Doran! Nice finish. And I'd look into maybe cutting a Goyf for a MB Pridemage? Also, LOL at your Oops opponent trying to trick you into playing Liliana.
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Doran! Nice finish. And I'd look into maybe cutting a Goyf for a MB Pridemage? Also, LOL at your Oops opponent trying to trick you into playing Liliana.
Nice finish! Your opinion on Batterskull was fair, but at least you tried it all out :)Quote:
Originally Posted by T-101
-Matt
Another 40 duals, another top 8. I lost in top 8 however :frown:, so I did not get any blue duals. But I did manage to trade my 4 Savannah prizes for a Bayou, Scrubland and Taiga, which means I am only a Plateau and a Badlands away from finishing my set of 40 Revised dual lands.
1 Swamp
1 Forest
3 Bayou
4 Scrubland
1 Savannah
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Marsh Flats
3 Windswept Heath
4 Wasteland
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Sylvan Library
4 Liliana of the Veil
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Swords to Plowshares
4 Thougthseize
2 Hymn to Tourach
2 Lingering Souls
Sideboard:
1 Life from the Loam
1 Duress
1 Lingering Souls
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Golgari Charm
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Zealous Persecution
Round 1: Win 2-0 versus 12 Post
Round 2: Win 2-0 versus Miracles
Round 3: Lose 0-2 versus Miracles (played very poorly here :( )
Round 4: Win 2-0 versus burn
Round 5: Win 2-0 versus UG Infect
Round 6: Win 2-0 versus GWb Maverick
Round 7: ID
Top 8: Lose 0-2 versus Death and Taxes
I am not sure what the MVP is, but the SB needs some work since not many of those cards felt like they had a huge impact in the last few weeks.
Notable plays: I made two big misplays that costed me the match against Miracles. My board is Deathrite and plenty of mana and my hand is just a Tarmogoyf against my opponents board of Sensei's Divining Top, 4 lands, 14 life and 0 cards in hand . For a moment I thought my Deathrite would be enough to pressure him, but then I decided to take the risk and speed up the clock with Tarmogoyf. My opponent topped into Terminus and my topdecks were not enough to beat a Jace, TMS.
The next game, my opponent made 2 Angels with Entreat the Angels and attacked me down to 3; instead of attacking me to 7 and attacking my Liliana of the Veil. My board is Thalia, Liliana, and Sylvan Library. I dropped Liliana from 3 to 1 counters to remove an Angel and passed the turn with Abrupt Decay mana up and Thalia untapped. My opponent then flashed in Vendilion Clique at the end of my turn and I face palmed when I saw the Lingering Souls in my hand.
In the top 8 match against Death and Taxes, I kept Marsh Flats, Wasteland, 2x Dark Confidant, Tarmogoyf, Thoughtseize and Sensei's Divining Top. I fetched a basic Swamp, cast Thoughtseize to see: 2x Mother of Runes, Stoneforge Mystic, Serra Avenger, Rishadan Port, 2x Plains.
I decided to take Stoneforge Mystic and hope my Dark Confidant triggers could draw me one of the 2x Zealous Persecution or Golgari Charm. My opponent drew another Stoneforge Mystic for his turn 2, I never draw a wrath effect and I ended up having to do some combat tricks to kill one of the two Mother of Runes.
In hindsight, if I had just Thoughtseized one of the Mother of Runes, I might have actually won the game without ever casting a wrath effect instead of getting bogged down by a pair of Mother of Runes.
Honestly, that's a tough call. I think I would've made the same play as you did. Him ripping another stone forge isjust bad luck. As for the miracles situation, I think there's a good chance I would've done the same as you as well. Just simply casting souls there doesn't feel like a move that necessarily wins the game
I think the play vs. DNT is correct also. The main issue being your opener only had one colored mana and no removal (so at least one mom is sticking presumably) and you are up against a 4 x wasteland 4 x port deck. Neither of you have brainstorm so it's just going to be top decks and 2 x bob is better top decking.
