I haven't really thought about it, but my Academy Ruins doesn't seem to be very useful most of the time. I can't recall the last time I needed it for its ability and not mana. I guess I just made room for another basic land.
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I haven't really thought about it, but my Academy Ruins doesn't seem to be very useful most of the time. I can't recall the last time I needed it for its ability and not mana. I guess I just made room for another basic land.
I agree with you about Academy Ruins, a basic land is generally more useful over the stretch of a bunch of games. Recurring EE or Crypt is more of a 'cool idea' than really practical, because of the huge mana investment, loss of your draw step and inconsistency it add to your ability to play your spells. Pity too, because I love the art and have had Thresh opponents randomly scoop when I've had Ruins on the board and gesture to the EE in my yard; though, these are not necessarily good opponents.Quote:
Originally Posted by mossivo1986
About Crucible, when I play it, I'm happy just to regrow a spent fetchland every turn, that's worth the investment alone and gets really nutty if you have Top in play.
I absolutely agree with you bardo. In fact its something that I really disagreed with dif on top about. Heres my list for referance: Basicly dif's.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bardo
Now also keep in mind that I hadn't even thought about relic when I was playing this list and elspeth was just a thought in peoples heads and wasn't a standard in the 3c models yet. so minus that its pretty good.
// Lands
1 [UNH] Plains
1 [MM] Dust Bowl
1 [FUT] Tolaria West
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (3)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (2)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
1 [UNH] Island
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
1 [B] Scrubland
1 [B] Savannah
1 [B] Tropical Island
2 [B] Underground Sea
4 [B] Tundra
1 [ON] Windswept Heath
2 [ON] Polluted Delta
// Creatures
2 [SC] Eternal Dragon
// Spells
2 [SC] Decree of Justice
4 [IA] Brainstorm
1 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
4 [IA] Swords to Plowshares
4 [OD] Standstill
2 [TE] Humility
4 [AP] Pernicious Deed
3 [JU] Cunning Wish
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [IA] Counterspell
// Sideboard
SB: 3 [PLC] Extirpate
SB: 2 [IA] Hydroblast
SB: 1 [B] Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 1 [RAV] Seed Spark
SB: 1 [FUT] Slaughter Pact
SB: 1 [6E] Enlightened Tutor
SB: 3 [PS] Meddling Mage
SB: 3 [7E] Engineered Plague
Now if I updated it now it would probobly look something like this.
// Lands
1 [UNH] Plains
1 [MM] Dust Bowl
1 [FUT] Tolaria West
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (3)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (2)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
1 [UNH] Island
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
1 [B] Scrubland
1 [B] Savannah
1 [B] Tropical Island
2 [B] Underground Sea
4 [B] Tundra
1 [ON] Windswept Heath
2 [ON] Polluted Delta
// Creatures
1 [SC] Eternal Dragon
// Spells
2 [SC] Decree of Justice
4 [IA] Brainstorm
1 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
4 [IA] Swords to Plowshares
4 [OD] Standstill
1 [TE] Humility
3 [AP] Pernicious Deed
3 [JU] Cunning Wish
4 [AL] Force of Will
1 [6E] Enlightened Tutor
1 [IA] Counterspell
3 [DIS] Spell Snare
2 [LRW] Ponder
// Sideboard
SB: 1 [6E] Enlightened Tutor
SB: 1 [DS] Pulse of the Fields
SB: 2 [LRW] Ajani Goldmane
SB: 1 [RAV] Seed Spark
SB: 1 [B] Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 2 [IA] Hydroblast
SB: 3 [PS] Meddling Mage
SB: 2 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus
SB: 2 [PLC] Extirpate
However alot of these changes are changes that make it look more like the 3c model that dif runs and I have also been playing heavily. The reason I would make the four color model look more like this is to improve the burn matchup as well as the canadian thresh and team america matchup. I haven't done anything at all to the mana base, and that probobly needs to have a bit of tweaking, I also cut one of the eternal dragons as it feels just like a dead slot / extra win condition, but I often find that i'd rather have something else then that. To be truthfull I don't know if i'll ever go back to four color now that I see how easy most matchups are with 3c. I don't really care if 4 c beats the 3 c in the mirror, how often does one play that matchup against someone whos played that matchup in particular. right? Anyways thoughts opinions?
