[Deck] Dredge-a-Tog - Psychatog with the new Dredge cards

Why hasn't anyone suggeted Deed? Or is the fact that Mox is in here outway one of the best board sweepers in the game? It seems that you should be able to use it still. In the late game getting rid of mana sources shouldn't really be a problem because of Loam, and in the early game it seems like you would just accelerate into it for a faster Deed. It seems like a perfect fit if you ask me. 10 times better than EE.

Yes I Thought about Deed too, but i Didnt needed it now.
And I had a lot of Discussions whats better: EE or Deed.
Believe me, EE can do many Things better then Deed. But the Deed can that too, only in other Situations ;)
Ah and here is my Actually Decklist:

// Lands
3 Lonely Sandbar
4 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
1 Flooded Strand
2 Wasteland
1 Cephalid Coliseum
4 Tropical Island
3 Underground Sea
4 Island

// Creatures
1 Eternal Witness
3 Psychatog
1 Genesis

// Spells
3 Intuition
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Accumulated Knowledge
4 Counterspell
3 Cunning Wish
3 Mox Diamond
4 Life from the Loam
3 Darkblast

// Sideboard
SB: 1 Shallow Grave
SB: 1 Fling
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 1 Ghastly Demise
SB: 1 Moment's Peace
SB: 1 Hideous Laughter
SB: 1 Coffin Purge
SB: 1 Misdirection
SB: 2 Engineered Plague
SB: 2 Duress
SB: 3 Stifle

I played against Solidarity for a minute.
Her was my Gameplan:
+2 Duress
+2 Stifle
-3 Darkblast
-1 Wasteland

The Plan:
Just make Cardadvantage with Loam, AK and Lands. he cant do anything against it.
Smash the Tog on the Table as soon as possible.
Then Try to get Intuition or even Better Cunning Wish.
You make Cardadvantage. Then, if you got 2-3 Coutners and enough mana, you attack, until he makes his combo. if you can force him, because you got a Lethal Tog, is better. He will his combo, interrupt him with Stifles if you can, but dont Counter any High-Tide/reset/Turnabout, if you not 100% know, he will break down.
Then when you are milled and he forces you to draw a Card, play Cunning Wish and Fling him ;)

Golgari Grave-Troll and Deep Analysis seem throughly awesome for how much you want to abuse Dredge and cycling lands.

Also, C. Wish for Berserk almost seems like overkill at this point. You can basically jump up +6-9 cards in hand and mill another 10-15 cards into the grave when you go off anyway. Trample is cute and all, but you could always just run a Wonder or two and fly over opponents for the win. And that costs 4 mana less.

Oh and no Putrefy?

Berserk/Fling let kill you faster. You can also kill on Round 4-5.

Putrefy costs 3cc.
preboard you have bad Chances against aggro, but Putrefy makes this not really better.
You must try to smash a Tog on the Table (if you know, your opponent dont play Swords). Its not necessary to protect him all the Time, since were playing Genesis and Witness.
With this you get easiliy 3-4 Rounds more time, because he wont attack with all/you block some Creatures to the Death.

After boarding you got EE, Engineered Plague.
Wishtargets are Hideous Laughter, Moments Peace (really great with Genesis/Witness Engine, you "only" got to remove the Pinger which are SGC 2/2 and Sharpshooter 1/1), Ghastly Remise, BEB.

I also though about, to cut BEB or Ghastly Demise for a 3rd Stifle, because I really think in Lile, there gonna be much Solidaritys.
BEB is the bigger candidat, because Demise kills Angels, Dragons and all the Big Reanimationcreatures.

Cycling lands are savagely, stupidly good with Life from the Loam. It's basically a recurring draw engine in and of itself. Add in Genesis, Wonder, and Deep Analysis, and you have recurring, evasive beats and even more draw off of Dredge. Other builds I've seen aren't even bothering with the old school Cunning Wish > Berserk tech. Life from the Loam with cycling lands is a robust enough engine in and of itself that the Berserk is often unnecessary, particularly when you have Wonder giving your Tog evasion.

In short, the new engine deserves more focus. The older remnants of the classic Hulk strategy like Wish can be donbe away with.

I just goldfished a few times with the deck, and it feels too slow. Just a suggestion on the board. Wouldn't Shred Memory be better than Coffin Purge? It does cost 1 more mana but with that you get 4 cards and it has dredge.

It hasnt Dredge ;)
It removes 4 at one time.
Purge says "I remove now a Dragon and maybe Later".

I cuttet 2 Darkblasts and 2 Loams.
I Play now 3 intuiton +1 SB and 3 Wishes.
Also i Cuttet the AKs, for being to slow (yes, no AKs with 3 Intuitions :P ).
I also test 2-3 Putrify and 3 Deeds.

I gonna play some Games and then Post the Results.
The Real Testingphase for Lile and the GPT Lile starts in 2 Days for our Team.

Cabal Pit, anyone? Looks like savage tech.

I played against Life from the Loam Madness/Tog at an Extended PTQ yesterday, and he killed me on turn four in game two. Again, this is in Extended. I think the claim "too slow vs. other aggro" is facetious.

Ah the T8 MadnessToG?
I really like this Deck :)

I just talked with a friend some minutes ago and we talked about Sylvan Library. "Top is better because you can dredge him away if you need to dredge, thats why he is better then Brainstorm....hey you dont dredge him away!"
That was our Brainstorming, about Brainstorm vs. Top.

You Tap Top, dredge and THEN put the Top on top.
Recurring Top with recurring Fetchs because of Life of Loam.

This could be a really good thing, but BS is an instant. Top is a permanent, what you only can destroy in response on putting him on Top. And not everybody Counters the Top.