Hi folks, I am considering the move from Modern into Legacy. Currently I have a modern GB Rock, without fetches. From years ago, I have a playset of bayou and a couple of savannah and 3 of each green onslaught fetchland. It seems that moving to legacy requires me to get DRS, Stoneforge and wasteland. How important is it to get the proper fetchlands, or can I work just fine with the 6 I have currently? I like knight of the reliquary a lot, but i have none, it's an easy fit, right? Should I try to source a scrubland or two?
I am having great sucess with 4 treetop villages in modern, why no one uses manlands in legacy BGx shells? Is it due to the format being much faster?
Also, why people use swords to plow instead of path to exile, if so many lists run no non-basics?
Unfortunately getting your tapped man land wasted is horrible. Path is a good card, but in a deck that generally doesn't care about their opponents life total, swords is superior. And good fetches are important for getting basics, but you could run with off color fetches if you don't fear wasteland. And some people like KOTR while others don't. It's really how your deck is built
It's also worth noting that Knight of the Reliquary is great at fetching Wastelands to harm your opponent's manabase. Running Path to Exile is doing the opposite in many cases; providing your opponent with the basic lands they need to fight through Wasteland.Quote:
Originally Posted by Megadeus
You can certainly function with the fetches you have, but you will likely notice some instances where you're unable to fetch the exact land you want. Eventually it's probably worth picking up some Verdant Catacombs, but in the mean time it's not detrimental and I'd focus on getting the other cards you'd like to work with first.
Treetop Village is quite the investment in legacy. As Deus mentioned, the loss of a turn to it coming into play tapped can hurt you. Further than that, however, is the mana investment required to use it. Unlike Modern where 4-6 lands can often be in play, Legacy tends to operate in the 2-4 range - or at least that's where the relevant business happens, meaning that activating a Treetop is going to cost you your entire turn's worth of mana. I think it's fine as a 1 or 2 of, but I definitely wouldn't want to be running a full four in some of the current Rock iterations (with Hymn to Tourach for example) . I'm sure there's a list you could make where it would be welcomed.
Since junk is a midrange deck rather than an aggro deck, path to exile is a liability because the decks that do have basic lands will be put ahead in terms of resources. In a deck like zoo that could erk out quick damage it didn't matter as much, but in this deck you really want to avoid ramping your opponent and progressing their midgame. Now, if your particular deck had a leonin arbiter or aven mindcensor theme I could see running it, but not in typical junk lists.Quote:
Originally Posted by G_g
Wasteland is the main reason manlands don't see play, but it is also pretty bad tempo. Tempo is not as important to a deck like deathblade which has creeping tarpit, but they have a stronger late game than we do. We need every resource possible in the early portion of the game since the fundamental turn is much quicker.
Went 7-2 at SCG Portland, just missing top 16 on breakers to make 19th place. Report to follow about how I crushed the last 7 rounds with the fist of an angry god.
-Matt
I played in an 8 man at the LGS yesterday, same list that you'll find at the top of the page. Went 3/0, without losing a game, though the level of competition was much lower.
Round 1 was vs. Merfolk, and my opponent was playing his first Legacy match. The deck full of removal, awesome creatures, and zero islands tends to do well vs fish. As history has taught me, resolved Stoneforge is usually GG vs Merfolk, even when it's not Batterskull. In game 2, he did go Turn 3 TNN, Turn 4, TNN, and Turn 5 TNN... but I had Turn 3 Edict, Turn 4 Zealous, Turn 5 Edict.
Round 2 vs. Modern DnT, but on-the-spot converted to Legacy. He was the 7th or 8th man, and so he swapped in Wasteland, Port, Plow, and Jitte, but the list was not optimal. Doran is a cool guy, and doesn't affraid of Thalia and Flickerwisp.
Round 3 vs. Burn, was my opponent's first time playing in a Legacy tournament. He had beaten Dredge and 'Mono-White Stoneforge + random equipment + guys from Zendikar and Mirrodin who care about equipment.' Game 1 was close, but Doran made Goyf strong enough for exactsies the turn before I died. Game 2 he was stuck on 1 land and didn't remove Stoneforge after I dug up Jitte. It took several turns, because I wanted to play it safe, but eventually Doran showed up and ate him. He asked if he made any misplays, and because I had Inquisitioned him after untapping with Stoneforge, I knew he could have killed the Stoneforge if he wanted to. We talked about how stopping Jitte/any life gain is very important. I realize there's plenty of play in Burn when deciding when to shoot early guys, and when to start going straight for the face, but I'm certain that you need to stop Jitte if you can. 1 hit is hard to beat, 2 hits is extremely hard to beat.