I was testing the Tolaria West + Dust Bowl approach a few weeks, but for the real tournament I prefered Wasteland beacuse Dust Bowl is too mana intensive and too slow.
I'm not sure why you want wastelock oponents. I prefer to do my land drops to asure I will have the mana for what I will want. I rarely dredge LftL more than two times in a game, but they use to be enough. I usually can wait until the LftL will be very strong, bringing three of the lands I want. Also LftL is very useful when you have a little mana hand, almost any hand with fetch+land+LftL is keepeble beacuse Life will sure you the third land drop. Also LftL is useful against discard strategies, Hymn to Tourach and Hypnotic Specter, protecting your most valuable cards with useless lands.
This is my latest version.
So how come I hear so much talk recently about landstill being a dead archetype? That it should run tarmogoyf and counter/top but then it's not landstill anymore? That vorosh and ITF are the evolution of landstill and the older-school versions are no longer viable? Just wondering, because it seems landstill is still doing pretty well, maybe more so in europe, but it's still a DTB. Anyway, I keep reworking my list and I'm hoping to get some critiques on it. I've arrived at the conclusion that the utility lands are too much mana investment for not enough payout(no damage) and clog the rest of the manabase. A few pages back I explained why I gave up humility for vedalken shackles and it's still working out well. Anyway, here goes:
4 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
3 Tundra
2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
1 Savannah
1 Scrubland
2 Island
1 Plains
4 Mishra's Factory
2 Nantuko Monastery
4 Standstill
4 Brainstorm
2 Fact or Fiction
4 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
2 Spell Snare
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Decree of Justice
4 Pernicious Deed
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Life From the Loam
2 Vedalken Shackles
ts not dead, 4c is kind of out of the loop right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by 3duece
I continue winning with the 4C build without Tarmogoyf or Counterbalance. I won 4 Foil Tarmos three weeks ago, and someone top8ed two weeks ago with another build here in Madrid.
It's a very configurable deck for almost any enviroment, and it will keep on change and adapting through the time.
Yeah, I think landstill is just a little down in america right now. ITF and Dreadstill are the more popular control decks at the moment, we don't really have a big weissman.dec for now, maybe UW w/Elspeth.
I see a lot more Dreadstill in the Northeast meta than Landstill. Which is fine for me, I don't mind playing against Dreadstill at all. Dreadstill just has a faster clock with Dreadnaught than tradition, slower Landstill. I usually get laughed at for running Elspeth. Thanks to you European players for keeping Landstill in the DTW/DTB forum.
So just to give a brief little summary. I've been missing 4 color alot lately. I miss deed, I miss LFTL, I miss it all. Seed spark oh how I <3 the.
Anyways I put together a sort of combination of dif's 3c and 4c build and ran it to see how it might do. I was impressed and unimpressed. Heres the list.
// Lands
1 [ON] Polluted Delta
2 [UNH] Plains
3 [UNH] Island
4 [B] Tundra
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (2)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (3)
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
1 [FUT] Tolaria West
1 [B] Underground Sea
1 [B] Scrubland
1 [B] Tropical Island
1 [B] Savannah
1 [MM] Dust Bowl
// Creatures
2 [ALA] Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2 [SC] Eternal Dragon
// Spells
1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
1 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
2 [LRW] Ponder
2 [DIS] Spell Snare
2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
1 [TE] Humility
2 [SC] Decree of Justice
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [B] Swords to Plowshares
3 [AP] Pernicious Deed
3 [JU] Cunning Wish
4 [CST] Brainstorm
4 [OD] Standstill
// Sideboard
SB: 1 [PLC] Extirpate
SB: 1 [RAV] Seed Spark
SB: 3 [PS] Meddling Mage
SB: 1 [6E] Enlightened Tutor
SB: 2 [IA] Hydroblast
SB: 1 [B] Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 2 [LRW] Ajani Goldmane
SB: 3 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus <-------- remove one and add a second pate
SB: 1 [DS] Pulse of the Fields
first off I would change one relic for an additional pate. Pate is soo good pre board against nasty control decks or random jank, and when you hit the second one it really comes in handy. Yes the more relic the marrier, but honestly I can tell you that I would rather have access to two pate pre then have to risk loosing a game to some graveyard shenanigans.
