[Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

I don't like playing too many dreadnought as set yourself up for the 2 for 1 way too often. Also playing too many requires you to play trickbinds somewhat which are not good enough on themselves to warrant play I think, especially since some of the top decks like merfolk are light on fetchlands and useful stifle targets.
Therefore i think its optimal to just run 1 or 2 dreadnoughts. Against decks that run plenty of removal I just side them out as they 2 for 1 yourself too often then. Going the route of kira is not so great i think as too often you will have only kira or only dreadnought and playing 4 kira isnt great as she is legendary. Also kira doesn't help against diabolic edict, deed and EE. Sometimes dreadnought still gets the double swords even if u have it so i just dont see the point in running her.

At the moment i run black and white splash as engineered plague is great against so many decks. Also i like running dark confidant as the card advantage helps alot against slow decks. Also i really like vindicate as a catch all answer maindeck which is just so useful. Offcourse splashing 2 colors makes the deck weaker against non-basic hate but with stifle avoiding wasteland it is usually fine. If the non-basic hate is high a monocolor or 2 color list is better offcourse.
My list is:
// Lands
2 [U] Tundra
1 [MM] Island (3)
1 [ARE] Plains (7)
4 [ON] Polluted Delta
2 [U] Underground Sea
3 [ON] Flooded Strand
2 [TE] Wasteland
4 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
1 [IN] Swamp (1)
// Creatures
1 [MI] Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 [RAV] Dark Confidant
3 [FD] Trinket Mage
// Spells
1 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus
2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
4 [SC] Stifle
3 [CS] Counterbalance
4 [IA] Brainstorm
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [IA] Swords to Plowshares
2 [AP] Vindicate
3 [OD] Standstill
2 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
3 [NE] Daze
// Sideboard
SB: 2 [MI] Phyrexian Dreadnought
SB: 1 [FD] Engineered Explosives
SB: 4 [FNM] Engineered Plague
SB: 1 [CH] Tormod's Crypt
SB: 1 [10E] Pithing Needle
SB: 1 [10E] Crucible of Worlds
SB: 1 [B] Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 1 [BOK] Threads of Disloyalty
SB: 2 [PS] Meddling Mage

At the moment i only run 1 dreadnought as I just don't like it vs many of the mainstream decks as they counter stifle OR just Stp/EE etc it after it is played. It still rocks vs stuff like goblins and sligh though so i run 2 and 3 in the board. Plague is for merfolk/elves/goblins where it rocks. It basically fills the same role as wrath as all mainstream swarm aggro decks happen to be tribal. The mana has been consistent for me so far and vindicate was great for me, i wonder why many lists don't seem to have dedicated cards for the mirror and landstill though. Standstill is not great against decks with equal ability to abuse it, especially as a resolved standstill can often just lead to both players ramping up to 7 cards with your opponent breaking it eot with a brainstorm. You end up discarding 3 cards of wasting a FoW on the brainstorm so the standstill didnt relal help you win. I think you really have to play crucible or elspeth or something to help the mirror.

I've been working on building a sideboard for Uw dreadstill but didn't like a lot I saw on deckcheck.net and most of the discussion here is pertaining to other variants. My MD is the same as LSV's I'll still post the list for those that don't remember or haven't seen.

Artifacts
1 Crucible Of Worlds
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Sensei's Divining Top

Artifact Creatures
2 Phyrexian Dreadnought

Creatures
3 Trinket Mage

Enchantments
3 Counterbalance
4 Standstill

Instants
4 Brainstorm
3 Daze
4 Force Of Will
3 Spell Snare
4 Stifle
4 Swords To Plowshares

Basic Lands
5 Island
1 Plains

Lands
4 Flooded Strand
4 Mishra's Factory
2 Polluted Delta
3 Tundra
3 Wasteland

SB:
3 Wrath of God - Goblins/Merfolk
3 Relic of Progentus - graveyard combo/Loam decks
1 Tormod's Crypt - same
1 Pithing Needle - Goblins, Survival, misc
2 Blue Elemental Blast - Goblins, RG beats, Loam
3 Kataki's War Wage - Affinity, Stax
1 Phyrexian Dreadnought - This is a bit random but I feel like there are matchups where I just want to see more Dreadnoughts
1 Engineered Explosives - Thresh, Belcher, misc.


