[Deck] Affinity

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Originally Posted by TheSleeper

Does anyone have a list that is metagamed to beat Zoo?

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I'm pretty sure you will beat zoo with this list :

1 Gaea's Cradle
2 Glimmervoid
4 Seat of the Synod
4 Tree of Tales
4 Vault of Whispers
1 Arcbound Ravager
1 Disciple of the Vault
2 Salvage Titan
4 Frogmite
4 Memnite
4 Myr Enforcer
4 Ornithopter
4 Riddlesmith
2 Cranial Plating
4 Mox Opal
4 Springleaf Drum
3 Cabal Therapy
4 Glimpse of Nature
4 Thoughtcast
SB: 4 Tarmogoyf
SB: 4 Erayo, Soratami Ascendant
SB: 4 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 Cranial Plating
SB: 1 Cabal Therapy

But it probably deserves another thread to be discussed.

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Originally Posted by TheSleeper

Does anyone have a list that is metagamed to beat Zoo?

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The last time I checked from The Zoo thread, they were running around 18 one-drops and 22 lands. This leaves them with 20 non-cc1 spells. So, half of their deck (including their biggest annoyances: Path to Exile, bolt removal/reach and SB Pithing Needle) will be shut down with T1 Chalice @ 1. I would recommend checking the UWx Metalcraft control thread on how to accomplish exactly that in an Affinity-like shell.

Qasali Pridemage will be their only MD response, but using up three mana for that should already have given you a couple of "time walks" to run them over.

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Originally Posted by Karhumies

I dropped the Ravager-Disciple combo ages ago. For extra gas, I initially tried Dark Condifant (too slow unless you get him out with T1 Mox Opal), which I dropped for Thirst for Knowledge (kinda nice but bad in multiples in opening hand), which I dropped for Jace, the Mind Sculptor (has more all-around uses such as bouncing blockers and Peacekeeper besides "just" the extra gas). Yet, in the spin-off UWx Metalcraft aggro-control thread, I have been suggested Arcane Denial which seems nifty when paired with redundant cc0 cards (2nd Mox Opal, topdecked Ornitopter/Memnite, etc.). Basically, it has the potential to act as a Thirst for Knowledge for 1U instead of 2U, with the added benefit of relevant interaction with the opponent.

Also, if you are running white, 2x Stoneforge Mystic in the main deck is not a bad idea. Plating is THE card you want to find from the deck with D.Confidant/E.Tutor/whatever draw effect, anyway, and S.Mystic even puts it into play through opposing counterspells.

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Confidant in affinity should be played like Brainstorm rather than Standstill. With Standstill, you want to drop it ASAP (at least, when you're position is neutral or favorable), but Brainstorm, you want to wait. It's the same thing with Confidant. You rarely want to drop him on T1. Instead, start out with something else. If you have an untapped creature, go for Springleaf. If you have 2 mana, go for Steel Overseer or Cranial Plating, but not Confidant just yet. This is because if they don't answer Steel Overseer, it'll establish better tempo for you in the short term than Confidant and if they have a swords, I'd rather have Overseer get hit by that than Confidant. The only reason to drop Confidant on T1 would be if you have a 1-land hand, but even then, Overseer would usually be better since he'll get hit by removal instead and you can use Confidant on T2 to get more lands. In short, play Confidant when you can afford it rather than as soon as possible. Drawing a card every turn is not too slow unless you're meta is filled with red (goblins, burn, and zoo). If you're facing pretty much anything else, Confidant is great.

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Originally Posted by Greenpoe

Confidant in affinity should be played like Brainstorm rather than Standstill. - - Drawing a card every turn is not too slow unless you're meta is filled with red (goblins, burn, and zoo). If you're facing pretty much anything else, Confidant is great.

