:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by jrw1985
These decks play completely differently. I wouldn't merge them into one category only because of BSkull.
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:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by jrw1985
These decks play completely differently. I wouldn't merge them into one category only because of BSkull.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cronos
Thats right at the First sight, but what they all have in Common is, that we win, if we handle batterskull/Jitte and possibly Mom
Thank you for your work. I feel like we shopuld be doing more of that. Are people interested in working on a collaborative summary of tournament and playtesting results sorted by...let's say Deckversion (like CLASSIC vs. MONO vs. WINSTOGATOR) and opponent's deck? I think this kind of work could turn out to be really insightful.Quote:
Originally Posted by cronos
So, any ideas how to approach things? You could answer here or (since I'm not sure if such things should be discussed in the actual deckthread) send me a PM.
Hi everyone! So I went to a bazaar of moxen trial today.
R1 shardless BUG
G1 Lackey connected, I don't remember much about G2, Bush I won both fairly easily.
1-0
R2 U/R Delver pyromancer
G1 I kept an okay fivecard hand and lost. I won a tight G2. G3 ended late in the game with me going Chieftain > Sharpshooter > Krenko over three turns, luckily my opponent didn't have a bolt in hand.
2-0
R3 I got stomped by death and taxes
2-1
R4 RUG delver
I won G1, lost G2, might have played too conservatively here. G3 We were in a position where I was clearly favored to win. I was at a decent lifetotal, had two vials in play and around 6 cards in hand, my opponent had 2-3 cards and a delver. Then my opponent flipped his delver with an ancient grudge and destroyed both vials. I drev a Tarfire for the delver but was stuck on two mountains with a hand full of three and fourdrops while my opponent went goyf > goyf for the win.
2-2 I still had a chance at making top 8 here, but knew my chances were low.
R5 death and taxes
I lost G1. G2 my opponent played a cataclysm and managed to draw the flickerwisp for my Vial the turn before I drew my Ringleader.
2-3
R6 BUG loam planeswalker control
It felt like a good matchup for me, although both my opponent and I were a bit tired at this point. I won 2-1.
3-3
So I ended up with a record of 3-3. Hopefully I will remember the games in more detail tomorrow, when I'll be rested.
Here is the list I played
4 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Badlands
6 fetch
4 port
4 Cavern
4 Wasteland
1 Prospector
4 vials
4 Lackey
1 Tarfire
3 Piledriver
3 Marshal
4 Gempalm
2 Warchief
3 Chieftain
4 Matron
4 Ringleader
1 Sharpshooter
1 Scrapper
1 Krenko
1 Siege-Gang
Sideboard
4 LotV
4 CotV
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Pyrokinesis
1 perish
Was happy with it overall, the one perish felt a bit random though. Thought about adding a second Tarfire, especially after losing two matches to death and taxes.
Just got 2 Ashen Rider. Can't wait to drop them off a show and tell just because they're cool. In reality they suffer from cunning wish-->stifle just like angel of despair... they would be much better with a sac outlet since the opponent would need 2 stifles.
I still believe that the better card to drop off show and tell is confusion in the ranks because it triggers twice... but Ashen rider is cool :)
So is Confusion in the Ranks better in almost every circumstance that Angel/Ashen? Most lists I see, play Angel, so why are they doing that instead of Confusion?Quote:
Originally Posted by LeoCop 90
We can hard cast confusion if we have too.
That's not the reason. Hardcasting CitR is a bad idea since it can be countered that way (which isn't the case if you drop it off a S&T).Quote:
Originally Posted by Dice_Box
Some reasons why people play Angel instead of CitR
* they don't know the enchantment
* they don't know how it works
* there are situations where your opponent can clear the battlefield (Pyroclasm or Firespout) and cast S&T. In that case you won't have a creature to swap places (unless you resolve one on your following turn, that is)
* Angel leaves you with a clock, CitR doesn't do that on it's own. However my experience is that you don't need that additional damage from Angel at times your opponent casts S&T
Yeah, i believe people keep using angel of despair just because they don't know the confusion in the ranks trick. Sometimes I'm also hesitant about playing confusion because i am sure that everytime i drop it my opponent would call the judge for clarification.... and i hate losing time this way. it also happened to me that the judge was unsure about the exact mechanic and it kept a lot of time to explain everything (i mostly play in my local store so that might happen).