Other Potential cards:
Oblivion Ring - good against Thresh but slow against aggro
Meddling Mage - doesn't seem that exciting
Orims Chant - combo matchups already pretty nice
Crucible - good in control matchups ie Mirror/Landstill
2nd Needle - Vial is a huge beating
Threads - 3 drop to reveal to CB and good against Thresh
Annul - hits CB and Affinity/Stax
Serenity - Affinity/Stax/Enchantress

Don't know if Kataki is better than Energy Flux but I like how it comes down a turn quicker and Affinity with Disciple can kill very quick. I know that if you look at the metagame in general Affinity isn't that popular but I feel like there is going to be a disproportionate amount of the deck at the GP. I've been testing a bit but not doing as much boarded games as I should so don't feel as strong in this area. Any input would be appreciated thanks.

Woah fell off the map of the DTB forum! Looks like a perfect choice to slide under the radar now with this deck =].

Yeah. Here's hoping one of us top 8s at Chicago.

Merfolks are everywhere these day and let's be frank, they are kinda a bad MU. Lets see what they do that cause us trouble (I play the Ur version btw) :

They lay a lot of threat fast
They have vial
They bounce our dreagnouht with enought success
They can play under stanstill

Now what can we do?

First im thinking actully playing Kira MD, I know the idea was brought from the merfolk forum by rood (from jazzycat I think) to play it in the side, but most deck run some removal MD, exept combo wich we have a good MU against.

Secondly i would play a needle MD, nuff said.

And then i would play 4 firespout (clasm just isnnt enough against merfolks) + 4 REB in the side.

So change from a standart list would look like :

-3 Speel snare
+2 Kira
+1 Needle

With a side of :

4 Firespout
4 REB
3 Relic
2 BEB
1 Needle
1 Kira


We end up with a pretty narrow sideboard, but right now, i beleive it's necessary.

So, now that this deck took 12th out of 1200 people at a Grand Prix, can it go back to being a Deck To Beat?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but would it be so bad to play Magus of the Moon in a straight Ur version of this deck? It would give you an additional out against the smug opponent across the table holding a krosan grip (thanks to 3cc off counterbalance), and it forces the new threshold deck to basically scoop. Granted, there is some disynergy with Mishra's Factory here, but you could potentially get some of that damage through with something else like Price of Progress out of the sideboard. I know this might seem a little radical but...it deserves a look.

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Originally Posted by FoulQ

Correct me if I'm wrong, but would it be so bad to play Magus of the Moon in a straight Ur version of this deck? It would give you an additional out against the smug opponent across the table holding a krosan grip (thanks to 3cc off counterbalance), and it forces the new threshold deck to basically scoop. Granted, there is some disynergy with Mishra's Factory here, but you could potentially get some of that damage through with something else like Price of Progress out of the sideboard. I know this might seem a little radical but...it deserves a look.

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I was thinking about the same thing + Downhill Charge. Since all lands will be mountains we could sac an unused fetch for the cost and have an unblocked Factory or Mage do some real damage maybe even finish the game a little sooner. This of course could be a terrible idea that just looks good on paper.

I'm currently testing the deck again since I took a bit of a break from playing magic for about 5 months. The format has changed alot so I feel like we'll have to come up with new tricks =D.

@MoTM: I wouldn't consider it really an option against like Tribe, but against the new Threshold/NLB variants I'd say definetally try him out.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but would it be so bad to play Magus of the Moon in a straight Ur version of this deck? It would give you an additional out against the smug opponent across the table holding a krosan grip (thanks to 3cc off counterbalance), and it forces the new threshold deck to basically scoop. Granted, there is some disynergy with Mishra's Factory here, but you could potentially get some of that damage through with something else like Price of Progress out of the sideboard. I know this might seem a little radical but...it deserves a look.