second off. I like swapping the sensei's devining top for ponder number 3. I love the synergy with elspeth and deed, I like the 3-3 split between deed and wish, as im never sick of getting two wishes, but im always sick of getting 2 deeds. I like the added basics in the maindeck but I do not like the configuration quite yet. 2 dragon plus 5 fetch = 7 searchable land fixing early, and 1 extra win condition later. the 2nd dragon replaces crucible which is as dif said a dead card and landstill does have a window to win in unlike what some people say. I dislike how weak 4c is against stifle. It seems like besides humility and elspeth everything else can get wrecked soo easily. that said theres simply too many stiflable activations to really know which one is the best to hit. so lets break the deck down really quick like:
Lands: 23
Win conditions: 9
draw: 14
Counter: 6
removal: 10
Other: 1
So to explain this a bit lets start with win cons since the deck plays a pretty standard amount of lands. It has 3 mishra 2 elspeth 2 decree and 2 eternal dragon. This is 3 more win conditions then normal landstill builds have I believe and personally I always fealt in my testing that I had control of the direction of the game. When I needed the game to end, it ended quickly and effeciently thanks to the additional pressure I was able to put on via tempo win conditions that are someone inevitable.
draw. The draw in this model like difs 3c is rediculous. Dif and I had a discussion and he brought up some interesting points that he was liking 4c less and less because of its inability to both rebutle and main control of games early mid and late, and also the lack of game win conditions. The 3 color model uses the theory that the more of my deck I see earlier then my opponent the more likely I am to draw a worthwhile answer, or simply shuffle my deck. This theory holds strong in this model as there are more shuffle effects and better overall choices because it is afterall 4c. I won go into great detail about the draw spells except that I feel like a 3-3 split with deed and wish was necessary. I love 3 wish in 4c and I hated 4 deed in 4 color as I almost always hit 2, which pisses me off :(.
Counter magic is light in this model for many reasons. The main change is the drop of counterspell in coordination with deeds ability to make board positions go buh bye and the excessive drawing you have will 9x out of 10 but you in a better position then having that 1-2 counterspells a game. Bottom line this more is more answer intensive and less im going to "control" the game. The addition of spell snare is also part of difs 3c model and I believe the correct split against challice is as he has 2snare 3explosives 4 force, but unfortunately I couldn't find room for a 3rd ee nor is it truly that necessary as you have 3 deed plus enlightened tutor via wish if you absolutely have to have it.
So I guess I would like help in tightening this list via the landbase and the 4 drops. I like the way its all set up but I have a small feeling my 4drops may be a bit too heavy.
Two Landstill builds made the top8 of Beta Duals (Top8: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...5&postcount=73) and I was wondering what you guys thought of them ? In particular, I'd like to know your take as to why some specific card choices were made.
1st Alix Hatfield
4 brainstorm
4 standstill
3 fact or fiction
3 Sensei's tops
4 force of will
4 counterspell
4 swords to plowshares
4 pernicious deed
1 vindicate
4 tarmogoyf
4 mishra's factory
2 nantuko monastery
4 polluted delta
4 flooded strand
4 tropical island
3 tundra
3 underground sea
1 scrubland
s.b.
4 blue elemental blast
4 engineered plague
4 counterbalance
2 krosan grip
1 vindicate
This list runs 10 threats (but adding Top and playing 3 FoF probably helps to get them when needed). Playing CB in the SB might be a good call in a Dreadstill, Threshold, etc. infested environment.
Splashing white to play StoP seems like a good idea to answer fatties (in particular when a lot of Team America - i.e. Tombstalkers - lurk around).
Monastery (with Goyf) looks like a good way to speed the deck's clock, while Vindicate is obviously a universal removal spell answering in particular (with a good chance of success) CBalance, recursion engines (like V. Stronghold in ITF), Seismic Assault (Loam) and a ton of other stuff (including the occasionnal 'I didn't plan to see any of card X at the tournament').
