Tammit67- didnt think of siding the tutor, the idea is alot more appealing now actually.
Also Rampart you gave me lyrics for a new rock tune man.."cant grind the skull!" dundun da tzzz tzzz
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Tammit67- didnt think of siding the tutor, the idea is alot more appealing now actually.
Also Rampart you gave me lyrics for a new rock tune man.."cant grind the skull!" dundun da tzzz tzzz
I've been playing this list and haven't found CB Miracles to be all that tough:
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Duress
3 Snapcaster Mage
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Past in Flames
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Gitaxian Probe
2 Island
2 Swamp
1 Volcanic Island
4 Polluted Delta
2 Underground Sea
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Bloodstained Mire
SB: 3 Wipe Away
SB: 3 Karakas
SB: 1 Tendrils of Agony
SB: 1 Duress
SB: 3 Virtue's Ruin
SB: 2 Chain of Vapor
SB: 2 Engineered Explosives
Sideboard plan vs Miracles has been:
-1 Lotus Petal
-1 Lion's Eye Diamond
-2 Snapcaster Mage
-1 Gitaxian Probe
-1 Ad Nauseam
+1 Duress
+3 Wipe Away
+2 Engineered Explosives
Sideboard plan vs Maverick has been:
-3 Snapcaster Mage
-3 Duress
-4 Cabal Therapy
+2 Engineered Explosives
+2 Chain of Vapor
+3 Karakas
+3 Virtue's Ruin
If I see or suspect Mindbreak Trap, I keep in Cabal Therapy and don't bring EE/Chain of Vapor (they're less likely to have Canonist it seems if they run Mindbreak Trap).
RUG Delver goes something like:
-1 Gitaxian Probe
-1 Ad Nauseam
+1 Duress
+1 Tendrils of Agony
Reanimator (I have a plan w/ and w/o Snapcaster, not sure which I like best)
-3 Snapcaster Mage
-1 Gitaxian Probe
+3 Karakas
+1 Duress
or with Snapcaster Mage:
-4 Gitaxian Probe
+1 Duress
+3 Karakas
EE is pretty interesting, I'll have to try that -- seems pretty sweet in one of the board wipe slots. I tried Wipe Away against U/W for a while, and never really liked it all that much, as you basically get to the point where you have to get Wipe Away + 2 Discard effects in hand + enough gas to go off, all while not being able to cantrip at all. I've tried a second Tendrils in the SB in the past, I will start testing that again (I remember it being sweet in some easy matchups as well, such as Landstill and Burn and such).Quote:
Originally Posted by emidln
Do you ever have problems finding gas with that list? It seems pretty durdly to run 3 Snapcasters and only 4 Tutors + 1 Ad Naus.
Unless you're facing down discard, Tendrils is a business spell in a deck packed with Probes, Therapies, and Snapcaster Mages. You can also just Snapcaster Mage to buyback a cantrip.
with 3 snapcasters the plan is to go long, you will find a tutor eventually. you can even use snapcaster to do it since it re buys you cantrips.Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronm678
The list with.snapcaster seems like a stock UBR lists with snapcaster over burning wish. I like having wish targets. However, I can see the use in flashing back a single spell.
Maybe you missed the part where my sideboard doesn't suck. Not easy to do with burning wish in the deck.
emidln- I too missed the part where your sideboard doesnt suck, at least initially..got it now. Only joking man I do really like your current board. Anyway how often do you find you use chain of vapor? I ask because the rest of your board seems to cover those same bases. Also ive toyed with snaps on and off but nothing serious yet so im interested in what the fundamental turn for your build is?
Can we discuss pyroblast over yard hate in side?
It is absolutely something I am going to test. It looks great for what I'd expect to faceQuote:
Originally Posted by emidln
Switched back to Inquisition of Kozilek over Pyroblast in my side. Still not sure if that is correct or should have Pithing Needle. So current board looks like:
4 Dread of Night
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Echoing Truth
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Meltdown
1 Pyroclasm
2 Karakas
Taking an idea from Bryant Cook on the two Karakas.
12 Cards against Maverick (including wish target Pyroclasm)
4 Cards against RUG (including wish target Pyroclasm)
6 Cards against Tribal (including wish target Pyroclasm)
5 Cards Against Show and Tell/Reanimator/Grislebrand.dec
Let me know your thoughts. Still having problems deciding what to side out.
