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If no one minds I'm gonna write a tournament report on the 3 dailies I played yesterday with Imperial Taxes. I'm gonna go over different hands I kept and lines of play, seems like it could generate some discussion now that there hasn't really been any for a few days.
Please do
As I've played against you yesterday, I'd really like to hear your thoughts on how / why you made some plays.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bahra
So yesterday I had time to play 3 dailies. So it's almost like I played a 12 round tournament :tongue:
I will include a lot of details about the hands I kept and how the games played out, since I think it will help newer and experienced players alike, to see what hands are a keep and which are not, among other things.
The list I played:
Lands (23):
1x Cavern of Souls
2x Karakas
2x Plateau
3x Plains
3x Flooded Strand
4x Windswept Heath
4x Wasteland
4x Rishadan Port
Creatures (26):
4x Mother of Runes
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4x Stoneforge Mystic
3x Phyrexian Revoker
4x flickerwisp
2x Imperial Recruiter
3x Magus of the Moon
1x Mirran Crusader
1x Fiend Hunter
Non-creature spells (11):
4x Æther Vial
4x Swords to Plowshares
1x Batterskull
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
Sideboard (15):
3x Sudden Demise
4x Ethersworn Canonist
3x Rest in Peace
1x Leonin Relic-Warder
2x Council's Judgement
1x Pithing Needle
1x Ratchet Bomb
Here's how it went:
Round 1: Merfolk 2-0
Game 1: He's playing merfolk with main deck Jitte, Chalice, Echoing Truth among other things so it's definitely tougher than regular merfolk but he had to spend too many FoW's early and I ran him out of resources and killed him with flyers.
Game 2: I'm on the draw and this is the hand I kept, and I think it's a snap keep:
http://i.imgur.com/geEpPLN.png
Needless to say, I draw a Karakas in my first draw step and the first vial even resolves :cool:
The reason why you want to keep a hand like this though, is that basically all your draws are very good and you're very likely to stick a vial anyways, which merfolk can't deal with.
Round 2: Grixis Delver 2-1
Game 1: He has the triple delver backed up by forked bolts draw and with a solid hand I almost fight through it but lose in the end.
Game 2: I start off with Mother of Runes, he Probes into Cabal Therapy both my Stoneforge Mystics. I play a Thalia and next turn I draw another Stoneforge Mystic. Since he has no creatures on board yet, I get Sword of Fire and Ice and then the game is over.
Game 3: He has turn 1 swiftspear which I basically ignore and I wasteland him a couple of times and establish Flickerwisp + Mother of Runes to hold back his team and then I draw Jitte and he has no lands on board and the game is over
Round 3: Miracles 2-1
Game 1: I am on the draw but resolve Vial, after he deploys 3 basics he still is spending double swords to plowshares (through mother of runes) on a Magus of the Moon, that's how much it annoys miracles. I of course have another Magus of the Moon in hand. And later in the game I fetch Sword of Fire and Ice and end the game.
Game 2: I keep this hand:
http://i.imgur.com/oojln8g.png
By no means a great hand but it can certainly develop into something very good with average to good draws. Turns out he has Swords to Plowshares into Swords to Plowshares into Jace into Council's Judgement on the Revoker I drew + a Monestary Mentor on the same turn.
Game 3: He plays turn 1 Sensei's Divining top into Force of Will my turn 1 Æther Vial, then my turn 2 Æther Vial resolved, he then played Monastery Mentor into Jace, the Mind Sculptor. Pretty good start but Mother of Runes + Stoneforge Mystic + Sword of Fire and Ice deals with Monastery Mentor while he's tapped out for Jace. I then wait to his drawstep to see if he has Terminus, he doesn't, then I Vial in Flickerwisp to Exile Jace for a turn so he can't brainstorm again. From there I have Vial on 3 and 2 Imperial Recruiters in hand and the way to victory is pretty trivial.
Round 4: UR Delver 0-2
Game 1: He has an incredible nut draw, kills me on turn 4 (!!!) despite the fact that I get active Jitte on turn 3 and have Æther Vial into Mother of Runes.
Game 2: I have a solid hand with Mother of Runes, Swords to Plowshares a Ratchet Bomb and some other stuff, but for the rest of the game I only draw Mother of Runes and lands. So this happened:
http://i.imgur.com/g6msXJE.png
so 3-1, not bad but certainly not happy with the result.
On to the next one:
Round 1: Grixis Delver with Deathrite Shaman 2-0
Game 1: He mulligans to 4, probably because he's running only 18 lands including 4 wastelands.
