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Hollywood, do to the decks weakness against Mono-Colored aggro decks D&T Goblins, etc, I've recently been testing a 2nd Silent Arbiter and Umezawa's Jittes out of the board and I've been really impressed by them. Have you given Jitte any consideration against the not so great aggro matchups?Quote:
Originally Posted by A Legend
I was thinking about it. It might actually be a much wiser solution than more creatures in the board because you already play so many in the main. Jitte would solve a lot of issues the deck faces against more aggressive decks.
A Legend: did you make any report of your second place?
http://www.deckcheck.net/list.php?ty...&format=Legacy
Maveric I suggest you start paying attention to the format, instead of trying to bait A_Legend.
This deck is a known entity in both USA and Europe and is likely to get better as people work on it.
It is already being worked on in UK, and I have no doubt the Germans have several lists undergoing testing.
It's not just a "flash in the pan" , the deck has an interesting and fairly reliable kill .
People ignored Aluren and AgroLoam for ages (especially in USA), but those decks proved just how well they can contend.
Instead of just writing off the deck, either suggest in a concise manner where you think the decks flaws are (and yes there are some), or leave the thread and accept that others want to work on it without your trolling.
On the deck, I've had some sucess with the Imperial lists but currently am branching away from red to splash a second colour to help in some of the weaker matches.
Blasts are much better in legacy than ppl would like to admit. Even as a counter to a brainstorm, they can be useful across the board.
Imperial Recruiter is an interesting idea and I wonder just how far it can be taken successfully. For one thing I would like to test an integrated list using both painter\IR\and an affinity style shell.
4 IR
4 Arcbound Ravager
4 Painter
2 Ornithopter
2 Magus of the Moon
1 Atog
4 Frogmite
3 Chrome Mox
4 ReBs
2 Pyroblast
4 Grindstone
4 Aether Vial
4 Cranial Plating
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Great Furnace
4 Darksteel Citadel
5 Mountain
I've also been considering a RDW style shell with the classic manabase:
4 Wasteland
4 Port
4 Woooded Foothills
4 Bloodstained Mire
8 Mountains
That way Painter is protected while resolving with blasts, and in response to removal you can either destroy lands and such or just simply counter the removal. Seems like a decent complement to a reletively slow combo deck.
.
So you people were trying to put this Imperial Painter to a more aggro mode, good luck with that, that's a cool idea anyway unless I'll miss the way Jaya use her strength to control the board and SSG + Blast as red FoW. .
@Happy, too many Plating in my opinion, also 3 Chrome Mox for only 13 color imprinted will be a waste (yes you can sac them for Ravager, but the benefit is too low)
Finals at Hadley 6/28/08Quote:
Originally Posted by Maveric78f
Hopefully there'll be another good report after this weekend in Syracuse at the $1,000 event.
Painter makes late game artifacts and even lands imprintable on Chrome Mox. You could imprint other Grindstones which would make up slightly for how useless they are in multiples. Platings are very good and with no draw you want to maximize how often you draw them. Being able to force them through with blasts is awesome. Plating also makes IR somewhat better, giving it the ability to trade with much much larger creatures.Quote:
Originally Posted by moOnsteak
No it doesn't. Chrome Mox says non land, non artifact.Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Gilmore
Another possibility for a Recruit-able aggro one-of is Furnace Whelp. Although it is one less toughness then Dragon Whelp, it's fire breathing isn't limited, so it can end the game sooner.