Question: Is the white splash worth it ? The manabase has no basic lands. I guess LD could be a problem (but running Brainstorm, Top and 8 fetches might smooth things a little). This list might struggle against decks running Moon effects (D. Stompy, Moon Thresh) - knowing that these match-ups are not very probable in the particular metagame might be a good idea before playing the deck at a tournament.
4th Kyle Humphres
4 brainstorm
4 standstill
2 fact or fiction
4 force of will
3 counterspell
3 spell snare
3 stifle
3 thoughtseize
3 diabolic edict
3 engineered explosives
4 tarmogoyfs
3 tombstalker
4 polluted delta
2 flooded strand
3 underground sea
3 tropical island
2 island
1 swamp
3 wasteland
3 mishra's factory
s.b.
3 pernicious deed
3 engineered plague
3 hydroblast
3 tormods crypt
3 extirpate
This build also runs 10 threats but is removal light (no Deeds maindeck in particular). This lack of removal is balanced by a bigger disruption package (in particular by playing Thoughtseize).
Is 3 Edicts + 3 EE maindeck enough to answer most threats in the meta ? Is this lack of removal causing the deck to lose match-ups it would otherwise win (e.g. random aggro, Merfolk) ? Should Spell Snare be replaced by some form of disruption or removal with a larger scope of potential applications (e.g. - 3 Snare, +3 Deed) ? Does adding proactive control (Thoughtseize) contradict the fact that the deck sometimes wants a hard counter on turn 2 (i.e. Counterspell) - I guess Spell Snare was added to partially answer this ?
So after months of testing, I have a new 4C build. I tried virtually everything to give me outs to things I couldn't handle, like Cunning Wish, as well as giving me more maindeck kill conditions than just my six lands, ranging from Planeswalkers to Goyf to Stalker to Shriekmaw to Living Wish. Finally, after deciding that most of my problems could largely be solved by Meddling Mage and Spell Snare, and after coming to the conclusion that thanks to Ad Nauseam, Stifle now blows, here's what I'm running.
4 Tundra
4 Underground Sea
3 Tropical Island
4 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
4 Mishra's Factory
2 Nantuko Monestary
4 Brainstorm
4 Standstill
3 Fact or Fiction
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Pernicious Deed
3 Diabolic Edict
2 Engineered Explosives
4 Force of Will
4 Counterspell
4 Meddling Mage
SB:
4 Blue Elemental Blast
4 Spell Snare*
3 Extirpate
2 Engineered Plague*
2 Krosan Grip
*(I run 3/3 if I anticipate Goblins/Ichorid or other Plague-hurt decks)
What's Gone From My List:
1. Stifle. Stifle shined against Wasteland, Witness, and Combo decks. It doesn't do the last one so much anymore. So regrettably, it had to go. Mage maindeck keeps the blue count for Force high.
2. The singleton maindeck Life From The Loam. Four maindeck threats makes recursion less necessary. Additionally, you'll want to Mage for Loam sometimes in game 1. And Snare is awesome against black LD nuisances like Sinkhole and Smallpox.
3. Crime // Punishment. With less 1-drops due to Stifle being gone, turn one EE for 1 is all the better. Plus, Crime, while insanely cool, is less necessary with me now having more maindeck kill conditions.
4. The fourth Tropical. No maindeck Loam means the seventh fetchland is better.
What's New:
1. Maindeck Meddling Mage. If you know what you're doing, game one Mages are hot. Shines against lots of random stuff and is rarely dead. Can name Swords midgame if your opponent's built up a hand full of them. Helps against trouble cards, like Life From The Loam, Blood Moon, Back to Basics, etc. Requires a high knowledge of the format and ability to deduce what an opponent's holding (Based on how long he's been holding it, what he's done in certain situations, what his deck is, etc.) or what card could hurt you the most.
2. Quad Snare in sideboard. Snare does two things: Costs you games by being narrow, and wins you games by being incredible. You'll bring it in to help stop everything from Survival of the Fittest to Counterbalance to Smallpox and Sinkhole to Chalice for 1 to Wishes to virtually every combo deck in existence to whatever. Knowing when to board it in and for what takes practice.
