[Deck] 12 Post

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Originally Posted by Skurt

I'm just curious. why is this card so amazing?

In my point of view: Jund, BUG and Junk all run Abrupt Decay. Why would it be so great to just put Oblivion Stone on the table?
It's also exposed to opposing Oblivion Rings and such.

And against those decks you are the one running alot of artifacts, not them! Especially relevant are Pithing Needle and Candelabra which you'll lose when cracking O-Stone.

Several avantages of All is Dust over O--stone:
I find the power of being unexpected and cast directly from the hand much bigger. To do this with O-stone it costs 1 mora mana and you're exposed to both counterspells and Stifles all in the same turn!!

Another advantage of All is Dust is ability to cost less with Eye of Ugin.

I don't see how it's so much better than All is Dust? Can someone plase explain.

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O-Stone kills MUD (one of our terrible match-ups game 1), and is an out against SnT decks because it kills Emrakul as well. It also kills Helm of Obedience.

Its weakness to Abrupt Decay is easily remedied by activating it the turn it comes into play, or if you have to play it early, by providing a good Abrupt Decay target to your opponent as bait (Most players start getting nervous when I play a Candelabra, for example).

If your local meta doesn't run a lot of Emrakuls and Helms, then All is Dust is probably better.

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Originally Posted by Skurt

I'm just curious. why is this card so amazing?

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Biggest reasons off the top of my head: Obilvion Stone hits artifacts too... and during your opponent's turn, which All is Dust does neither.

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Originally Posted by Skurt

In my point of view: Jund, BUG and Junk all run Abrupt Decay. Why would it be so great to just put Oblivion Stone on the table?
It's also exposed to opposing Oblivion Rings and such.

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Well, yes. But in response to all the cards you just mentioned, we can generally just detonate the Oblivion Stone, which is why Stifle is the only real concern.

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Originally Posted by Skurt

And against those decks you are the one running alot of artifacts, not them! Especially relevant are Pithing Needle and Candelabra which you'll lose when cracking O-Stone.

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Two things:
1. Those cards are not as necessary to win as you imply. Yes, they are amazing at what they do, but we can play around Wasteland without Pithing Needle and Candelabra adds speed, not inevitability.
2. The Locus player controls when they put their cards out. Just because I have Candelabra in hand doesn't mean that I have to play it right away.

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Originally Posted by Skurt

Several avantages of All is Dust over O--stone:
I find the power of being unexpected and cast directly from the hand much bigger. To do this with O-stone it costs 1 mora mana and you're exposed to both counterspells and Stifles all in the same turn!!

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The power to wipe the field during your opponent's turn is the counterpoint that comes to mind. An opponent may see the giant bomb we just through out sitting there, but what they don't see is what will cause the player to detonate. And that means that they have to force detonation, which is a value play for us and potentially a misplay for them.

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Originally Posted by Skurt

Another advantage of All is Dust is ability to cost less with Eye of Ugin.

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My rule of thumb with Eye of Ugin: let the Annihilator or Infinite turns solve it.

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Originally Posted by Skurt

I don't see how it's so much better than All is Dust?

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One thing I'm curious at trying is a 1-2 Split of All is Dust-Oblivion Stone like my Modern Tron deck. But that said, O-Stone is either an :8: bomb or a :3:: set the bomb, and at any later point :5:: Planar Cleansing, and if the opponent's can't outplay the O-Stone fast enough, it also gives us time to sink mana into Fate Counters. All is Dust is just a reset button, which is great, but... not flexible.

Hi all, sorry for my bad English
I really like Turbo Eldrazi deck, i played a lot blue/green list, but now i'm testin mono green list, i think it's amazing!

The core:
4 Vesuva
1 Eye of Ugin
4 Glimmerpost
4 Cloudpost
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre

Supplemental spells:
4 Primeval Titan
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Crop rotation
4 Exploration
3 Manabond
4 Beast Within
3 Exedition Map
3 Phiting Needle
3 Candelabra of Tawnos

Lands:
5 Forest
1 Karakas
1 Flooded Strand
1 Bojuka Bog
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Glacial Chasm

What do you think about this list?

