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Is winter orb any good right now?
I'm looking at it in the board of punishing mac to lock up midrange mana bases while I have knights/heirachs and scryb ranger… thoughts?
Okay, to anyone who still plays maverick. I am playing punishing mav tomorrow with 3 mindcensors and 3 pridemages main, 3 equipment, fire/ice feast/famine and jitte and 23 lands
Just took 9th at a 60 man tourney with punishing maverick. I lost my win an in to death and taxes 2-1. Report to follow.
Still running Maverick, for the past year or so. Haven't had great success with it, due a lot of reasons, but mainly due lack of practice and lack of general knowledge of legacy. Latest change to my GW deck has been adding black for Deathrites, Dark Confidants, Abrupt Decays and Zealous Persecutions. Though it has been difficult to cut cards for those. I' ve been trying to keep up to the date reading this thread, so thanks for all the input.
Telkku, do you think Bob has been the deciding factor in your games against the Rock? I can't remember taking a single win against Rock with straight GW Maverick in testing. And I would also appreciate any advice anyone can contribute on Jund (Punishing or ordinary) matches.
Yesterday I attended a GPT with Maverick. There were about 30people, 5 rounds and then a top8. I played to finals where I split the prizes due to time limitations. It was a great day and here's a report (will post decklist after and thoughts on it):
R1 Pox
G1 He's on the play. Dark ritual -> Liliana. I managed to give him a fight though but in the end she was at 13 counters and I had an empty board, literally. He was beating down with nether spirit
G2 I board in pithing needles. Played one of them and named Liliana, he also had a bad mull down to 5 so there wasn't much of a game
G3 I got both my pithing needles in my starter 7. He does the dark ritual liliana thing again but I play needle on liliana on next turn on Top. Game was in my favour at this point and Mirran Crusader killed him at last 1-0
R2 Bug delver
G1 Really tight game. I make a mistake where I don't leave up mana to counter his Deathrite's actications (with Ooze), as I was on 7 health and he had tombstalker and 2x deathrites in play. I played sloopy and he won the game
G2 I put lots of pressure of him including Choke which he has to FoW. Basically attacking his mana base a lot and I had him dead on board at one point, but I made a mistake:
He was at 2 life, I had an Ooze, Mother of runes and a GSZ in hand. He had deathrite in play and 1 unknown card in hand. I was pretty sure it was a aburpt decay. So pre combat I give my ooze pro green and attack, he cast disfigure on it. (ooze was only 2/2) What I could have down was GSZ for scryb ranger and give my ooze both pro green and black. Also if he had abrupt decay in hand this would also do it
He stabilizes a bit and casts tombstalker. But I gsz for Knight and kill him the following turn
G3 Game goes to time. 1-0-1
R3 Lands
G1 Mother of runes beatdown. He didn't find any gas or action and I just put out creatures and killed him
G2 Pretty much same. He get some punshing fire action going but Ooze eats up his graveyard and Knight found my wastelands for his maze of ith.
2-0-1
R4 Tin Fins
G1 He combo me out Turn 2.
G2 I play pithing needle on Griselbrand. He reanimates it anyways and keeps bashing for 7 every turn. I'm at like 4 life and I cast a scryb ranger to chump. I get one more drawstep, so I draw the card and slam it on the table - Oblivion ring. I remove his griselbrand and proceed to win the game
G3 Turn 1 needle on griselbrand, turn 2 Thalia. He's stuck on 1 land and I wasteland it and he has no lands in play and I have a thalia, needle + extraction in hand
3-0-1
R5 Merfolk
G1 I was in such a good position this game, using Scryb Ranger tricks to eat lots of his guys. I serach for Sword of fire and ice with SFM (Which is a mistake! Always go for jitte!!!) and he puts out So Many Lords. really. Not even funny and kills me.
