[Deck] Nic Fit (GBx Explorer Zenith Control)

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Originally Posted by MiracleMan

Snap serves as Gifts 2.5 and sometimes the extra in making sure I get exactly what I want out the pile.
Slime is just a do good, take care of cards (like tarpit) card.
Rune Scarred serves as a threat that can also get unique parts of the combo (often mystic snake)

The deck is operating off of a couple of points:
#1 Thragtusk + Nightmare is insane. Setting that up usually wins you the game
#2 Deed takes care of 90% of the deck's problems, as long as you can search for it and recur it, you don't need much removal
#3 If anyone ever messes with your graveyard, you need a backup plan to still do insane things: Deadeye

I think the list looks a lot like a pile, but, one problem I've always been frustrated with, regarding Nic Fit, is that it can often have a lot of dead draws. I've found that the list doesn't have that problem as often as other lists I've played.

EpicLevelCommander,
In terms of your changes, I like the direction you're going with it and the criticism you're providing makes a lot of sense. However, I think dropping recurring nightmare is a mistake. I think the card is insane, especially with the lack of graveyard hate.

I think just because gifts isn't completely optimized in the nic fit shell, doesn't mean that it can't be incredibly successful.

That said, if I ever go in a straight BUG shell without the gifts package, you're list makes a lot of sense. I love playing top and I've been trying to find room for a 2nd Jace, even though he's at an all-time level of uselessness more often than I'd like.

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well as fair as the slime goes venser can do all that plus more
and i feel the demon is a weak seven drop
come on ur in bug colors gotta think bigger more obnoxious

Well if you're running gifts/intuition intent + ewit + grim harvest is a hilarious, if not overly powerful, combo.

I like this new Kiora Planeswalker. Not as good as Jace but she seems to be a nice support for him in a Planeswalker heavy BUG list. 4 Decays, 3-4 Deeds and a lot of PWs.
She also has some advantages like an easier casting cost and the ability to win the game much faster (which is something that Planeswalker BUG sometimes has problems with).

Meh. Don't get me wrong. I love explore. But she just seems underwhelming when she hits the board. I think I'd rather play Gary Wildspeaker.

I just can't see running Kiora in a BUG Walker list. After maxing out Jace and Lili, the next thing I want is Ashiok #2 or 3 and Vraska #3. Ashiok helps you stay ahead when you are, and Vraska helps you pull out of non-swarm situations. Kiora is almost 100% durdle, and basically only decent when paired with other walkers on your board - in a vacuum, Jace, Lili, Ashiok and Vraska are all better, as are various Garruks.

BUG POD:
I've really struggled to beat Merfolk because the combination of 12 lords, Islandwalk and Mutavaults, and VE can be a liability here because it accelerates them too. My only strategy has been to mull into Pernicious Deed, avoid Islands at all costs, and try to grind them out.

I've also found there are some matches that I simply cannot grind out without Recurring Nightmare giving me continuous value from something - usually Thragtusk, or having a second big threat to Pod into. I'm considering adding a 2nd RN, but also am evaluating Frost Titan, Oona and Tradewind Rider. The Rider would require a Qurion Ranger or Scryb Sprite, but would give me an alternative way to grind out games, while both Frost Titan and Oona give me a different way to mess with my opponent.

I'm also really interested in this Junk list: http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/dec...7&iddeck=91069. I've always like that white offers Sun Titan, Reveillark and Academy Rector, and this seems to take advantage of 2 of these well. Not sure if Recycle and Debtors' Knell are too cute, but the biggest appeal of this list is that it solves my BUG Pod problems above, which is that it has better ways of getting Recurring Nightmare, and has varied threats at the high end to close out games post-Deed wiping. I will admit that I've come to love the disruption that blue offers, with Pilferer and Negate/Envelop/Flusterstorm plus discard very strong, and that Junk lists are going to have poor matchups against Storm and the like (maybe adding a Leyline of the Void and Leyline of Sanctity so its fetchable by Rector? but that probably can't come out fast enough).

she is durdle if she has nothin to do but shutin a batterskull or a tar pit down wich barth are nic fits biggest problem cards keeping them on a lock it all part of control

IO feel like at that point I'd rather just have Tamiyo though

Debtor's Knell is cute in Rector Fit but not overly useful. Also, Recycle is insane in the grindy matchups and in-fact the easiest way to beat all of the blade variant decks and is decent against shardless IF you have a top to go with it to get out of Hymn problems. The only questionable cards for me in that list are the primeval bounty (as the card seems like overkill with recycle already present, and in my testing didn't do as much), only having 2 tops (as the typical Rector build tends to shuffle its deck at least once if not twice a turn), and having 0 marsh flats. Finally, if you can afford it, moat is a godsend for that particular build.