Anyway confusion in the ranks works better, unless you don't have any creature on the battlefield as gobolord said... but by the time they cast show and tell you should always have a lackey/prospector or piledriver/mogg war marshal/thalia/warren instigator on the battlefield.
In general I think it would be a bad move to cast the enchantment, but if somehow the games goes long casting it would prevent us losing to sneak attack. Just theorizing because it never happened to me to cast it.Quote:
Originally Posted by GoboLord
I've done it once(round 7), and let me tell you, it feels good.Quote:
Originally Posted by LeoCop 90
Confusion is still the best hate against Sneak Show, but as has been already pointed out, it does nothing against Dream Halls. Don't know what the best strategy would be right now.
3-1 at Redcap's tonight. 22 people. 4 rounds, cut to top 8. Knocked out of the money by Reanimator.
Classic list.
23 lands - 3 Mountain, 1 Taiga, 1 Plateau
26 core
4 Gempalm Incinerator
3 Mogg War Marshal
1 Stingscourger
1 Tin Street Hooligan
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Skirk Prospector
Sideboard
3 Mindbreak Trap
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Red Elemental Blast
3 Relic of Progenitus
2 Pyrokinesis
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
R1 - W/U/r Miracles, 1-2. Lost round 3 when he slammed a Moat after I had got him to 1...
R2 - W/G/b Maverick, 2-1.
R3 - W/U/B Landstill, 2-0.
R4 - Burn, 2-0. He was new and made mistakes game 1. Game 2 he kept a 1 lander after a mull to 6.
Top 8
R5 - Reanimator, 0-2.
Game 1 he's on the play and starts with Griselbrand, followed turn 2 by Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite.
Game 2 I keep a 3 colorless land hand with Relic and Stingscourger. I don't draw a colored source in time and he gets around my turn 1 Relic by Reanimating turn 1 again... *sigh*
Next time I may try MBT over REB.
Played at a local turney, 20+ people. 5 rounds + top4.
4 Goblin Lackey
4 vial
4 thalia
4 Mogg War Marshal
1 Stingscourger
3 Gempalm Incinerator
3 Goblin Matron
3 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Warchief
1 mirror entity
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 krenko
1 tuktuk scrapper
Lands
4 Wasteland
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Rishadan Port
3 Mountain
1 karakas
2 plateau
5 red fetches
//Sideboard
2 ethersworn canonist
2 angel of despair
1 Stingscourger
1 relic of progenitus
3 rest in peace
1 sharpshooter
2 pyrokinesis
3 wear//tear
results:
UWR delver: 2-0
enchantress: 2-0
jund with lingering souls: 2-0
punishing jund: 1-1
D&T: 2-0
semifinals: U/R pyromancer delver: 1-2
Got some store credit, happy overall, however I was a bit angry with myself for loosing at the semifinal due to play mistakes.
Thoughts:
- G1 against punishing jund feels unwinnable. All their cards are so good. Having 4+ grave hate pieces after SB is key.
- Wear//tear surprises me every single time. destroying equipments without having to fetch for the splash color is great. The possibility of pitching it to pyrokinesis is also good. Great SB card.
- Mirror entity showed up only once and my opponent scooped. However, I was in good board position, if it was a chieftan or a krenko it would probably have had the same effect. I never matroned for him though, always fetched for a krenko. I am still undecided whether he is better than the second krenko.
- stingscourger in SB never comes in. He will be replaced.
On a side note, has anybody recently tested Jötun Grunt in the SB?
As graveyard hate? If Relic of Progenitus is too slow sometimes, I can't see how the Grunt will be better.Quote:
Originally Posted by fimo
Against combo graveyard decks is way too slow sure, as often is relic. I am more thinking against tarmogoyf / punshing fire / knight of the reliquary / lavamancer / mongoose / deathrite shaman / life from the loam decks. Cavern naming soldiers makes him (and thalia) uncounterable. It can be vialled. It is a 4/4 for 2 mana. Shrinks creatures, it is out of bolt range. Seems good especially against RUG and punishing jund.Quote:
Originally Posted by magicmerl
I highly doubt that you get your Jötun Grunt to eat a Punishing Fire, or anything that could otherwise be resurrected from your graveyard by Deathrite Shama, Grim Lavamancer and the like.Quote:
Originally Posted by fimo
The way I see it it works like this:
* J.G. triggered ability resolves, you target 2 cards.