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First of, i think that Blood Moon is still stronger than Magus, because its more likely that they'll either have a basic Plains or can float mana for Swords, than Forest / float mana for Grip.

Price of Progress doesnt look good, its not supplemented by other burn spells and it will hurt you too. Remember this is still a control deck.

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..suggesting Downhill Charge...

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No comment on this one, its obviously bad.

Current sideboard i run (for an unknown / developed meta):
3 REB
2 BEB
3 Kira
3 Blood Moon
2 Relic
2 Firespout

The 3rd REB may become a Needle / 4th Kira (or Crypt if there are some Ichorid players). Could also be if Stax or some Landstill must be expected.
Crucible is also a candidate, all these options need to be tested / suited for the meta.
I choosed to cut Echoing Truth because its not strong / needed enough in my opinion.

EDIT:
The 3rd REB will stay for now, because of Tyrgon Predator and CB. I am currently trying the 3rd Moon instead of a BEB.

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Originally Posted by The Atog Lord

So, now that this deck took 12th out of 1200 people at a Grand Prix, can it go back to being a Deck To Beat?

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Good play to finish 12th. It shows that this deck can win stuff, altough it has not won a lot recently.

I've got a question,. What kind of sideboard did you run and futhermore, did you notice the two daze. I love playing daze, so i wonder why you only played two and included ponder as well to your maindeck.

Grtz
Marco

I almost never say this, but I was very happy with my 75 total cards. Two daze was enough so that I never felt like they cluttered up my hand, and yet were present often enough to matter. I've always liked playing 1 or 2 daze in Dreadstill. I think Daze is situational, but having 1 or 2 means that you can keep your opponent off guard with them, while not having them come into your hand too often in the latter part of the game when they are dead.

My sideboard was great. I was really happy with every single card in it.
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Tormod's Crypt
2 REB/PBlast
3 BEB/HBlast
2 Krosan Grip
2 Ancient Grudge
3 Firespout

Ultimately, the sideboard is why I opted for this build of Dreadstill. Whatever didn't have a good solution in the maindeck was answered in the sideboard. The fifteen were excellent. I had played with a few other builds of Dreadstill, and while they are fine pre board, red and green provide the best sideboard answers.

Hello all, this is the first time I post, but I'm following the thread from a while. I currently play a UB dreadstill.
I notice some lack of counter magic in this version and I have 61 cards total because I don't know what to cut off.
Here is my list:

3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
3 Wasteland
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Underground Sea
3 Island

4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 Dark Confidant
3 Trinket Mage

4 Force of Will
3 Daze
4 Brainstorm
4 Stifle
2 Trickbind

4 Standstill
3 Thoughtseize
3 Counterbalance
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Engineered Explosives

The sideboard is still in progress:

4 Engineered Plague
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Pithing Needle
3 Echoing Truth
3 Smother

This is about it. Comments or advice are welcome!

By the way, has anyone thought of sinkhole (for more mana denial)?
And what about extirpate? I think it's great against other counters or even better on a dual land after wastland did it's job!

Use the Edit button. It's what it's there for. Welcome to the Source. ~Nihil Credo

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By the way, has anyone thought of sinkhole (for more mana denial)?
And what about extirpate? I think it's great against other counters or even better on a dual land after wastland did it's job!

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Yeah, and why not adding another color for fast beater, so that we have a fast clock, mmh, green maybe for Goyf?
TA anyone?!

I tried Kira and he's kinda not cool.
You have to drop him after the dreadnought, which still allows your opponent to grip the naughty guy in response. Not tech imo.

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Originally Posted by EaD

I tried Kira and he's kinda not cool.
You have to drop him after the dreadnought, which still allows your opponent to grip the naughty guy in response. Not tech imo.

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Actually you don't have to drop him afterwards. You are stifling the dreadnaughts ability (see goblin pile driver) upon which Kira has no effect on.

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Actually you don't have to drop him afterwards. You are stifling the dreadnaughts ability (see goblin pile driver) upon which Kira has no effect on.