On a side note, I took my rector build to a local tournament with 16 players and eeked into top 8.

Round 1: Sneak and Show W 2-0

Game 1: He never finds a show and tell or a sneak attack and double explorer ramp puts me into eventually having both kukusho and sun titan in play. Not going to lie this game was pure luck.

Game 2: Another rather lucky spree, despite his insane top deck. On the draw I therapy him naming show and tell and see both sneak and griselbrand. He then casts the sneak on turn 2 and passes. I quickly fetch my lone dryad arbor to flash therapy back and hit the griselbrand only to have him rip emrakul the very next turn. Fortunately he proceeds to brick for about 4 turns not finding another big dude and thalia and ooze beats get him.

Round 2: Merfolk L 0-2

Well my luck ran out in this match from earlier sadly

Game 1: I keep a decent starting hand with deed and rector on the draw and proceed to get punched in the face by various fish and he happens to have the force for the turn 3 deed after landing his true name. He then untaps, phantasmal images his true name and I die readily.

Game 2: Another decent hand this time I deed away his entire board with a thragtusk in play and him being hellbent after this. He then proceeds to rip a true name off the top and slammed it into play. I then play ooze and make him a 9/9 while not finding a single out with top in play the entire time though the last turn I could have done something I punted as I had enough mana to spin top see the third card down on my draw step and then crack a fetch to find another deed, however I don't take the opportunity and the third card down is indeed a deed where I the proceeded to facepalm myself. Had I not misplayed game 3 most certainly would have come about.

Round 3: Deathblade W 2-1

Game 1: I lose the die roll mull to 6 and keep a lose one lander as I'm a bit tilted from the last match. He opens with deathrite to which I proceed to thoughtseize and see jace, true name, stoneforge mystic, and the lands to cast all of them. Needless to say I lost this one.

Game 2: This one goes long with me eventually landing sigarda and beating face with it while memoriciding his stoneforged batterskull, after this it was all downhill for him.

Game 3: My opponent apparently kept a lose hand as he was now on tilt to which my decent hand of carpet and vet with a sac outlet ramped me into t3 huge dudes. This was also aided by the fact that after forcing my t1 carpet I ripped a second one and slammed it into play. I believe he saw at least 3 FoW this game but my threats just got there.

Round 4: Reanimator L 0-2

Game 1: I die to a griselbrand suited up with an animate dead on it. Ooze showed up a turn too late and it was all downhill from there.

Game 2: I keep a decent hand of thoughtseize and ramp and am rewarded by snatching his entomb to his reanimate and exhume hand, However, I eventually stall out on 5 lands and am unable to cast kukusho or anything of relevance at this point and eventually die to another griselbrand. Hedging my board against storm and show and tell has definitely hurt my gy matchups.

Top 8

Shardless Bug L 0-2

Game 1: This is a long slugfest and eventually resulted in my sigarda and moat vs his jace, lili and deathrite. I lost by 1 turn's worth of damage when his jace found a second deathrite and his last card in hand was the FoW for the green sun's I had ripped trying to find thragtusk. All in all, it was a very tight match and I believe slight misplays ended up losing the game for me.

Game 2; I nut draw into turn 2 5 mana and resolve my garruk relentless killing his deathrite. However, He then proceeds to play all 4 of his baleful strix in a row and I eventually deeded them away though most of my resources in my hand became dead. I then memoricde him naming jace and see that he had boarded them out, which was fantastic however, he then dropped a goyf and blind cascaded into a visions with an agent, lots of sick rips this tournament. I then dropped my moat and proceeded to have it charmed away which then put me dead in the water.

Overall the deck felt pretty good though I may move the thalias out for some extripates again, dryad arbor once again pulled his weight for me and, I saw approximately 1 therapy all day which is both unusual and particularly bad.

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Originally Posted by megadeus

io feel like at that point i'd rather just have tamiyo though

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but tamy cant win a game

True, but she can draw cards, keep any non walker permanent locked down, and her ultimate will win any grindy game

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Originally Posted by megadeus

true, but she can draw cards, keep any non walker permanent locked down, and her ultimate will win any grindy game

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yes but tami cant stop from things doing damage and as well kiora can draw cards and allow extra land drops plus she wins the game

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Originally Posted by plogan

Debtor's Knell is cute in Rector Fit but not overly useful. Also, Recycle is insane in the grindy matchups and in-fact the easiest way to beat all of the blade variant decks and is decent against shardless IF you have a top to go with it to get out of Hymn problems. The only questionable cards for me in that list are the primeval bounty (as the card seems like overkill with recycle already present, and in my testing didn't do as much), only having 2 tops (as the typical Rector build tends to shuffle its deck at least once if not twice a turn), and having 0 marsh flats. Finally, if you can afford it, moat is a godsend for that particular build.