I like pyroblast and have moved to 2. no testign yet but it forces them to have the force.
I don't think burning wish kills your board that much, it at most eats up 5-6 spots in the board: (EtW, ToA, PiF and/or IGG, IT, a sweeper, maybe an artifact sweeper if you want it)
If your plan is to board 12 cards in against maverick and they don't win you the game faster you are doing it wrong. they have no counter spells, they don't interact until turn 2 or 3. just kill them.
I do really like EE. need to see if it is good enough
I like having the extra insurance against Maverick. For the blue match-ups I am going up to 11 discard post-board. I know that Inquisition cannot grab Force of Will so I am not sure if Thoughtseize maybe better. In those control games, I feel it is a grind and I am much more likely to win with Past in Flames and Tutor chains (kinda ryhmes) than Ad Nauseum. That and the extra discard is pro-active against Counterbalance before it hits.
GW maverick is an awful matchup. I feel like the deck isn't fast enough to race a turn 2 hate bear, so we need answers.
Dread was pretty miserable, as they usually have teeg (off GSZ) or cannonist in addition to Thalia.
I think I want 3 deathmark postboard. Thoughts?
If you are going with targeted removal Slaughter Pact is probably a better choice. I run a 2/1 split of Pact/Deathmark so I have wishable removal G1 and better Ad Naus flips in G2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Clown of Tresserhorn
Playing 3 Karakas, 2 Chain, 2 EE, 3 Virtue's Ruin makes it pretty hard to lose to Maverick. The most important cards are the Karakas, but Virtue's Ruin definitely helps when you can draw into it. Spot removal is less good now that people are playing Safekeeper in addition to the standard 4 Mother of Runes. Mass removal like EE and Virtue's Ruin, while both having drawbacks (EE is vulnerable to Teeg and Pridemage, Virtue's Ruin often costs 4), having a mix lets you be pretty successful. IMO, their ability to have double threat a good portion of the time makes discard less useful. Chain actually commits them to their mana (meaning an eot turn 2 chain, untap into a turn 3 kill is still okay). Chain and EE also function to deal with random non-creature threats that can show up, while providing a lot of utility in other matchups.Quote:
Originally Posted by Clown of Tresserhorn
For real on the 6 dedicated spots to maverick?!?! (I assume EE and chain come in vs. other things) I still like deathmark, as it basically kills everything they have that's relevant. I'm not sure I buy the virtue's ruins, since they're so bad with Ad Naus.Quote:
Originally Posted by emidln
Thats sick. I bring in 4 dread, 2 echoing truth + wishable sweeper and sometimes I even feel bad about it heh, not anymore.Quote:
Playing 3 Karakas, 2 Chain, 2 EE, 3 Virtue's Ruin makes it pretty hard to lose to Maverick.
Clown of Tresserhorn- I agree spot removal (by itself) isnt really viable anymore. emidln's SB is obviously > than mine but what we have in common are cheap sweepers for mom/thalia/mindcensor to keep spot removal active, and then obviously spot removal for teeg. I can see why you dont like DoN but IMO its not meant as a stand alone answer, and not that you said it was. To me though its just a sweeper for B that keeps my spot removal active. If I can stack 2 fine ive probably won, if not it still keeps me from losing to mom + hatebear and kills thalias along the way. I guess my point is if you arent already bringing/wishing into removal for teeg maybe combine the two.
Also virtues ruin is very good, I just really happen to like dread of night plus I dont own any VRs anymore or I might play them too.
Karakas has applications elsewhere (Reanimator actually has serious issues beating karakas + cabal therapy when you untap). But the way I see it, the following common matchups need help postboard:
Maverick
CB Miracles
I'm fine dedicating 6ish slots to one and 5ish to the other. These are very common draws, and dropping either with consistency is going to affect your ability to do well.
Being able to beat multiple hatebears or hatebear + mom/safekeeper is what lets you cast Ad Nauseam to begin with. Without the first step of removing hatebears + friends, you can't be in a position where Ad Nauseam is good/bad (and, tbh, you can still Past in Flames at a low life total).
I think 4 Dread of Night, 2 Echoing Truth, 4 Cabal Therapy, and Pyroclams as a wish target are enough to beat Maverick. I keep ten cantrips in to dig.