-----
Doran continues to be awesome, which makes me happy, because I like Doran. Maybe I'll pursue some Full Arts instead of completing the set of Mercaidan Foil Brainstorms. I'll probably swap the 4th Goyf for a 4th Stoneforge. Goyf is frequently better game 1, but graveyard hate can be backbreaking. Also, this is twice in a row that I've played without yard hate of my own, and I probably should have some Crypts/Spellbombs in the board somewhere... it's just so hard to cut sweet spells though.
For what it's worth, some BUG decks have run a singleton Creeping Tar Pit before, so a one-of manland might not be a huge liability especially with Knight to tutor for it in the right matchups. Unfortunately none of the G/B/W manlands are as good as Tar pit or Colonnade.
I agree, none of our man-lands are as good as Tar Pit. It's a shame we haven't gotten an enemy cycle of WWK manlands. However, if you're playing Knight, you can consider playing a Nantuko Monastery. I have had some success (and a lot of fun) Knighting out a Monastery. A 5th colorless land (or 4th if you shave a Wasteland) can be rough, but it comes in untapped for the occasional First-striking surprise block, or EOT boost your clock by 5 points.Quote:
Originally Posted by HammerAndSickled
So now for my report:
3 Bayou
2 Scrubland
2 Savannah
1 Underground Sea
1 Windswept Heath
2 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Wasteland
2 Swamp
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Tarmogoyf
3 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
1 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Thoughtseize
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Swords to Plowshares
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Sylvan Library
2 Lingering Souls
SB: 3 Meddling Mage
SB: 3 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 1 Scavenging Ooze
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution
SB: 2 Krosan Grip
SB: 2 Engineered Explosives
I cut Doran to try Souls again since I expected more Miracles at this tournament, and Doran is terrible against Miracles.
Round 1: Nate with Jund
I lose the die roll and start with a good hand, but only with Fetch and Wasteland, but it has double Dark Confidant and Stoneforge. Cool. We attrition back and forth and I finally stick a Confidant. I get Wastelanded twice and land Dryad Arbor, which gets nuked. I flip with Confidant 4 times and hit no lands, while he gets his own Confidant and draws gas.
-3 Thoughtseize, -2 IoK, -1 random
+1 Scavening Ooze, +3 Meddling Mage, +2 Engineered Explosives
I destroy him game two with a nice curve of Deathrite into Liliana into Meddling Mage + SFM.
Game 3 is really close and very back and forth. I hold my Wastelands for Groves since he has Punishing Fires going. It gets awkward when I land Sylvan and literally hit no removal. I have Goyf + SFM + Dryad Arbor to his Goyf, but he topdecks Umezawa's Jitte and I can't remove it. If I had played Souls a turn sooner, I'd have won and just raced him.
0-1
Round 2: Derek with Tax Rack Control
While shuffling, I catch a glimpse of a few basic Plains, so I put him on DnT. Awesome. He starts out turn 1 with Plains, Land Tax, and Zuran Orb. Fuck. I don't draw removal soon enough for Land Tax, and he gets Scroll Rack going. He drops Humility, then plays Wrath of God, and I draw 6 lands in a row. Awesome.
-3 STP, -3 Goyf (since I suspect Rest in Peace), -3 Liliana
+3 Gaddock Teeg, +2 EE, +2 Krosan Grip, +2 Pithing Needle
I really want to be the aggressor here and I am. I fetch basics since I suspect he might be playing Blood Moon, and it turns out $300 basic lands are better than Blood Moon. I destroy him with SFM, Souls and multiple Decays.
