@Klaus: Think you missed the 4 Auntie's Hovel there...
Printable View
@Klaus: Think you missed the 4 Auntie's Hovel there...
And even in commander, he is also not the best "goblin-themed" general...Quote:
Originally Posted by LeoCop 90
I played my trusty Rw goblins deck again last night. I had some pretty smooth wins against RUG Delver, UR Delver, and Grixis Delver. The RUG Delver MU (which I used to hate) has just gotten easier and easier over time. 2 md Tarfire have been excellent. Krenko continues to be a house against Delver decks mid to late game. Young Pyromancer isn't very threatening when you're playing md Sharpshooter and 2 Chieftains. The only game I lost to Delver decks last night was on a mull to 5.
My only round loss last night was against Nic Fit. This MU has gotten significantly worse after Cavern of Souls was printed. Running cavern plus a W splash makes me unable to benefit from Veteran Explorer triggers. I won the first game when he tapped out to play a CT, then cast garruk and made a wolf to flash back the CT to hit Kenko in my hand. I had a lackey, chieftain, and a random goblin in play, then I ripped a matron and played it and a Piledriver to swing for lethal. Game 2 he played t1 Top, I played lackey. He played t2 Veteran Explorer. I attacked with lackey t2. When he blocked with VE I cast Wear on his Top, forcing him to draw with it and shuffle it away. I was hoping this would leave him in top deck mode and allow me to drown him in CA for the rest of the game. Well, he wound up drawing top off of top so my plan didn't work out and he eventually got PF online and a Deed. I obviously lost. G3 I had to keep a mediocre 7 which allowed me to put a ton of pressure on the board but didn't have any CA to keep the momentum.
I've been thinking about how best to approach this MU. Now that I don't run many basics its probably best for me to keep VEs alive and just build up my board without Lackey attacks. Deny him the ramp and hope to get a game winning board before he hits 6 mana. So Vial and Warchief are probably the best cards for this MU.
I'm always interested in how others play against Nic fit if anyone has good insights. Thanks!
-Jon
Commander Goblin seems like a fun commander card... Unfortunately that is about all he's good for. As Tokugawa pointed out, he's not the best option for 3 color goblin tribal EDH. I will continue to use Adun Oakenshield to bind my colors and dig in the graveyard when I run out of gas.
It does appear Klaus missed the Hovels in GoboLord's list.
Last night I tried my hand at RB Goblins. It did not go well due to pairings, mulligans, and other factors. I used the following manabase:
4 Mountain
2 Chrome Mox
4 Wasteland
1 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Auntie's Hovel
4 Badlands
GoboLord - Why 1 Badlands and 4 fetches instead of 4 Badlands? Did it prove better than other configurations in testing?
As far as I can tell:
Pros for 1 Badlands/4 Fetch:
*Slightly* less vulnerable to Wasteland
Occasionally you can pretend to be mono-colored
Pros for 4 Badlands/0 Fetch:
Only your Wastelands feed Deathrite
No life-loss to fetching (admittedly a pretty minor benefit)
No fear of Stifle
Keeps non-Goblin cards on the bottom after Ringleader reveals them
jrw - Regarding NicFit: I would not recommend the strategy of filling the board until you can overrun unless you are running a Pithing Needle effect to stop Pernicious Deed.
If a number of people are dropping G and playing Wear//Tear, could it be a good idea to play RWB goblins to play perish. It seems that with the exception of Death n Taxes and Fish, the main creatures that are bad for us are Green. Perish despite being slower seems like a solid out to all those decks.
@Jon: I don't really have experience against NicFit playing a colored version. Against Monored, it's quite easy. I mean, playing Lackey T1, not connecting, and being able to cast Ringleader T2 is backbreaking.
For the RW version Besides Needle, that I don't like very much here, there is RiP, but that only shuts down Veteran Explorer and Recurring Nightmare (and PF it seems...), and is destroyed by Deed.
