[Deck] Goblins

I think that a 1:1 split krenko-SGC is the way to go: anyone of them can win games where the other one would have not, so both of them are necessary.
I have an issue with boarding pyrokinesis. It seems like you guys keep pyrokinesis in more than I do. I am truly hesitant playing pyrokinesis against blue decks, the idea of getting it countered and get 2 for 1 makes me feel bad. Even against aggro decks like RUG and BUG I prefer to board it out in favour of cards like REB and relic which will get 1:1 in case they are countered. I know that they board out removal against us but they don t board out all removals so there is still a chance. If they play 4 FOW, 4 daze and some number of spell pierce/spell snare MD they cannot board everything out.

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Originally Posted by jrw1985

If I'm understanding correctly you had 3 REB, 2 KGrip and 1 TSH in your 60 at this point. REBs can handle Jace/Tezzeret. Grip/TSH can handle Humility/Bridge. So I'd probably take the 3 Sword of the Meek. I agree with Scatman that you can beat the Thoptor/Sword Combo (Piledriver is Pro U, Thoptors ar U, plus you have Sharpshooter) but taking 3 Sword of the Meek leaves him with 4 much less useful Foundries in his deck. You're essentially giving him 4 near-blanks to draw. With his combo nerfed he can't chump your horde, which should give you time to do what goblins does.

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Wow, I thought he'd bring in 3 Duress, 2 K.Grips and hooligan, but guess that doesn't change my view all that much. I don't agree with you, but from what I know, you might be right.
Remembered another thing though. He said it was T2. by T3 he would have 8 power on the board, plus whatever else he could afford playing. That inclines me a little more on my side of taking the lock pieces, since the opponent would likely be dead in 1-2 turns.

The last few days I've been playing around with a "new" build of goblins. It basically seeks to expand upon a few strengths of goblins:

6 cost reduction cards instead of 4 (cheating a lot of goblins onto the battlefield in rapid succession while optimizing cards like Rishadan Port and Wasteland)
7 haste givers instead of 4-5 (have a lot of instant pressure, even after sweepers)
6 tutors instead of 4 (getting those Ringleaders or silver bullets more often when you need them)
4 +1/+1 pumpers instead of 0-1 (simply adds more muscle and resilience to plague)

The deck looks like this:

(Dutch/Limbo Goblins)
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Chieftain
3 Goblin Warchief
3 Frogtosser Banneret
3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Boggart Harbinger
2 Goblin Piledriver
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Stingscourger
1 Skirk Prospector
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

4 Aether Vial
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Rishadan Ports
2 Mountain
1 Arid Mesa
4 Wasteland
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Badlands

I don't claim that this version is superior. It's just an attempt to expand some of its classic strengths. Give it a chance before you dismiss it!

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Originally Posted by ScatmanX

I am cenrtainly enjoying it. Bring on the 2nd part.
Sad to realise we did not meedt. next tournament I'll pm you.
Rock on against SnT. My only issue when winning against it, is that it might take longer for them to ban the f***** card.

I discussed SB a little with some other users against Merfolk. We did not reach a concenssus on what was the best approach, but I want to state what I would do in your position with your decklist: -1 Chieftain, -1 Stingscourger, +2 ReB.

@Cleston: Qhat did you used on you W Splash?

Just for the record, on my next tournament I'll try a Rbg build, MD weird as hell, with this SB:
1 Tin Street Hooligan
2 Pyrokinesis

1 Surgical
3 Relic of Progenitus

2 Krosan Grip

2 Engineered Explosives
4 Duress / Combo hate
Too weird, or might actually be promissing?

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@Scatman: Have you allready played with that Rgb list? I'm also thinking to add black cause that's kind of a meta chose for me. Would you like ton post your list?

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Originally Posted by angel882

@Scatman: Have you allready played with that Rgb list? I'm also thinking to add black cause that's kind of a meta chose for me. Would you like ton post your list?

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Haven't had time.
Avatara's list looks pretty sweet actually. Might try something like that. I love some Frogtosser Bannerrets =]
I'd cut a prospector (it just doesn't do enough there) and maybe a Harbinger on that list to fit in some more removal, but would like to try something similar.

Mine looks like this right now:
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
4 Badlands
1 Aunties Hovel
1 Taiga
6 Fetchland
2 Mountain

4 Aether Vial

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Frogtosser Banneret
4 Goblin Chieftain
4 Warren Instigator
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
2 Siege-Gang Commander

3 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger
1 Warrens Weirdings
2 Tarfire

1 Krenko

Sideboard:
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Tin-Street Hooligan

2 Pyrokinesis

4 Gravehate of choice (I'm on 2 Surgical, 2 Relic)

2 Krosan Grip

1 Engineered Explosives
4 Duress

While it plays quite differently than traditional goblins, it is much funny to play, and quite powerful too.

I want to ask a question regarding the mirror:

I always board out lackey whether I am on the play or draw. Some friends told me that they never board out lackey as it can give you an auto win if it connects. It is also a removal for an opponent's lackey that will bring you in trouble if not boarded out.

My reasoning about boarding lackey out: It is the worst top deck that you can think in the mirror. The opponent that can connect with lackey tends to over extend and I can play the game in control mode and take over the game bit by bit.

What do you think?

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Originally Posted by ScatmanX

Wow, I thought he'd bring in 3 Duress, 2 K.Grips and hooligan, but guess that doesn't change my view all that much. I don't agree with you, but from what I know, you might be right.
Remembered another thing though. He said it was T2. by T3 he would have 8 power on the board, plus whatever else he could afford playing. That inclines me a little more on my side of taking the lock pieces, since the opponent would likely be dead in 1-2 turns.