:smile:

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Originally Posted by SBGpinas

They finally posted Jeremiah's list in SCG:

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=52981

He was just short of Top 16... bad pairings perhaps?

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I could draw into top 8 if I had won my round 8 pairing, I lost it though, so drew for an auto into top 32 with a friend, which is 100$ prize. My two losses were both to Show & tell, one Omnitell, for which I had altered my sideboard to remove vensers, and still had a very close match. The second, Sneaky was a culmination of them having absurd hands to my mediocre mulligans.

Deck is still strong, might need a stronger showing for handling griselbrand, possibly one needle. O-stone completely saved the matchup from being a miserable failure.

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Originally Posted by Rock Lee

I could draw into top 8 if I had won my round 8 pairing, I lost it though, so drew for an auto into top 32 with a friend, which is 100$ prize. My two losses were both to Show & tell, one Omnitell, for which I had altered my sideboard to remove vensers, and still had a very close match. The second, Sneaky was a culmination of them having absurd hands to my mediocre mulligans.

Deck is still strong, might need a stronger showing for handling griselbrand, possibly one needle. O-stone completely saved the matchup from being a miserable failure.

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What were the rest of your pairings for that event?

If you were to make a change to your current list, knowing what the weaknesses are, what would you do?

We're currently trying a list that contains both Pithing Needle and O-stone, but seeing as these two cards don't really interact in the best way, we might just remove Pithing Needle altogether. Still, its ability to shut down Sneak Attack, Griselbrand, Liliana of the Veil, among others, simply cannot be ignored, Abrupt Decay notwithstanding.

Hey guys, i want to attend a small local tourney with this deck on sunday and my concerns are as always sideboarding strategies... in example, would you bring in flusterstorms against jund? and against an aggro bug? and against a more controlish-version? Also, when would you side your surgical extractions, against any black based deck that runs wasteland?
Thanks for your advices

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Originally Posted by Davek

Hey guys, i want to attend a small local tourney with this deck on sunday and my concerns are as always sideboarding strategies... in example, would you bring in flusterstorms against jund? and against an aggro bug? and against a more controlish-version? Also, when would you side your surgical extractions, against any black based deck that runs wasteland?
Thanks for your advices

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trying a new build that addresses both Sneaky-show weaknesses and might make sideboarding easier. I'll get back to you tomorrow after work and class.

Hi everyone, I'm slowly putting the list together but I don't think I'll get candelabra in a near futur seeing its price (180€ or more),

So I'm looking to something to fill the spot MD, I've thought to the magus of the candelabra ou the mul daya creature that lets us put a land. What do you think I could play in this spot?

Thanks a lot for your advice

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Originally Posted by SaintS

Hi everyone, I'm slowly putting the list together but I don't think I'll get candelabra in a near futur seeing its price (180€ or more),

So I'm looking to something to fill the spot MD, I've thought to the magus of the candelabra ou the mul daya creature that lets us put a land. What do you think I could play in this spot?

Thanks a lot for your advice

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Oracle of Mul Daya
Magus of the Candelabra
Deserted Temple
Explore
Crucible of Worlds

Those are the cards that come to mind off the top of my head. None of these are as good as Candelabra itself, but they can pull their weight in their own unique way, Take your pick, but also keep in mind that Locus Lands can win games without Candelabra.

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Originally Posted by Rock Lee

trying a new build that addresses both Sneaky-show weaknesses and might make sideboarding easier. I'll get back to you tomorrow after work and class.

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I would also highly interested in this.

Thanks in advanced.

Stephan

nice disruption and draw engine

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers...0650&type=card http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers...1487&type=card
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers...9831&type=card

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Originally Posted by bizdoin

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers...9831&type=card

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I think for raw draw power I'd rather go into Stroke of Genius or Well of Knowledge, but I might give it a shot.