Game 3 is slow going, and he removes my Dark Confidant and SFM with STP. I draw Gadock Teeg, and drop it to stop Humility. But, I draw EE next turn and then can't use it to kill his Tax or Rack. Awesome....so I sit there building up. He finally STP's my Teeg and I drop EE on 3 against Solitary Confinement, but he scrolls into Oblivion Ring. I never hit Needle, Grip, another EE, or Decay for the rest of the game, which takes him 20 minutes of Scrolling and Taxing. Eventually he assembles Helm + RIP. Turns out he scrubbed out, which I obviously expect with a deck this bad. /Badbeats.
0-2
Round 3: David with UR Delver
David seems like the 30-something Dad type who escapes his small children at home by playing Magic when it comes to town...and he is! David's a nice guy, but he's a super rules lawyer type and it constantly making sure I'm not drawing extra cards for some reason. Okay buddy, cool story.
I see he's on UR by the turn 1 volcanic into Goblin Guide, which nets me more lands. Excellent. I fetch basics, then STP when I can after drawing another lands. I get the easy removal out of his hand and get SFM into Jitte. He kills my SFM, but I drop Goyf as a wall. He Prices me, but doesn't do anything. I play Deathrite to prevent Snapcaster shenanigans. He tries to Snapcaster Price of Progress, but I use DRS and he doesn't understand the interaction. He incorrectly states that he can flashback first. I tell him if he's unsure to call a judge, but he doesn't and he listens to me. I then crush the living shit out of him with Jitte while holding up Wasteland on my own lands.
-3 Thoughtseize, -3 Liliana of the Veil, -1 Decay, -2 Confidant
+3 Meddling Mage, +3 Gaddock Teeg, +1 Ooze, +2 Zealous Persecution (I saw Young Pyro game 1)
I fall a bit behind in this game and fetch too deep into non-basics, and get punished by Triple Price of Progress. Meh.
Game 3 I use Meddling Mage to name Price of Progress, and Gaddock Teeg blows out Fireblasts late in the game (so sick). He gets double Goblin Guide online with a Grim Lavamancer up to my Bayou, Scrubland, and Verdant Catacombs at the start, though. He swings in, I fetch for Dryad Arbor and ZP to pump. I as if it resolves, and he says yes. I move to blocks, and he tries to Lavamancer my Arbor. I give him the solid "no-sir" since the Lavamancer was dead and he had no responses. I block one and don't have to trade while still drawing two lands. It goes further downhill for him when I drop the Mage and Teeg followed by Jitte. I Jitte, he quit-te.
1-2
Round 4: Natty with TES
Natty's a younger kid, likely about 14, playing TES. He goes off turn 2 for tons of Goblins after I thoughtseize away his Ad Nauseum, which is frustrating.
-3 STP, -4 Decay, -1 SFM, -1 SolaS
+2 ZP, +3 Meddling Mage, +3 Teeg, +1 Ooze'
I crush him with Turn 1 Thoughtseize, Turn 2 Teeg, Turn 3 Meddling Mage.
Game 3 is pretty insane. I run the Turn 1 Deathrite, Turn 2 SFM, but he goes off since I don't have anything else for 12 goblins. I'm behind but Jitte should help put me ahead. I drop a Teeg and A Jitte and we both do some math. Even with Jitte, I still lose the life race. He follows up with a Burning Wish for Grapeshot for that critical upcoming turn. I peel a Zealous Persecution. Holy fuck. I nuke his team and attack with jitte and he scoops.
2-2
Round 4: Wyatt with Merfolk Standstill
Wyatt's on old school Merfolk after I catch a glimpse of Vial and Standstill while Shuffling. He chains triple Standstill in game 1 and I just can't keep up.
-3 Thoughtseize, -2 Inquisition, -1 Dark Confidant, -1 SoLaS
+2 Engineered Explosives, +1 Ooze, +2 ZP, +2 Needle
I get ahead when he casts double Vial and I have Needle on Vial. Ouch. His mana is off and he's off to a rough start. I drop Goyf with 2 mana up, and he drops Tidebender Mage and follows up with Standstill. I have the Decay then proceed to beat under his Standstill with a 5/6 Goyf. He cracks Standstill in my favour, and I draw serious juice and he can't keep up.
