Minor nitpick, I'd go ESG to be able to cast World BreakerQuote:
Originally Posted by Gheizen64
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Minor nitpick, I'd go ESG to be able to cast World BreakerQuote:
Originally Posted by Gheizen64
This list looks really thought through and Displacer is a reason I will maybe sometime give up thinking about an aggressive colorless version as this week I lost to Show and Tell in compelling fashion due to 2 Show and Telled creatures (G1 Emrakul G2 Griselbrand) even through my disruption of Thorn & Revoker G1 and Revoker G2. It is also very hard to name the right thing with revoker if you don't have Displacers (I only played 2 Endbringers) and only one Karakas and no maindeck Warping Wails.Quote:
Originally Posted by WinterN
Anyways I went 3-1 (well basically 2-1):
R1 I played against Show and Tell (see above) 0:2
R2 Bye...
R3 Reanimator: 2:0
G1 I get some pressure out and a Thorn and he is not able to cobble anything together.
G2 My time to luck out: I mull and see Karakas on the scry. I then still go to revoke Griselbrand, as I have little else and he careful studies Griselbrand and Tidespout Tyrant. I am really reluctant to name Griselbrand as don't want to make him reanimate
Tidespout Tyrant. He goes to reanimate Griselbrand, as he thinks 7/7 lifelink is better (I agree) and I Karakas it away and that was all she wrote.
R4 Dredge: 2:0
G1 after realizing the Endless Ones are a great out to Bridges I keep a hand of 2 Endless Ones and a Chalice. After Chalices resolves he is unable to do much (he had played a Looting on T1) as he has only 1 Land.
G2 I have a Chalice again and play an Endless one removing 2 Bridges, but he hardcasts Narcomoeba, Putrid Imp, Thug and relevantly a Stinkweed Imp. To not die to his little Fliers I hardcast a Faerie off a Mox and a Cavern naming Faerie ;) After some turns of building a board against his Stinkweed Imp I attack and Exile the dead Imp with another Faerie. I then go on to roll over him -> A strange game.
The list I played was:
4x Ancient Tomb
4x Cavern of Souls
4x City of Traitors
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x Eye of Ugin
1x Karakas
4x Wasteland
3x Dismember
4x Eldrazi Mimic
2x Endbringer
4x Endless One
4x Phyrexian Revoker
4x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Chalice of the Void
3x Mox Diamond
3x Thorn of Amethyst
1x Umezawa's Jitte
Sideboard
3x Faerie Macabre
1x Grafdigger's Cage
3x Pithing Needle
3x Ratchet Bomb
1x Umezawa's Jitte
3x Warping Wail
1x Trinisphere
In the future I will probably heed the words of others and maindeck the Warping Wails to come to something like this:
4x Ancient Tomb
4x Cavern of Souls
4x City of Traitors
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x Eye of Ugin
1x Karakas
4x Wasteland
3x Warping Wail
4x Eldrazi Mimic
3x Endbringer
4x Endless One
3x Phyrexian Revoker
4x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
4x Chalice of the Void
3x Mox Diamond
4x Thorn of Amethyst
Sideboard
1x Dismember
4x Faerie Macabre
1x Grafdigger's Cage
3x Pithing Needle
3x Ratchet Bomb
2x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Warping Wail
On the other hand I have to admit that the white version can eschew a lot of the problems the colorless Stompy version has and the displacer is sweet and white has great sideboard cards in RIP and Disenchant. It might be that it is just a more stable deck as with the Cities you sometimes have horrible hands of Eye + City + Chalice or double City...
I don't get it: Tidespout is not legendary, so Karakas does nothing to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by hofzge
And you can't Revoke him since its ability is not activated.
In fact, Tidespout is maybe the best fatty to reanimate against Eldrazi Stompy.
I still have no idea how you guys don't understand the power of Wasteland Strangler, Deathrite Shaman, and Relic of Progenitus in Legacy.
The lists in this thread are glass cannon creature lists that get wrecked by the tier 1 decks.
I was considering Wasteland Strangler as a sideboard card but discarded the idea as I think it will only be truly relevant against Elves. Can you propose a list using the above cards and explain why you think it will favor the currently unfavorable match ups?Quote:
Originally Posted by gkraigher
That's a pretty ignorant post. Chalice of the Void is better than either DRS or Relic in Legacy.Quote:
Originally Posted by gkraigher
Your post also blatantly ignores the development of the GW Midrange version.
It sounds to me like someone is trying to replicate the modern version without understanding what makes legacy a different format, but I don't want to jump to conclusions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
My Bad: What I meant was he does NOT reanimate Tidespout but Griselbrand and loses because of that.Quote:
Originally Posted by anakyn
Wrong, cards you auto lose to:Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
Moat
Glacial chasm
Dark depths
Ensnaring bridge
Humility
Blazing archon
Progenitus
Terminus
Price of progress - all these lists auto lose to burn. Auto lose.
These are all cards you will have to play against and your only solution is endbringer. The deck had only one line of attack, it has no reach, no tricks, just creatures attacking. That is an extremely weak strategy when it isn't protected by counter magic.
