[Deck] Painter-Stone

So due to some unforeseen stuff, I didn't make it out to the GP site. I did, however, play in the legacy challenge on MTGO. I went 4-3 and finished 24th (out of 75ish), losing to Shardless (mul to 4 game 3), UR Delver with maindeck Price of Progress (a pretty hard matchup, I think), and a BUG Delver player who slammed t2 Null Rod games two and three. I beat Miracles, Belcher, Storm and BR Reanimator. I could have played tighter against the Shartless player in G2 to win, I think. UR Delver is really hard because of Price and Lightning Bolt and Chain Lightning. Padeem would probably help with the bolts, but PoP is still a rough card. Null Rod is beatable, but fuuuuuuck is it hard.

Best part of the tournament was beating BR Reanimator after he t1 Reanimated a Chancellor of the Annex. A four turn clock is to slow.

Saheeli was awesome. There was not a single time where I wished that she was Dack instead, and I ultimated her twice to win the game.

My List:

4x Scalding Tarn
3x Seat of the Synod
3x Ancient Tomb
2x Volcanic Island
2x Great Furnace
1x Vault of Whispers
1x Underground Sea
1x Inventor's Fair
1x Island
1x Mountain

4x Painter's Servant
4x Goblin Welder
2x Baleful Strix
1x Hope of Ghirapur

4x Brainstorm
4x Force of Will
3x Pyroblast

4x Grindstone
3x Sensei's Divining Top
3x Mox Opal
2x Smuggler's Copter
1x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Ensnaring Bridge

3x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2x Saheeli Rai

Sideboard:
3x Blood Moon
1x Ghirapur Aether Grid

2x Flusterstorm
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Red Elemental Blast
1x Ancient Grudge

1x Phyrexian Revoker
1x Spellskite

1x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Ensnaring Bridge

1x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1x Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast


I wanna play with the sideboard some more, I'm only medium happy with it. There is A LOT less Eldrazi in general and on MTGO especially, which means the Blood Moons are only really good against lands. There's also an uptick of Sneak and Show which makes me want to have more Tormod's Crypt effects. Gotta tweak and see where I end up.

Also, I decided I should just get all the Masterpieces XD

Blood Moon completely shuts down delver (besides bolts) and can really hurt miracles, if they are popular in your meta.

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Originally Posted by chaosjace

Blood Moon completely shuts down delver (besides bolts) and can really hurt miracles, if they are popular in your meta.

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Blood Moon completely shuts down Canadian. It's much less effective against the DRS / Abrupt Decay delver variants. The Miracles MU is already pretty good, and many of them are built for Back to Basics or Bloodmoon themselves atm. I'm not saying you don't get any points, but it seems marginal.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hisa

Blood Moon completely shuts down Canadian. It's much less effective against the DRS / Abrupt Decay delver variants. The Miracles MU is already pretty good, and many of them are built for Back to Basics or Bloodmoon themselves atm. I'm not saying you don't get any points, but it seems marginal.

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I don't see how? DRS cannot be cast, or activated if all the lands are mountains. I personally have not seen any delver variants with basics. and abrupt decay wont save them if you are activating in response for the win. And from the miracles side, not all of them play bloodmoon, and the ones that do, haven't considered their basic land to non basic ratio. the very, VERY few that are set up for back to basics, are the only ones you have to worry about MAYBE. Miracles plays 9 fetches minimum, that is a good chunk of their mana base. If your meta is flooded with the rare miracles variants that run B2B, then carry on with these ideals.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chaosjace

Blood Moon completely shuts down delver (besides bolts) and can really hurt miracles, if they are popular in your meta.

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I put Moon into all bug match up or any 3color deck, but i understand moon is better in wR or mono red or UR version. What do you propose ? Witch card can go in side if we cut moon?

Maybe trinket mage, tornod, wurmcoil, sulfure elemental?

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Originally Posted by Cyanhur

Good luck! Can you tell us a report after ?

I am preparing a tournament for next week, and i think i will run too Saheeli to cut 2 dack.

But is Whir in one off is a good choice to cut your jace? Waz?

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I don't like Whir's UUU cost.

For those that have been cutting Daretti, how have you found it? It feels like having more planeswalkers makes the deck more resilient in the grindy matchup, as well as providing another avenue of removal/dealing with unexpected artifacts.

