@sdematt -
I suggest playing a SDT in place of the 3rd Library. The duplicate copies of Library become really annoying in the mid-game.
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@sdematt -
I suggest playing a SDT in place of the 3rd Library. The duplicate copies of Library become really annoying in the mid-game.
@Damionblackgear
Yeah bc against omni tell thalia wins, against sneak n show blind obedience is soo awesome haha even if they play through the breach. We play knight, it's just how timely you play it and knowing whats in their hand so you don't face sneak n show. What's best about blind obedience is the fact that lotus petals, all moxes come in tapped. The card is also great against elves, muahaha no tapping for mana heritage druid, it's just super powerful also the extort is a win for life gain and gut shot your opponent.
@sdematt
I did have a way to find sigarda, eladarami's call. Opponent plays show n tell, response, eladarami's call grabbing sigarda, show in sigarda. Trouble for emmy.
4 swords 3 decays(A) vs 3 swords 4 decays(B):
I did play (B) in the beginning seeing how powerful it is but against Jund, swords is soo powerful. If you don't drop a DRS and they do, you fetch your land and swords it. Also you don't have to waste your decays on Bobs and DRS. You rather have decays used on Goyfs, Liliana, Libraries, and other pesky shit. Even when i tested the against the Jund and Bug match-up my buddy was saying how 4 swords was a crap load of creature removal against them. For 1 white, removing and not destroying, i feel is what gives junk the best spot removal compared to bug n jund.
Against esper if you board out maze then keep discard, because u have to deal with batterskull their best win condition. I personally would keep in discard bc then you really hurt all their plays. You have the ability to rid their hand of removal, planeswalkers and much more. Slow them down even more than they already are lol.
Just like T-Pain is in love with a stripper I like Knights in every match-up regardless of how they try to deal with him. He's a must block and allows junk to apply a lot of pressure.
I think Tidehollow Sculler is what you play if you want to tilt Junk a little more towards anti-combo, you don't lose too much aggression and he's really disruptive. Not many combo decks can handle 1CC-TD turn 1 with Sculler follow up. He really pounds Show and Tell decks.Quote:
Originally Posted by sdematt
So I was shifting Sigarda out for the 4th Lingering Souls, and I've really been liking it. It really helped the Jund match moreso than the Sigarda, since increasing the Souls density was pretty darn great.
It increased my susceptibility to Engineered Plague, but then I just came back with Sorin and Humility. Humility was only quite subpar when I had an empty board and he had Punishing Fires.
Also, under Humility, he had boarded in Jitte, and that cleaned me up pretty well, unfortunately since I didn't see any removal.
Either way, I really liked Sorin in that matchup, and Humility was fine as well (since turning off BBE and DRS was pretty great).
I'll be playing more Esperblade Thursday.
The question is, now that I'm playing 4 Souls and Rest in Peace seems to be a bit less popular than before, so I switch back to one Zealous and one Golgari, considering my token threat density?
-Matt
Maybe out your way, Matt -- RIP is actually gaining popularity on the east coast right now. Not sure if worldwide trend or just regional.
Also, I'm not sure I follow your logic in boarding in Humility vs Jund. I'd only board it in vs Show and Tell.dec, personally (or Nic Fit, Reanimator....the "big dude" decks). Your creatures are better than Jund's -- you both have Deathrites, Bobs, and Goyfs, but you also have Knights, and I'd think that you'd want your Knights to be wreaking havoc on his manabase (and/or beating for a million).
Yes, but depending on the position you're in, Bloodbraid Elf and Deathrite Shaman can start to ruin your life. Plus you have Lingering Souls AND Sorin to break the symmetry of Humility. You're only playing it though when you're behind/have tons of Souls out, or when Bloodbraid is going to ruin your day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arianrhod
-Matt
Agreed! I feel like rest in peace is becoming more popular. It seem like decks that play white like it as a graveyard hate. I just have sigarda coming from the side. not necessarily cutting it entirely but I do feel like without a way to get her I don't really want to playing her as well. Doesn't mean I don't give the credibility she deserves lol she won a lot of games for me. As for Humility, I like the power of the card but it's technically only boarded in for one match-up. I don't like it in the esper match at all... Maybe torpor orb to shut off snapcaster and stoneforge mystic. It also stop cascade from triggering... hmm.... I also think against the esper match-up I wanna bring back choke.
