That is an old Oracle update that was meant to do what you suggest. However the new wording, which was updated very recently, overrides this. It seems they just haven't removed those old Oracle notes.
Printable View
That is an old Oracle update that was meant to do what you suggest. However the new wording, which was updated very recently, overrides this. It seems they just haven't removed those old Oracle notes.
please see the FAQ
Thank you Hikee.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hikeeba!
Anyone else find it amusing that this thread already has more posts than the UGW Threshold thread?
Gut reaction: If you are up to 4 mana, why didn't you try to go off already?Quote:
Originally Posted by ACME_Myst
What you say could be true, but I haven't tested the mirror match, so I really don't know. For all I know, the Disciple kill could be 1000% better in all situations. Until somebody checks it out, I really couldn't say. Considering that the Disciple Hulk deck is plenty good enough to kick the crap out of most anything, I don't think it hurts anybody to brainstorm variations on the deck.
What I will say is this: If the deck is still legal the next time I get a chance to play, I'll go with whatever combo is the best. I have no unreasonable attachment to the Karmic Guide combo - if Disciple is better, then I'll run it.
Yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacosnape
So what is the optimal pre FS builds for the disiple and non disiple version? I have seen a ton of post FS builds but only 1 pre FS build (with summoners egg?) If good ones are already up please direct me to them.
Edited for truth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hikeeba!
Summoner's egg is for when you go off with either Karmic Guide or Kikki Jikki in hand, you get egg and feeder imprint the Guide or Kikki Jikki on it sacrifice the egg to put the guy into play and then continue going off.
On a side note Goblin Chirurgeon could be a decent alternative to benevolent bodyguard against red decks; since you can't give the Guide pro red or Kikki Jikki can't target him.
Goblin Chirurgeon - R
Creature - Goblin
Sacrifice a Goblin: Regenerate target creature.
0/2
Vigilant Martyr does the same thing basically but doesn't sound as cool so will exclude him.
I'm not saying he’s perfect, but no one has come up with a sequence of cards for the Kikki Jikki win condition that is compact and can't be stopped at any point. Including things like Bodyguard and Chirurgeon forces the opponent to understand the deck much better to stop it but neither is perfect.
It seems like everyone is missing something. Wizards will NOT change the errata back. It would be too much work for Magic Online. Instead they will just ban Protean Hulk. Perhaps they will even restrict Flash, but they wont fix the errata. Even so, this will PROBABLY happen AFTER the GP. I can forsee the GP being hosed by Hulk Flash, but after that we shouldn't have to worry any more.
Ishan, you are brilliant. Does your mama tell you how smart you are, cuz ya are.
Legacy has no restricted list.
Banning Protean Hulk - a 7 mana card - over Flash is well....
Grrr, do you really think no one has brought this up?
Why would you play Ravager in the first place? That makes you vulnerable to PithingNeedle, which the 0/0 artifact combo doesn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheInfamousBearAssassin
-Slay
Don't call people out on 'missing something' when you have no clue about the history of banning cards. Protean Hulk is not the threat and is no threat to the format without Flash. (Sneak Attack? Come the fuck on. Sneak Attack blows.) Flash is a threat to the format without Protean Hulk, although less so. Flash is the broken piece in this deck. Flash will get the ban or nothing will get the ban.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ihsan
Well, they banned Worldgorger Dragon over Dance of the Dead, Animate Dead, Necromancy, and Ambassador Laquatus, so I believe your logic is flawed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn
Banning Protean Hulk over Flash
Pros - Let's some kind of Flash/Rector deck get a shot, probably promising but not insane.
Cons - DCI feels stupid for banning Protean Hulk.
Meat AND Eggs? Me eat.
As petty as it sounds, I think Flash is more likely, if only cause they'd feel less silly banning cheap blue instants than enormous green creatures.
They also banned Bazaar and Entomb, which are more anagolous to Flash than the Re-animates or Laquatus.Quote:
Well, they banned Worldgorger Dragon over Dance of the Dead, Animate Dead, Necromancy, and Ambassador Laquatus, so I believe your logic is flawed.
So, possibly both, but not just Hulk.
They banned Worldgorger Dragon because there's absolutely no chance in hell of a second combo emerging with Animate Dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Durahan
Flash isn't the same. Flash has tons of other creatures to interact with. We've only scratched on the surface with Protean Hulk.
@ Durahan, Yeah, and we can see how much those cards have warped the meta in the ensuing years.
Think.
If they left the Dragon, they would have to kill all the animation permanents in the game, and could never print another at a reasonable cost.
If they leave Flash, they can just get going banning creatures.
Hulk
Rector
Karmic Guide
etc.
Whatever, and they can not print this kind of creature ever again.
Well, except for Reanimating Protean Hulk...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacosnape
Care to back this up? Nobody yet has provided a degenerate alternative to Protean Hulk for Flash combo. The closest anyone has admitted to getting is to suggest Academy Rector into a toolbox of different hoser enchantments.Quote:
Flash isn't the same. Flash has tons of other creatures to interact with. We've only scratched on the surface with Protean Hulk.
I will admit that banning only the Hulk would mean that R&D would always have to be aware of Flash when they design leaves-play creatures.
Flash and Karmic guide is the end of the world 2 mana 2 cards instant speed reanimation OMG! The only other really effect besides Hulk that could be broken is the Rector, but its not an instant win although Null Profusion could be scary who knows.
Hulk -> broken with FlashQuote:
Originally Posted by Finn
Rector -> useful, but not a verified threat yet
Karmic Guide -> oh, no Flash = 1U instant reanimator that costs 2 cards in hand!
Not convinced yet. (but it is probable that Flash + Rector will also restrict what enchantments they can make...)
EDIT: Not convinced that Hulk isn't ban-worthy, that is. I'm flexible on Flash, if only for future design consideration.
You guys are brilliant at parsing words. If you disagree with my meaning, say so, but if you don't like my examples, does it make me wrong? Are you saying Flash is OK? No, I didn't think so.
I was actually thinking of the new Cheese Stands Alone card and Academy Rector. You could also do Rector with Shield Spheres and company to bring in a great Day of the Dragons. You could possibly fit that into an existing Kobold/Glimpse deck.Quote:
Care to back this up? Nobody yet has provided a degenerate alternative to Protean Hulk for Flash combo. The closest anyone has admitted to getting is to suggest Academy Rector into a toolbox of different hoser enchantments.