In game 3 I get Needle on Vial, and we go back and forth. I have Liliana, Decay, STP, etc. I get to EE away a TNN and a Reejerey as well. But, the turning point is when he has Silvergill adept in play, and a Vial on 3 and i know he has a TNN from the reveal. i look/act really depressed about it and let him Vial in TNN (I guess instead of a Lord) since it's better pressure with the board. I slump my head into my hands and say wearily, "Vial resolves, nothing I can do....". He thinks and drops TNN off the Vial and moves to untap. I say, "Wait, ZP end of turn," and gives me the dirtiest look at the two for one. He drops Reejerey next turn but I have Goyf with SOFI in my hand and he dies :P
3-2
Round 6: Adam Ruprecht with Miracle Thopters
Adam's an excellent Miracles player, and we've played many times before, be he knows this isn't amazing for him. He wins Game 1 after REALLY going back and forth, but he lands his third Foundry and is able to pull back from two life.
-3 Thoughtseize, -2 IoK, -3 STP, -1 SFM, -1 Liliana
+3 Gaddock Teeg, +2 EE, +2 Needle, +2 Grip, +1 Ooze
Realistically, I could bring in all 15 cards, but I just dont have the space. i crush Adam in this game with double Grip, Needle, Teeg, and Sylvan. He has triple STP, but it ends up not mattering.
In game 3, I get a very good hand and were off to the races. I land Needle on Top and I get to Grip a Thoper Foundry. He tries to lock me out with Blood Moon via E. tutor, but I have a Grip in hand. Teeg seals him off Jace and Terminus, but he gets Foundry up. I Sylvan super deep and hit a Needle and a SOFI. SOFI goes past the4 or so tokens he made. I triple waste him down to Plains, Plains, Island and he cant come back. Always good playing with Adam.
4-2
Round 7: Brett with UWr Miracles
A listener of the podcast, Brett knows what Im on. he mulls to 6, but I have a Thoughtseize to take his top after which he flounders. I jam SFM into Liliana into Sylvan and Equip. He doesnt come back.
-1 Liliana of the Veil, -3 STP, -cančt remember
+3 Teeg, +3 Mage, +2 Needle, +1 Grip, +2 EE
We get going but I get behind on lands after fetching into Sea + Scrub for Mage, which gets Terminused away, and I have so many green cards in my hand like Teeg and Sylvan. I get so far behind after which he Blood Moons, then Entreats.
Game 3 I get an Arbor suited up with SoLaS and SOFI and make quick work. He Entreats for 4 or 5, but i swing past. I get Terminused, and then he drops Blood Moon, but he has no basic white sources (only Top online with a basic Island and Mountain). I fetch into Forest to go along with my plains and cast sandbagged DRS. i cast Meddling mage on Snapcaster, since thats his only ambush viper to do anything. I think the Swords+ Dryad may have been game one, but eventually I drew Equipment here and he died.
5-2
Round 8: Chase with Reanimator
Game 1 I win due to his mull to 5 and my excellent start with DRS. Not much he can do here.
-4 Decay, -1 SFM, -1 Jitte
+3 Meddling Mage, +2 Pithing Needle, +1 Ooze
i get SUPER close to killing him, but I get Elesh Norned, then Jin-gitaxised then Tidespouted. He wins at 2 life.
In Game 3 its quite close, but I grind him out with 2 Deathrites, and eventually, a third. I keep the pressure on with discard as well and he cant animate anything.
6-2
Round 9: Justin with Burn
I see mountains while he shuffles, so I know hes on Burn. Game 1 I double discard his instant speed removal and use SFM for jitte, and he spends his turn removing SFM. I land Goyf and Equip Jitte, and he cant kill me fast enough.
-3 Dark Confidant, -3 Liliana of the Veil, -1 Thoughtseize
+3 Meddling Mage, +3 Gaddock Teeg, +1 Scavenging Ooze
I have the natural SoLaS in my opener, and I hit Inquisition for his Bridge. He later casts a Riftbolt on suspend, and I slide a Mage under that and Searing Blood while hes tapped out. Double Mage with SoLaS goes all the way.
7-2
Overall, my terrible breakers drop me out of the Top 16 to 19th, which Im still decently happy about. The list felt solid. Souls was great, but in a heavier Delver meta Doran would have been better. Grip and Needle were great cards all day, and Meddling Mage did some real work.