What I Tested And Cut For Various Reasons:
1. Stifle. Snare was more versatile.
2. Orim's Chant. See above.
3. Anti-Burn / Lifegain cards. Meh.
4. Sideboard Life From The Loams. Snare generally does enough, I think.
5. Jace Beleren. If he had flash or everybody ever didn't run Bolt/Chain, he'd totally be better than Fact or Fiction.
6. Tarmogoyf/Tombstalker. Neat, but still just a guy. At least Mage solves problems, and in a pinch can survive when an opponent's built up three or four STP's all game.
7. Cunning Wish / Decree of Justice / Humility / Etc. All very good, but don't suit the way I play Landstill, which isn't the UW style.
What's On The Bubble / Needs Further Testing:
1. Thoughtseize. I keep wanting it in my sideboard. It's possible it could battle any combination of Spell Snare and Krosan Grip, the general LVP of the board, for additional spots.
So there you people go, who've been wanting a fix of this style Landstill. It does still function.
1) What don't you want to board in Snare against? I can only think of Goblins and Ichorid.
2) Did you ever test Vendilion Clique? Meets similar criteria as Meddling Mage (disruption + body + blue count). I'm loving this guy in every control deck I cram him in. Both Flash and the two sides of his 187 are great abilities.
3) Is it worth running 2 Plagues at all (3 is more reasonable)? A huge reason behind their effectiveness was the hard-lock that a double-Plague is against Goblins, but that shouldn't happen much as a 2-of. Plus, Goblin players rightfully love their Grips these days, and let's not talk about Elves. Unfortunately, I don't have much to suggest in the way of alternatives. Hail Storm and Plague Spitter are all that come to mind.
Goblins, Ichorid, Faerie Stompy, Dragon Stompy, and a lot of control decks you could handle otherwise, as while there will be targets, often there won't be enough and you can be stuck holding a Snare. Alternately, there are some decks where I'll only board Snare in against when they're going first, as when I'm going first I can stop anything I can Snare by making my second land drop and getting down a Mage or having mana for a Counterspell first, whereas Snare on the draw is godly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nihil Credo
Ehhh. I did. I wasn't all that sold. He's neat, he's cool, he just feels like he doesn't save my ass in any games. Mage feels like he saves my ass in games. It's entirely possible that I play Mage far better than I play Clique (I'm amazing with name a card spells and have won tournaments off blind Mages and Therapies, but probably only average with Clique Trickery). I just didn't see the power of Clique though.Quote:
2) Did you ever test Vendilion Clique? Meets similar criteria as Meddling Mage (disruption + body + blue count). I'm loving this guy in every control deck I cram him in. Both Flash and the two sides of his 187 are great abilities.
Yes, but like I said, three might be better in some metagames. The reason the Plague is still worth it, even against Goblins alone, is that when you drop it and they grip it, you're still usually going to pick up a Goblin or two in the process, as any 1-toughness guys on the board go down the tubes. If Krosan Grip is a problem, you can always Mage it (I leave 2 in against Goblins), or just chalk it up to being one less they're throwing at your Pernicious Deeds.Quote:
3) Is it worth running 2 Plagues at all (3 is more reasonable)? A huge reason behind their effectiveness was the hard-lock that a double-Plague is against Goblins, but that shouldn't happen much as a 2-of. Plus, Goblin players rightfully love their Grips these days, and let's not talk about Elves. Unfortunately, I don't have much to suggest in the way of alternatives. Hail Storm and Plague Spitter are all that come to mind.
Plague also bails your ass out in some random games. I use it against Ichorid to huge success. I've been known to board a pair in and get it on Soldiers against UW Landstill. Helps against all kinds of random crap. Plagues are worth it even as 2 of (I can't ever think what else I'd want those two slots to be). Go 3/3 with it and the Snares if your metagame warrants, or just cut the Krosan Grips and add a Plague and whatever else.