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Wait, what?
I think i should read the cards properly before posting :(

Anyone thought adding 2 cunning wish in the MB?
I thought of it after losing from humility and after losing from moat because you can't counter always.
By the way, with an UB list the only thing is Echoing Truth or is there some other card?

Realizing that Dreadnaught is too fragile to commit two cards to early game against many decks, I figured two would be the right number in a deck, and he should be supported with really good early game cards. This lead me to this list. Looking for comments and suggestions.

4 Wasteland
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
3 Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
1 Bayou

4 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Dreadnaught

4 Brainstorm
4 Stifle
3 Counterbalance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Spell Snare
3 Daze
4 Force of Will
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Putrefy
2 Smother

SB:
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Krosan Grip
3 Pernicious Deed (Seems mediocre, was E. Plague)
3 Hydroblast
2 Diabolic Edict (This was a concession to NO-Progenitus, can probably change)

A brainstorm and daze or maybe spell snare could probably be turned into the 4th top and the 4th CB, perhaps add a land. The list has felt really solid on MWS, in fact I played against freakish777 and we had a good match.

I love this deck but with the INSANE amounts of spot removal and Grips to hit counterbalance in my meta I had to stop playing it. Has anyone found a way to fight through the hate? I've tried Kira but he/she kind of sucks otherwise.

I was thinking of a list quite similar to Paradigm Shift's one.
Cutting the trinket mages in my UB list for Goyfs and standtills for spot remova or for Cunning Wish, even though I'm not sure of cutting these.
By the way I would never drop Dreadnoughts under 3 of.

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Originally Posted by Paradigm Shift

Realizing that Dreadnaught is too fragile to commit two cards to early game against many decks, I figured two would be the right number in a deck, and he should be supported with really good early game cards. This lead me to this list. Looking for comments and suggestions.

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Running two Dreadnoughts isn't optimal, especially when you're not running Trinket Mage. You want at least three. Your manabase is awful, why are you running maindeck Islands, only 2 Sea, only 2 Trop, and a Bayou? If you want to take advantage of something like Back to Basics out of your board, I can understand why you'd run maindeck Island, but other than that, it just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Since I'm on the subject of not making sense, why are you running Mishra's, but no Standstill? And why in the world would you cut a Brainstorm for anything? If you're going to cut something, cut the awful creature removal you're running in Putrefy. What creatures (or artifacts) are you afraid of that you feel the need to run that card?

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Originally Posted by Jazzykat

I love this deck but with the INSANE amounts of spot removal and Grips to hit counterbalance in my meta I had to stop playing it. Has anyone found a way to fight through the hate? I've tried Kira but he/she kind of sucks otherwise.

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I've been fighting Fire with Fire. I've changed the list I had been running after I saw everyone making the most out of Counterbalance Top at the GP. I think it's best to run all 4 of your own Counterbalance, a full set of Top, and a full set of Daze to fight off Counterbalance. This way, you maximize your ability to set up Counterbalance Top (hopefully before your opponent) and you have Force and Daze to stop their Counterbalance. I like the Green splash build that gives you access to Goyf and SB Grip.

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I've been fighting Fire with Fire. I've changed the list I had been running after I saw everyone making the most out of Counterbalance Top at the GP. I think it's best to run all 4 of your own Counterbalance, a full set of Top, and a full set of Daze to fight off Counterbalance. This way, you maximize your ability to set up Counterbalance Top (hopefully before your opponent) and you have Force and Daze to stop their Counterbalance. I like the Green splash build that gives you access to Goyf and SB Grip.

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I agree with you here that the deck need an update with the GP results in mind.
First of i consider the Ur version as ideal, so i started from there. Like i posted in the Dreadstalker thread my approach is to add black instead of red for Confidant, Stalker and maybe Thoughtseize (Plague out of the board).
Confidant would replace Standstill, running both would be overkill in my opinion (with 4 BS and 2-4 SDT already in the deck). Stalker is a large beater beside Nought and people might side in useless GY hate because of him. Double black could be a problem, with Confidant in the deck i wouldnt run more than two (maybe in the board).