You could just not play Tarfire, and play some Swords to Plowshers, like, 2 MD, 1 SB. That way Veteran won't trigger. Still, don't think it's a god idea...
@Potdindy: That sounds fun. Tell us how it does.
That misses the point though. If we can't overwhelm the board against them we can't beat them, wouldn't you agree? If I don't overwhelm the board we'll stay at parity until he resolves a Deed or naturally casts one of his fatties, at which point he's pretty much won. If I turn off Deed with Needle I'm less exposed to having my board swept, but he still has outs to needle (AD) and PF to potentially clear my board anyway. If I wait for a Needle I give him more time to assemble PF/Grove. If I overwhelm the board I'm exposed to sweepers. It's a catch-22 MU.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew
The path to beating Nic fit, as I see it, is in denying them their ramps so I can build my board without being exposed to fatties or sweepers. If I can do that I can win the game in the mid-game. I need to disrupt their set-up (ramps and Top) then try to force through enough damage to win. The question I still have is how to do this while developing my board.
Nicfit match ups are not that difficult to deal with but if the game gets longer usually your'e on the losing end, game one I usually mull to lackey for an early KILL - alpha strike is the key here before they ramp their mana's and do silly things, Games 2 and 3's " LEYLINE OF THE VOID " shuts down almost 30-40% of their spells and this is our oppurtunity to slow them down and go all out.:smile:Quote:
Originally Posted by jrw1985
Updated my last post (here) with new results against many decks!
- Fourth update (10-17-2013)
vs. Dark Maverick: 2-0
vs. Burn: 1-2
vs. Pox: 2-0
vs. Sneak and Show: 2-0 (As Phyrexian Revoker entered the battlefield, I named Sneak Attack. It was the MVP in G2). I won G1 due to Stingscourger.
I've reorganised my listing of results in different archetypes! Regards.
I found Sulfuric Vortex very effective against them. Denies Punishing Fire. Denies DRSs lifgain (and Kitche Finks, and Scavenging ooze). Depends on their list though. Otherwise I'd suggestQuote:
Originally Posted by jrw1985
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinoy Goblin
I agree with you, but the reason why I played only 1 Badlands is that I sold my Badlands #2 to #4 some time ago. So, I own only 1 Badlands.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew
Fair enough :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by GoboLord
I like Earwig Squad. I ran 3 maindeck Wednesday because I've had no experience with them and wanted to try them out. My Storm opponent scooped a game upon resolving him. The other games he was a non-factor due to poor keeps against bad matchups or in one case the opponent having both his Ensnaring Bridges in hand.
Cabal Therapy is another card I like. Especially with Mogg War Marshal. But I have no experience with it. What do you normally name blindly against Storm? Or S+T variants? In what other matches is it worth bringing in? Ones with SFM?
Curse of Predation. http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attac...1&d=1381907551
I really like this card. I think it has some potential in Goblins.
Yes, it cost three mana, requires green, cannot be vialed in, can be countered, and is not a Goblin.
But still, getting +1/+1 counters just by attacking, before combat damage, is kind of a big deal.
Well, the most obvious application is Combo-MUs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew
If I make a blind call it depends on wether or not I can flashback it. If I have a dude to sacrifice and my opponent doesn't cast brainstorm in response I usually name "Brainstorm". Because: in that situation your flashback will hit a relevant card with 100% certainty, even if you don't see Brainstorm on the first cast. If he uses Brainstorm in response things get trickier. In that case it even depends on what deck you are facing and what cards he already played and how experienced you think your opponent is.
Some questions to consider (example of playing against Tendrils Storm Combo)
Did he use Brainstorm?
Y: name something that accelerates mana.
N: name Brainstorm
Are you able to flashback immediately?
Y: name Brainstorm
N: name something that accelerates mana or name Infernal Tutor
(in situations where you choose between mana-accel or Tutor) Can you manascrew him effectively?
Y: name some mana-accel
N: name the Infernal Tutor
Which mana-accel should I name?