G2 This time I got an early jitte going and that sealed the game
G3 Such a tight game! He bashes me with lots of lords and other blue fishy creatures. Turn 4 I played jitte and equipped it to my Knight, versus his 4 lords and I was at 10 life or something. He was so sure he was gonna win so he attacks with his team: I block one of his lords, saccing a land to fetch maze of ith to kill his phantasmal image. He puts me to 1 life. From here on I manage to stabilize, put lots of dudes out on the field and killing stuff with Jitte.
4-0-1
Top8
Merfolk (same player)
G1 He forgets his aether vial triggers and he played a standstill and forgot about that too and played a spell to have me draw 3 cards. Game was not even close
G2 I get Jitte going and he doesn't have any gas. Game was over fairly quickly
Elves
G1 He combo me out turn 3
G2 I put a teeg into play which buys me so time. Eventually I cast zealous persecution that kills pretty much all his team and I take the game from there
G3 Wow. Mega tight game, we both go to beatdowns as he can't find any NO. I have a mirran crusader bashing, and he has some elves. At one point, im at 3 life and have 3 blockers, and he he has 5 guys and some of them are 2/2s. If he had turned his guys sideways he would have won but he thought I had some combat trick in hand so he decided not to. I draw GSZ it get Noble Hierarch. I attack with miran crusader with exalted trigger which is exaclty lethal
Finals Deadguy
We split!
CREATURES (28)
3 Qasali Pridemage
2 Scryb Ranger
4 Mother of Runes
1 Noble Hierarch
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Deathrite Shaman
2 Mirran Crusader
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
SORCERIES (4)
4 Green Sun’s Zenith
INSTANTS (4)
4 Swords to Plowshares
ARTIFACTS (2)
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa’s Jitte
LANDS (22)
1 Forest
1 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Maze of Ith
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Wasteland
3 Savannah
1 Scrubland
1 Bayou
1 Karakas
1 Cavern of Souls
SIDEBOARD
2 Pithing Needle
3 Oblivion Ring
2 Choke
3 Zealous Persecution
3 Surgical Extraction
2 Gaddock Teeg
Couldn't find a cradle so put a cavern of souls in that spot instead.
Mirran crusader was actually really good! Still wouldn't play more than 2
Sylvan safekeeper did nothing for me all day
Niether did Gaddock Teeg
I think we should play more SFM. Jitte and Swords are just too good not to play every game
Qasali pridemage was OK. Reason I ran 3 was I suspected lots of true name nemesis and I need to destroy all the equipments they run else its over.
Pithing Needle was very good
So was Zealous Persecution against elves :D
O-ring was OK. It's mainly there against show and tell matchups but u can board it in against lots of other decks too
So i went 4-2 at the AZ magic players legacy open which drew 60 players. I lost my win and in and took 9th…with punishing maverick.
Round 1: UWr miracles 1-2
Game one: He lands a turn 2 counterbalance and slowly gets me locked under it thanks to a terminus.
Game two: I shrug off a turn three terminus with equipment and mana dudes, with a noble heirarch being Voltroned up for the win.
Game three: I have the dream hand of turn one mom, turn two stoneforge mystic turn three GSZ for teeg. He plows the mom and drops a blood moon on my turn 2, I look at the heirarch in my hand and never play another spell.
Round 2:Jund 2-0
Game One: He kills my first three creatures and can't answer my knight into wastelands
Game two:He gets two early goyfs backed up by discard but stoneforge and Mother of ruins(sword of feast and famine) allow me to hold down the fort until knight comes online.
Round 3: Painter 2-0
Game one: I have an ooze turn off his goblin welder and removal for the painters he plays.
Game two: Multiple pridemages keep him down and then sword of feast and famine takes apart his hand.
Round 4: Merfolk 2-0
Game one: He gets a true name nemesis and a jittte but it isn't enough against double knights.
Game two: I have tons of removal and get an active sword of fire and ice.
Round 5 Elves: 2-0
Game one: I swords to plowshares into jitte to steal the win.
Game two: Teeg+Canonist+Mom+nothing else means this game took way too long. I never draw removal and slowly have to attack him to death with 2/2's while he is blocking and returning 1/1's
Round 6 Death and Taxes: 1-2
Game one: he destroys my mana base and wins quickly
Game 2: I establish my mana base and destroy him.
