I know our deck can be very capable of winning matches against combo. I know that every deck has its limitations but I would love to try and figure out a way to get more meaningful T1 interaction against these decks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lavafrogg

Elves is not a good matchup, especially game one.

Our main form of disruption is Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and she only effects elves minimally game one.

In most instances, Jitte is the card that gives us the highest probability of winning game one.

Game one, game one, game one.

Game two we get more hate bears that I ranked in a handy table a few posts ago.

So unless we want to remove Thalia for a better disruption card, game one we get jitte and game two we get <insert hatebears>. We can't play most sweeepers and especially not Perish. Zealous Persicution is a good board card if you are okay with taking losses to your manabase against PoP or wastelands, as you have to cut basics.

@TMagPie: unlike you, I didn't say I would play Teeg first. I would pray they drew a slow hand, because a fast hand doesn't matter because we are dead, and SFM for jitte first. In a perfect world turn 1 mom, turn 2 SFM, turn 3 Swords Symbiote + teeg, turn 4 play and equip jitte, swing with mom protection.

Even turn 1 Heirarch, turn 2 GSZ for Teeg, turn 3 SFM + Mom, turn 4 play and equip jitte, swing with mom protection is turn 4, but you lose the swords to plowshares option but also about as good as you can hope for.

If you want better options you have to cut Thalia for a better hatebear, or play more hatebears mainboard to have more relevant cards against elves. I have been pushing the use of Sanctum Prelate as the card is viable against most decks even elves.

Turn 2 teeg, turn 3 Prelate on 1 cuts out all combo options... as does turn 2 Prelate on 1 turn 3 teeg.(sprinkling in GSZ and Noble Heirarch where needed) From that point knights + equipment can just clog up the board and take over against their 1/1 and 2/2 team.

---

For reference, the ideal for me is

Turn 1 Mana dork
Turn 2 Knight
Turn 3 green Suns Zenith for Teeg + plow
Turn 4 make a 20/20 + other spells
Turn 5 win the game

The option

Turn 1 mana dork
Turn 2 Zenith for Teeg
Turn 3 SFM + Mom
Turn 4 Cast and equip Jitte, kill 2 creatures
Turn 5 kill two creatures assuming they didn't GSZ for Rec Sage

Both disrupt as fast. It's not about speed or efficiency more that, because Knight in my list is also an evasive creature--it means that decks like Elves, Goblins, etc... which can overwhelm the board can't just block Knight into oblivion.

I can actually employ both strategies in my list, for example. I run 4 SFM and 4 KotR. Both lines of play are available to my deck. And with the loss of miracles I actually have room for more hate for the matchup.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

Regarding Aven Mindcensor. For now I'm definitely seeing it as a meta call. It definitely caught people by surprise and no one suspected it. I would say the one advantage to it though is that it's a static ability. Obviously you can screw people over by flashing it in which I did a few times but a lot of times I played it at their endstep and once it's resolved there is no playing around it. It's like a hatebear where it's just an annoying creature and to get around it they have to kill him.

I faced 2 DnT which felt like very easy matches. Sword of Light and Shadow is a house in that matchup and qasali Pridemage blows up any scary equipment. Not too much to say there.

I played cloudpost. He got me in G3. I had a slow hand but it had wasteland and knight (to hopefully get more wasteland) but he turned 1 pithing needled....wasteland. Did not prepare for this MU.

I played BR reanimator which there seemed to be quite a few of at the event. I got it in G3 off the back of DRS and Mindcensor.

I played against RUG delver. It was funny. Our fist game my opening hand was plains, karakas, Thalia, stoneforge mystic, sword of light and shadow, Aven Mindcensor. Between maybe 8 turns I don't draw anymore lands and I draw green spells or 3 drops. All he sees is plains, karakas, sfm and a few Thalia's I tried to jam. Bricking on lands was rough but he thinks I'm on DnT. G2 I drop bayou DRS into T2 Prelate on 1. It just goes south from there and he sideboards correctly. At this point I was 2-1 in matches and really excited to get a good MU for round 4 but a little tilted from bricking on lands G1 (it happens, this is magic not chess). I haven't played against RUG in a while and since it's a good MU I did not respect the deck nearly as much as I should have. We get to a board state where he can kill me in 2 turns and off the top of my deck with library I see KOTR and some lands. I misplay by not grabbing one of the lands so I can play around daze and drop KOTR to block the turn he would kill me. I didn't respect his permission enough and should have thought the line through more.

I went to G3 against Dark Bant blade. There were quite a few variants of this deck running around. I know one topped 8. In this game my mana has been hit hard by his wastelands but Scryb ranger helps me out. I zealous persecution his TNN and Vendillion Clique. I try to get Scryb going with a sword of fire and ice but he finds 2x more tnn and kills me. Very close games. Aven Mindcensor was a house in this MU.

I had one Prelate in my SB and I really liked it. Could definitely see bumping up to 2 or 3 and possible MD. I think it depends on your meta and what you want to be shutting down.