Hisa, what has your experience been like with Hope of Ghirapur?

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Originally Posted by Hisa

I wanna play with the sideboard some more, I'm only medium happy with it.

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Stealing some potential ideas from Monored Stompy:
Fiery Confluence (artifact & weenie hate)
Sudden Demise / Rolling Earthquake
Trinisphere / Thorn of Amethyst (combo)
more Ensnaring Bridges
Sudden Shock (Monastery Mentor)
Quicksmith Rebel (similar to Ghirapur Aether Grid)
Sin Prodder (similar to Chandra, synergy with Welder)

Stealing some potential ideas from BUG and UBR midrange:
Lost Legacy
Engineered Explosives
Kolaghan's Command

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Originally Posted by waz

I don't like Whir's UUU cost.

For those that have been cutting Daretti, how have you found it? It feels like having more planeswalkers makes the deck more resilient in the grindy matchup, as well as providing another avenue of removal/dealing with unexpected artifacts.

Hisa, what has your experience been like with Hope of Ghirapur?

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Daretti si fine vs dnt, but for the others match up i am not convinced.

I have a tornament this week-end i think i will Try this :


1 Kolaghan
1 Chandra
2 fluster
2 moon
1 bridge
1 Reb
1 extraction
1 needle
1 spellskite
1 cage
1 missdirection
1 sudden demise
1 tornod

I keep the same main list i cut 2 intuition for 2 saheeli i keep transmut and explosive arti

Quote:

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Originally Posted by waz

I don't like Whir's UUU cost.

For those that have been cutting Daretti, how have you found it? It feels like having more planeswalkers makes the deck more resilient in the grindy matchup, as well as providing another avenue of removal/dealing with unexpected artifacts.

Hisa, what has your experience been like with Hope of Ghirapur?

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I've mostly been jamming on MTGO where I play against mono Storm and SnS. Its great in those matches, as it often buys you the turn you need to go off as they are low on interaction for your turn. The HoG / Welder lock in those matches is super super good. It has utility for protection in the fair matches (protecting from swords and daze and abrupt decay), but I don't usually find myself digging for that. I would say it has as much or more utility than the Pithing Needle I had in that slot beforehand, and it crews the Copter.

In other news, Saheeli continues to be incredible. I've never looked Dack. ;)

Dack has been fine, but with the increase in Leovolds I cut the JVP for Saheeli and have been completely happy with that switch.

I switched up the sideboard a bit. I most recently ran:

2 Blood Moon
1 Ghirapur Aether Grid
1 Kozilek's Return
2 Flusterstorm
1 Pithing Needle
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Kolaghan's Command
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Spellskite
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1 Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast

I'm not sure how I feel about cutting the third moon, and while I can see K-Command & Daretti serving similar purposes, I do like that Daretti is an on-board threat. K-Command was outstanding.

I see most people cutting intuition and transmute artifact. What's the reasoning for this? In the past those are really the two cards that made URx a real contender over R/Rw for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by Ish

I see most people cutting intuition and transmute artifact. What's the reasoning for this? In the past those are really the two cards that made URx a real contender over R/Rw for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Those cards are clunky. Thinking about this as a pure combo deck is wrong. Imperial Painter or Strawberry Shortcake are always going to be better at the combo aspects of the deck. UR and URb Painted Stone are midrange / control decks with a combo finish filling a similar niche to what Twin filled in modern. The first card I slide out in every match I can get away with it is Force of Will, because I'm not really interested in protecting the combo. I think this deck wins almost every game that it can drag to the midgame.

To your question, Ish, Intuition and Transmute Artifact are sluggish and help set up the combo. They don't win fair grindy games.


All of that being said, with the downtick in Eldrazi I want to trim or cut my Bloodmoons. Is Mindslaver too greedy?

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Originally Posted by Hisa

Those cards are clunky. Thinking about this as a pure combo deck is wrong. Imperial Painter or Strawberry Shortcake are always going to be better at the combo aspects of the deck. UR and URb Painted Stone are midrange / control decks with a combo finish filling a similar niche to what Twin filled in modern. The first card I slide out in every match I can get away with it is Force of Will, because I'm not really interested in protecting the combo. I think this deck wins almost every game that it can drag to the midgame.

To your question, Ish, Intuition and Transmute Artifact are sluggish and help set up the combo. They don't win fair grindy games.