Game 3: he destroys my mana base and wins quickly.
and I take 9th!
The bonus is my wife also went 4-2 which was good enough for 16th in her first magic tournament ever!
I never drew relevant punishing fires but it would have been good if i ever had it online. In the first match against miracles I never drew/cast a pridemage or a green suns zenith, either would have won me the match.
edit:
list
Creatures
4 Mother of Runes
3 Noble Hierarch
1 Birds of Paradise
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Qasali Pridemage
3 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Aven Mindcensor
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Gaddock Teeg
Spells
4 Green Sun’s Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Punishing Fire
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa’s Jitte
Lands
1 Karakas
1 Maze of Ith
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Dryad Arbor
3 Wasteland
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Plateau
3 Savannah
2 Taiga
3 Windswept Heath
3 Wooded Foothills
1 Forest
Sideboard
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Enlightened Tutor
1 Sylvan Library
2 Path to Exile
1 Life from the Loam
1 Tormod’s Crypt
3 Red Elemental Blast
3 Oblivion Ring
I plan on swapping aven mind censor for spirit of the labyrinth straight up as I feel it will give me more traction against all of the blue floating around.
I've seen a couple decklists using spirit, obviously the basic consensus is 3-4 for of for most of us. Until I get some actual testing in I'm going to lean on him as a 4 of. That 3 power seems saucy. Unlike most I'm still a proponent of the SFM package and I thought I would share my list I'll start testing:
Dark Spirit Maverick
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Gaddok Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger
2 Noble Hierarch
2 Qasali Pridemage
3 Deathrite Shaman
3 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mother of Runes
4 Spirit of the Labyrinth
4 Green Sun Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Sword of Body and Mind
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Bayou
1 Dark Depths
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
1 Marsh Flats
3 Savannah
1 Scrubland
1 Thespians Stage
2 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
SB:
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Wilt-Leaf Liege
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Bojuka Bog
3 Cabal Therapy
1 Life from the Loam
2 Oblivion Ring
1 Scavenging Ooze
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Im thiking of tweaking my dark maverick into a dark vial maverick. Is this in any way possible? I want to try the spirit of the labyrinth but I still do want to retain my black splash.
Im thinking of
-4 green sun zenith
+4 aether vials
-2 sylvan library
- 4 thoughtsieze
+ 3 spirit of labyrinth
+ 1 gaddock teeg ( 2 total)
+ 2 aven mindcensor
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I've been trying to do the same thing to get Zealous Persecution in the board, but I haven't really ended up with a build I'm happy with. I hope the Vial Build players have ideas.
I also have another question regarding the vial build: How have you guys been adapting to the -1/-1 type of hate? I've thought about revamping my build and heavily reducing the number of x/1s but I'm not really sure how that will go, considering two of the best vial hatebears are x/1.
Forgive me...but what are the 2 best vial hatebears? Thalia and sol?")Quote:
Originally Posted by .Ix
Really excited about the banning later.not expecting anything to shake up legacy but you never know.")
Hoping for tnn to get the axe tho. Or unbnan survival.")
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Thalia and ether sworn canonist are the two best but canonist is too strong to main deck against fair decks.Quote:
Originally Posted by IL_casual
IMO they are Revoker and Thalia.Quote:
Originally Posted by IL_casual
Revoker isn't a hate bear, it is a utility creature.Quote:
Originally Posted by .Ix
I'm still on the GSZ package. IMO Death and Taxes is the better Vial deck because they can abuse Ports and Wastelands together with Vials. Ports + Vials in a mono coloured deck is saucy.
I'm going -2 Aven Mindcensor, -1 Scryb Ranger (she does a little of everything but not enough!) and -1 Ooze (Back down to one since Goyfs, Snaps and Kotrs see less play now) for 4 Spirit of the Labyrinth. Really looking forward to testing the 3/1 blue hatecat. The 3 power is a serious clock.