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I brought +3 Duress, +3 REB and +2 KGrip.

Indeed it was a T2 8 power board. Maybe I should have taken those cards that would prevent me from attacking, like esnaring and humility, instead of thinking of removing those that would burn me to death, like tezzeret. the fact that i had lost to a tezzeret burn 5 minutes before was polluting my decision making, it seems.

He seemed to have sandbagged (yay) swords to plowshares for Sharpshooter both games...



@Rb lists being discussed here: I love to see them coming, though I feel that I should stress the need for more test on Earwig Squad. Extraction effect, 5 power, prowl cost that can be afforded at turn 2 with lackey into warchief (or banneret), seems like a bargain for me, and could improve matchups you have no business winning preboard.

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Originally Posted by Sasan

I want to ask a question regarding the mirror:

I always board out lackey whether I am on the play or draw. Some friends told me that they never board out lackey as it can give you an auto win if it connects. It is also a removal for an opponent's lackey that will bring you in trouble if not boarded out.

My reasoning about boarding lackey out: It is the worst top deck that you can think in the mirror. The opponent that can connect with lackey tends to over extend and I can play the game in control mode and take over the game bit by bit.

What do you think?

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I tend to keep them in on the play, removing Pliedrivers/Stingscourger/Prospector. Stinger sucks, Prospector is nice, but you don't want him in this attrition matchup, and Piledriver imo is quite bad, being blocked/killed by everything, while blocking almost anything good.
On the draw he is one of the few answers to opposing Lackeys, and that has to be taken under consideration. Haven't really played the mirror on quite sometime, so am not really sure.

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Originally Posted by Cleston

I brought +3 Duress, +3 REB and +2 KGrip.

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That is a lot of sideboarding. Imo 5 cards should have been the max there.

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Originally Posted by ScatmanX

That is a lot of sideboarding. Imo 5 cards should have been the max there.

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this is what happens when you haven't got the matchup figured out. you either side too much or you don't attack the matchup on the right angle.

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Originally Posted by Cleston

I brought +3 Duress, +3 REB and +2 KGrip.

Indeed it was a T2 8 power board. Maybe I should have taken those cards that would prevent me from attacking, like esnaring and humility, instead of thinking of removing those that would burn me to death, like tezzeret. the fact that i had lost to a tezzeret burn 5 minutes before was polluting my decision making, it seems.

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I would not have sided in those Duresses. I only want to see discard spells against Combo decks.

Considering you had 8 damage on the board T2 on the play taking Bridge and Humility sounds like a better bet than my initial suggestion of Sword, just because you're in a position to bring the beats and you ought to be able to out-pressure him at this point. Warchief gives you a pretty significant combat advantage. Plus, if Foundry/Sword ever comes online you can always respond to Sword's trigger by REB/KGripping the Foundry, so you've still got half his combo shut down.

Today testing with a Rw list against Canadian I had a problem at sideboarding: The thing is that I think there are too many cards to board in but not too many to take out, so I'd like to hear your opinions about what would you guys side in and take out from MD against Canadian with the following SB:

3x Chalice
3x RIP
3x Pyrokinesis
3x Seal of Cleansing
3x Thalia

I look forward to see your opinions :smile:

bring in only 3 RiP and take out the artifact hate goblin, a Piledriver and a sharpshooter. that is enough :)

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Originally Posted by Eleven

Today testing with a Rw list against Canadian I had a problem at sideboarding: The thing is that I think there are too many cards to board in but not too many to take out, so I'd like to hear your opinions about what would you guys side in and take out from MD against Canadian with the following SB:

3x Chalice
3x RIP
3x Pyrokinesis
3x Seal of Cleansing
3x Thalia

I look forward to see your opinions :smile:

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I would do:

-1 skirk prospector
-1 tuktuk/TSH
-3 piledriver (if you play 4 in your MD)
-1 pyrokinesis (if you play it in your MD)

+3 RIP
+3 chalice

RIP removes 2/3 of their win conditions and chalice locks them out of the game. I think pyrokinesis is bad in this MU.

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Originally Posted by fimo

I would do:

-1 skirk prospector
-1 tuktuk/TSH
-3 piledriver (if you play 4 in your MD)
-1 pyrokinesis (if you play it in your MD)

+3 RIP
+3 chalice

RIP removes 2/3 of their win conditions and chalice locks them out of the game. I think pyrokinesis is bad in this MU.

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I agree with this. Used to board pyrok against them and it was more than useless. You could also board out Stinger.

Chalice will get countered and is not a good topdeck if not drawn early in game. I highly advise everyone NOT to board in Chalice and ONLY to board Relic or RiP.

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Originally Posted by Sasan

Chalice will get countered.

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Well I think that this is not a reason to not board them in since RIP can also be countered, and even stifled.

ok fair enough but Chalice does nothing if he opponent has casted Goyf. Really Really bad topdeck.

With the Boarding in of 7 cards as the others have proposed our Ringleaders become weaker and our creature count is lowered significantly. I cannot see that we can win against RUG under these circumstances.

Just Relic/Rip and that is enough.

I'm with Sasan! I also only board 4 RiP against RUG!

It's not necessery to make your Ringleader more weak. I played against RUG the last days and i boarded Chalice but they ALWAYS got countered...

RiP is the way to play and win here!

I'm gonna test with +3 RIP -1 Scrapper -1 Sharpshooter -1 Piledriver next time and I'll see :)

RUG players board out most of their counters game 2. Sticking Chalice @1 is a big deal against them, and we can chump block goyf all day. I suggest:
+2 CotV
+3 GY hate of your choice
-3 Piledriver
-1 Stingscourger
-1Tuktuk/TSH