[Deck] Spring Tide

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Originally Posted by TeKo

Cloud in play
min. 3 H Tides played
5UUU open

|-> 1. play Capsize+Buyback
| 2. bounce Cloud
|_ 3. play Cloud untap 2 Lands

Not very good with these requirements you should win anyway.
Or is there an easier way?

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Infinite storm Combo
3 Tides played, a COF in play, and three islands untapped:
1) Play Capsize with buyback targeting Faerie (floating UU)
2) Play Faerie, untap and repeat
3) Use your remaining island/mana to freeze opponent and win.

Infinite Storm+mana
4 tides played, a COF in play, and two island untapped
1) same as above but you'll have floating UUU instead of UU
2) Play Faerie, untap and repeat and you'll get an extra U floating everytime you repeat.
3) Use both brainfreezes and stroke of genius on your opponent (backed up with all your Force of Wills) for Godly kill. Playing stroke is a must here or you'll just burn yourself :tongue:

Hello everybody. 1st post here and on the forum. Excuse me for the bad english.

I saw, in the earlier posts, someone did a math, calculating the odds of winning on the draw and on the play, and on the draw were always grater. Does it meas that, if we win de roll to game 1, we should choose to draw first, not to play?

thanks.

If i win the dice (what rarely happens) i never choose to draw. I dont want the opponent give the chance finding and dropping hate before i go of.

Yesterday I play a little tournament (14 players).
I became 3rd losing only two times in all the day. Both vs Eva Green.

The first one match I won easily in 3rd or 4th turn.
The second one I only draw two lands in 20 cards, 0 ponders and 0 brainstorm :frown:
The 3rd one I started the combo and saw an Orim's Chant in response to Ideas Unbound, breaking a fetch for Savannah :cry: . I had a meditate and 6 mana left, but didn't play it searching a FOW because I had a Merchant Scroll on hand and can try to combo the next turn. After Ideas resolves I draw a FOW :mad:
The next turn I starts the combo again and after playing some cards I have two FOW, three Cunning and a bunch of lands on hand. I Cunning for untap effect (three manas lefts) and I forgot to put any untap effect in my sideboard ! :eek:
The four Turnabout was in my maindeck (in any case I need one more mana) and didn't have chain of vapor or snap. So I lose this game.

For my next tournament I expect that I'll do even better. 3rd place aren't bad for my first Spring Tide tournament.

Any one has try Flash of Insight? Solidarity players BF himselfs to put Flash on the graveyard (and a bunch of Blue spells) and put the rest of the deck in order so they can combo without problem...

A friend of mine played this deck in a tournament and he's a very solid player. Top 8-ing almost every tourney he goes to, however when he decided to give this deck a spin he went 2-3. He told me he was never ever going to pick up the deck again and hated it.

My question; did he just scrub out with bad luck, or is the deck just very bad in today's metagame?

The deck isn't easy to play. You need a lot of matchs to make good decisions about wich card search, wich cast in every moment (Ideas or Meditate with only three lands?) and how sideboard vs other decks.

If your friend didn't test the deck one or two weeks before the tournament it's completely normal that he went 2-3.

And finally the deck it's a bye vs counterbalance or discard if you don't have your MD and sideboard specially designed vs them. The old versions don't work very well in this aspect.
In Solidarity, Cryptic Command helps a lot vs counterbalance, but I haven't done any test with Spring Tide yet.
Vs discard you can play Divert, Disruption or Spell Snare. A Meditate before your turn if your opponent doesn't expect to have a new turn helps too.

QUOTE Gocho:
If your friend didn't test the deck one or two weeks before the tournament it's completely normal that he went 2-3.


Quoted for truth!

Spring tide isnt a very good choice if you expect some suicide and/or counterbalance.dec.
Flash of Insight is not nessasary, because your draw is better than Solidaritys. I had tested Cryptic Command and i think he isnt as good as he is in Solidarity. You dont want to left 4 mana open to counter something, go for Cunning Wish -> Wipe away and bounce the cb eot, then win in your turn! :cool:

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Originally Posted by donnhart

Flash of Insight is not nessasary, because your draw is better than Solidaritys.

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Flash of Insight let you make some little tricks with Brain Freeze and Remand, but I haven't test it yet.

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Originally Posted by donnhart

I had tested Cryptic Command and i think he isnt as good as he is in Solidarity. You dont want to left 4 mana open to counter something, go for Cunning Wish -> Wipe away and bounce the cb eot, then win in your turn! :cool:

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Cunning + Wipe are 6 mana EOT, Cryptic Command are only 4, and can counter CB before it would be a problem. And Command helps a lot in other matchs too. (Solidarity + Cryptic Command report here: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=10963)

In any case, 2 Cryptic Command are almost $40-$50 so I will try another solution for CB :tongue:

Dont make the mistake to compare Spring Tide with Solidarity. Its a different deck. Freeze + Remand + Flash are nice, sure. But in Tide those tricks arent needed, because you are faster and you have stronger draw/tutor power.