I went to an 11-person tournament at Comic Book Crazy in Garland Texas on Saturday and placed 1st with Imperial Painter. Here's the list I took:
10 Mountain
4 City
4 tomb
4 Mox
4 SSG
4 Magus
4 Recruiter
4 Servant
3 Jaya
3 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Bolt
4 RE Blast
4 P Blast
4 Grindstone
SB:
3 Trinisphere
3 Blood Moon
3 Pyrokinesis
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Viashino Heretic
1 Vexing Shusher
1 Stuffy Doll
I had only played Legacy casually (but usually against competitive decks) since there is no organized Legacy in Houston. This weekend though I had a business trip to the Dallas area so I was finally able to play in a tournament...and thanks to Imperial Painter the result was good. The metagame was probably half casual decks. The decks I knew of were:
1 UBGR Goyf Control (competitive)
1 Welder/Naught/Painter Control (competitive)
1 Mono-red Aggro (seemed competitive since he got 2nd place)
2 White Weenie (both seemed fairly casual)
1 Affinity (I think this was a standard build - competitive)
1 Slivers (I didn't see this build)
1 Reanimator (I didn't see this build)
I don't know what the other 2 decks were, but I know 1 of them was casual.
Next time I'll try to take notes as things happen, but here's what I wrote down immediately after the tournament:
Match 1 / UBGR Goyf
Game 1 - I went second and saw a delta, so my first turn I played a Tomb, a Mox (imprinting something), and then a second Mox, looking at my opponent for permission. I actually did not intend to imprint anything on this one, but to bait something out if possible, so I could safely play a Magus 1st turn. I can't remember if it was a Brainstorm/Daze or a Stifle, but it worked. I got my Magus, and proceeded to get a Painter and some Blasts, which kept me in total control until I got a Grindstone on turn 6 or 7 I think.
SB: -3 Magma Jet, -1 Jaya, +3 Blood Moon, +1 Shusher (I made the mistake of not bringing in Trinisphere)
Game 2 - I can't remember the start of this one, but I know he was able to counter many of my early spells. After I have a Painter and a Recruiter out, he plays Deed (I'm thinking this was sideboarded, which I find is correct). He wipes the board clean, and plays a Goyf next turn. I'm finished soon after.
SB: -4 Grindstone, +3 Trinisphere, +1 Stuffy Doll
Game 3 - This game started with me playing a Magus and a Blood Moon both of which are countered. Then I play a Trinisphere, which I think I had to protect with a Blast. I Recruit a Shusher, play it, and draw another Recruiter and have a Blood Moon in hand. I Recruit w/ Shusher support for Stuffy Doll. During most of this time, the opponent is using Sensei's Top to shape his hand, but plays a Goyf, which is 5/6. I activate Shusher's ability, which gets Stifled, so I play Blood Moon to bait out the counter, which he has to do because every land he has is nonbasic. I have chumpblocked with both Recruiters now, leaving only my Shusher. But now I activate his ability successfully and play the Doll. Without STP's or Jitte, he has no answer for Doll, and I proceed to play a Servant and draw some Lightning Bolts, and win. Doll can be really good!
2-1
Match 2 / White Weenie
Game 1 - I go first, and I do have some burn, but a Soltari Priest with a SoFI is too difficult for me to deal with. I lose.
SB: -4 Magus, -1 Jaya, -4 Blasts, + 3 Trinisphere, +3 Pyrokinesis, +2 Viashino Heretic, +1 Doll (I'm not sure if I sideboard correctly here)
Game 2 - I combo on turn 3.
Game 3 - My first turn Trinisphere slows the Weenies after a Savannah Lion is already played, and my second turn Servant serves as a decent blocker early. I draw some Blasts and a Jaya, and try to find the right balance of removing threats and land, but Serra Avengers, Soltari Priests and some other guys are coming fast. I have Pyrokinesis in hand but there is a Burrenton Forge Tender out. I think I make a mistake here by Recruiting a Heretic as preemptive protection from equipment, when I could've fetched Doll. I had already Blasted the Flyers, and the only guy that was evasive was 1 Priest. I Magma Jet one of the Weenies and scry away 2 Mountains. I'm at 5 life and I topdeck a Grindstone. I have to use Tomb to play and use it, so I win with 3 life.
