[Deck] Goblins

VI. Update notes

April 12th, 2013
* major changes on the "bad cardchoices" list

Quote:

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Originally Posted by B-rad

On the subject of Angel vs O ring vs Confusion I'm going to have to disagree with both of you and say Angel is the better option vs S+T. While O-ring takes care of whatever they drop in and Confusion is kind of cute at pulling a switcheroo, Angel of Despair takes care of the problem in a much cleaner way than either of those cards. I understand it has the same effect as O ring but I feel like a lot of people are vastly underrating the clock that angel puts on the opponent. I've played against S+T in SCG opens more times than I can count and every time I've showed in an angel I've won the game just by being able to kill them with a 5/5 flyer and some other men before they can rebuild, and with all the card manipulation the deck has its not that difficult for them to do.

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The result of this "cute switcheroo" will usually be that you have an Emrakul, Griselbrand or Omniscience on your side of the battlefield. That isn't strictly worse than having a 5/5 bold-headed Angel. That means Confusion will set up a clock most of the time - just like Bold Angel - but it's close to impossible for them to recover with Confusion of the Ranks on the battlefield. However, I agree that Angel of Despair takes care of whatever they drop, while Confusion in the Ranks demand a creature on your side, in case they drop Griselbrand or Emrakul. Oblivion Ring is worse than both cards though.

I'm on the Confusion in the Ranks bandwagoon too, because of extensive playtesting and tournament play.
(also, hardcastin Confusion to get a cast Sneak Attack from your opponent, and killing him with a hasty Piledriver from your hand, is priceless)

Edit: And here we go again, back to DtB. A little more finishes from elves and they'd be in here instead of us.

First(horrible) goblin spoiled in dragon's maze. Hope for something better.

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attac...8&d=1365772144

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LeoCop 90

First(horrible) goblin spoiled in dragon's maze. Hope for something better.

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attac...8&d=1365772144

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http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attac...8&d=1365772144
The image was awesome. Too bad we can never get our hopes up...

Tietze's list looks pretty good; I see he devoted essentially 12/15 cards to the various combo matchups he'd face. Mindbreak Trap though? Is that a "gotcha!" card if the Storm player opts to combo off without protection?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Arsenal

Tietze's list looks pretty good; I see he devoted essentially 12/15 cards to the various combo matchups he'd face. Mindbreak Trap though? Is that a "gotcha!" card if the Storm player opts to combo off without protection?

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It's a Trap!

I've been doing a bunch of playtesting against Jund today. G-damn, that MU sucks. Bloodmoon is the only good card I've found against them thus far. And even then, DRS can still keep them in the game. But they run about 0 basics so Moon can really shut them down.

It's difficult to outgrind a deck that runs 12-14 removal spells, 4 of which recur... and all of our guys are */1 and */2.

If they show and tell with me having a creature in play and he puts emrakul in and I put confusion in the ranks in. Do I get emrakul or do I need to play another creatire?

In my goldfishing today I've found a very strong sideboard plan against Jund:

+3 Blood Moon
+3 Pyrokinesis
+3 Relic of Progenitus

-3 Thalia
-4 Aether Vial
-2 Piledriver

The idea is pretty simple: keep as many bodies in play as possible, use Relic and Pyro to control the board, then lock them out with Blood Moon. It's been very efficient.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jrw1985

-4 Aether Vial

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Strange, when Max Tietze was playing on camera it seemed like Aether Vial was the single best card in that match-up.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by markbris

If they show and tell with me having a creature in play and he puts emrakul in and I put confusion in the ranks in. Do I get emrakul or do I need to play another creatire?

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You need to have a creature in play. So assuming that you're playing goblins, it's pretty likely you'll have at least 1 creature in play by the time you'll see a SnT.

Basically, they play SnT, play big Em. You play CITR, then you exchange creatures if you have them. Because of CITR, they have to give up Big Em to one of your creatures if you have one in play. If they have an enchantment, they take your CITR (but who cares?).

CitR and Angel are of course better than Oblivion Ring versus SNT decks. But the ring is great versus other matchups, too, as our virtual third Grip. I like not so narrow SB cards.