But go for it and test Command and Flash, then you will see what i mean. :wink:

What i can see it's that Spring Tide has access to less mana that Solidarity, but combo faster :laugh:

I need more gametest with the deck, but I like it a lot

I always appreciated this deck, and recently I decided to build it, becuase it's so funny to play and it's also a valorous way to examine your playing skills with a deck which is,surely, not easy to play.
I wanna ask you only a question: I saw that several people confirmed how it's almost an autoloss when an opposing counterbalance lands on the ground, but I had an enormous difficulty also, of course, in managing to keep a decent bunch of cards to combo -off with when I tested against black-discarders decks. I wanna ask that german guy who ploted spring tide on the top of a tourney (donnhart?): how do/did you face those enemies ? i mean, it's almost impossible to win against those typologies of decks, I wanna know how can we manage to face these threats in a consistent way. I always sided in Divert g1 e g2, but , of course, it's not easy to rely on 3 cards to prevent a heavy discard suite (about 12 cards, which magically, always appear in opponent's hand in the first turns).. Are there any techs to fight the fucking duresses, thoughtseizes and hymns ( not counting the land destruction..), apart from brainstorming in response and hoping that divert comes in our hands?
And what do you usually side in against them , only divert ? and which card do you take out ? trade routes ( which, in my case, is a Peek), twincast and..?
I wanna know these things because I'm seriously indecided whether to choose spring tide or solidarity, which seems to offer a more preventive response against them, having all instants ( " thoughtseize? well, in response i combo out in your face"). I'm in a meta with quite of Eva greens and some TheRocks with few Thresholds, but i DO wanna play this deck and manage to fuck off all their discard-suites/counters, but it seems very hard..
But, on the other side, I don't wanna play a crappy deck such as Burn to get top8.

I don't play this deck, so maybe i'm wrong, but... Is not deep analysis a good sideboard option against discard??

I had explained my boarding plan few posts ago. Seriously, if your meta is full of EvaGreen/Deadguy/Counterbalance you shouldnt play any Stormcombo.dec.
With the "Divert-Tech" you can increase this Mu to about 30%. (Preboard maybe 15-20%)
There is no way to fight through heavy discard without weakening the combo (which leads to the same result:rolleyes: ).
You can play some Think Twice or Spell Snares main to refill your hand or counter Hymn/Sinkhole. With lucky draw you can combo of before they discard your hand, but this isnt a solid plan...

Try to do goldfishs with 2-3 lands in play and only 3-4 cards in hand, if you are able to win 80% of the attempts, go for the tourney. If not: change the deck for a time.
After my succes with tide, the meta had turned to combohate. So i dropped the deck and play muc for some time -> http://www.deckcheck.net/deck.php?id=19886
(not-quite-mono-u-but-with-random-other-colors-control)
I will pick up Spring Tide again, but for now is this my choice :cool: .

In my opinion Solidarity it's better that Spring Tide vs Discards.dec, because with remand you only need storm of 7 + BF + Remand + BF again. It's easy to do with 4-6 lands in play and only one reset.

Spring Tide needs storm of 15-16 + BF to win and it's very difficult to do with all the Duress and Hymns around you.

But I'm with donnhart, if you have an anticombo meta don't play combo.

Edit:
Anyone have try Shappire medallion or Locket of yesterdays in the Snap slot?

I didnt test Locket or Medallion, but the idea seems at least interesting.
Medallion enables to combo of without High Tide, which could be great sometimes. But i have no idea what to cut for 2-3 Medallion.
Locket isnt worth trying, i think.

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Originally Posted by Gocho

Anyone have try Shappire medallion or Locket of yesterdays in the Snap slot?

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I did try Locket but it just sucked. It sucks in your start hand and moreso when you draw it later.

Didn't try Medallion, though...

Hey There,
I was reading about a Type 1 version of this deck and I came across an interesting idea that I had never considered and didn't know if other people had really though about it.

Summer Bloom
1G
Sorcery
You may play up to three additional lands this turn.

Now I know that it is very dangerous to play non basics in this deck but if this card allows me to go off more easily with less lands in play initially. Also, it turns the dead draws of lands into something useful. An on average i would guess as useful as an untap spell. For a given two mana untap spell we average 2 to 4 mana. This spell average a >4 mana increase. It seems like it might be worth it though it cannot be fetched with scroll (obv) it can be fetched with mystical.

I dont think its currently worth the green splash, on the other hand green gives us foremost Krosan Grip and Xantid Swarm.

If they decide to unban Time Spiral this could be decent though

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gocho

But I'm with donnhart, if you have an anticombo meta don't play combo.

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That statement just shows that a.) you don't know how to play combo effectively and b.) that you may not just play MONO BLUE combo in an anti-combo meta...

Trade Routes has proven itself to me time and again. I don't know why people refuse to play it. It turns every land you draw into a Lonely Sandbar, only just a little worse (stifleable, but honestly, is that really a concern?)...

Pce,

--DC

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Originally Posted by Dark_Cynic87

It turns every land you draw into a Lonely Sandbar, only just a little worse (stifleable, but honestly, is that really a concern?)...

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Lonely Sandbar is also stifleable.