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Do you have a list you can share? I'm definitely interested in exploring Junk Fit.

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Originally Posted by tons of fun

yes but tami cant stop from things doing damage and as well kiora can draw cards and allow extra land drops plus she wins the game

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What do you mean doing damage? Like Sulfuric Vortex or a planeswalker? Kiora dies to TNN/Lightning Bolt even after using her +1 ability. I mean that is not to say Tamiyo is amazing or anything, but I feel like her +1 is almost always going to be better, plus she starts at a much higher loyalty level. And comparing planeswalker ultimates is almost always useless. I mean sure, unchecked, Kiora is better at ending the game, but you really can't judge planeswalkers by their ultimate

[QUOTE=Megadeus;777822]What do you mean doing damage? Like Sulfuric Vortex or a planeswalker? Kiora dies to TNN/Lightning Bolt even after using her +1 ability. I mean that is not to say Tamiyo is amazing or anything, but I feel like her +1 is almost always going to be better, plus she starts at a much higher loyalty level. And comparing planeswalker ultimates is almost always useless. I mean sure, unchecked, Kiora is better at ending the game, but you really can't judge planeswalkers by their ultimate[

WOOPY SHIT ALMOST EVERY PLANS WALKER GETTS THERE ASS TURNED INSIDE OUT BY BOLTS AND TNN POIN IT SHE HAS ABILITIE TO KEEP THINGS IN CHECK IF U PLAY HER RIGHT AND SHE HAS MORE UTILITY THEN TAMY CUZ I HAVE RAN TAMI AND SHE IS OK AT BEST I DO NOT THINK SHE IS THE END ALL BEAT ALLL BUT SHE HAS TESTING ROOM IN BUGG]

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Originally Posted by megadeus

what do you mean doing damage? Like sulfuric vortex or a planeswalker? Kiora dies to tnn/lightning bolt even after using her +1 ability. I mean that is not to say tamiyo is amazing or anything, but i feel like her +1 is almost always going to be better, plus she starts at a much higher loyalty level. And comparing planeswalker ultimates is almost always useless. I mean sure, unchecked, kiora is better at ending the game, but you really can't judge planeswalkers by their ultimate

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jace give up too a bolt and tnn as well if they turn three tnn ur not gonna turn four jace or any planwalker anyways so the tnn is a mut point to argue with anyways

I mean yes, but with Tamiyo/Jace, you can at least +1 them to survive the bolt/attack, then next turn slam a way to protect them. Whereas with Koria (is that even her name?), even if you +1 her she dies. And if you -1 her just to get value out of her, then great, you cast a 4 mana explore. I just don't see her being very good. Like I said, feel free to test her out and prove me wrong. I love Explore. I just don't think she is worth it, and in theory (I havent tested either) I would test Tamiyo before I tested her.

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Originally Posted by megadeus

i mean yes, but with tamiyo/jace, you can at least +1 them to survive the bolt/attack, then next turn slam a way to protect them. Whereas with koria (is that even her name?), even if you +1 her she dies. And if you -1 her just to get value out of her, then great, you cast a 4 mana explore. I just don't see her being very good. Like i said, feel free to test her out and prove me wrong. I love explore. I just don't think she is worth it, and in theory (i havent tested either) i would test tamiyo before i tested her.

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i tested tamiyo especially in my build koria would be the best option but u can slam proctection for jace against tnn any ways
the best u can do is stop a bolt with something so that a very weak back up . Like every torny i play and i have seen mckee play we each have the same cards in fair match up that give our decks problems its tar pits and batter skullls and she can put them on a lock

I mean I see what you are saying, but how is Koria better vs Tar Pit and BSkull than Tamiyo? Like you said, Tamiyo was underwhelming, so what do you really expect with Kiora?

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Originally Posted by megadeus

i mean i see what you are saying, but how is koria better vs tar pit and bskull than tamiyo? Like you said, tamiyo was underwhelming, so what do you really expect with kiora?

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koria one is cheaper for starters

plus the ability to hit more then one land drop and draw cards with that still not horrible
realistically ther all at the same level as far as what they do u can use either to shut down creatures koria givein me lands drops and a chance a 9/9 every turn

I see what you are saying. My point being though, that if Tamiyo wasn't worth it, then Kiora probably won't be either. I like her abilities, I just think the loyalty is too low unfortunately.