I really gonna think about this, maybe Top/Brainstorm Combination on 5 Slots? 2 Tops/3 brainstorm or 3/2?
Let's see how good this little Artifact can be ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by t3h.sWaRm

I just goldfished a few times with the deck, and it feels too slow. Just a suggestion on the board. Wouldn't Shred Memory be better than Coffin Purge? It does cost 1 more mana but with that you get 4 cards and it has dredge.

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Take the Dredge Tog deck that made T8 at PT:LA and test that. You can generally get plenty of turn 4/5 kills once you get the deck down. And no, I haven't yet. It's a bit more complicated than the older Tog decks, but the Japanese have shown that the deck is indeed as fast a Tog w/ Gush.

Yeah, but look at the Engine.
kenji really only play 6 "Drawspells", which are 3 Gifts and 3 Wishes. I really dont Count the 3 Cyclelands as a Carddraw, for the 1 Loam.
But he really Plays his Deck controlled and btw, the Quarterfinal was really nice, Mulliganed and Screwed his opponent with this one Random oxidize on the Chrome Mox and the pernicious Deed for the Artifact Land.
So there was no problem for him to cast the Gifts and know, the opponent just can't Counter and he gets a Landdrop turn for turn and get the Draw out of the Cyclelands.

You really can Smash the Tog early on the Table and just say "Go, you got 1 Round to Win and i got a full Hand".

Have you ever played with or witnessed Life of the Loam + cycling lands in action? It's insane. Obviously you'd probably change the deck so it was playing hard counters instead of Leak and Force Spike, but Tsumura can draw three cards a turn for five mana and keep filling his graveyard every single turn. It's a very powerful engine.

I know the Decklist:

4 Island
1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
1 Lonely Sandbar
1 Swamp
1 Barren Moor
1 Tranquil Thicket
4 Polluted Delta
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Watery Grave
3 Overgrown Tomb
3 Yavimaya Coast
1 Underground River
1 Darkwater Catacombs

26 land

4 Psychatog
1 Wonder

5 creatures
3 Force Spike
1 Darkblast
1 Oxidize
4 Counterspell
2 Mana Leak
2 Last Gasp
1 Smother
1 Life from the Loam
1 Circular Logic
4 Cunning Wish
3 Putrefy
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Gifts Ungiven

29 other spells
2 Viridian Shaman
3 Duress
1 Ghastly Demise
1 Oxidize
1 Naturalize
1 Krosan Reclamation
1 Natural Affinity
1 Mana Short
1 Circular Logic
1 Hideous Laughter
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Tsabo's Decree

15 sideboard cards

I watched the livestream of the LA Pro Tour.
he won the Quarter against Boros Deck Wins (Red Deck Wins with White), but lost against the "Oldschool Tog" from Ruel 0-2.

Yeah, i know how powerful the Engine is, I play them by myself, but how Powerful is a Drawengine, if you don't draw them?

Have you ever actually played with the Life engine and used it to bury your opponent in an avalanche of card draw that simultaneously fed your graveyard by truly sick amounts?

I was quite impressed in the games against Ervin how Billy Moreno used his Coleseum+Loam engine to good effect; its a strong engine but then again, are we putting it in the wrong deck?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sobek

I was quite impressed in the games against Ervin how Billy Moreno used his Coleseum+Loam engine to good effect; its a strong engine but then again, are we putting it in the wrong deck?

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You mean should we be discussing Life from the Loam in UGb Madness instead of Hulk Smash? Hard to say. In the end, once you add Tog and dredge cards to UG Madness, the differences between the decks decrease rather a lot. It's really mostly a matter of whether you want to be playing a more controlling build or a more aggressive build, which is a metagame call, I'd imagine. In the end, it's probably easier to call this a new archetype entirely, and say that certain variants might include Madness options like Mongrel, Deep Anal, and Circular Logic. Maybe.

This would be MadnessTog and should be Discuss in another Thread. This Thread would be really weird if we just discuss on 2 different Deckconcepts..Aggro and Control

Here's your starting point. I've done a few tricky things, like running a Witness main to Genesis up, but I think this is definitely where you want to start your resting. You should be looking for a place to put Berserk in the board and an extra land in the main.

// Lands
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
4 Underground Sea
4 Tropical Island
6 Island
2 Swamp
1 Lonely Sandbar
1 Barren Moor

// Creatures
4 Psychatog
1 Eternal Witness
1 Wonder
1 Genesis

// Spells
3 Mox Diamond
1 Darkblast
1 Life from the Loam
3 Cunning Wish
3 Pernicious Deed
4 Force of Will
4 Counterspell
4 Brainstorm
3 Putrefy
3 Intuition

// Sideboard
SB: 1 Putrefy
SB: 1 Intuition
SB: 4 Duress
SB: 1 Mana Short
SB: 1 Hideous Laughter
SB: 4 Engineered Plague
SB: 1 Fact or Fiction
SB: 1 Nightmare Void
SB: 1 Coffin Purge

I'm not convinced Putrefy belongs in the deck. The 3cc seems a bit high. Has anybody tested Deep Analysis? It seems like it would belong in the deck. Also, 3 Cunning Wish seems maybe too high, since you don't need the wish for Berserk to win anymore. I also noticed you have no Wastelands in your build. I think they belong as a 1-3 of (right now I have 2) in this deck, with the ability to continuosly recur them. How about:
-3 Putrefy
-1 Cunning Wish
-1 Island
-1 Barren Moore
+1 Lonely Sandbar(I feel more confortable with U because I have i available most often)
+2 Wasteland
+3 Diabolic Edict

SB:
-1 Putrefy
-1 Mana Short(What's this for? Solidarity?)
+1 Diabolic Edict
+1 Darkblast? <- Not sure what to put in yet

I'll have to test more to see if Putrefy's ability to kill artifacts matters much.