As for tidehollow, I used think the card was powerful but it you play board wipe or your opponent does also, would'nt it suck if they nuke the board then say you took a creature and they drop it on you n kill you with it? Also I don't think it's that powerful in the combo match-up. Mind as well just board in more discard. I play against my buddy who's a pure combo player all the time and it doesn't do crap to him. Not talking down on your card but if it works for you then go for it. Junk is a deck made to be tweaked all the time. There will never be a standard list lol
Matt, sorry since I know you went over it a while ago but, why do you run Sorin > Elspeth again?
Petree, How was the single Needle?
Next question to all, Why are we keeping the charms again? I know I pushed pretty hard but I'm finding no need for a sweeper and we rarely, RARELY, get a chance to actually regenerate my team. So, we should be able to fine improved alternates to the destructive abilities. Mortify could be considerable an option at instant speed.
It doesn't stop cascade from triggering because Cascade goes on the stack before the creature enters the battlefield.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petree
Why doesn't it do crap? I can't imagine it being useless in the Show and Tell or Storm matchups. Should be as good as a Thoughtseize against these decks.Quote:
I play against my buddy who's a pure combo player all the time and it doesn't do crap to him.
@damionblackgear
how did the singleton pithing needle do? hmmm sucks major balls lol.... If I was going to play it again, I'd run 2 or copies bc never really seeing it doesn't do much. I liked charms but I took them out bc I didn't have room in my sideboard. Against goblins it didn't do much and neither did it do anything against merfolk, it wouldve done a bunch a work against me getting supreme verdict though lol
@ .Ix
Very true. It doesn't stop cascade. My bad.
It has a significance and your right it does add extra discard and pressure for aggro. That's why I said if you like playing that style then thats you. I'm not trashing the card. Against snt it is useful but over a knight i don't think so.... remember if they show n tell and you play tidehollow and they play sneak attack, they can still respond to you targeting them once tidehollow resolves. Against combo it can potentially slow them down but i believe thalia is more powerful. Tidehollow will get chained of vapor and then what? anyway... not hating on the tech/card, its personal preference IMO.
@ All
Thalia's been very powerful. I underestimated her.
@ Damion
The Charms are great as extra things to muck Rest in Peace/Sneak Attack, have a card that clears out tokens/small dudes, and can possibly regenerate your team in wake of a Verdict/Deed. It's the flexibility I like. I'm going to SCG Seattle this weekend, so I expect a bunch of Tribal as well as a small resurgence in Death and Taxes, where Charm hoses their ENTIRE team. For two mana, I can't say no. I may split it with Zealous Persecution just because I'm very all in on the Souls/tokens plan. However, Charm does hit E. Plague against my Spirits, which was the only tech Jund seemed to muster postboard.Quote:
Matt, sorry since I know you went over it a while ago but, why do you run Sorin > Elspeth again?
Petree, How was the single Needle?
Next question to all, Why are we keeping the charms again? I know I pushed pretty hard but I'm finding no need for a sweeper and we rarely, RARELY, get a chance to actually regenerate my team. So, we should be able to fine improved alternates to the destructive abilities. Mortify could be considerable an option at instant speed.
I've been liking Sorin for a few reasons more than Elspeth in the Lingering Souls build specifically.
1) The emblem is VERY relevant when you have 2-4 creature tokens on board. It's a ton more damage.
2) It's easier to cast.
3) Lifelink tokens can be more relevant than just regular do-nothing tokens.
4) It's an answer or a pre-emptive answer to a Jace, TMS.
I know it doesn't give the evasion and a boost, but it's been VERY solid. I was quite skeptical as well, but pooping Vampires and making Emblems is huge. Usually my plan is poop a Vampire, Emblem, Poop, Emblem.
I'd say give it a try. It's pretty great.
-Matt
Petree:
I didn't mean holding Tidehollow for when they play Show. I meant hardcasting it and exiling Show from them just for a disruption-body. Anyway, yes it's definitely a matter of preference. Thalia being very good in the same matchups is true, and she doesn't affect us as much as one would think. The last time someone played Thalia against me, I played Souls, then flashback and got ahead anyway.
I don't think Mortify is the direction we should be going. We should be looking to Qasali Pridemage and Vindicate again if we need something to deal with problematic permanents.Quote:
Originally Posted by damionblackgear
Regarding Thalia: I've always been more tilted towards Tidehollow Sculler. It's one-sided against combo and fills in the discard/disruption curve perfectly. Turn 1 Thoughtseize, turn 2 Sculler, turn 3 Liliana. That is so backbreaking against most combo decks, and against most decks period, that it seems like a core function of my deck. I know I should be playing Lingering Souls, it seems right considering the mini-Stoneforge package I'm using, but I can't help but think that 3x Sculler/2x Souls is better than 2x Sculler/3x Souls. I like the flexibility of Souls when sideboarding, but I can't help but think that Souls could be in the sideboard instead. I'm doing some tweaking and I'll have a revised list to post soon.