Game 2: I keep this hand:
http://i.imgur.com/eL9Vuh1.png
And he goes Deathrite Shaman -> Young Pyromancer + Spell Snare my Ratchet Bomb -> Young Pyromancer + Brainstorm. But I port and wasteland him to give myself the opportunity to deploy Batterskull (I drew a white source during the first 4 turns) and he gets Sulfuric Vortex online after 1 Batterskull hit, we sit there for about 5 turns until I draw another Stoneforge Mystic and I get Sword of Fire and Ice and kill him.
Round 2: Miracles 2-1
Game 1: I lead off with Mother of Runes he Swords to Plowshares it and play a counterbalance. I have Cavern of Souls and Imperial Recruiter for Stoneforge Mystic that find Sword of Fire and Ice while I wasteland his white source and the game ends there.
Game 2: This happens: http://i.imgur.com/HsDVl8P.jpg
He hides behind Batterskull and brainstorms while I screw myself with Magus of the Moon. First and probably last time that has happened (was a misplay to play the Magus of the Moon in the first place).
Game 3: I grind him out with Flickerwisp and Stoneforge Mystic. I even save my Æther Vial from Disenchant by Vialing in Leonin Relic-Warder to exile it temporarily which made him never want to get rid of the Relic-Warder.
Round 3: Hall of Famer Olle Råde on Belcher 2-1
Game 1: He kills me with the cannon on turn 1
Game 2: He makes 14 goblins on turn 1 and I grind it out with turn 2 Stoneforge Mystic
Game 3: He doesn't have the kill before I get an Ethersworn Canonist down, I have Mother of Runes which protects the Ethersworn Canonist from Pyroclasm on turn 4. Eventually he dies.
Round 4: Esper Stoneblade 2-1
Game 1: I win the die roll and mulligan to 5 and get Thoughtseized on my opponent's turn 1. I concede in response to the Thoughtseize with this hand and a Karakas on board:
http://i.imgur.com/c4NBSXF.png
Might've been stupid to concede since he probably knows I'm on D&T anyways but he might not know about Magus of the Moon which could be crucial.
Game 2: After he goes Thoughtseize into Counterspell into Jace I feel super behind, I Council's Judgement the Jace and started grinding. I eventually manage to turn the situation and steal the game.
Game 3: My opponent goes turn 2 Stoneforge for Jitte but doesn't have a third land. I have port + wasteland + double vial and on my turn 4+5 I Imperial Recruiter for Magus of the Moon and the game is over.
So that's a 4-0, now we're talking :laugh:
On to another daily event!
Round 1: MUD 2-1
Game 1: He goes Lightning Greaves into Metalworker into Blightsteel Colossus and I lose
Game 2: I lead with Æther Vial and he plays turn 2 Metalworker which I revoker. I then deploy Magus of the Moon and he never gets more than 3 mana for the rest of the game.
Game 3: I keep this hand on the draw after my opponent mulligans to 6:
http://i.imgur.com/cwuoxoz.png
I think it's OK, if he has turn 1 Chalice then that's unfortunate but otherwise the hand is good with potential to be amazing.
As it turns out, my opponent mulligans further down to 5 cards and now even if he has chalice he is down on enough cards that he is likely unable to punish me for a slow start IF my vials gets stopped. He doesn't have Chalice but he again has an early Metalworker + Lightning Greaves but he also used a Grim Monolith to play the Metalworker so he's left with 1 card and it is not enough before I kill him with Stoneforge Mystic and the Mirran Crusader I drew.
Round 2: UR Omnitell 2-0
Game 1: I mulligan to 6 and start with Vial. I think he's on UWR stoneblade so I blind name Umezawa's Jitte and he Cunning Wishes for Electrikery and kill half my board. I then play a Magus of the Moon which shuts down my own karakas. I hope that then he will go for Show and Tell + Emrakul and I can Imperial Recruiter for Fiend Hunter then. And as I drew it up, it happens and he dies after losing his precious Show and Tell for no value.
Game 2: He dies to Mother of Runes + Ethersworn Canonist.
Round 3: Junk Maverick 2-1
Game 1: I play Æther Vial on turn 1, he has Pridemage for the Vial but is stuck on 2 lands. I am now stuck with 2 Flickerwisp in my hand as I Port him every turn. Eventually I draw a second white and start jamming flyers and he dies. This game took 15.5 min. for my opponent to complete while it took me about 7 min.
Game 2: I have a weak hand and die within a minute to Deathrite Shaman into wasteland into 2 Knight of the Reliquary.