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T2+ Confidant is too slow versus decks with fundamental turn 4-. Examples include Solidarity, TES, Dredge, some Elf combo decks and Sneaky Show. Versus these decks, you need either faster draw effects (e.g. Thirst for Knowledge), faster finishers (e.g. Fling, Disciple+Ravager) or relevant interaction (e.g. Arcane Denial, Ethersworn Canonist, Duress/Thoughtseize, Tidehollow Sculler) which compete with the same slot with Dark Confidant. While D.Confidant is a staple in black decks, those decks have traditionally run Thoughtseize, Hymn to Tourach, etc. to ensure that the D.Confidant player does not get killed before he can benefit from D.Confidant.

Signal Pest

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Artifact Creature - Pest
Battle cry (Whenever this creature attacks, each other attacking creature gets +1/+0 until end of turn.)


Signal Pest can't be blocked except by creatures with flying or reach.
0/1
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anyone?

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Originally Posted by BattlefieldMedic

Signal Pest

Artifact Creature - Pest
Battle cry (Whenever this creature attacks, each other attacking creature gets +1/+0 until end of turn.)


Signal Pest can't be blocked except by creatures with flying or reach.
0/1
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anyone?

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What does it replace? I wouldn't play it over Ornithopter or Memnite, because I'd rather play a zero mana creature than a 1cc creature such as Signal Pest. The Pest is probably better than Roterothopter or Arcbound Worker, but those cards aren't played so much anymore because Meminte is a better replacement.

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Originally Posted by Justin

What does it replace? I wouldn't play it over Ornithopter or Memnite, because I'd rather play a zero mana creature than a 1cc creature such as Signal Pest. The Pest is probably better than Roterothopter or Arcbound Worker, but those cards aren't played so much anymore because Meminte is a better replacement.

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This card is basically a 1cc Lord in terms of offense that's awesome in multiples. I think it definitely has the potential to replace one of the 0cc's or another 1cc card like drum. It gives affinity the offensive push and lord effect that it may need to be competitive again.

What the hell is wrong with you people. You are derailing Affinity so much. Confidant>Thoughtcast? What the hell? And Memnite over Worker? You really wouldn't want to pay 1 mana for modular? I've tested Memnite and it sucks. And taking out Vial? Why even play Affinity if it isn't to beat CB-Top?

That new lord looks awesome. Makes our CB-Top match-up even better as he gives a clock. He should replace the 4 Workers.

Here's to hoping that Beseiged has more to offer.

The lord certainly adds interesting prospects. However I would not be so hasty to discount memnite. That along with Mox Opal has made the deck a turn faster as far as I could tell when it came to emptying your hand. This has allowed me to cast turn 1 cannonists with ease. Which I might add, I think will still be relevant, despite survival's demise. I think that counterbalance and combo will see a bit of a resurgance.

Here's the list I have been playing in testing to favorable results:

4 Memnite
4 Ornithopter
4 Arcbound Ravager
3 Ethersworn Cannonist
4 Master of Etherium
4 Frogmite
4 Myr Enforcer
27 dudes

4 Aether Vial
4 Cranial Plating
4 Thoughtcast
12 spells

4 Mox Opal
1 Darksteel Citadel
4 City of Brass
4 Ancient Den
4 Seat of the Synod
4 Vault of Whispers
21 mana

SB
2 Ronom Unicorn
3 Thoughtsieze
2 Extirpate
3 Pithing Needle
2 Path to Exile
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Etherswown Cannonist

I would like to somehow fit diciples back into the deck, but so far I have not yet figured out what to cut. In testing the 3 maindeck cannonists have helped a lot against the harder combo match. I am not set on the sideboard, still trying to figure that one out. If null rod's are really that popular as hate, then I will try and fit in some echoing truth's.

Running 4 mox opals has not been a problem. I have been able to get hits metalcraft online by turn 1 rather frequently. Running only 17 lands hasn't been an issue either since I have 4 mox.

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Originally Posted by Kanti

What the hell is wrong with you people. You are derailing Affinity so much. Confidant>Thoughtcast? What the hell? And Memnite over Worker? You really wouldn't want to pay 1 mana for modular? I've tested Memnite and it sucks.