-Matt
Nice report!Quote:
Originally Posted by sdematt
Interesting how on that last bit you say that doran would have been better in a delver meta though. In my experience with lingering souls, I have found it to be very solid in the delver matchup. Doran has been great against other midrange and mid control decks (esperblade/deathblade), at least from my own testing. Definitely lingering souls in the miracle meta though.
The more towards miracles the meta goes, maybe the inclusion of a single sylvan safekeeper in GSZ lists would be good. Many of the current miracle players have no rememberance of the Maverick days, and scoff at little Olle Rade until they realize he hard locks them with Teeg.
The Sylvan/Teeg lock is pretty gnarly against Miracles.Quote:
Originally Posted by ironclad8690
With Meddling Mage to name STP (or whatever) and SoLaS, it's essentially the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by T-101
If I was still on my old 3x GSZ list, Olle would be a definite inclusion. I think I have my bases covered, however, with SoLaS, Meddling Mage, and Teeg. Accompanied with Krosan Grip, Pithing Needle, and Engineered Explosives, this matchup is a fucking nightmare for Miracles.
-Matt
@ sdmatt
i have seen in your report that you are now favoring EE instead of deed.
i would have loved to hear your reasoning on this, as i was thinking of the same change,... well actually a 1/1 split beween EE and Deed (deed is still an awesome catch all)
awesome report btw. and yes doran is really good in a delver-infested meta (the only deck not heavily effected is RUG, which runs out of gas quickly if they do not get enough damage through, and even here doran helps by making delver a 10 turn clock instead of a 7 turn clock)
another thing i would have liked to know is how you felt about running 3 equips main (jitte, SoFaI, and SoLaS)
how usefull is it to have access to both swords in game 1?
i am asking because i have 1 to 2 flex slots in my maindeck (1 quasali pridemage -> could go to sideboard, and possibly 1 of my 2 GSZ)
the things that could take these flex slot are the following: 4th confidant, 3rd SFM, 3rd Equip(SoLaS), 4th Swords to Plowshares
thx, and have a nice day guys
I like having SoLaS maindeck against decks like Miracles, Deathblade, and Patriot. It's likely the least fetched equipment game 1, but I still say I like having it in the deck. It's a definite out to a Batterskull, but that's just me. In game 2, it does come out where totally unnecessary. Ex. Elves, Storm, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by AggroSteve
I like EE better for a few reasons at the moment.
1) I use it against Delver because it costs 0 mana to cast to kill a flipped Delver, which can be important in the Tempo race. Deed can get easily spell Pierced.
2) I bring it in against Empty the Warrens decks for the same reason. I can cast on turn 1 and blow it on Turn 2.
3) It's worse against Miracles generally, but with my build using the 1 Sea, I can EE more easily on 4, giving me a few more outs to Jace.
4) It kills more selectively. I hated wiping out my own Deathrites and/or Lingering Souls just to kill a couple of Goyfs on their end of the board. I think EE, at least in the matchups that I'm facing, provides a bit more advantage for me in that I don't have to kill as much of my own stuff. Deed is the better card at removing a chunk of creatures and artifacts/enchantments from the board, but I need a board presence as well.
-Matt
I really like the third equipment. In both of my last 2 tournaments, I specifically searched up each different equipment. The suite gives you a good option for many match ups/game states. If I HAD to cut one, it would be Light and Shadow, but I don't currently want to cut it.Quote:
Originally Posted by AggroSteve
@matt - The thing I really like about Sylvan/Teeg is that it shuts down ALL their answers simultaneously, provided you have land that you are willing to part with for Plow. Insurance against Terminus, AND Jace, AND Plow (and even Supreme Verdict if they have any of those) is hard to match.
The thing that makes me nervous about Miracles is that even when you stabilize after the opening salvo, they have a handful of cards that will save them, and they have great card selection. For instance, you open with Deathrite, they Plow then Counterbalance. You Decay, then drop 1 or 2 of Bob/Goyf/Stoneforge/Doran, they Terminus. You find another piece of action, but you are at the mercy of so many answers, + 4 BS and Top to find them. Sylvan/Teeg doesn't let them find any currently popular cards to save them.