So I was enamored with Max Tietze's deck and wanted to play it. Specifically, I wanted to look at the following differences from my deck:
1. MWM over Thalia
2. No Karakas
3. Rishadan Port
4. 2 SGC over a Krenko split

That said, my deck wasn't exactly the same as his. This is what I sleeved up for our local 'Big Legacy' tournament:

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Ringleader
3 Mogg War Marshal
2 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Skirk Prospector
1 Stingscourger
1 Tin Street Hooligan
1 Goblin Sharpshooter

4 Aether Vial

4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
3 Bloodstained Mire
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Mountain
2 Plateau
1 Taiga

Sideboard
4 Rest in Peace
3 Pyrokinesis
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Boartusk Liege

On to the tournament!

R1 vs LED Dredge
Game 1 he made 16 goblins on T2. I did not win.
SB: - 4 Gempalm, TSH, Stingscourger, 2 Ringleaders, + 4 RIP, 3 Pyrokinesis, 1 Boartusk Liege
Game 2 (mull to 5) he got Elesh Norn into play T4 along with some irrelevant zombies, while RIP was nowhere to be found.
Note: I retrospectively decided that Thalia should have come into this matchup as well instead of Pyrokinesis.
0-2

R2 vs countertop
Game 1 was about Lackey coming down before his T1 Top, T2 Counterbalance. From there Lackey laughs at him.
SB: - 4 Gempalm, 1 Sharpshooter, 3 MWM, + 4 CotV, 3 Thalia, 1 Boartusk Liege
Game 2 he had double Engineered Plague, followed by Swords on my Liege.
Game 3 I played some rubbishy dudes on T1 and T2, then ported him to death (while two Engineered Plagues rotted in his hand). PORTS FOR THE WIN!
2-1

R3 vs Zoo
Game 1 was Vial chaining Ringleaders for the win.
SB: - 2 Piledrivers, TSH, Prospector + 4 RIP
Game 2 was him beating me down with Nacatyls, Tarmogoyf and KotR, until Gempalm killed the Nacatyl and RIP let me stop his fatties and Sharpshooter mopped up.
2-0

R4 vs countertop
Game 1 Aether Vial let me laugh my way through his Top/Counterbalance combo which he assembled. Eventually Warchief and Ringleaders swarmed him.
SB: - 3 MWM, + 3 Thalia
Game 2 Cavern of Souls gave me Lackey, which just made a joke of what he wanted to do. He wrathed but Ringleader lets me rebuild.
2-0

R5 vs uw Top control
Game 1 he got down Top and RIP, but luckily never saw Energy Field before I swarmed him, despite a Terminus in the middle.
SB: - Sharpshooter, Stingscourger, TSH + 3 Thalia
He never got past 3 land and Aether Vial and Thalia made it hard for him to play.
Note: I had no outs to the Energy Field/RIP combo, MD or SB.
2-0

R6 - ID into top8
Went and got a Doner Kebab, quietly watched bubble matches, resting (i.e. starting top8 competition early).

Quarterfinals vs Stoneblade
Game 1 he got down a Jace and a Verdict, plus Swords/Snapcaster. but eventually I just played a bunch of dudes and they swarmed him.
SB: - 3 MWM, + 3 Thalia
Game 2 He started with T2 Stoneforge, T3 Batterskull, T4 Jitte equip, while I had Aether Vial, T3 Warchief, T4 Matron for Prospector. He got down Engineered Plague while I bounced his germ and killed his Stoneforge. My Warchief let my matrons turn into Piledrivers which swarmed him through the plague.
2-0

Semifinals vs Show and Tell
Game 1 I kept a durdly hand, but he didn't do much and eventually attacking for 5 or so a turn killed him.
SB: - 3 MWM, + 3 Thalia
Game 2 he Show and Tell'd into Omni
Game 3 I kept a slow hand, then he Pyroclasm'd my board of Lackey, Warchief, MWM, SGC + tokens away. I rebuilt with Matron-Ringleader, and he pyroclasm'd again. Eventually Warchief + dorks take him down as he has Show, but nothing to tell (same as G1).
Note: I had nothing to stop me losing straight up to S&T with Omni in hand. O-Ring would give me a chance.
2-1