4-2
Match 3 / Mono-Red Aggro
Game 1 - I go first and play Mountain, Grindstone. He plays Mountain. I play Tomb, Servant and then have to Blast his Lightning Bolt. I can't remember what he plays, but I combo on turn 3.
SB: -4 Magus, -2 Blasts, +3 Trinisphere, +3 Pyrokinesis
Game 2 - He plays Mountain. I play Tomb, Servant, but he Bolts it. He plays Mogg Fanatic I think. I play Mountain, and another Servant. He plays a burn spell that deals 2 damage to Servant (I can't remember which spell), but I have two Blasts in hand, and I counter. Next turn I play Grindstone off of the Tomb, taking 3 damage total, but I keep the Mountain untapped to Blast-counter. I draw a mountain, play it, and combo on turn 4 with an extra mountain and Blast available but it isn't necessary.
6-2
Match 4 / Welder/Naught/Servant Control
I concede so he can get into top 4. We did not play our deck against each other here because we figured we might meet in the semifinals or finals. Since we don't, I wish we would have played so I could test the matchup.
Top 4: Me, UBGR Goyf, Welder/Naught/Servant, Mono-Red Aggro
Semifinals / UBGR Goyf again
Game 1 - I go first I think, and I play Magus, protected by SSG and Blast. I have no cards in hand after turn 1. That doesn't matter though because I topdeck a Servant, some Blasts, and then a Gindstone, and combo on turn 6 or 7 I think.
SB: -4 Grindstone, -3 Jet, -1 Jaya, +3 Trinisphere, +3 Blood Moon, +1 Shusher, +1 Doll
Game 2 - Even though I have 2 Cities, SSG and a Magus, I mulligan because I have no back up red mana, and only a Recruiter to play if the Magus were to be countered. I get a hand with Mox, Tomb, Recruiter, SSG and 2 Blasts. He plays a land. I have play Recruiter and hope it doesn't get countered. He Brainstorms, but the Recruiter gets through, and I find a Servant. He plays a Top, then I play the Servant. He plays Deed, then I Blast the Deed, and keep 1 Blast for countering. I don't remember the next several turns exactly, but I force a Trinisphere out with Blast. I know that I Recruited a Magus but the Magus was countered, and he gets a Goyf out at 4/5. He also Grips the Trinisphere. After chumpblocking the Goyf with both Recruiters, I draw Stuffy Doll, but I have to wait another turn before I get the mana to play it. I do and it is not countered. After that, I get another Trinisphere, stabilize and slow roll.
8-2
Finals / Mono-Red Aggro
Game 1 - I combo on turn 4 or 5 after controlling the board with burn and Blasts (Magma Jets help here).
SB: -4 Magus, -2 Blasts, +3 Trinisphere, +2 Pyrokinesis, +1 Doll
Game 2 - I have my first turn Servant Bolted, and I'm not topdecking much. He plays Boggart Ram Gang on turn 3 which starts to scare me. I get a Bolt and kill the Ram Gang. I play a Servant, and then Magma Jet one of his other guys, scrying and finding a Grindstone on turn 6 I think and being at 8 life. He beats me for 4 more the following turn, and then I have to Tomb to activate the Grindstone, so I win with 2 life. What a game!
10-2
In summary:
1. Thanks to Josh at Comic Book Crazy for managing a great store and hosting Legacy. The people at the tournament were especially cool.
2. Even though it wasn't the most competitive tournament in the world, it still made me more confident that Imperial Painter is good.
3. Stuffy Doll was incredible for me in this tournament. I put him in the SB to help against Deed, but he is just generally bad for Goyfs. Obviously he is great against control that doesn't use STP (and probably against certain Aggro that doesn't use Jitte). But with extra Blood Moon effects in the SB and the ability to Blast lands, I could even see him being used against control with STP, since you can deny access to the white mana.