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While Confidant vs Thoughtcast is at least a discussion, Memnite vs Worker is not. Memnite is nuts compared to Worker, Worker blows. No one gives a fuck about modular anymore.

@ Kanti and kkoie: if you are playing Affinity to wreck Counterbalance decks as a meta choice, I would try fitting 2x Stoneforge Mystic into the main deck. Vialing Mystic into play at opponent's EOT, tutor Plating, then activate Mystic + equip on your own turn is an incredibly strong play. Not to mention that with Mox Opal, you are sometimes able to hardcast Mystic T1 (just like E.Canonist), so unless they have FoW, they are going to have an incredibly hard time for the remainder of the game.

I was thinking of including 2 mystic and cutting 1-2 plating for a jitte and possibly a sword of fire/ice. But I would have to make room. What are thoughts on running less than 4 myr enforcer? They seem to be the few heavy hitters in the deck that do not need other artifacts to be big (like master of etherium) and do not need tricks (like arcbound ravager). I have seen a few lists that cut them entirely. Are they not that nessessary anymore??

Confidant vs Thoughtcast is not a discussion. Confidant blows as he gets hit by removal and Deed and doesn't give CA right away. And you have x4 Frogmites ans x4 Enforcers, high CC cards that you don't want to hit.

Modular is extremly important. There are too many games where I had Memnite cast t1 and a mana open. Stop goldfishing and go play against a competent opponent. Worker is leaps and bounds better in the Thresh match and Zoo matchups, matchups you want to win.

Canonist in the main seems to suck. When Survival was around I'd say go for it, and replace Workers with Heap Dolls, but now it is gone and we should shift out focus back to beating CB-Top and creature decks.

i do not know if this would fit into this thread since this list does not use any vials, but here is a intresting list i just found, and it made 8th place in kansas

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=36116

it uses no Masters of etherium, which seems quite strange to me but maximises the use of arcbound ravager but i have to say i like the list (but the landcount seems odd), specially because its not as much as othe affinity-decks in sense of playing against a wall^^
i specially like the glimpse of nature because with a lot of non-cost creatures it can be quite effective

just a question since i put my affinity aside now for a few years i am not sure about the answer, does disciple trigger with the thopter-tokens that are sacrificed for ravager?, honestly i am not sure and thopter foundry was not yet printed when i stopped playing this deck, but i am considering picking this deck up again, since it was my first deck ever in legacy

so please tell me what do you think of this list, and please tell me about the disciple-token-thing, since it depends strongly on this if i am considering this list, or a similar one

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Originally Posted by AggroSteve

i do not know if this would fit into this thread since this list does not use any vials, but here is a intresting list i just found, and it made 8th place in kansas

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=36116

it uses no Masters of etherium, which seems quite strange to me but maximises the use of arcbound ravager but i have to say i like the list (but the landcount seems odd), specially because its not as much as othe affinity-decks in sense of playing against a wall^^
i specially like the glimpse of nature because with a lot of non-cost creatures it can be quite effective

just a question since i put my affinity aside now for a few years i am not sure about the answer, does disciple trigger with the thopter-tokens that are sacrificed for ravager?, honestly i am not sure and thopter foundry was not yet printed when i stopped playing this deck, but i am considering picking this deck up again, since it was my first deck ever in legacy

so please tell me what do you think of this list, and please tell me about the disciple-token-thing, since it depends strongly on this if i am considering this list, or a similar one

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It's an interesting list. It's been a long time since Affinity made top eight at a major event, so this result presents some hope. By the way, Disciple of the Vault's ability can trigger (if you don't forget to use it) when you sac a thopter token (or any artifact token for that matter). They still go to the graveyard. So yes, Disciple can be a very strong card in this build of Affinity. My concern with the deck is that it plays Thopter Foundry and Sword of the Meek without a way to tutor for either card.

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Originally Posted by Kanti

Confidant vs Thoughtcast is not a discussion. Confidant blows as he gets hit by removal and Deed and doesn't give CA right away. And you have x4 Frogmites ans x4 Enforcers, high CC cards that you don't want to hit.

