Making top8 isn't about beating the decks that made top 8.
Making top8 is about beating the decks that the decks that made top 8 beat. (try saying that three times fast)
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Making top8 isn't about beating the decks that made top 8.
Making top8 is about beating the decks that the decks that made top 8 beat. (try saying that three times fast)
I think it could beat Elves and the Miracles deck. 50/50 against RUG--that version runs Lavamancers and Stifles.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScatmanX
I'd rather be on the Jund (removal.dec + hand disruption + Engineered Plague) and Esperblade (Jitte, Swords, Snapcaster, Zealous Persecution) side of the matchup.
No idea about BUG vs. Goblins.
Putting my Goblins away for the time being.
I'm thinking about Blood Moon in sideboard. BUG,RUG,Junk ,Jund all run very few basic lands. They will be raped by Blood Moon the problem is that it's easily counterable, but maybe they would side out some counters in the second game against us.
Has anone tried the Canonist against ANT/combo?
Ran a very standard Goblin list at SCG Columbus this past weekend. Saw lots of BUG and Jund. How does Goblins beat a turn 1 Deathrite Shaman? Usually I like seeing Lackeys in my opening hand, but in this meta it just saddens me. I feel that the tempo loss just crushes me, because instead of dropping Gobs into play they are being discarded to Thoughtseize, Hymm and Inquisition. Then once my hand is empty Liliana hits the table and keeps it empty, even if I Matron for something good.
You beat it with AEther Vial and Goblin Ringleaders.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psyqo
BUG is a cakewalk if they do not smash multiple Tarmogoyfs into the table. Once you get your first Ringleader, the train becomes unstoppable.
I'm going to try this out, but those Deathrite Shamans may be a pain in the ass on our plan...be sure not to run fetches.Quote:
Originally Posted by LeoCop 90
Random pertinent question:
What do you guys think is the best SB card, for monored, against:
1 - Esperblade
2 - Jund
3 - Bug (without Delvers)
1. Ancient Grudge: Discard and Counterproof
2. Perish
3. Rest in Peace and Swords to Plowshares
As you cannot run 4 colours and as the third option is also solid vs Jund I suggest a RWG splash. Swords rock vs BUG Decks.
New Goblin spoiled:
~Goblin Scrapper
Creature - Goblin Berserker
Creatures you control have haste and attack each combat phase if able.
Illus. Karl Kopinski 2/2
When I saw the name Scrapper I got my hopes up (think Tuktuk), but this guy is just a much worse Chieftain or Warchief. Not Legacy playable. But it's a hopeful sign of spoilers to come. This has been such a Human-centric set I was worrying there'd be no love for the other tribes.
I wish I shared your enthusiasm, but testing and actual tournament play didn't pan out as bright as that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vandalize
On the draw:
Him Turn 1, Fetch, Bayou, Shaman, Go.
Me: Mountain, Vial, Go.
Him Turn 2: Land, Decay the Vial, Thoughtseize, Go. I lose Ringleader.
Me: Land, Lackey, Go.
At that point I'm so far behind it just feels inevitable that a Goyf WILL hit the table and will be a 5/6 after land, creature, artifact, sorcery, instant.
Obviously on the play I feel much better, but after sideboard they have Engineered Plague and while I can usually fight through 1, with all the other disruption they have it is still very tough. I don't think I'm the only one either, I saw lots of Goblins at the tournament but none (or none that I saw) ever got up to the top tables. It is funny that elves won because I played an Elves deck and won in about 10 minutes with Sharpshooter on turns 3 in g1 and turn 4 in g2.
Heh. It's like the best hand they can have vs us.... They aren't going to do that every game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psyqo
With the rise of BUG, perhaps Rest in Peace should be MD over Thalia? That certainly seems to alleviate the Deathrite Shaman and Tarmogoyf problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psyqo
It is, but similar hands can happen. Seize T1+ Abrupt T2 is also backbreaking. I really did not liked Vials against both Bug and Jund (finally got some hours of testing), because it has lost it's reliability. Hands with 1-2 lands and Vial now are much worse, even against a non-FoW deck.Quote:
Originally Posted by magicmerl
That led me to try 2 things.
1st - (Idea already tossed) cutting 1 MWM, 1 Pilly, 1 Prospector, 1 Tuktuk/Shooter for 4 Deathrite Shaman. It was great against some decks, and let me accelerate a lot, while providing some more reach. In the end, it wasn't worth it (the manabase was ok, but cutting those guys sucked).
2nd - Vialles goblins again. I'm trying a 4 Tarfire build, with 24-25 lands. During testing often times I felt more comfortable having 3-4 lands in my hand than 2-3 lands and a Vial, specially if a land was Wastelandable. Will be playing a small tournament this weekend and I'll tell you guys how it goes.
Edit: this decision has taken into account the vanishing of Maverick and the reduced goblin mirrors, that are decks that Vial shines against. UW is manageable without it, reanimator disappeared, dredge and combo are irrelevant for this decision, while against other non-merfolk tribal (that vanished too) stay the same.
@New goblin: Depressing =(
@Sassan: I agree with your cards, but had asked for a monored build.
oh Sorry Scatena. I did read your post careful enough.
For monored I would suggest Relics, Tarfire, perhaps Stingscourger and Lightning Bolt.
If it is a mono red build without ports then Price of Progress will easily kill BUG with their gready mana bases.
This will be my list that I will test for a meta full of BUG and Rock etc...
Deck: Sasans Goblins
Counts : 60 main / 15 sideboard
Creatures:33
4 Goblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
3 Goblin Piledriver
3 Mogg War Marshal
1 Tin Street Hooligan
4 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Matron
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Siege-Gang Commander
Spells:4
4 AEther Vial
Lands:23
4 Arid Mesa
4 Cavern of Souls
1 Karakas
4 Mountain
2 Plateau
3 Scalding Tarn
1 Taiga
4 Wasteland
Sideboard:15
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Rest in Peace
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
2 Krosan Grip
1 Boartusk Liege
This is exactly my build i'm going to play the next time! BUT i'm also working on a build with at least 3 Tarfire. Think Tarfire has gained in strength. It gets rid of Shamans and f.e. Delver and such threats.
Today i have a little testing round so i will play both variants and i'm giving you a feedback afterwards.
Sasan, I really like your list. I think it's pretty close to optimal. I think that the MWM are the 'flex' slot that can be Thalia if you want her MD, and I have the 2nd Chieftain as a Stingscourger. But other than that, your MD looks really good.
Regarding your SB, do you really need Swords? Is spot removal for opponents creatures the thing that will win us matches? If we want removal, how about Pyrokinesis?
You need good and cheap removal vs BUG. Kinesis is good but as BUG has Hymn and other Discard Spells, you really cannot afford to lose more cards with Kinesis.
Swords can kill Tombstalker, Shaman, Goyf and Delvers. So yeah it can kill all win conditions of BUG.
That is why I consider swords to be a viable option vs BUG.
My list is in Game 1 a standard Goblin list as I do not want to make concessions in other Mus. The two Chieftains increase our clock, something Brad Campell told some days ago is perhaps necessary vs BUG. A better clock is also good in regard to my cuttings of the Ports. We cannot ruin the opponents gameplam as much as with Ports, so we need to be faster.
I agree with Korvo (and others) that Tarfire is a good way to deal with the uprising BUG/Jund decks. It gives our deck the needed tempo boost to catch up with the increased speed of the format.
I played 3 Tarfire MD at the Hanau event and was never disappointed when I drew one of them. Getting rid of the Shaman as quick as possible is of great importance.
Tarfire is good against other decks as well. Tested against Esperblade yesterday and the Tarfires felt really strong. SFM needs to be killed on the spot – Tarfire does that very reliable...
Other thoughts:
Boartusk Liege works very good against E.-Plague– being Decay-proof is so huge!
Inspired by the Gobbo-list that finished Top8 in Hanau I wanted to try Sparksmith. He played two of them MD. Until now I am very impressed by this little guy.
More testing is needed thats for sure but I would highly recommend to give this guy a shot (or two )...
Just my 2-cents
I agree with you on Tarfire but if you can afford a white splash Swords is far superior.
I play the white splash...
But I have no love for the sword here.
I rather bring in some copies of RIP and then kill their Goyfs with Tarfire ;-)
let us put it that way: You need Tarfire or Swords in greater numbers (3 or 4) and a great GY Hate card (Relic or RiP) to beat BUG Tempo.
Kinesis sucks in that matchup.
More haste lords seem also a must now.
The B Liege is THE answer for E. Plague as it cannot be decayed. The huge thing is that I do not need to board in Grips in Game 2 and 3 and lose my clock if I have Liege.
I think we can agree on these points :-)