As for the others, I might try Mishra's Helix in my 16-Post MUD, but I think it might not be the best fit in the UG Turbo Eldrazi because by they time you would be casting it with the intent to shut down your opponent is probably about the same time you'd be shutting down your opponent with Emrakul+Karakas. The Into the Eye of Chaos might be interesting, but I think I'll stick to Flusterstorm for the time being... I might try it as a 1 of, or maybe work it into in a kind of UW Control-Post.

Rock Lee

i want to find out your opinion about two matchups: Goblins and Merfolks. we are talking about your current list

i test a lot these matchups and i consider them to be the worst our matchups. i cant understand, how we can win them without needles on wastelands? Goblins play potrs, that can beat us without candelabras

i understand, that our main plan is show and tell into titan or eldrazi. but merfols has so much counterspells =( Our mass removal is too slow against them because of wastelands. Certainly, we can generate paranoic sideboard against them:
Grass
Explosives
Propaganda
Moment's Peace
Drop of Honey
Ensnaring Bridge o_O

and so on. but all these cards are useless against really bad mutchups like Sneak and Combo

may be only in Moscow there people which play Goblins and Merfolks :laugh:yeah. they didnt here about Jund. But its true. the same problem with maverick in Moscow. their pilots play 4 Aven in main, that kill all our attempts to find necessary cards

waiting for your answers (((=

UPD! the last question: you are playing without forest. Didnt you have problems to cast titan for mana? playing this deck i find out, that if everything is ok, we won't have problems to go into show into titan on turn 3. But if we have problems we have to cast him for mana. and only 4 Tropical to do it. i am wrong?

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Originally Posted by Loxmatii

Rock Lee

i want to find out your opinion about two matchups: Goblins and Merfolks. we are talking about your current list

i test a lot these matchups and i consider them to be the worst our matchups. i cant understand, how we can win them without needles on wastelands? Goblins play potrs, that can beat us without candelabras

i understand, that our main plan is show and tell into titan or eldrazi. but merfols has so much counterspells =( Our mass removal is too slow against them because of wastelands. Certainly, we can generate paranoic sideboard against them:
Grass
Explosives
Propaganda
Moment's Peace
Drop of Honey
Ensnaring Bridge o_O

and so on. but all these cards are useless against really bad mutchups like Sneak and Combo

may be only in Moscow there people which play Goblins and Merfolks :laugh:yeah. they didnt here about Jund. But its true. the same problem with maverick in Moscow. their pilots play 4 Aven in main, that kill all our attempts to find necessary cards

waiting for your answers (((=

UPD! the last question: you are playing without forest. Didnt you have problems to cast titan for mana? playing this deck i find out, that if everything is ok, we won't have problems to go into show into titan on turn 3. But if we have problems we have to cast him for mana. and only 4 Tropical to do it. i am wrong?

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If I may provide some input...

The thing with Goblins is that even without Pithing Needles, the matchup is winnable because of Glimmerpost and Glacial Chasm.

It's not every game where they open with a Turn 1 Lackey, Turn 2 Lackey into Chieftain and 2 Piledrivers. During their slower draws, you can survive long enough to either Show and Tell a Primeval Titan, or get enough lands to hard-cast it. Wastelands can be answered by Crop Rotation, and even if their Wastelands are successful, they would have to have an insane draw to get a 2nd and a 3rd to slow you down with.

My build has main deck Pithing Needles, and I only open with them a little less than half of the time, and I still have a very positive match-up against Goblins during games when I don't have it. Maybe you're just playing someone who is extremely lucky with their draws.

As for Merfolk, admittedly, it is one of the hardest aggro matchups. Still, you'd want to rely on Crop Rotation and Show and Tell to pull off a win. You can choke out their counterspells by continually playing a relevant spell one after another. Eventually they will run out of counters and you will resolve something relevant and it will give you enough breathing room to recover and kill them. This is more of an even matchup compared to Goblins without Pithing Needle main.

Still it makes me wonder how many Goblins and Merfolk exist in your local meta. If they're the prevalent deck, then of course you're better off putting Pithing Needles main. In a Junk, Jund, Esper meta, Pithing Needles are not as strong as in a Goblins/Merfolk metagame.

