Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Sadly, AD comes pretty often paired with DRS and thus the manadenial plan doesn't work 100%. The only thing they need to play AD is to have :b::g: available, meaning they need a sole land and an active DRS that did not die to the "many" removal we play. Not an impossible task, manadenial or not, esp. when they start and may fetch land and play DRS without fear of Stifle/Daze.
AD changed the thing fundamentally, because in past you just played your threat and then protected it from removal until it won you the game; ok, sometimes you were unable to do it, but that's another story. There's no maindeck protection against AD and even the post-sb one is pretty janky: Submerge (ok, maybe Divert) and that's about it. Delver dies to every fart, Mongose can't break through opposing Goyfs/KotRs/Germs/younameit and is a mere 3/3 even if the ground is clear. Goyf, while also easily blocked by KotR, at least makes short work with Germs, and doesn't die when blocked by Goyf (in cases like double Goyf into their one, or Goyf+Bolt into Goyf, etc.) and with a power of 4/5 at the very least (but someties even more, as every Sylvan Library, Liliana, etc. feeds him) is a bit faster and he also recovers from RiP/Relic much faster - not that these cards are played alongside Decay, but whatever...
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Barbed Blightning
It's just removal. It's nothing we haven't seen before--unlike DRS, who exemplifies the emergent midrange archetype by being an accelerant, utility and threat in one efficient body.
Decay is obviously powerful vs us because of its uncounterability, but unless you are playing vs Jund (very winnable still due to the suicidal and greedy nature of the deck) four decays are going to be the bulk of your problems in a match. Run surgical if you are really scared of the card and save your future dudes after one is struck down.
Take STP or Bolt for example, the first and second best creature removal spells in the format. Both CAN be countered, but due to their less prohibitive costs they are still hard to daze/pierce consistently. Forcing, unless you are certain that it will resolve, is too risky.
Each have an element that can hurt us as well. Bolt hits your head. STP can be used defensively. STP exiles, meaning thresh or goyf counts could be impacted. Both are played in decks with Snapcaster, meaning a countered removal spell can still be active, or could 2-for-1.
In short, I'm not scared of Abrupt Decay
Sadly, I find myself playing against decks with both Decay and Snappy quite often. :laugh:
EDIT: Well, I need to add something. It's an UBG control deck that plays two LftL main, so basically this matchup might be unwinnable: the guy has access to all the available tools to make my manadenial plan not work, his many PWs and removal recursion stops my targetable creatures and Goose losses to DRS and Lili.
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Besides mana denial, bolting Deathrite Shaman and not allowing them to resolve Lilianna or Tarmogoyf has been important points of my current gameplan vs BGX (BUG delver, Shardless BUG, and Jund). Games usually end with me winning through nimble mongoose, Tarmogoyf dead, and Delver used as FOW fodder.
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cheerios
Besides mana denial, bolting Deathrite Shaman and not allowing them to resolve Lilianna or Tarmogoyf has been important points of my current gameplan vs BGX (BUG delver, Shardless BUG, and Jund). Games usually end with me winning through nimble mongoose, Tarmogoyf dead, and Delver used as FOW fodder.
Yep, I analyzed the DRS.dec matchups and realized that of all the cards they play, only DRS is such a pain that it warrants additional answer - something that not even Decay or Liliana deserve. Unfortunately, the slots are limited and I don't really like to play 2 Forked Bolts, so I gonna try the Snare+Bolt+F/I combination. I expect to be dissapointed by the latter and look forward to playing my sixth sorcery. If only there weren't so many red decks, I'd play Chain Lightning in a minute, but losing to myself is so tiresome...
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Barbed Blightning
So your solution to the turn one problem of DRS is fire, a two-mana forked bolt?
FB has always been terrific IMO. Especially against mav or D&T
No, my solution is 5x 1-mana removal and 1x two-mana removal. Also, not every game they start and I really want something else then crappy sorcery bolt or abysmal black card that hurts me for four.