* your opponent responds to that by targeting the same cards with DRS, Lavaman, or Grove of Burnwillows.
As for hating Goyfs and Mongese I'd suggest to try Rest in Peace first, which has the same manacosts and is just flat out better than your Giant (unless you insist on using his body, that is).
Updated my last post (here) with new results against Merfolks and Pox!
Speaking of which, how have you found the Pox MU. I got to play it a bit, it was a BW version, and I beat it once on the play, but found the land destruction and discard really hard to fight through. Is Pox a really bad match for us, or is it something we can beat with tight play?Quote:
Originally Posted by cronos
I think this really depends on their list. Pox decks have (very much like Goblin decks) access to so many meaningful cards and their deck can be focused on one or more of the three things: landdestruction, handdistruption, aggro-disruption (removal). I think that things get hairy if they have effective cards vs tribal decks (like Damnation and/or Engineered Plague). Landdestruction is only problematic if you don't start with Vial or if you Lackey doesn't connect.Quote:
Originally Posted by Potdindy
The weakness of Pox decks is generally they (a) have hard times winning (people tend to overdo it with their disruption package and forget they actually need to WIN somehow); and (b) are quite inconsistent (meaning that they do have nutty draws sometimes, but they will just as often draw only mana and discard spells - which don't really stop you).
SO I can't really give any advice here, since Pox decks are so diverse, but overall I've found the MU slightly favorable, if you can handle Engineered Plague.
Pox is a difficult pairing due to spells like Rancid Earth, Innocent Blood (our Goblin Lackey will die), Liliana of the Veil, etc. However, in our sideboard we've Chalice of the Void, Relic of Progenitus and Boartusk Liege (against Engineered Plague).
Chalice of the Void of X=1 will counter spells like Innocent Blood, Thoughtseize, Inquisition of Kozilek, Cursed Scroll, Dark Ritual or Raven's Crime (Loam Pox).
---------------
Maybe I'll remove Angel of Despair (Ashen Rider) of my sideboard because decks like Omnitell plays with Trickbind and Dream Halls. Sneak and Show can use Sneak Attack to put a creature card from their hand onto the battlefield instead of Show and Tell. For those reasons I find Angel of Despair useless.
I think of include Phyrexian Revoker for this reasons...
- vs. Spiral Tide: Candelabra of Tawnos.
- vs. ANT/TNT/TES: Lion's Eye Diamond, Lotus Petal and Chrome Mox.
- vs. Painter: Grindstone.
- vs. Nic Fit: Recurring Nightmare.
- vs. MUD: Metalworker, Grim Monolith, Kuldotha Forgemaster, etc.
- vs. Elves: any elf.
- vs. Pernicious Deed / Engineered Explosives / Ratchet Bomb / Powder Keg.
- vs. Umezawa's Jitte
- vs. Sword of Fire and Ice, Sword of Light and Shadow, etc.
- vs. planeswalkers
Why I prefer playing with Phyrexian Revoker to playing with Pithing Needle?
- Phyrexian Revoker can't be countered if we play it with Æther Vial or Cavern of Souls.
- It has CMC2 and many times we choose CoTV of CMC1.
- It can attacks.
- It affects mana abilities (Metalworker, Elves, etc.)
What do you think? Regards.
Hi! I'm a huge fan of this Deckprimer and i come here almost every day to see updates to helping me to be a better legacy Goblin player even if i play only occasionally. Like all of you goblins is also my favorite tribal deck and its always good to see that it still gets well positioned in tournaments. Please keep up the good work!
Now, relatively to Phyrexian Revoker, never tried it but it can be a nice replacement for Pithing Needle. But there is something about them... Neither can prevent The Sword cycle effects because they are triggered effects, I'm sure. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
EDIT: Oh, unless you are speaking of the blocking part. But i don't think it's worth it just for that...
Please keep up the good work. And thanks GoboLord.