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Originally Posted by Loxmatii

Rock Lee

i want to find out your opinion about two matchups: Goblins

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I have such a long list of experience against goblins that I can beat them without needle. Needle no doubt is an INCREDIBLE card against them, and to a novice player who can't edge out advantage elsewhere, I suggest md'ing needles if you have goblins in your meta.

The ways I beat them involve two logic paths, supplemented by two strong answers post-side.

path 1: resolve a show & tell'd titan. no maindeck answers to this, that lets you either go for massive lifegain, or a chasm.
path 2: sit on chasm and win slowly but surely. This is always my plan B, and i never go for it first, but with needles main you can make it your plan A.

post-side

Bebs ruin them
Tabernacle lets them cry to overcommittment and unable to port you out.

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and Merfolks.

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Same concept as goblins, but you need to know what they will bite on for counters. They lack explosiveness, but make up for it in an array of weak counters. Test test test this matchup and it becomes easy. Even easier if they run standstill. Again without experience, just maindeck needles and call it a day.


In the sideboard I run a 4th show & 4th o-stone, and against almost all aggro matchups they are my bread and butter.

The O stones also come in against some forms of combo, which increases your sb efficiency greatly.

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UPD! the last question: you are playing without forest. Didnt you have problems to cast titan for mana? playing this deck i find out, that if everything is ok, we won't have problems to go into show into titan on turn 3. But if we have problems we have to cast him for mana. and only 4 Tropical to do it. i am wrong?

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You forgot that titan's true mana cost is 2U. I never missed the forest.

Rock, this is a question that came up in testing, as I blew it too early:

Under what circumstances is it correct to blow up your own Titan with an O-Stone? Because, once again, I punted hard on this question in my testing.

SBGpinas , Rock Lee
thank you for your answers. you gave me a lot to think about and test

I was wondering what kind of list I should be playing as I own at the moment 3 Tropical Islands, 3 Show and Tells, 1 Candelabra, and 1 Tabernacle. Also testing last night using Arianrhod's deck, each match against my friend who was on maverick I was blown out over and over by wasteland and knight tutoring up wastelands, even with crop rotation for the first few targets. I was never able to get enough steam to get started. I was wonder what the best way to combat that would be, I know part of the problem is not being proficient in the deck. Any and all advice is most welcome. And thank you.

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Originally Posted by doomedfire

I was wondering what kind of list I should be playing as I own at the moment 3 Tropical Islands, 3 Show and Tells, 1 Candelabra, and 1 Tabernacle.

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The only concern based on what you wrote is that you only have 3 Tropical Islands. You can run either a Breeding Pool, another basic land, or a fetch in the slot. Multiple Candelabras and a full set of Show and Tell is nice, but the deck can survive with only three and a single Candelabra.

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Originally Posted by doomedfire

Also testing last night using Arianrhod's deck, each match against my friend who was on maverick I was blown out over and over by wasteland and knight tutoring up wastelands, even with crop rotation for the first few targets. I was never able to get enough steam to get started. I was wonder what the best way to combat that would be, I know part of the problem is not being proficient in the deck. Any and all advice is most welcome. And thank you.

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Do you run Pithing Needle or Surgical Extraction? If you want to be unconventional, you can also try Stifle effects. Personally, I'm a fan of Pithing Needle because it's searchable by Trinket Mage.

This is my list (which he was borrowing last night):


4 Misty Rainforest
4 Tropical Island
2 Island
4 Cloudpost
4 Glimmerpost
4 Vesuva
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Karakas
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Glacial Chasm
1 Eye of Ugin

4 Show and Tell
1 All is Dust

4 Brainstorm
4 Crop Rotation
3 Repeal

3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Expedition Map
2 Candelabra of Tawnos
1 Oblivion Stone

2 Trinket Mage
4 Primeval Titan
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn

//SB
3 Mindbreak Trap
2 Flusterstorm
2 Blue Elemental Blast
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Chalice of the Void
1 All is Dust
1 Oblivion Stone
2 Hibernation

There were Needles a while ago -- I found them to be more of a hassle than they're worth.