All of that being said, with the downtick in Eldrazi I want to trim or cut my Bloodmoons. Is Mindslaver too greedy?

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I'm really confused by this comment. This version of the deck is also called All in Painter... That's because it can combo off MUCH faster than the R and R/w variants, because you have access to lion's eye diamond. My experience is that it's very much a combo deck that sides into a more midrange, control deck (to fend off hate) post-board.

I also don't understand why people on here are cutting Intuition and Transmute Artifact. What's the point of running Goblin Welder? Just as protection and redundancy? Has no one here EoT Intuition with a welder out and untapped and grinded the opponent out? How on earth is Intuition a slow card??? Maybe against a Thalia deck, sure. Perhaps you cut it against black decks that will bring in surgical. But maindeck, it's a blowout.

I was hoping to find some reactions on the thread to the Top ban. I've adjusted my main deck, replacing my welder-top engine with welder-strix. I've been running ponders and have found the deck to still be quite resilient. I haven't tested out Saheeli Rai, as she seems incredibly slow and do nothing, but I suppose could be good with Strix. Scrying is great, but dealing one to the opponent is borderline useless. What matchups does she shine in?

Also Daretti (BR version) is an all star. He comes in against every creature deck and he does WORK. My record is stellar when resolving a Daretti, and he turns the DnT matchup to be quite favorable.

Has anyone written a primer on their version of the deck? I have my own but would be curious as to what others are running and why.

Thanks and good luck in the brave new world of legacy!

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Originally Posted by inkwelder

I'm really confused by this comment. This version of the deck is also called All in Painter... That's because it can combo off MUCH faster than the R and R/w variants, because you have access to lion's eye diamond. My experience is that it's very much a combo deck that sides into a more midrange, control deck (to fend off hate) post-board.

I also don't understand why people on here are cutting Intuition and Transmute Artifact. What's the point of running Goblin Welder? Just as protection and redundancy? Has no one here EoT Intuition with a welder out and untapped and grinded the opponent out? How on earth is Intuition a slow card??? Maybe against a Thalia deck, sure. Perhaps you cut it against black decks that will bring in surgical. But maindeck, it's a blowout.

I was hoping to find some reactions on the thread to the Top ban. I've adjusted my main deck, replacing my welder-top engine with welder-strix. I've been running ponders and have found the deck to still be quite resilient. I haven't tested out Saheeli Rai, as she seems incredibly slow and do nothing, but I suppose could be good with Strix. Scrying is great, but dealing one to the opponent is borderline useless. What matchups does she shine in?

Also Daretti (BR version) is an all star. He comes in against every creature deck and he does WORK. My record is stellar when resolving a Daretti, and he turns the DnT matchup to be quite favorable.

Has anyone written a primer on their version of the deck? I have my own but would be curious as to what others are running and why.

Thanks and good luck in the brave new world of legacy!

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can you share your list,please?

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Originally Posted by polski

can you share your list,please?

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Not sure on proper formatting for deck pasting so here's a link in case with a mostly updated primer included:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/agents-servants-1/

Let me know if you have any comments/questions or suggestions.

Land (19)
2x Ancient Tomb
3x Bloodstained Mire
1x City of Traitors
1x Great Furnace
1x Island
1x Mountain
3x Polluted Delta
3x Seat of the Synod
1x Swamp
1x Underground Sea
2x Volcanic Island

Sorcery (4)
3x Ponder
1x Transmute Artifact

Artifact (12)
1x Chrome Mox
4x Grindstone
3x Lion's Eye Diamond
3x Mox Opal
1x Nihil Spellbomb

Creature (11)
2x Baleful Strix
4x Goblin Welder
4x Painter's Servant
1x Trinket Mage

Instant (12)
4x Brainstorm
4x Force of Will
4x Intuition

Planeswalker (2)
2x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

Sideboard (15)
2x Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1x Engineered Explosives
1x Ensnaring Bridge
2x Ghirapur AEther Grid
1x Pithing Needle
3x Pyroblast
2x Spellskite
1x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2x Thoughtseize

Cheers!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by inkwelder

Not sure on proper formatting for deck pasting so here's a link in case with a mostly updated primer included:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/agents-servants-1/

Let me know if you have any comments/questions or suggestions.