I think the card is vastly overrated. I just don't think it will be THAT good. I'm sure it is fine, but it doesnt seem completely insane or anything.
The spirit is not broken but it is strong enough to play main deck because the 3 power trades with most aggro creatures in non blue matchups. Against anything else it is main deck material that forces them to play fair, something that maverick is really good at. No jacing, no brainstorming away bad cards, no amazing card selection engine.
Honestly, I do think I would play the spirit over Thalia, but I am on punishing mav right now and cannot play the legend due to wanting to recur punishing fires.
With the spirit out, I have stoneforge, knight, loam, punishing fires and swords for non draw card advantage as well as not losing any of my card selection. Win win.
For those who are following along I am on the three sword plan right now. Sword of Fire and Ice, Feast and Famine and Light and Shadow. Jitte and batterskull are floating around my sideboard right now but in most cases I want to get a sword on a creature and attack right away.
The amount of combo always leads me to wanting feast and famine, against control I want fire and ice and against grindy decks I want light and shadow….in all actually they all are great in most situations with some being better than the others at certain times.
Hello Mav players,
I have been playing legacy for a few years and I seen a new card printed that might be a cool 1 of Greensun Zyneth target. The card I am talking about is Courser of Kruphish from the Born of the Gods set. I've been testing this card this week and I have some good results with the card in a slot I was using for a second scavenging ooze. I've been running a list similar to a punishing dark Mav list I seen on tc decks (http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=12122&iddeck=88837) and I have taken some creative freedom with the list.
So far, the decks ability to shuffle with cards like KOTR, fetch lands, green sun, (and in my list stoneforge mystic) has been very useful in peeking at my top card and adjusting my top card for either more land drops, or a more ideal top card to draw next turn. This may be too cute of a trick for this deck, as some games in this format end turn 2 or 3, but in a grindy match playing punish fire tech, this card has been nice to me so far.
Feedback is appreciate. I see potential, but it may be too small to matter. I'll post more if I get good results in a legacy weekly in a week or two. Thanks. :)
I just realized (I'm sure I'm not the first) that Spirit of the Labyrinth messes up the card draw on Sword of Fire and Ice (corner case exception: if you play Life from the Loam or another Dredge card, you can dredge first and then draw off the sword). What do you guys think is the best way to handle this in a TNN metagame?
Ignore it, since it won't always come up and the sword will be decent anyway?
Play Sword of Body and Mind? I'm pretty sure protection from green is better than red in most cases, which would make up for weaker abilities to some degree.
Play another equipment altogether (Batterskull, SoL&S, SoF&F) and up the number of prot. blue guys? Skylasher and Great Sable Stag are probably the best.
Play another equipment, compensating for the loss of TNN protection in some other way (more evasion, Zealous Persecution, whatnot)?
Something else?
That card is awful. Don't get cute with your tutor slots, something has to be really really good to play over more oozes, pridemages, or the singleton teeg/scryb. In a grindy match up you are better off just getting a knight and winning the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Strassbaw
In addition to helping out the punishing mav build that I have been working on I think there is a GWu Maverick list that should appear with cliques main as disruption and evasion(and the combo with spirit and karakas) and meddling mages in the side board to fight combo. I'm brewing hard now!Quote:
Originally Posted by Moroklumpen
You can dredge since it replaces the draw effect, meaning you didn't draw. However, you can't draw for the turn and later replace the Sword proc with a dredge.
"If a replacement effect would try to replace a card that you can't draw, that effect can't apply."
Here's what I'm considering for the next tournament:
3 Birds of Paradise
3 Mother of Runes
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
3 Weathered Wayfarer
2 Gaddock Teeg
2 Qasali Pridemage
2 Scryb Ranger
4 Spirit of the Labyrinth
2 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Aether Vial
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Savannah
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Forest
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Gavony Township
1 Karakas
1 Plains
1 Stirring Wildwood
Sideboard to come. At the moment I'm kinda itching to add Sword of Light and Shadow; it was a house before the True-Name Menace and works better with Spirit. Comments?