4. I liked having 4 Lightning Bolts and 3 Magma Jets MD. It made me more comfortable in Game 1's against aggro.
5. From this tournament, I found a little too frequently that I did not want to discard anything to Pyrokinesis. I know that this was no normal metagame, but is this a concern anyone else has had? I know that I really wanted a Silent Arbiter against White Weenie, and I was thinking about going down to 2 Pyrokinesis in the SB and adding the Arbiter back in.
6. I'd like to try a Hearth Kami or something in the place of one of the Viashino Heretics, so that you can search for something that will destroy an artifact the turn it comes into play. Any thoughts on this?
Well, I'm sure I forgot some stuff, but that's enough for one post. I give credit to many people on this thread for helping improve this deck, and helping me to understand it better. This deck is damn fun to play.
I've been testing out two Sword of Fire and Ice in the deck and I really like it. It basically acts like a Lightning Greaves when Painter's Servant is in play. Your creature can't be targeted against their blue spells, you pump up rather smaller creatures, you can kill opposing creatures, and you draw cards.
I think it's the solution the deck has been looking for.
That doesn't work. Painter's Servant makes Sophie blue, so when state-based effects are checked after equipping it to a creature, it will become unattached because that creature has Protection from Blue.
You could splash for Blue Ward, however :cool:
Ahh right. I completely became oblivious to the fact it makes the Equipment blue, too.
At any rate, it's really strong here with creatures like Simian Spirit Guide and Imperial Recruiter who just become Clark Kents outside of their super-powers and I think it merits some discussion. Thoughts?
I'd rather run SOL&S, 'cause it'll get you EE or Deed'd away folks, gain you life (negligibly important) and make your Painter Swords-proof (And smother, Vindicate, Ghastly Demise and... Last Gasp-proof).Quote:
Originally Posted by A Legend
I ran this list and came in 3rd in local tourney yesterday
10 mtn
4 tomb
4 traitors
4 chrome
4 painter
4 recruiter
4 magmoon
4 bolt
4 spirit guide
8 blast
3 stone
3 trisphere
2 jaya
1 shusher
1 macabre
side
1 blessing
1 macabre
1 duplicant
1 stingscourger
1 stuffy doll
1 silent arbiter
1 heretic
1 fulminator mage
2 shatter spree
2 pyrokinesis
3 blood moon
first I will say, I love this deck, and will be completing my set of recruiters to play it full time. I had to drive all over town yesterday to borrow recruiters from two different ppl to complement the single one I own. the meta was basically all combo and fish, which I crushed. the only deck I lost to was in top 4, a GWB agro deck w volrath stronghold, e-witness, tombstalker, d-conf, doran, plows, etc. I didnt have nearly enough yard hate to deal w his recursion, I will definitely be playing 4xmacabre in future between main/side. I lost two games in the swiss due to manaflood, so conclude I need either fetchlands+divining top or make a black splash for d-conf + thoughtseize. also, I feel the moon effects are over rated. every deck was prepared for them, and as soon as they saw mtn, they got basics w every fetch. in no game was magmoon devastating, and probably only was substantially responsible for winning one game. Im definitely cutting the bloodmoons from board, and probably cutting magmoon main down to 1-2, just as recruiter target. painter+jaya is much more effective mana denial anyway. jaya was great, I actually used her big ability twice. first to kill a tombstalker, and then to just deal 6 damage to opponent for lethal. I had earlier considered, and am now convinced is correct, instead playing price of progress in place of moons. let them have their non-basics, and get raped by PoP. lightning bolt was clutch, killing many, many dark confidants, and just efficiently doming opponents to accelerate clock. I was also considering
spitebellow (cant be recruited, but kills tombstalker/anything)
wildfire emisary (better than dragon whelp/etc? cant be plowed, and still firebreathes pretty well off tomb/traitors)
greater gargadon (hes just pretty good, and synergizes w city traitors)
lava dart/flame jab (lightning bolt pretty much was just kill target dark confidant, and price of progress is more effective dome burn, so this would be better than bolt)
FYI, sounds like The Rock with Doran.Quote:
Originally Posted by vroman
Hmm, I was under the impression that painter made it possible. I'll have to confirm that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanguine Voyeur
Btw, has anyone considered Goblin Welder?