I do still see the main problem Maverick has with combo is being on the draw. Against BR reanimator, G2 my hand had a GSZ/Thalia/wasteland/windswept Heath/sanctum prelate/Containment Priest. A hand like that is nuts. There are so many good cards in it. You can go T2 Prelate, T2 Thalia Waste, T2 C Priest. Just so good. So T1 I GSZ for dryad arbor. He then on his T2 is able to reanimate Griselbrand and Sire of Insanity. I realize that is the nature of BR reanimator to have nuts hands that go off T1 or T2 but I realized that on the play I probably would have won that game. And that's the problem I'm having with Maverick is that some of these combo decks are very hard to win G1 especially when you're going in blind and your hand of DRS/SFM/STP/KOTR/3x lands seem sweet but then you're playing the storm guy and get wrecked. G2 you win but then G3 on the draw you get an excellent hand but they go off T2 and kill you anyways.

I know it does not always go this way. I know our deck can be very capable of winning matches against combo. I know that every deck has its limitations but I would love to try and figure out a way to get more meaningful T1 interaction against these decks.

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There really is no turn 1 interaction that you want to play in GW Hatebears. You can sideboard Faerie Macabre/Surgical Extraction for reanimator or Mondbreak Trap against fast combo, but I like the sideboard spots to try and beat the slower T2-4 combo decks.

Our best hope is to build a deck that can steal games from combo occasionally and beat the living shit out of the Delver and Stoneblade decks that wreck the combo decks. If the meta never shifts and pushes combo down, then we are in trouble and can either switch to Delver.dec or combo ourselves. Personally, I would start splashing blue for spell pierce and Vendillion clique, but that doesn't actually fix the turn 0-1 problem.

Against Delver+Bant you had mana issues, what is your land count/how many basics do you play?

Against cloudpost, they always bring in Needle(or just mainboard a few) for Wasteland, you just need a few more games against them. That is also a random tier 3 deck that we line up with awkwardly Knight + Wasteland or Something + Equipment is the best answer as they really just derp until they start dropping monsters. Wasteland pretty much destroys them as they were a deck that preyed on Miracles.

Would you mind posting your list?

@TMagPie You still don't stop them from glimpsing on you which is the faster, less consistent kill.

In your option 2 they can't GSZ because you played Teeg.

Neither of the non-Prelate game one options stop them from killing you. When you are valuing jitte over all else you have a chance to just naturally draw and play it to win the game. If you want to bet elves every game, play more jittes and splash red for sudden demise. Knight is not a Elves killer, I can't be more clear.

Turn 2 Prelate turn 3 Teeg, or visa versa, is the only way to lock them out of both options, in which they can still win if they draw exactly what they need.

Knight is not an evasive creature. He does not have evasion of any kind. He fetches a two card combo that makes a 20/20 flying that the opponent either does, or does not have an answer for. It is not a card you want against Elves.

I posted my list a few posts ago, turn 2/3 Prelate and Teeg locks them out of both wins, I also have 3 Mirran Crusaders to just kill them, especially with a Jitte. The win condition is Crusader + Jitte, the interaction are Prelates and Teegs, which is what actually win me the game. The win condition doesn't matter if you have stopped them from comboing.

In your words: "In my experience, Teeg into Jitte does nothing but you watching elves draw cards." So you know and admit that Teeg into Knight doesn't work consistently.

I have said "Elves is not a good matchup, especially game one. Our main form of disruption is Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and she only effects elves minimally game one. In most instances, Jitte is the card that gives us the highest probability of winning game one. " This means, that Jitte offers the highest probability of winning game one, more than Knight, more than Teeg.

Here is a list of cards you want, in order:

Good
Jitte
SFM for Jitte
Ethersworn Canonist
Sanctum Prelate
Grafdiggers Cage
Containment Priest
Gaddock Teeg
<insert black splash sweeper>
Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Aven Mindcensor
Phyrexian Revoker
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Orim's Chant
Less Good But Still Have Uses

I have offered a solution and a list that I use with success I am not sure what you are trying to contribute to the conversation as you are not very clear in your post. Please clarify any issues or comments you would like to discuss and include a list if you need to.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lavafrogg

There really is no turn 1 interaction that you want to play in GW Hatebears. You can sideboard Faerie Macabre/Surgical Extraction for reanimator or Mondbreak Trap against fast combo, but I like the sideboard spots to try and beat the slower T2-4 combo decks.

Our best hope is to build a deck that can steal games from combo occasionally and beat the living shit out of the Delver and Stoneblade decks that wreck the combo decks. If the meta never shifts and pushes combo down, then we are in trouble and can either switch to Delver.dec or combo ourselves. Personally, I would start splashing blue for spell pierce and Vendillion clique, but that doesn't actually fix the turn 0-1 problem.

Against Delver+Bant you had mana issues, what is your land count/how many basics do you play?

Against cloudpost, they always bring in Needle(or just mainboard a few) for Wasteland, you just need a few more games against them. That is also a random tier 3 deck that we line up with awkwardly Knight + Wasteland or Something + Equipment is the best answer as they really just derp until they start dropping monsters. Wasteland pretty much destroys them as they were a deck that preyed on Miracles.