Any other idea? I'm asking seriously... Would you rather play double Forked Bolt? Because right now I don't see a maindeckable card that could fight DRS better than some :r: removal. The only reason why I include F/I is surprise factor and the fact that it's not completely dead against Goyf.
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Barbed Blightning
I DO play double forked bolt. They are great. Sorceries are lacking in this deck aside from ponder (or maybe probe) so being able to consistently get goyf to a 4/5 is relevant in some matches like tribal decks.
The ability to ping two dudes, a dude and a planeswalker or any other combination of targets for one mana is still pretty damn good. Plus, yes, it can kill DRS
Ok, I misunderstood the "terrific" part of your previous post. Gonna try that setting, then. :smile:
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
What makes rug tempo so much more popular then bug ?
I know rug seems to place much more often, my question is plainly. What does rug do that bug doesn't ?
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kingsey
What makes rug tempo so much more popular then bug ?
I know rug seems to place much more often, my question is plainly. What does rug do that bug doesn't ?
Have an amazing sideboard plan against every deck in the format while keeping the manacosts between 0 and 2.
Rough//tumble, pyroblast, ancient grudge, sulfur elemental, and lightning bolt: why pay twice as much when don't have too?
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Barbed Blightning
Another possible removal spell to consider is
vapor snag. It's not really removal, but it pings and can be cast with any colored land we play, plus it can save a dude from decay/lilly/what have you. Plus of can take out a big dude for turn(which is all you need sometimes).
Hm. Never thought of it. The fact that it saves Goyf/Delver from Decay is sweet, even at the cost of one life this ain't bad.
As a removal it is quite strange. It's nice that it can remove their blocker but in the long term it does very little, namely against DRS which they may replay immediatelly after their draw phase passes. I'm not sure if for this matter F/I ain't better - yes, it costs one mana more, but it kills DRS and "removes" any big blocker while cantripping. :rolleyes:
I consider dropping the single Snare and going for either 3x Forked Bolt or even 3x Chain Lightning. That random Snare does little, once in a pale moon it hits Goyf/Hymn and that's it. Otoh, playing additional burn might prove helpful, as it can remove DRS/MoR/elves/Delver or end the game when directed to dome.
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Nice discussion here.
The big question in my mind is: Is gitaxian probe now a must mainddeck card?
The last time I played RUG, I had 2 copies in my maindeck, I I was very happy with them.
They helped my to structure my next turn.
See what my opponent has in hand, what do I have to counter in which way, and finally draws me an extra card.
My opponents were never happy when I had a full view to thair hands.
Chris Pikula played 3 copies last weekend, so what are your thougts?
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Eldamion
Nice discussion here.
The big question in my mind is: Is gitaxian probe now a must mainddeck card?
The last time I played RUG, I had 2 copies in my maindeck, I I was very happy with them.
They helped my to structure my next turn.
See what my opponent has in hand, what do I have to counter in which way, and finally draws me an extra card.
My opponents were never happy when I had a full view to thair hands.
Chris Pikula played 3 copies last weekend, so what are your thougts?
It's a must maindeck card for me. Been playing with 3 copies lately. It was never useless for me and was always crucial in decision making.
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Since Gitaxian Probe is starting to be the norm, is it worth it to try squeezing in a single Snapcaster Mage? It's value increases quite a bit when you have the option of running it out as a two drop.
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
For those who play GP (namely those who found place for three of them), how does your maindeck look like?
Re: [DTB] Canadian Thresh (a.k.a. RUG Tempo, Tempo Thresh)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bed Decks Palyer
For those who play GP (namely those who found place for three of them), how does your maindeck look like?
Been using Chris Pikula's 74 (not running a zuran orb since burn isn't really a factor locally). The lack of a 4th stifle is a but unnerving but the 3rd probe means more velocity and it often pans out. I'm considering running a Young Pyromancer over the 4th goyf for testing purposes after watching Pikula's off camera feature match against shardless where it seemed to take over a game.