Legacy is a format where decks attack on more than one plane. Creatures attacking is one of the single weakest strategies in Legacy. And these decks are all in on that one strategy because that's all you have.
I think time will prove me correct that eldrazi without deathrite shaman is strictly a tier 3 decklists. It does nothing unfair in an unfair field. You are playing modern, while your opponent is playing legacy. Good luck doing that.
Moat - World BreakerQuote:
Originally Posted by gkraigher
Glacial Chasm - World Breaker
Dark Depths - Eldrazi Displacer, World Breaker
Ensnaring Bridge - World Breaker
Humility - World Breaker
Blazing Archon - Yes, an issue, but it rarely comes up. Only in reanimate sideboards. Ulamog in sideboard
Terminus - Warping Wail
Price of Progress - Warping Wail / Chalice of the Void
Moat --> World Breaker, All is DustQuote:
Originally Posted by gkraigher
Glacial chasm --> World Breaker
Dark depths --> Karakas or Displacer
Ensnaring bridge --> World Breaker
Humility --> World Breaker, All is Dust
Blazing Archon --> All is Dust
Progenitus --> Wail can counter whatever puts it into play, All is Dust
Terminus --> Wail, TKS + Displacer combo, Factory, not playing like an idiot
Price of progress - all these lists auto lose to burn. Auto lose. - Can't win against everybody. Besides, Burn is such a tiny part of the metagame that I don't care about it.
That's why I dislike the pure colorless build/aggro build because it's so much of a one-trick pony.
Edit: @Bruizar: Chalice works, Wail can't counter instants.
Much more comprehensive, and correct :-) Thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
I don't think what barook said is wrong. Chalice on 1 is way better for eldrazi than Relic, DRS, and Strangler - that and chalice isn't much of a modern card as far as I know. Confused by wasteland strangler comment; I guess it has applications but seems only relevant to legacy b/c it can ingest suspended Ancestral Vision - especially puzzling because it almost doesn't matter how many cards shardless draws (if you can beat goyf with your eldrazi).Quote:
Originally Posted by bruizar
Take chalice out of this deck without going blue (or thorn/sphere overload) and throwing in some cards you've suggested will destroy eldrazi's win % vs top tier decks (especially miracles and sneak 'n show). I think you'll find that Eldrazi lists [especially colorless ones] are easily able to compete with more than half of the Decks to Beat sub-forum. One thing that is clear right now is that ANT and Miracles widely agreed upon as being the top two Legacy decks at this moment, and eldrazi will win most of these matches [and do even better vs ANT if it reserves sideboard slots for Null Rods]. The glaring weakness of Eldrazi lists at this time are RG Lands and Batterskull decks (piloted as combo), and potentially burn/reanimator. I don't see how your three suggestions do anything but overreact to yard based strategies, especially when this deck can't actually afford to use revoker without chalice on 1 protection.
Before going after x=1 chalice, I'd be quicker to criticize GW eldrazi for its use of mana signets, maindeck displacers, and overloading reanimator hate [RiP in sideboard, multiple Karakas in main].
This is why I'm advocating and running Sword of Light and Shadow. The life gain helps offset your Ancient Tombs / Burn if you can get it down quickly enough, it provides protection from D&T.dec and germ token, and it recurrs Faerie Macabres when you connect against graveyard strategies. In addition, it negates Gurmag Angler which could outclass a lot of the deck's creatures.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
I think Displacer is easily one of the Top 3 Eldazi now, if not the most important one after TKS, and not at least splashing white for 4x Displacer is a grave mistake. It is that good.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
E.g. played against MUD today with an opponent about to jam down two Wurmcoil Engines. Displacer not only stopped the first Engine, but I also brought in Containment Priest, which swiftly ended the game with the exile combo.
It's definitely fancy, so you get style points. What I want to see more of though if you use it is:Quote:
Originally Posted by Barook
-attack with TKS
-blink TKS at end opponent draw step
-huzzah, vigilance trick unlocked!
This would be especially good vs sorcery speed reliant decks.
Displacer brings the creature back tapped, which is why it's so good. So no vigilance, but complete control of combat. After the tournament I'll try and brew something with the Rasputin Dreamweaver combo as I think it's easily doable for the deck and provides an instant win by exiling / drawing deck through TKS.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
I don't think so.Quote:
Exile another target creature, then return it to the battlefield tapped under its owner's control.
You can nuke Miracles with their trigger on the stack if you flicker TKS, though.
True, but it's also pure control of what they can play at sorcery speed - and that's what's important. Force opponent to draw 2nd card, remove the relevant one as TKS comes back, and only then allow them into a main phase.Quote:
Originally Posted by bruizar
no vigilance :mad:
Well, the short version is that it rolls over anything not named Tasigur, the Golden Fang, and even then, you can still catch out Mentors and Goyfs if you play it post-combat. IT is an utterly ridiculous card - which is somewhat surprising, let me tell you.Quote:
Originally Posted by bruizar