Finals vs tin fins (who had had multiple T1 kills throughout the tournament)
G1 he attacks me with Griselbrand and Emrakul on T2.
SB: - 4 Ringleaders, 4 Gempalms, 2 Aether Vial, Sharpshooter, 1 SGC, + 4 RIP, 4 CotV, 3 Thalia, + Liege
G2 I start with Lackey into RIP, then cheat in Matron -> SGC. He doesn't come back from that.
G3 I start with this hand on the draw: Bloodstained Mire, 2 CotV, Thalia, Piledriver, Warchief, SGC. Would you keep this hand?
I ended up keeping it since even if I falter on hitting a land for my first two draw steps, CotV on 0 still shuts down his Lotus Petals and Chrome Moxes which he uses to surge through his combo after drawing 14 from Griselbrand. I ripped a land like a champ, then played a CotV for 0 on turn 1, then T2 Thalia, followed by CotV for 1 on T3. After that random durdles killed him.

So I won the tournament (and two Tarmogoyfs). Neat.

Thoughts on the deck.
1. Thalia vs MWM. I honestly think that Thalia is better vs basically non-Tarmogoyf decks, which is most of the field. All throughout I was asking myself 'is MWM better here?' and while sometimes it let Piledriver attack for more, it could be cast off R because of Warchief, usually Thalia was a much better play. She's *much* better in the matchups that I feel are bad for us. MWM also is a nombo with RIP (since you don't get the token when he is exiled).

2. Karakas vs Port. I was fully on board with Karakas before the tournament, and it has been good for me in the past. But Port really did work, letting my rubbishy little dudes kill them while disrupting their mana. I'd like to see how a list with both Thalia and Port plays. Port takes Goblins from being a midrange deck (i.e. a bad deck) and making it a tempo or aggro-control deck, with much better game vs control and combo.

3. Krenko vs SGC. Never missed him. Krenko is just too slow, and can't act as a removal spell.

4. I used my whole SB, and like them all. I felt pretty naked though vs Energy Field and Show and Tell without Oblivion Ring in my SB. I think that 3 Thalia MD and 3 O-Ring SB is better than what I played.

@magicmerl - grats on your finish. You didn't really play any match-ups where MWM shines besides Zoo. He's a lot better vs RUG, Team America, Maverick and Jund.

Goblins is in the DTB forum! yay

Tobias Dreger won one of the Grand Prix trials yesterday in Strassbourg.

Interesting list. As always he plays with blue splash.


Tobias Dreger
GPT Winner - Legacy



Main Deck
60 cards

4 Cavern of Souls
1 Plateau
3 Rishadan Port
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
3 Wooded Foothills
23 lands

3 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Warchief
1 Lightning Crafter
4 Mogg War Marshal
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Sparksmith
2 Stingscourger
33 creatures

4 Aether Vial
4 other spells

Sideboard
1 Boartusk Liege
3 Celestial Purge
3 Pyrokinesis
2 Relic of Progenitus
3 Spell Pierce
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
15 sideboard cards

[QUOTE=Sasan;717650]Tobias Dreger won one of the Grand Prix trials yesterday in Strassbourg.

Interesting list. As always he plays with blue splash.



Blue splash? interesting... also kinda iffy. will be testing this sometime soon. Well, speaking of weird splashes, what do you think about the black splash? It's one of my personal favorites and i want to hear other people's thoughts.

I'll be playing in SCG Milwaukee tomorrow. Wish me luck! Naturally I'll be rocking Goblins. Hopefully I get good MUs and good draws.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sasan

Tobias Dreger won one of the Grand Prix trials yesterday in Strassbourg.

Interesting list. As always he plays with blue splash.

Tobias Dreger
GPT Winner - Legacy

Main Deck
60 cards

4 Cavern of Souls
1 Plateau
3 Rishadan Port
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
3 Wooded Foothills
23 lands

3 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Warchief
1 Lightning Crafter
4 Mogg War Marshal
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Sparksmith
2 Stingscourger
33 creatures

4 Aether Vial
4 other spells

Sideboard
1 Boartusk Liege
3 Celestial Purge
3 Pyrokinesis
2 relic
3 Spell Pierce
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
15 sideboard cards

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Tobias knows his Goblins. He placed 18th with a goblins list at a GP last year. Congrats to him.