When you have Chalice in play: Dark Ritual (otherwise: Lion's Eye Diamond)
When your opponent knows that you play Cabal Therapy: Dark Ritual (otherwise Lion's Eye Diamond)
Which Tutor shall I name?
Against TES: Burning Wish or Infernal Tutor
Against ANT: Infernal Tutor
So, whatever you think your opponent is more likely to have in hand, also considering what he already played.
This is different story when you are playing against some other Combo deck like S&T or Belcher or High Tide. E.g. Against S&T decks if I cast Cabal Therapy and my opponent doesn't Brainstorm in response, I might even considering naming "Force of Will". Either way: the card is most effective when you can flashback it (obviously) and I tend to use the first cast in a way to make sure that the 2nd cast will hit something relevant. You get better with the card the more often you use it. Sometimes there is even a situation where you can be sure that only 1 or 2 card in your opponents hand could possibly keep you from winning. In that situation you obviously name those. Think carefully.
Depending on the SB and the MD configuration I might even use CT against SFM.dec to rip Batterskull in the turn he plays tutors it. You can also use CT in combination with Stingscourger or MWM to maximize it's efficiency.
Damn, that's an interesting card. That's really a huge benefit for a swarm deck like ours, but for 3 mana you can just run Chieftain. I realize chieftain doesn't provide the cumulative value of Curse of Predation over time, but he has much better synergy with our deck. I don't think I'll be running Curse any time soon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hof
I played again last night. Went 3-1 with Rw goblins, making me 6-2 over the past 2 days and 5-0 against Delver Tempo decks. I had an awesome match last night against American Delver where I managed to assemble Prospector, sharpshooter, and Krenko and cleared his board of 2 Delver, 2 SFM, Batterskull. It was pretty awesome.
I play goblins mainly for moments like this.Quote:
Originally Posted by jrw1985
I had another awesome game yesterday against OmniTell when, after outracing him g1, I drew an opening 7 g2 of Karakas, Port, Cavern, Vial, Prospector, Thalia, Wear // Tear. So I played Vial t1, Ported him on his t3 upkeep, he t3 tapped out for SnT. I played Thalia, he played Omni but was locked under Thalia's tax effect. T3 I Teared his Omni and he couldn't come back. T4 I wasted his city of traitors. The whole game was pretty much a lock.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScatmanX
Edit: Out of DTB! Woo-hoo!
The full COMM2013 lists are revealed, seem that nothing would go into goblin decks.
Toxic Deluge is effective against goblins, and may be seen some legacy play. However, when a black deck lands a E-Plague(also cost 2B), we are already nearly dead...so this card wouldn‘t change a lot.
Oh my, and even had Karakas+Vial to protect it from Removal/Bounce. Christ. Nice draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by jrw1985
Is this the list you're playing still? How does it fare against BGx decks? I'll be playing goblins soon, and maybe will try Rw again. If it's not, pm/post the new one?
Thanks.
edit: Well, you're using Prospector, so it's different. Mind sending boarding plans against Punishing Jund and Shardless bug too? Those are tricky for me. Thanks.
Exact same MD. My sb currently has 2 Cannonist, -1 MbT -1Chalice.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScatmanX
I haven't played too much against BGx decks lately. I assume you mean Shardless Agent decks. They're pretty tough since they play great answers to our T1 plays (DRS and Thoughtseize) and they also play AD to blow up Vial. If you can land a RiP against them you turn off their clock, or you can lock them out with Blood Moon. But they're a much more flexible deck than us, considering they run Jace and Lilliana which can lock us out pretty easily. So the matches get pretty miserable pretty quickly if your hand isn't great, or if you blank a ringleader. I think that the match will get better with time and adaptation (like RUG Delver did), but I don't know what we could play to shut em down. The first thing that comes to mind is Suppression Field, just because it shuts down their fetches, DRSs, Plainswalkers and manlands. But that's just an off the cuff idea.