Modular is extremly important. There are too many games where I had Memnite cast t1 and a mana open. Stop goldfishing and go play against a competent opponent. Worker is leaps and bounds better in the Thresh match and Zoo matchups, matchups you want to win.

Canonist in the main seems to suck. When Survival was around I'd say go for it, and replace Workers with Heap Dolls, but now it is gone and we should shift out focus back to beating CB-Top and creature decks.

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I play both. After hundreds of games, I still like having both Thoughtcast and Confidant in the same deck. Lands+4x Mox+8x 0cc creatures+1 drops leaves most of the deck at a pretty low CMC, so more than half the time, you take 0 or 1 damage. Confidant wins games, at least in my build, he's the best card in the deck.

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By the way, Disciple of the Vault's ability can trigger (if you don't forget to use it) when you sac a thopter token (or any artifact token for that matter). They still go to the graveyard. So yes, Disciple can be a very strong card in this build of Affinity

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lovely^^, in this case i will definitely build my affinity deck again, and the thing i love the most about the list i posted is that thopter foundry and sword of the meek give a mide-lategame-plan

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. My concern with the deck is that it plays Thopter Foundry and Sword of the Meek without a way to tutor for either card.

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i do not think that foundry or sword are bad as singletons even if you cannot tutor for them, the list i posted had 12 1/1 creatures (ravager, worker, memnite) so sword can be recurred quite often even without thopter foundry, and foundry alone is effective as well, since we can use every artefact we do not need anymore to generate some thopters with evasion for plating

as i just stated i find the absence of Master of etherium rather strange, what do you guys think about it?

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Originally Posted by AggroSteve

lovely^^, in this case i will definitely build my affinity deck again, and the thing i love the most about the list i posted is that thopter foundry and sword of the meek give a mide-lategame-plan



i do not think that foundry or sword are bad as singletons even if you cannot tutor for them, the list i posted had 12 1/1 creatures (ravager, worker, memnite) so sword can be recurred quite often even without thopter foundry, and foundry alone is effective as well, since we can use every artefact we do not need anymore to generate some thopters with evasion for plating

as i just stated i find the absence of Master of etherium rather strange, what do you guys think about it?

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Improving the speed of the deck is the only reason I can see for omitting Master. Still, the list runs two Etched Champion. I would rather play Master as a 3cc creature in that spot. Master can be a real house in this deck.

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Originally Posted by Justin

Improving the speed of the deck is the only reason I can see for omitting Master. Still, the list runs two Etched Champion. I would rather play Master as a 3cc creature in that spot. Master can be a real house in this deck.

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While Master is a house, I've got to throw out there that a major reason I've won a large portion of my games in testing is due to Champion. Having a threat/blocker that won't eat path/swords is absolutely amazing, especially when playing with plating and moving counters around with ravager. The more i play with him the more I don't think the deck will be competitive without him.

I've been meaning to post on here for the past couple days, but have yet to make time until now.

First off, I love the list that Top 8 in Kansas. There are some things about the list that I don't feel comfortable with, but I'm okay with that. Some say discomfort creates potential for growth, which is the point of this forum. It's definitely a list that I want to pick up. I love the usage of Glimpse of Nature. It's good to see that it is being considered and has potential. A lot of top players such as Chapin and Saito have talked about Affinity using that card for quite a while.

Speaking of Chapin, he released an article not too long ago talking about building a deck that is just a bad version of another deck. This got me thinking...Does the use of Glimpse of Nature make this a bad Elf combo deck? Or is this a better Elf combo?

I am concerned that people are going to see this list as an omen for what is about to come. A lot of people are claiming that Affinity is going to make (or already has made) a comeback, which is definitely not the case. We all know this deck isn't good enough for people to start packing Hurkly's Recalls and Null Rod. While our speed has increased, a few of the deck's weaknesses haven't been addressed well enough yet.

Lastly, I like Signal Pest. My only issue is that using it would make us depend even more on our swarming strategy and probably takes away some of the deck's resilience. I can't see it being played highly in Legacy.