And how do you get the stuff you want to weld into your GY?Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Gilmore
your pieces can still be killed and countered. This would be an excellent backup plan, not to mention could have very good synergy with SB cards such as crypt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeggi
This is the direction I was thinking for a more controling build:
4 Thoughtseize
4 Red Elemental Blast
3 Pyroblast
4 Grindstone
4 Magma Jet
4 IR
4 Magus of the Moon
4 Painter
2 Fulminator Mage
1 Jaya?
2 Fledgling Dragon
4 Wasteland
4 Port
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Badlands
1 Swamp
3 Mountain
Destroy target land for 1 mana? Sign me up.
This is the creature that was mentioned before, just released:
http://www.mtgmintcard.com/photos/ma...Scarecrone.jpg
As a target for Imperial Recruiter, he should find his way into some builds as a one (or two) of over the much frailer Goblin Welder. I could see it as a four-of if you play around it correctly.
@Lonelybaritone: The thing I like best about SoFI is that it hits creatures after it's dealt damage to a player. If I Equip it to a Monkey or an Imperial Recruiter and it gets Swords to Plowshared, that's not really the end of the world as those creatures just bait the StP on themselves over Servant. Sword of Light and Shadow's life gain and ability to return a creature don't really stand out over the ludicrous damage and card draw SoFI provides (that the deck was sorely lacking).
I'm reworking my build after doing some team play-testing and will have it posted soon.
EDIT: I updated the original list. I decided to run one S.o.L.S as there are twenty creatures in the deck and I really feel these equipments give the deck the edge it needs against aggro-based decks that gave it so much trouble to begin with. Some people have talked about cutting a Grindstone, and I don't think that's a right call. In a deck that doesn't have a whole lot of card draw, you want to draw into it. You should play four or none. A great strategy is taking out the Grindstones games two and three and boarding into a more aggressive theme. It works for me.
Much frailer?
Is one point of toughness and Disenchantability really worth an extra six mana?
If you want a draw engine, I'd recommend Bottled Cloister. Also allows you to comfortably fit in Ensnaring Bridge, which would do little to hinder your own win conditions, but provide a comfortable life buffer.
Until they Krosan Grip it. :( I used to run the card in Stax and that was always the problem with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheInfamousBearAssassin
They destroy it, your hand is RFG upside-down, period. :cry:
Goblin Welder would be a backup to the main strategy. And would even allow the deck to go off on less mana. Activate Grinding Stone, Weld in Painter in response. It would also create a head ache for any artifact based deck and the mirror, where you can weld your opponents artifacts in and out at will.
Btw, Try Thorn over Trinisphere. It is amazing.
So if SoFI is already equipped to a creature, and then Servant is played naming blue, does SoFI still unattach?Quote:
That doesn't work. Painter's Servant makes Sophie blue, so when state-based effects are checked after equipping it to a creature, it will become unattached because that creature has Protection from Blue.
Krosan Grip and Engineered Exposives are kind of a relevant threat in the format right now. Being able to recur the most important part of the deck back directly into play with one card that you can fetch is generally a good thing. It fits the curve of the deck and at worst you draw a card. It will be a singleton in my build, no more.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheInfamousBearAssassin
If you play Ensnaring Bridge, you're going to potentially hinder your attack step, which is an important strategy of the deck. S.o.L.S also gains you life and returns creatures.
Somehow, I fail to see where "Krosan Grip is played, therefore Grippable recursion that costs a lot more mana= good" is an argument.
Somehow, I also think that your strategy of SoLS on a Recruiter is going to be a bigger worry to the opponent than the opponent's attack step will be to you, nine times out of ten. The point of Bottled Cloister is to break the symmetry of Bridge anyway.