Game 3: I have turn 1 Æther Vial but by turn 5 I have 5 lands in play and another 2 in hand and I haven't played a creature yet. Eventually I start drawing creatures and put up a fight but I have 11 lands in play at this point so I don't have a lot of cards to play just mostly lands and only 1 of those lands is a wasteland which I can't use due to the opponents Quirion Ranger. Eventually I stabilize at 6 life with opponent also on 6 life and a Sylvan Library in play and he times out. After the daily he messages me to tell me that he managed to 3-1 still and if I would give him a petty pack because he would've won against me (according to him).
Round 4: ANT 0-0-1
Round 4 I split versus an ANT player. It is 2 am. and I want to go to bed :tongue:
So 10-1-1 in 3 dailies I'm fairly happy with. Definitely gonna play this at GP Lille, looking forward to it!
Nothing obvious that I would change about the sideboard. Might cut 1 RiP for something else though.
Good job Marc. List continues to seem really good, cant wait for gp seattle this fall
what do you think about the quality of players you played against?
You lost in round 4, and tied, nearly lost in the last 2 matchs of daily 3.
For the grand prix, it might mean an easy start 4-0, then better opponents...
I'm not saying that this itteration of the deck is not good... i'm just trying to assess a little bit more perfectly its powerlevel :)
I think the players I faced all played very well. They are also mostly all familiar with my list which makes it harder. The level of play online is just astounding compared to paper, so I am very happy with a result like this. I expect that the general level of play on day 2 of the GP will still be lower than it is online.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
There's also a lot of the players from the dailies going to GP Lille actually, and I expect most of them to do well.
Ok :) Good luck then. I cannot make it to GP Lille, but I'll root for all D&T players (Mono white and Red and taxes players).Quote:
Originally Posted by Bahra
Did we agree on a name for this particular itteration? I like Red and taxes but you seem to use imperial taxes yourself.
Vote Taxcake #1Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
@Bahra
Thank you for the reports.
Is the red splash the preferred version for Death and Taxes now? Finally got my 3rd Karakas at GP Atlantic City. Now need to get Imperial Recruiters? I have one in a commander deck so just have to get a 2nd one.
I wouldn't say it's the preferred version. It's the preferred version for me though. I think it's better than mono white in general. But it's slightly worse against delver and significantly worse in the mirror.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirika
I have heard Team Denmark for this variant of Death and Taxes. I think Bahra prefers Imperial Taxes though just because the name is less nondescript.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tylert
How are you guys dealing with Monastery Mentor out of Miracles' board? He's a real beating, I find.
I am a long time player of the monowhite version of the deck but feel that the meta has shifted to a point where a light splash color may help fix some rougher matchups. The splash color I propose isn't red though, it's black. This is a working outline of what I had in mind along with card explanations:
Dead and Taxes
Lands (23):
1x Cavern of Souls
2x Karakas
2x Scrubland
3x Plains
4x Flooded Strand
3x Windswept Heath
4x Wasteland
4x Rishadan Port
Creatures (26):
4x Mother of Runes
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4x Stoneforge Mystic
4x Tidehollow Sculler
4x Flickerwisp
3x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1x Athreos, God of Passage
Non-creature spells (11):
4x Æther Vial
4x Swords to Plowshares
1x Batterskull
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
Sideboard (15):
4x Ethersworn Canonist
3x Zealous Persecution
3x Cabal Therapy
2x Rest in Peace
2x Council's Judgement
1x Pithing Needle
Card Explainations:
Tidehollow Sculler: This guy lets us interact with the one zone we don't currently interact with, the hand, this should help with our combo matchups. He can act as instant speed targeted discard off of a vial, and can permanently exile a card for free when he is flickered with an instant speed 'Wisp.
Athreos, God of Passage He lets us force our opponent to either give us back the creature lock piece they just removed or take 3 to the face, also he can be vialed in in response to a wrath effect. He often ends up being a huge indestructible beater due to the high number of colored mana symbols in the deck. Lastly he interacts favorably with the Cabal Therapy out of the board.
Zealous Persecution: Mainly a 2 mana instant speed wrath against elves and young pyromancer, but also is counter to golgari charm that kills Deathrite in the process. Can also anthem your team for game ending alpha strikes.
Cabal Therapy: The best and most skill testing discard spell ever printed, no explanation needed really, a house against combo. Can be cast as a followup to Sculler for perfect knowledge of an opponents hand. Makes Brimaz the best choice for our 3CMC beater since his tokens make perfect sac fodder for therapy flashbacks.