Land (19)
2x Ancient Tomb
3x Bloodstained Mire
1x City of Traitors
1x Great Furnace
1x Island
1x Mountain
3x Polluted Delta
3x Seat of the Synod
1x Swamp
1x Underground Sea
2x Volcanic Island

Sorcery (4)
3x Ponder
1x Transmute Artifact

Artifact (12)
1x Chrome Mox
4x Grindstone
3x Lion's Eye Diamond
3x Mox Opal
1x Nihil Spellbomb

Creature (11)
2x Baleful Strix
4x Goblin Welder
4x Painter's Servant
1x Trinket Mage

Instant (12)
4x Brainstorm
4x Force of Will
4x Intuition

Planeswalker (2)
2x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas

Sideboard (15)
2x Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast
1x Engineered Explosives
1x Ensnaring Bridge
2x Ghirapur AEther Grid
1x Pithing Needle
3x Pyroblast
2x Spellskite
1x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2x Thoughtseize

Cheers!

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I am in love with goblin welder.... is there a way to play this without the lions eyes diamonds, and if so how would you change things up? you also mentioned in your tappedout post that you could run this deck with Dack Fayden, Ensnaring Bridge, and Pyroblast main, if you where going to do that, what would you be taking out?

I haven't played this deck in a very long time but what is the reason for not playing 4 Ponder? It seems like you're basically like Show and Tell decks where you are trying to assemble A + B, isn't ponder better especially post top ban? Also I remember that this deck used to play Grim Monolith, what is the reason that card fell out of favor? It seems pretty good when your postboard plan is to play turbo wurmcoil engines against non white playing fair decks.

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Originally Posted by CptHaddock

I haven't played this deck in a very long time but what is the reason for not playing 4 Ponder? It seems like you're basically like Show and Tell decks where you are trying to assemble A + B, isn't ponder better especially post top ban? Also I remember that this deck used to play Grim Monolith, what is the reason that card fell out of favor? It seems pretty good when your postboard plan is to play turbo wurmcoil engines against non white playing fair decks.

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THe reason for not playing ponder used to just be room and that with an ancient tomb and non-fetch heavy mana base it was better to be casting tutors than ponders. I don't know if the new versions are still set up that way, but without top the deck definitely changes a bit, probably not as much as the Red version, but ponder might be reasonable.

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Originally Posted by merfolkotpt

THe reason for not playing ponder used to just be room and that with an ancient tomb and non-fetch heavy mana base it was better to be casting tutors than ponders. I don't know if the new versions are still set up that way, but without top the deck definitely changes a bit, probably not as much as the Red version, but ponder might be reasonable.

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That's fair, I guess this deck was (is still?) the turbo painter deck.

So i'm thinking about running this list, what do people think about it? I think that there are too many delver decks out there to be playing the turbo combo plan and our combo is pretty easy to interact with for more decks so I want to play a slower more grinder game.

4 Painter's Servant
4 Ponder
4 Brainstorm
4 Grindstone
4 Pyroblast
4 Force of Will
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
1 Tormod's Crypt
4 Goblin Welder
2 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Mox Opal
1 Island
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
1 Tropical Island
2 Great Furnace
3 Volcanic Island
3 Seat of the Synod
1 Polluted Delta
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Spell Pierce

2 Flusterstorm
2 Kozilek's Return
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Spellskite
2 Blood Moon
1 Engineered Explosives

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CptHaddock

That's fair, I guess this deck was (is still?) the turbo painter deck.

So i'm thinking about running this list, what do people think about it? I think that there are too many delver decks out there to be playing the turbo combo plan and our combo is pretty easy to interact with for more decks so I want to play a slower more grinder game.

4 Painter's Servant
4 Ponder
4 Brainstorm
4 Grindstone
4 Pyroblast
4 Force of Will
2 Transmute Artifact
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
1 Tormod's Crypt
4 Goblin Welder
2 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Mox Opal
1 Island
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Ancient Tomb
1 City of Traitors
1 Tropical Island
2 Great Furnace
3 Volcanic Island
3 Seat of the Synod
1 Polluted Delta
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Spell Pierce

2 Flusterstorm
2 Kozilek's Return
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Spellskite
2 Blood Moon
1 Engineered Explosives

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So what kind of luck have you had with this setup, it looks like a lot of fun?