Yes, as soon as SBEs are checked.Quote:
Originally Posted by DrewliusMaximus
Sword of Light and Shadow is a fine choice. I'm going to try out Scarecrone and see how it fares as a bullet. I've been trying to make the deck a little less dependent on Painter's Servant, and now with the inclusion of the Swords, you create imminent threats which your opponent must deal with at once.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheInfamousBearAssassin
And four mana shouldn't be considered "a lot" in a deck which plays fifteen to sixteen mana accelerators. Sword of Light and Shadow is there to compliment the other Swords, which are a bit more important here. Either way, equipping any of your creatures is a good thing.
Putting Bottled Cloister in the deck and Ensnaring Bridge is just atrocious. Why in God's name would you want to set aside your critical Blasts when you'd need them most? You're better off just playing Grafted Skullcap then. And in that scenario, your spells would become all sorceries, just as though you had Cloister. Either way, it's just not good.
Well, you could use your Scarecrone as a draw-engine, but then I'd say run 2 or 3, perhaps 4. So you can sac themselves and don't have to sac the servant.Quote:
Originally Posted by A Legend
Rather Sword of Fire and Ice, have you checked how much mana that "engine" you mention costs? It isn't really an engine to sac your artifacts to draw cards. It just slaughters your bullets and thins your deck.Quote:
Well, you could use your Scarecrone as a draw-engine, but then I'd say run 2 or 3, perhaps 4. So you can sac themselves and don't have to sac the servant.
Or were you meaning to have one in play and one in graveyard? So then, you return it, sac the tapped one, draw a card, recur it, then sac the other.... Each draw will cost you 5 mana, that's way too much.
You can of course play it then sac it, wow you cantripped for 4 colorless mana! :rolleyes:
Honestly, I can't really see Scarecrone fit in the deck. The ability to recur the Servant at the cost of 7 mana, and you would still have to wait a turn due to the tap ability... There must be better alternatives, like Welder or even Trash for Treasure. It's pretty irrelevant that it can be fetched with Recruiter, just fetch another Servant instead. Am I wrong in these statements?
Goblin Welder can also be fetched by Recruiter =P
And I agree with TheInfamousBearAssassin that Scarecrone doesn't seem superior to Welder in any way, for the reasons stated earlier (1cc, no mana cost to activate, immune to artifact hate) only issue is you need an artifact in your Graveyard for it to be useful, but that's true for Scarecrone as well.. You haven't said why it's better then Welder, A Legend.. I would like to hear your arguments.
SoFI doesn't stick after painter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Willoe
I only mentioned that, if you are thinking of incorporating Scarecrone, you could use it as an engine. Yes, high mana, but you're also running 4 Ancient Tomb and 4 City of Traitors, 3 Moxes and 4 SSG's. Granted, it's still much...but I don't like Welder since you need to sac one thing to recur the other; it seems like it only costs :r:, but it also costs :1: or :2: and an extra card on top of it, plus you don't really want to sac your servant.
Plus Scarecrone protects servant from, say, a StP.
One thing about Welder, powerful but not belong to this build because of some reasons :
- Lack of artifacts on the board (only Chrome Mox?? can be solved with additional Great Furnace)
- Lack of way to put an artifact into graveyard (no sac ability, just Jaya's discard cost or hope some of your artifact be countered / destroyed), Greater Gargadon will be a nice answer if you try to use Welder. .
SO if you are playing Goblin Welder, perhaps it would be a good plan to also play Gamble.
I was thinking that if you were to use Welder MD, you could add 2 or 3 Gambles to search for Grindstone. Like Moonsteak said, there's still a problem with Artifacts on the board to sac, but once you start going this route, I feel like the whole deck changes a little bit, so other cards could be replaced with artifacts (possibly even Scarecrones, since they would allow you to sac a Servant and get it back). I still play with 4 Mox, and I think you'd want to play with 4 if you use Welder.