This is just a rough outline so any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
I haven't had any problems with him. Usually if they tap out on turn 3 they're pretty dead. Even if I know that my opponent is playing Monastery Mentor I still board out all my Swords to Plowshares. I have started not boarding out Jitte though, since that card is good if they have mentor.Quote:
Originally Posted by koten
I board out the Jitte. They never bother to STP my Mystic when I fetch it in game one. That is a strong indicator to me. I have found that Sword of Fire//Ice is the weapon of choice in just about all Miracles matchups, Mentor or no. I can see the value in popping little dudes with counters, but I would be afraid of a response and prowess crapola.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bahra
Are you fetching Jitte before the sword?
So Finn, are you on the side of Imperial Taxes or plain white Death n Taxes? What are your latest thoughts / conclusions on splashing red?
I'm never fetching the Jitte, it's just that I'd rather draw that than any of the sideboard cards I have left. Always go Sword of Fire and Ice and then Batterskull. But then again I haven't really had problems against Monastery Mentor either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn
Eh. I do not have the degree of insider knowledge on this stuff that I used to. I bet there are several posters in this thread who have better insight. I hope they are kind enough to make their thoughts known. That said, I have some generic information that you may find useful.Quote:
Originally Posted by MGB
A long time ago, I complained that the color white did not have a practical finisher. Exalted Angel was the card of choice at the birth of Legacy. But it was only reasonable with sol lands, so not practical. We got Stoneforge Mystic. Not what I thought I was looking for, but D+T used this card for an amazingly long time before any of the Stoneblade decks came about - and it clearly works. Sometime after that I said that what this deck needs is a Glowrider that costs 2. We got it and, well, awesome. As the format has gotten stronger I have been hoping out loud that we would get a card that looks a lot like this:
white's wet dream
creature - thingie
:w:
When ~this~ enters the battlefield, you may discard a creature card. If you do, search your library for a white creature card and put it in your hand. If you don't, sacrifice ~this~.
1/1
Or something like that. It is aggressively priced, but probably not OP because of the strict requirements. We do not have it, but Imperial Recruiter is a sorta facsimile of it. Kinda. I am tickled that Bahra has begun this experiment. I have been wondering about it for quite some time, and never put in the time to find out if it can fly. Thing is though, green has some similar tools in Zenith, Teeg, and company. You could take the deck in that direction also, as many have. In the end you get Maverick. It is a good deck, to be sure. But it does not perform as well as D+T because you both gain and lose when you make the switch. The jury is still out on whether the gain from Imperial is worth the loss.
So I definitely want it to work. But there have been a lot of ideas that have come and gone to this deck. A lot of good ones, in fact. It is just that the bar is very high for Legacy. I am doubtful that the splash is straight-up better. The more likely scenario is that it is markedly improves some while diluting most others. Is that a net gain? I guess that depends on which of those decks have more format presence, which is a big, complicated topic.
Hello everyone,
I haven't been able to play Magic in a couple of months, and I am looking to brush up my (mono-white) DnT list before getting back into the game soon. My main question concerns the use of anti-combo sideboard slots: do you guys think it's still worth it to pack a couple of Containment Priests and a singleton Spirit of the Labyrinth, or are we better served just maxing out on Ethersworn Canonist?
The idea is that Omni-Tell seems to have largely supplanted Sneak and Show as the Show and Tell deck of choice, and Canonist is probably better than SoTL against them now that they no longer go off through Enter the Infinite.
Against Elves, all three cards are good to the point that it could be considered a wash, although there are merits to diversifying your angles of attack.
Against ANT, Canonist is often our only saving grace in post-board games if they bring in Dread of Night, so more copies of it will directly and substantially improve the match-up.
Priest remains superior against S&S, Reanimator, and Dredge, but none of those seems to be particularly common right now, and we have a boatload of good stuff against the first two anyway. Infect is probably more common than any of those three, and once again Canonist is the clear winner there.
All in all, Canonist's stock relative to CP seems to be at an all time high, and, in the matches where Priest shines, we either remain quite strong, or Canonist works as a viable alternative. I was previously running a 2/2 split, but I will certainly at least try a 3/1 split in favor of Canonist, and take it from there. Spirit is probably the weakest of the three, but it has wide enough utility that I will probably keep the singleton for the moment, if only to increase my chances of attacking from different angles rather than having redundant multiples of the same hatebear (also, gotta keep the vial-in-response-to-brainstorm dream alive).
Thoughts?
BONUS QUESTION: would you side in some number of Ethersworn Canonists against Sneak and Show? Specifically, would you side them over part of the stoneforge package?