I'm taking this to chicago:
4 flooded strand
2 polluted delta
3 tundra
2 tropical island
2 underground sea
1 savannah
1 scrubland
2 island
1 plains
4 mishra's factory
2 nantuko monastery
4 standstill
4 brainstorm
2 fact or fiction
4 counterspell
4 force of will
2 spell snare
4 swords to plowshares
4 pernicious deed
2 decree of justice
2 engineered explosives
2 vedalken shackles
1 crucible of worlds
1 life from the loam
4 hydroblast
3 krosan grip
3 tormod's crypt
2 relic of progenitus
2 circle of protection: red
1 crucible of worlds
The decks plays very strong and I like it without cunning wish. I figure the roughest matchups will be burn based decks (burn, goyfsligh and boros) and graveyard strategies (namely dredge and aggroloam) as well as team america, so:
4 hydroblast: an out to moon effects, stops all goblins, dragons, burning wish, devastating dreams, seismic assault and empty the warrens.
3 krosan grip: comes in for decks with top (both counterbalance and confidant), stax pieces and opposing deeds.
3 tormod's crypt/2 relic of progenitus: the split is because I know dredge will bring in needle for crypt because I'm not running enough black to bring in chain of vapor for leyline, so they'll have to land two needles to be safe which won't happen before I can counter one and/or destroy the other. I also love relic because it dwarfs tarmogoyf and terravore.
2 circle of protection: red: I love this card against any burn based strategy with creatures or not. It's better than counter/top against them because it's one card, one less mana and the same activation as top, but it also shuts off red creature damage. I'm not sure how red wins with this on the table since I'll always have mana superiority.
1 crucible of worlds: this is for team america. I figure if I nullify their land destruction they lose alot of tempo and I should gain enough momentum to counter thoughtseize and land a deed and/or standstill. Still not sure about this, haven't tested it yet.
You might want to split 2-2 hydro and blue elemental blats against extirpate.Quote:
Originally Posted by 3duece
Hey folks,
Give some (very well argumented) thoughts about the following list. It's our Team's 3C Giftstill list. We feel that Cunning Wish is more like "finding an answer for 3 extra mana" than a "win now" card. Gifts Ungiven does exactly what this deck needs: softlocking your opponent instantly, and finding a fast wincondition. Garruk is a incredible card, but you all figured that out, I'm sure. It can overrun the opponent in a single turn, what comes in handy versus some fast aggro or even combo.
1 Eternal witness
1 shriekmaw
2 spell snare
2 counterspell
2 mana leak
4 force of will
3 gifts ungiven
4 brainstorm
1 diabolic edict
1 engineered explosives
1 Damnation
4 pernicious deed
4 standstill
1 life from the loam
1 innocent blood
1 smother
2 Garruk wildspeaker
4 polluted delta
3 flooded strand
3 underground sea
3 tropical island
1 bayou
1 island
1 swamp
4 mishra's factory
1 wasteland
1 academy ruins
1 volrath's stronghold
1 barren moor
1 lonely sandbar
Sideboard:
2 blue elemental blast
2 hydroblast
4 leyline of the void
1 gigapede
3 krosan grip
3 extirpate
So, I guess I'll be the one to make the obvious question: Why Gifts over Intuition? Being able to Intuition for 3 Forces or 3 Pernicious Deeds would seem to make it the better pick. The difference in cardadvantage is easily made up by the Loam engine anyway and the fact that it can be cast sooner.
Your manabase looks desperately greedy. I see a huge chance of Damnation, Witness and Garruks getting stuck in your hand given your manabase - using Gifts Ungiven as manafixing is really slow and a waste of a powerful card. If what I am saying is correct, either replace those spells with single-coloured cards (possibility: Chainer's Edict, Regrowth, Crucible of Worlds) or cut back on the basic and colourless lands.
Leyline of the Void is also the worst graveyard hate for a control deck - you hate to mulligan for it, and you can't Brainstorm into it on turn 1. If you need to supplement Extirpate, use Relic of Progenitus (or Crypt, or a split of the two).
Also, I like Prohibit more than Mana Leak in the current Legacy format (again, especially in a control deck). Maybe you'll like it too.
for card advantage in landstill I really like the following set upQuote:
Originally Posted by Nihil Credo
4bstorm
2ponder
1top
2wish
4standstill
Its works incredibly well for me.