I can't tell you how many combo matchups I've won because of Sculler. Like I posted above, it fills the gap. You're trying to do something relevant to lead up to a game-winning Liliana. Tidehollow Sculler is more relevant than just additional discard options like Duress or Inquisition of Kozilek. It doesn't miss, just like Thoughtseize, and allows you to develop your board, unlike the other options. I don't typically board in Deed and leave in Sculler. Sculler is generally bad against decks that have a good amount of removal, but if you curve out perfectly he's still at a minimum a 1-for-1 that takes attention of your bigger threats or at best gives you a 2-for-1 that gives you leverage to win the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petree
I can't imagine playing this deck without Sculler anymore, it will likely always be in the 75 somewhere in some number.
One point I'd like to throw out there for Sorin vs Elspeth; while Elspeth is objectively more powerful at closing games faster (Jump ability specifically), Sorin's tokens are black. This matters against some Red decks that also board into Sulfuric Elemental. I imagine this might see some play since it handily kills Mother of Runes without providing an opportunity to respond vs Death & Taxes and Maverick. Having a planeswalker provide a way around this creature might have merit if D&T hate is to be expected this weekend.
Hmm.... Makes me almost want to test -3 Lingering souls +3 tidehollow sculler... I will try that out.
Sorin sounds like a house but isn't elspeth a jace killer and just basically makes your aggro matches better. I'll test both.
but Souls + Sorin is also just as much of a Jace killer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petree
Went 4-0 Tonight beating Mono Black, Pox, 4C Stoneblade, and Elves.
-Matt
i will be hopefully going to a tournament on sunday and wednesday after
i would love your insight in some matchups and what would be best boarding (specially what to board out)
my list
23 lands (5 shocklands, 8 fetches, 3 wastelands , 1 horizon canopy, 1 maze of ith, 1 karakas, 3 basics, 1 dryad arbor)
4 deathrite shaman
4 dark confidant
4 tarmogoyf
3 knight of the reliquary
4 thoughtseize
2 cabal therapy
4 swords to plowshares
3 abrupt decay
2 vindicate
3 sensei's divining top
2 green sun's zenith
2 liliana of the veil
1 elspeth, knights errant
Sideboard
3 extirpate
2 tidehollow sculler
1 cabal therapy
2 gaddock teeg
2 golgari charm
2 pernicious deed
3 kitchen finks
decks i could be facing are: Esperblade, Maverick, Reanimate, canadian thresh/RUG-delver, sneakshow, MUD-metalworker, maybe eva green, pox
these were the decks i saw last time i was at that place playing a tournament
reanimate should not be a problem, on the others i would love to hear your thoughts and boarding plans if possible, because most of the time i board on instinct.
Last time i went there i had a dark horizon-style list and went 3-1 winning against GW-Maverick (really hard game), reanimate (shaman and extirpate for the win), one win against RUG-delver, and one loss against RUG-delver (this one had the nuts in 2 of 3 games / tripple delver and double delver+double stifle+ wastland)
i was a bit surprised i won against the first rug-player 2-0, would not have expected this (he could not believe it either :P), because of my shocklands, and that i made 1-2 agaist the second RUG-player
i think the most problems i will have are with RUG-Delver, Maverick, Esperblade, Sneakshow,.... if you guys would help me there with what to board i'd be very happy and grateful
5 shocklands, 8 fetchlands, 1 Horizon Canopy, 4 Thoughtseize and 4 Bobs look like a lot of self-inflicted damage. Let's say during the course of an average game you play 2 shocklands untapped, crack 3 fetches, Thoughtseize once and your Bobs flip a cumulative 5 points of damage. That's a whopping 14 damage you did to yourself. Not much work left for your opponents.Quote:
Originally Posted by AggroSteve
Before going over sideboarding strategies you should really try to get (borrow, maybe?) some painless duals. I don't mean to nag at your deckchoice, more power to anybody who picks up a non-blue deck, but you are in for hard times, IMHO.
best
Sorin's ultimate steal their Jace. Just something I'd like to point out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petree