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The mana base is way better and works fine. Against RUG you're playing around stifle AND wasteland. it's better to have an optimal decision with your fetch rather than getting stuck with a shit dual. I feel like running one Loam in the sb is also nuts against Jund and RUG.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasan
I agree completely with 1 Volcanic. Its makes so much and sense and plays very smoothly.
That creature base looks sexy. Just try it. You have decent board control with that and 3 shroud creatures ;-).Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormod
It is a tough call and I think that it is very ok to run 8 fetchlands. With that Mongeese get faster Thresh and perhaps Tormod starts liking Mongeese again :DQuote:
Originally Posted by TheKingslayer
Isnt there a safe way to get in 4 DRS and 4 mongoose in this list?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormod
Would it be safe to go something like:
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secret
4 Mongoose
2 V. Clique
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Stifle
1 Spell Pierce
2 Spell Snare
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Wasteland
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
1 Volcanic Island
1 Taiga
Im tired of having my Goyfs nuked to 0/1s from RIP (even though we have Stifle), but cutting 2 pierce is maybe to risky ? it does reduce the delver-flip-chance..
that's it. i've been playing RUG for the past year and a half, but the bUrg version just feels better in every aspect.
maybe cutting the 4 goyfs have a little drawback in some machtups, but the rest of the deck does everything, if not better, just as efficient as RUG!
congrats on converting another player to the deck! =)
Welcome! RUG is a great deck, but it's better once you add black. :tongue:Quote:
Originally Posted by renanprezende
My meta is comprised of miracles, stoneblade, and combo. I would marry Nimble Mongoose if I could.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasan
Welcome, renanprezende! We're glad you decided to take the black.
@ Neffy- your list looks exactly like mine, but without MD vendillion clique. I would advise you to drop both of them from the main, or maybe only run one in place of 1 mongoose. I've traditionally been running 12 creatures (4 goose, 4 deathrite, 4 delver) to great success, and I am testing 1 TNN-3 Geese, but it could easily be a clique. In the stead of the extra 2 creatures, you'll want a 3rd snare to ensure no RIP and to stop opposing goyfs. As well, I run an extra pierce. Make sure you run atleast 2 submerges in your board to knock out opposing goyfs and Stalkers. 4 Deathrites, contrary to much belief, are great as they can be shuffled away in multiples, and they incredibly good at being one mana lightning rods.
@Sasan, I like goose as long as there's threshold by turn 3/4 :D HeisenbUrg has been putting good performances for me. Without goose I was still putting up the wins, I just don't have those awkward "where is my threshold" moments. Something notable is that there has been a decline in baleful strix across the format. This makes goose, goyf and delver better. Yesterday TNN didn't make any differences in my match ups until round 4
@ Neffy, the early versions of bUrg 4 Delver, 4 Deathrite, 4 Mongoose. But there are certainly matches where you need more meat.
I played 14 creatures for a time, but really 12 is enough and the additional disruption is better and its easier for your delvers to flip.
Its cool to see new faces in this thread. I hope my reports and tuning have been interesting and informative.
Great that the deck catches some fire with more RUG Delver players switching :-P
I like the discussion that is going on. Let us see if we can have some good results with the deck to have more switchers and believers.
What about playing Thought Scour if we run Nimble? It gives more punch to the deck to reach ******** in 2/3 turns. Incidentally, it feeds DRS...
Canadian Threshold decks have entirely cut Scour for either more interaction or Gitaxian Probe. Probe is awesome - it still adds cards to grave, and so many plays in this deck have similar EV a priori, but the posterior distribution changes enormously.Quote:
Originally Posted by Akinos
For example, do you lead on Delver or hold up Stifle? They have pretty similar EV depending on the matchup, but if you know that they have no more fetchlands in hand, the EV of the Stifle play goes way down.
Against Show and Tell, do you play Delver or hold up Pierce on the play? Normally it's correct EV to play Delver because they're slower. If you know that they have a turn 1 win, however, the EV of that play is awful.
Also this deck plays Taiga. A free cantrip is much better.
I playtested yesterday and two times i got an opening 7 with 1 waste and 1 taiga for lands, which is so sad. Do you guys have experience with this? We are so blue heavy that it looks like an instant mulligan (if no deathrite). Even mongoose in that hand doesnt seem to make it better.
Yes it happens from time to time but playing Taiga is a necessary evil and it does not happen that often. We need the ability to run with two lands ;-).
I guess you mean Sea+taiga? Do we ever miss badlands (to supply tropical island)?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasan
You can read the primer where I debate on Badlands vs Taiga ;-).
Yes I mean Usea and Taiga.
But all is in the primer. Most primers here are not up to date but that one has always all information.
Here is my friend hes RUG delver list ;) ( He won 7:0 in a sideevent tournament)
4 Wasteland
3 Volcanic Island
3 Tropical Island
3 Polluted Delta
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Scalding Tarn
1 Flooded Strand
//13 CREATURES
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Nimble Mongoose
3 Tarmogoyf
2 True-Name Nemesis
//29 INSTANTS and SORCERIES
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
4 Stifle
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Gitaxian Probe
1 Spell Pierce
He's very happy with it. So now he Plays True-Name Nemesis and i see a lot Points too to Play him.
Should'nt this go under RUG? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pdingo
Very nice primer Sasan btw, though it's a bit funny you mention goyfs here and there where as the main list does not feature them. I guess its the updated list there :)
I actually like that we go around goyf, but im not keen on having 12 delver, mongoose, DRS and no "bigger" creature. I like to have 1-2 clique main (i know its not bigger then flipped delver, but it does have a surprise element and disruption effect). I think clique > TNN as our deck really does not abuse it enough (read. equipments!).
When you read 2-4 pages back you see why i post it here;))
That's cool, 4 Gitaxian Probe. I'm considering this since lots of days but didn't do it so far. How did this configuration feel for him, also the lonely spell pierce?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pdingo
I like the list, it has some freshness. As I look at it and the last posts, I'd go 4 Delver, 4 Geese, 2 Goyf, 2 TNN/Clique and 2 pierce or 1 pierce/1 tarfire/chainlightning.
But well, that's marginal RUG topic ;)
@BURG
I like the idea of 2 Cliques as further virtual counters in the slots of TNN. 4 Delver, 4 Deathrites, 2 Goyfs, 2 Cliques feels great atm imho.
F*** off that there are no longer shroudies around. But I won't go under 4 Delvers or Deathrites and i like the beef behind goyfs and the all in one wonder namely clique. There's the advantage I'm not that theshold dependent anymore....