I like the idea of Scarecrone as an addition to the existing build though. Not because it is a robust draw engine, but because it can do many things. If I'm in game 1 against a deck with ground-beaters, I've got a Servant in the graveyard, and at least 4 mana, I will want to Recruit a Scarecrone on many occasions so I can turn my Servant into a reusable chumb-blocker. If I have 5 mana in that situation, my Servant is a chump-blocker that can draw a card right after blocking, and then return EOT. This brings up the point that the draw engine Scarecrone creates, while mana-intensive, can be activated at the end of the opponent's turn. You can keep that mana available to do other things if needed in the meantime. And like Skeggi mentioned, you can protect your Servants from STP, or just sac them to draw a card when they are Gripped, or Smothered or Deeded, or whatever. Additionally, Scarecrone can reanimate destroyed/countered sideboard cards like Silent Arbiter and Stuffy Doll. I don't know that Scarecrone would be worth an addition, but should most definitely be tested right? I don't think you would need more than 2 total between the MD and SB.
Quick question for Vroman: Stingscourger and Duplicant are cool ideas. I really like Stingscourger, but would be afraid that Duplicant's cost could be prohibitive. Did these guys work out for you?
When you're talking about adding these artifacts to the deck, you're bogging down an already oiled machine by putting in cards that are just saying "win more". The deck's route to victory is through the attack step. You're talking about playing a 1/1 Goblin that in this deck is very situational (just like Scarecrone, which probably won't make it into my final build anyways). More often than not, you know where Painter's Servant is going to be? Not the graveyard. He'll be in the RFG pile from Swords. There's no other relevant artifacts to recur in this deck. All sorts of unnecessary things have to happen in this deck to place him in, and I'm not prepared to cut an already tight list for Bottled Cloisters. Both Scarecrone and Welder really don't belong here.
Again, the main issue the deck faces is beating green in general. That's it. It's the only color I've had trouble with in the past and the addition of the equipment and Dragon have kind of given the deck a shove in the right direction, which is to say, a better match against aggro.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DM
Great Furnace, boys.Quote:
Originally Posted by AL
Death and Taxes is big here, and the Imperial Painter guys are always annoyed when they get paired with it.Quote:
Again, the main issue the deck faces is beating green in general. That's it. It's the only color I've had trouble with in the past...
yes. its easy to get 6 mana, esp w magmoon out so city traitors dont sac. dup laso gets to keep goyfs power toughness, w the new */* rules. stingscourger buys two turns vs goyf. first you bounce goyf, and they spend the next turn recasting him, so you pay the echo and then chump the following turn. stinger also not bad vs ichorid, bc you just let it die to remove bridges, and put a narcomeba into their hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by DrewliusMaximus
I dont like the generc beater dragon plan. price of progress is way more efficient in most matches.
Im testing mog fanatic in place of lightning bolt, bc he is slightly relevent vs goyfs, wheras Ive never killed a goyf w bolt. and fanatic still kills dconf, and can frequently deal 3 damage to opponent for R, and also is recruitable.
I agree here. In theory, I like the idea of a single Scarecrone, but like you said, there are limited targets for it and it might be too conditional.Quote:
When you're talking about adding these artifacts to the deck, you're bogging down an already oiled machine
Are you talking about Green Stompy and Elves, or anything that uses Green mana acceleration, or what?Quote:
Again, the main issue the deck faces is beating green in general.
I think I agree with this too. I feel like there are Recruitable-creature-based solutions that would be harder for the opponent to deal with. This past weekend, Stuffy Doll epitomized this for me. I can see Duplicant, Stingscourger and Wildfire Emissary being other good examples. I know it has been mentioned before, but Wildfire Emissary sure seems strong as a pumpable Recruiter target...it comes protected from STP and you can always name White with Servant.Quote:
I dont like the generic beater dragon plan.