Would you mind posting your list?

@TMagPie You still don't stop them from glimpsing on you which is the faster, less consistent kill.

In your option 2 they can't GSZ because you played Teeg.

Neither of the non-Prelate game one options stop them from killing you. When you are valuing jitte over all else you have a chance to just naturally draw and play it to win the game. If you want to bet elves every game, play more jittes and splash red for sudden demise. Knight is not a Elves killer, I can't be more clear.

Turn 2 Prelate turn 3 Teeg, or visa versa, is the only way to lock them out of both options, in which they can still win if they draw exactly what they need.

Knight is not an evasive creature. He does not have evasion of any kind. He fetches a two card combo that makes a 20/20 flying that the opponent either does, or does not have an answer for. It is not a card you want against Elves.

I posted my list a few posts ago, turn 2/3 Prelate and Teeg locks them out of both wins, I also have 3 Mirran Crusaders to just kill them, especially with a Jitte. The win condition is Crusader + Jitte, the interaction are Prelates and Teegs, which is what actually win me the game. The win condition doesn't matter if you have stopped them from comboing.

In your words: "In my experience, Teeg into Jitte does nothing but you watching elves draw cards." So you know and admit that Teeg into Knight doesn't work consistently.

I have said "Elves is not a good matchup, especially game one. Our main form of disruption is Thalia, Guardian of Thraben and she only effects elves minimally game one. In most instances, Jitte is the card that gives us the highest probability of winning game one. " This means, that Jitte offers the highest probability of winning game one, more than Knight, more than Teeg.

Here is a list of cards you want, in order:

Good
Jitte
SFM for Jitte
Ethersworn Canonist
Sanctum Prelate
Grafdiggers Cage
Containment Priest
Gaddock Teeg
<insert black splash sweeper>
Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Aven Mindcensor
Phyrexian Revoker
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Orim's Chant
Less Good But Still Have Uses

I have offered a solution and a list that I use with success I am not sure what you are trying to contribute to the conversation as you are not very clear in your post. Please clarify any issues or comments you would like to discuss and include a list if you need to.

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Here's my list.

Lands (22)

Creatures
4x Windswept Heath
3x Verdant Catacombs
2x Savannah
2x Bayou
1x Scrubland
2x Forest
1x Plains
1x Gaea's Cradle
1x Karakas
1x Horizon Canopy
4x Wasteland

Creatures (26)
4x Mother of Runes
4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Thalia Guardian of Thraben
4x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Dryad Arbor
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Scryb Ranger
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Qasali Pridemage
3x Stonefogre Mystic
2x Aven Mindcensor

Non-creature Spells (12)
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Green Sun's Zenith
1x Sylvan Library
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Sword of Light and Shadow

SB
2x Thoughtseize
2x Surgical Extraction
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Toxic Deluge
2x Containment Priest
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Qasali Pridemage
1x Sanctum Prelate
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Sigarda, Host of Herons

(I have since taken out Sigarda/1x Ethersworn for 2x more Thoughtseize)

I guess I feel like my fair matchups are already good enough and wanted to hedge against combo. I think we have a fundamental difference in approach. I feel like my deck with the correct lines and play can go toe to toe with almost any fair deck. Personally I rather be 55%(+) - 45% against some fair decks and have a better chance against the combo decks. That line of thought also was due to a meta call and I expected to run into more combo. I am not adverse to making builds that focus more on beating up on the fair MU. That is why I originally had Sigarda in the SB, for BGx and control decks. Sigarda is a house but it felt like overkill and I didn't need her to win matches.

I know you are off the black splash but for now I am going to keep Thoughtseize as my primary turn 1 disruption. It pairs well with Surgical Extraction and when I go g3 against the combo decks on the draw I feel like having that T1 interaction as a possibility can help hedge against them. That said I think we are both in agreement that our hatebears are our best bet and gameplan number 1.

Against RUG Delver g3 he had rough and tumble to kill one of my dryad arbors and DRS. He also had Wastelands and held up blue mana most of the game to stifle one of my later land drops. Personally I felt like I played g3 wrong and I just didn't respect RUG enough.

Against Stoneblade I just didn't draw into a ton of lands and he drew into a lot of his wastelands. That and the fact that I needed to fetch black for my ZP's so fetching basics at certain points would put me in awkward positions.

I felt like the deck performed fine against the fair decks and my losses in G3 to RUG and Stoneblade were due to lines I made vs the deck getting blown out. You live you learn.

Not too worried about Cloudpost since that deck got worse with Miracles gone and it was an already a more fringe archetype.

My thoughts are that Maverick is in a weird place right now. It's "boogeyman" so to speak is gone but there are still a lot of decks out there that can give us a hard time. Which of those decks will be prevalent I am not sure. I think as the meta settles a little more it will be easier for Maverick to have a gameplan going into big events and of what to expect. I know I am being a broken record at this point but it is because of the new unsettled meta that I wanted to try and bring a list that could have game against anything.

On the plus side I got a scrubland as a door prize :tongue: