[Deck] Next Level Threshold

I switched decks after Abrupt Decay and Deathrite were printed last year.

Goyf wars are very uncomfortable with Abrupt decay around and Deathrite makes Snapcaster Mages bad. This deck also has problems beating normal Canadian Threshold and UWr Miracles is tough matchup. In other words this deck isnt well positioned right now.



If I were to play this now I would focus on mana denial plan (Stifles + Loam) and play Grim Lavamancers + 4 Bolt and 1 Fire/Ice or Forked Bolt.

2 Grim Lavamancer
3 Vendilion Clique
3 Snapcaster Mage
4 Tarmogoyf

4 Brainstorm
3 Force of Will
3 Spell Snare
2 Spell Pierce
1 Counterspell
4 Stifle
4 Lightning Bolt

1 Life from the Loam
2 Ponder
1 Forked Bolt

2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

4 Wasteland
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
2 Island
1 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Wooded Foothills

Sideboard:
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Sulfur Elemental
2 Ancient Grudge
3 REB/Pyroblast
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Sower of Temptation
1 Flusterstorm
1 Force of Will

As I promised dsck yesterday night on cockatrice I took this deck to our locals. We traditionally don't have a lot of midrange stuff here, mostly Tempo and Combo, with me being one of the few/only Controlplayers. I decided to bring this in order to have fun while playing:

//Lands

4 Scalding Tarn

4 Misty Rainforest

3 Island

1 Mountain

1 Forest

1 Wasteland

1 Academy Ruins

3 Volcanic Island

3 Tropical Island

1 Taiga

//Creatures

2 Tarmogoyf

2 Scavenging Ooze

1 Grim Lavamancer

3 Snapcaster Mage

//Lock

3 Sensei's Divining Top

3 Counterbalance

//Counter

4 Force of WIll

3 Spell Snare

3 Spell Pierce

//Stuff

4 Brainstorm

2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

2 Engineered Explosives

1 LIfe from the Loam

1 Sylvan Library

4 Lightning Bolt

//Sideboard

2 Ancient Grudge

2 Sulfur Elemental

1 Red Elemental Blast

4 Flusterstorm

2 Grim Lavamancer

1 Tarmogoyf

1 Engineered Explosives

2 Surgical Extraction

And here is my short recap of the matches:

1) The Gate
I:Force his Thoughtseize, Snare his Confi, Pierce his Lilly, deploy Jace.
II: I get CounterTop out by T2, force his Percy and win from there.

2) TES
I: I mull a bad hand and get Snare, Force and stuff. He probes, silences. I let it resolve, he wishes for Empty and passes. I draw nothing, pass. He Silences, and Empties the Warrens. 8 Goblins. I use Mancer, Bolt and Snappy to survive until I find an EE at 1 life. Then I land Jace and brainstorm 1000 times.
II: I just counter all his stuff. Easy.

3) Canadian Threhsold
I: He deploys an early Nimble Mongoose and I struggle to find sufficient answers in time. Once I dealt with him I am at 2, he got nothing, I got a Snapcaster. So I start the beatdown. With him being at 4 he plays Delver. I play Mancer, attack with Snappy, he goes to 2. Delver flips, I am dead.
II: T2 Balance gets forced, but his unshrouded creatures die to Jace-stall a little later, then I Balance him out of the game.
III: I get an early Balance, all I have to do is deal with his creature. Easy.

4) Reanimator
I: I got Balance, he got Grisel in Grave. He Reanimates. I brainstorm and put 1 on top. Next turn he Exhumes. I Snare. Then he exhumes. I Snare. Then he Animates the Dead, I trigger Balance and scoop it up.
II: I just don't think I can realistically die to Reanimator postboard. He just never had a chance.
III: He bricks on lands and is dead soon after.

So, 4-0 at the locals, this deck was really a blast to play - especially for a metagame like mine - where I don't have to fight through shit like Jund or Maverick - brr :D

Greetings

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Einherjer

I'd post it here: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...reshold/page23

That's the thread for Midrange/Control RUG-decks.

Greetings

---

Hi. I wondered if that new Punishing RUG control deck from Caleb Durward could be good enough. I liked the idea and the unsusual cards but I'm not so sure about it since he only finished 234th.
Here is the link to the list and decktech :
http://www.starcitygames.com/events/...ug_with_c.html

Also comments below aren't very nice to the choices, so I figured I'd gather some additional opinions before working on it.
What do you all think ?

@Fr_Apo
Wait for M14 (Young Pyromancer) and see if the deck gets playable after then.

I think this deck is the best shell for pyromancer.

Instant (22)
4x Brainstorm
2x Counterspell
4x Force of Will
1x Izzet Charm (hasnt been very good)
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Spell Snare
4x Stifle

Sorcery (4)
2x Forked Bolt (could only run 1, but I dont want to see a living deathrite :mad:)
2x Preordain

Planeswalker (2)
2x Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Land (21)
4x Flooded Strand
4x Island
1x Mountain
4x Scalding Tarn
4x Volcanic Island
4x Wasteland

Creature (11)
2x Grim Lavamancer
3x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique
4x Young Pyromancer

Sideboard (15)
2x Flusterstorm
2x Pyroblast
1x Red Elemental Blast
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Smash to Smithereens
2x Submerge
2x Sulfur Elemental
2x Surgical Extraction

I could see some Price of Progresses in the SB, they are insane against most decks right now. Some Spell Pierces maybe should be in the 75. Im sure I forgot some good card that should be in the deck (especially SB) so if anyone else has tested similar lists, post your thoughts!

Rug is my favorite color combination in mtg. Was wondering if a loam rug or a counter-top version would be better. Brew two lists ( one for each style).

Loam

4 goyf
2 clique

4 bolt
4 pfire
4 bstorm
4 ponder
4 force
3 pierce
2 snare
1 loam

3 jace

4 wasteland
4 grove of the burnt willows
1 island
1 mountain
1 forest
2 trop
2 volcanic
4 misty
4 Tarn

c- top
4 goyf

3 lavamancer

2 clique

4 bstorm

3 spell pierce

3force

4 bolt

4 pfire

3 top

4 balance

3 Jace

4 grove

2 island

1 forest

2 mountains

4 misty

4 tarn

3 trop

3 volcanic

Please let me know thoughts.

Instant (21)
4x Brainstorm
1x Counterspell
1x Dismember
1x Fire/Ice
3x Force of Will
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Repeal
2x Spell Pierce
4x Stifle

Sorcery (4)
1x Forked Bolt
3x Ponder

Planeswalker (2)
2x Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Creature (12)
1x Augur of Bolas
2x Grim Lavamancer
3x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique
4x Young Pyromancer

Land (21)
1x Arid Mesa
4x Flooded Strand
2x Island
1x Mountain
1x Riptide Laboratory
4x Scalding Tarn
4x Volcanic Island
4x Wasteland

Sideboard (12)
2x Flusterstorm
1x Force of Will
1x Pyroblast
1x Red Elemental Blast
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Smash to Smithereens
2x Submerge
1x Surgical Extraction
3x ???



Im likin' it. Not enough games to determine most effective sideboard. Jaces are very good, may actually want 3rd in there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dsck

Instant (21)
4x Brainstorm
1x Counterspell
1x Dismember
1x Fire/Ice
3x Force of Will
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Repeal
2x Spell Pierce
4x Stifle

Sorcery (4)
1x Forked Bolt
3x Ponder

Planeswalker (2)
2x Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Creature (12)
1x Augur of Bolas
2x Grim Lavamancer
3x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique
4x Young Pyromancer

Land (21)
1x Arid Mesa
4x Flooded Strand
2x Island
1x Mountain
1x Riptide Laboratory
4x Scalding Tarn
4x Volcanic Island
4x Wasteland

Sideboard (12)
2x Flusterstorm
1x Force of Will
1x Pyroblast
1x Red Elemental Blast
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Smash to Smithereens
2x Submerge
1x Surgical Extraction
3x ???



Im likin' it. Not enough games to determine most effective sideboard. Jaces are very good, may actually want 3rd in there.

---

It seems nice. A couple of questions:

Is Augur of Bolas actually good? I despise the card from mana screwing me in Standard.

I notice you're not running the full set of Forces MD. Is this a meta call, or would you recommend it going blind into a tournament?

How's the Jund matchup?

Since you're running Young Pyromancer, wouldn't Punishing Fire be worth a look?

Also; I saw this list in TCDecks, and I really liked it, except for the fact that it runs 62 MD cards:

http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/dec...9&iddeck=84250

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Treefolk Master

It seems nice. A couple of questions:

Is Augur of Bolas actually good? I despise the card from mana screwing me in Standard.

I notice you're not running the full set of Forces MD. Is this a meta call, or would you recommend it going blind into a tournament?

How's the Jund matchup?

Since you're running Young Pyromancer, wouldn't Punishing Fire be worth a look?

Also; I saw this list in TCDecks, and I really liked it, except for the fact that it runs 62 MD cards:

http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/dec...9&iddeck=84250

---

I added 1 Submerge and 2 Blood Moons to SB.

I havent had chance to test against Jund, but in theory I dont see it as a good matchup. On the play with good stifle hand it may work out.

Augur is decent. I sometimes wish it would get any card from top 3 but so far in my limited testing it has 75% of the time gotten me a card.

Running only 3 FOWs is from my experience with NLT, I used to almost always side them out.

There are better decks to abuse Punishing Fire with, such as Calebs RUG cascade or Jund.

4 Wasteland
4 Stifle
2 Spell Snare
2 Spell Pierce
1 Life from the Loam
3 Volcanic Island
3 Tropical Island
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
3 Young Pyromancer
1 Vendilion Clique
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Force of Will
2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Polluted Delta
1 Island
4 Flooded Strand
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Punishing Fire
SB: 3 Electrickery
SB: 2 Krosan Grip
SB: 4 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 2 Flusterstorm
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives


Here's what I played last week in a local 56 players tournament. Missed top8 because of a misplay that cost me the 4th round. I played vs:

2-0 vs Jund
1-2 vs Mono Red Sneak Attack (the only chalice deck in a field of Elves and ANT, FML)
2-0 vs UR tempo burn
1-2 vs Vial Maverick ( I should have dredged Lftl for wasteland multiple times during g3,before losing to his topdecked Kotr. I had Punishing Grove online so I only lose to Kotr and I should have wrecked his manabase while pinging for 1 eot through P Fire. )
2-0 vs DeathBlade
2-1 vs Tin Fins

Overall record was 4-2. Deck is super smooth and nice to play. I'm not playing Daze as I need to develop my manabase quickly and can't afford timewalking myself.
Electrickery is bonkers.

EDIT:

I also played tonight in our local tournament. 17 people.

2-0 vs Thresh
2-0 vs Dredge
2-0 vs Maverick
2-1 vs Patriot

Top8: 2-0 vs DnT (he was a random scrub btw)
Top4: 0-2 vs Shardless BUG

Vs Bug it's really hard to control those Goyfs. Probably I shouldn't have boarded out FOWs, but I don't really like them vs BUG considering its whopping 4 Tourach 4 Seize. Probably I need Submerges in sb.

Isn't this deck excited about true name nemesis?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kiblast

4 Wasteland
4 Stifle
2 Spell Snare
2 Spell Pierce
1 Life from the Loam
3 Volcanic Island
3 Tropical Island
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
3 Young Pyromancer
1 Vendilion Clique
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Force of Will
2 Snapcaster Mage
4 Polluted Delta
1 Island
4 Flooded Strand
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Punishing Fire
SB: 3 Electrickery
SB: 2 Krosan Grip
SB: 4 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 2 Flusterstorm
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives

---

Is Mongoose actually better than Goyf in that shell?

Also, have you considered runnign SB Swan Song? The disadvantage is neutralized by PFire.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The Treefolk Master

Is Mongoose actually better than Goyf in that shell?

Also, have you considered runnign SB Swan Song? The disadvantage is neutralized by PFire.

---

I was running 2 Swan Song main deck, but at the beginning of the first tournament I switched them to Snares because I was fearing Goyfs and I thought I was set up too much versus combo.

Swan Song is certainly extremely good in Punishing shells as P Fire negates the downside of the card. But let's be honest here: what exactly SS does that we cannot do with Pierce? Pierce also has the added bonus of countering hardcasted Bskull and Planeswalkers. We have access to the full tempo package of 4 Wastelands and 4 Stifle so it's not difficult to keep opponent's mana under Pierce range for most of the match.

Moongose is shrouded. Goyf it's not. While I do admit I have problems with Goyfs (even with 2 Snares md) and if I played Goyfs I'd win any Goyf war (given the amount of burn we can play in this archetype) shroud is essential because we play so few creatures we really need em to stick. Young Pyromancer is an exception because you can still create a small army of tokens if he survives 1-2 turns; on the other hand if he gets Stp'ed or Decayed or Bolted you can still shoot a P Fire to your opponent netting you a 1/1.

I'm trying to cut a land and JTMS in order to make room for 3 Nemesis. That should solve the Goyf problem and gives us mongoose 5-7. Jace is the only reason why I run 22 lands, because the deck runs nicely on 20-21. Cutting a land and playing Nemesis makes sense as TNN sits nicely at the top of the curve of a 21 lands, 8 cantrips deck ; and deals with Goyfs way better than Jtms does. Also I heard opp's Nemesis love to eat your Jace. Playing them seems a no-brainer...

I'm going to play this list tonight:

Deck: URg Next Level Thresh http://deckstats.net/mana/m/u.gif http://deckstats.net/mana/m/r.gif http://deckstats.net/mana/m/g.gif

//Lands
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Island
1 Mountain
3 Polluted Delta
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland

//Spells
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Life from the Loam
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Ponder
4 Punishing Fire
3 Spell Pierce
3 Stifle

//Creatures
2 Grim Lavamancer
2 Snapcaster Mage
3 True-Name Nemesis
1 Vendilion Clique
3 Young Pyromancer

//Sideboard
3 Red Elemental Blast
4 Electrickery
3 Surgical Extraction
2 Krosan Grip
2 Sulfuric Vortex
1 Hibernation

http://i.hbtronix.de/chart_pie.png Display deck statistics

The metagame in which I'm going to play is really varied (they use proxy, I use foils, whatever) but mostly dominated by Goblins and Elves. Seem like a solid list. I could find Miracles and Trueblade as well. I think I'm really good positioned with this list.

Maciej Fidzinski (11th) Grand Prix Paris 2014

( http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazin...erage/gppar14/ )


// Land [20]
4 Volcanic Island
3 Tropical Island
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Wasteland
1 Taiga

// Creature [14]
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Grim Lavamancer
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 True-Name Nemesis
2 Tarmogoyf

// Instant [21]
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
3 Stifle
3 Spell Pierce
3 Daze

// Sorcery [5]
4 Ponder
1 Forked Bolt

// Sideboard [15]
2 Sulfuric Vortex
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Pyroblast
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Flusterstorm
3 Submerge
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Umezawa's Jitte

Thats way closer to canadian threshold/rug delver than NLT :cry:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dsck

Thats way closer to canadian threshold/rug delver than NLT :cry:

---

I agree; it is another Threshold variant deck.

Hello,

Since some splashes Black in Rug decks (Brug), why wouldn't you do the same in NLT ? What about a list like this one ?


9 Fetchs : 4 misty, 4 scalding, 1 polluted
3 usea
3 trop
1 volc
1 Taiga
4 Wasteland

4 DRS
4 Mongoose
3 TNN
1 Thrun

1 Loam
2 Jace
4 Brainstorm

4 Bolt
3 Decay

1 Counterspell
2 Snare
3 Force
3 Thoughtseize
4 Stifle


SB :

1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Grudge

1 Force of will
2 Fluster/Pierce
2 Reb

1 Diabolic Edict
1 Fire covenant
2 Electrickery

And another 4 slots, maybe some delvers ? Against Combo, gobelins, merfolk, etc... To gain tempo when needed.



I like the full shroud threats + Liliana protection from Stifle , 3 Thoughtseize + 7 Removals +2 Snare MD to clear the path. The only card that provides CA is Jace, but having shroud creats provides some kind of "virtual" CA : removals in the opponent's hand are negated..
The problem is the mana base, Volcanic Island is not the best land to have on Turn 1... That's why I pack only 1 volc and 1 Loam MD (in case i get taiga + volc wastelanded, but also for the mana denial plan).
What are your thoughts ?

4 Noble Hierarch
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Grim Lavamancer
1 Trygon Predator
2 Scryb Ranger
3 True-Name Nemesis

4 Brainstorm
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Ponder
3 Punishing Fires
3 Spell Snare
3 Spell Pierce
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Sylvan Library
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

3 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Taiga
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
1 Mountain
1 Forest
2 Island
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Scalding Tarn

-----------------

4 Force of Will
2 Sulfur Elemental
3 Red Elemental Blast
2 Krosan Grip
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Koth of the Hammer
2 Null Rod

I know this deck hasn't been seeing much play recently, but I just thought I'd be posting up something I'll be trying out in the next little bit. I've been wanting to brew RUG Punishing Fires for a while, since I think the RUG colours have some merit. I'll try to explain my brainstorming session.

4 Noble Hierarch
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Grim Lavamancer
1 Trygon Predator
2 Scryb Ranger
3 True-Name Nemesis

Noble provides acceleration and wins Goyf stalemates. Grim helps control Delvers and win Goyf wars/poke Deathrite Shamans. Trygon is just super value. Scryb Ranger seems really nice and techy by swinging past TNN, blocking Insectile, and untapping Goyfs and TNN's after combat but before blocks to muck incoming creatures.

4 Brainstorm
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Ponder
3 Punishing Fires

Removal and ways to find other cards. Not enough slots to run 4 and 4 BS/4 Ponder. I know I wanted to run P. Fires, but it's not the end all, be all. It helps to control little guys and Walkers, but Bolt is just way more effective.

3 Spell Snare
3 Spell Pierce

I don't want to play the deck like a Force of Will deck, at least against all of the midrange in the format. I feel like I want to board into Forces should I need them, but in my meta, I would be boarding them out more than in.

1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Sylvan Library
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Value manipulation. Zenith is just a 1-of since I can, and I've liked the 1-of in other decks before. Sylvan is just extra draw in permanent form, and Jace is the top of the curve.

The deck could be total crap, but I'll share any results I come up with. I'm not on the YP bandwagon for this particular build, but I'm sure I could come up with one.

-Matt

I feel like even if you believe your going to board out force a lot you should probably have 2-3 in the main deck. it is never a truly dead card and you gain a ton of points against combo game 1. I think force has some merit in the deck even though probably not a 4 of.