As you said a similiar thing can be achived by adding green for Goyf as big beater and keeping Standstill as CA engine.

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Originally Posted by jazzykat

I love this deck but with the INSANE amounts of spot removal and Grips to hit counterbalance in my meta I had to stop playing it. Has anyone found a way to fight through the hate? I've tried Kira but he/she kind of sucks otherwise.

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Kira also has the problem that once she lands you cannot stifle your own noughts effectively.

I had a Kira/Magus of the Abyss deck with Stiflenought as the other main effect and the suites collided so often that the deck never got past the nasty casual stage.

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Originally Posted by FoolofaTook

Kira also has the problem that once she lands you cannot stifle your own noughts effectively.

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Yes you can.

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Originally Posted by HammafistRoob

Yes you can.

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Details, you're not targeting the Dreadnought but the triggered ability.

Maybe I should go back and look at that deck again. It's the one I brought to Wareham a couple of times right after I got back into Magic and I completely missed the fact that I was stifling the ability on the stack not the nought itself.

Thanks for pointing out the blind spot.

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Originally Posted by deadlock

I agree with you here that the deck need an update with the GP results in mind.
First of i consider the Ur version as ideal, so i started from there. Like i posted in the Dreadstalker thread my approach is to add black instead of red for Confidant, Stalker and maybe Thoughtseize (Plague out of the board).
Confidant would replace Standstill, running both would be overkill in my opinion (with 4 BS and 2-4 SDT already in the deck). Stalker is a large beater beside Nought and people might side in useless GY hate because of him. Double black could be a problem, with Confidant in the deck i wouldnt run more than two (maybe in the board).

As you said a similiar thing can be achived by adding green for Goyf as big beater and keeping Standstill as CA engine.

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I've tinkered with Confidant in my weekly Legacy Tournaments here in VA and I think that's an idea with potential. DC doesn't die to Snuff Out and can be a huge headache for your opponent if they don't get rid of him. While I did miss Standstill and Tarmogoyf, it was nice to cut Mishra's Factory. If you cut Standstill and run Confidant, you can also run 2-3 Ponder which helped set up CounterTop in a few of the Top 16 GP Chicago Decks.

Has anyone tested a UR list with maindeck or sideboard Sowers?
Sower doesn't die to Krosan Grip, so it's a good alternative to Threads of Disloyalty seeing as Grip gets boarded in to deal with both Counterbalance and Dreadnought. Also, with the recent increase of Snuff Outs being played, CB flips Sower to counter it. And the deck has a lot of options of protecting it.

I tried to play with the Vedalken Shackles months ago, quite similar to Sower of Temptation but cutted them off. It'not what the deck needs.
I agree with cutting Standstill, but not Mishra's Factory.
And I also agree with playing a full set of CB/Top: the GP shows the results.
I don't think we also need Ponder: BS and SDT are enought library manipulation but I think we need another threat but Stalker is too "heavy" with confidant around. With the black splash there could be Hunted Horror, but it kinda sucks really.. Better splashing green for Tarmo and Krosan Grip.
I ask it again: anyone thinks Cunning Wish could fit the Board?

Despite GP results with Sower maindeck, i see the card only work in one scenario: In a MUC style deck, where the maindeck threats present themselves all immun to spot removal (eg Morphling) comes Sower out of the board. So your opponent never knows if he must keep the spot removal and if yes for how many Sowers?
In Dreadstill your opponent will keep his removal in every case, there is one thing so. I quite like Kira out of the board, which would accidentally synergizes with Sower aswell.

For Wish is see no room and no room / to slow or do you have some strong arguments for its inclusion?

GP top 8 featured a deck with i think 3 Stalkes and 3 SDT, so 4 SDT, 4 BS and 2 Stalker should be fine dont you think? He fulfills the role like Goyf and Nought as heavy beater which doesnt get hit by Grip, but doesnt require an additional splash (Goyf) and doesnt two for one you (Nought), so he can be cast more 'blindly' into your opponents removal.

I also dont think that Ponder is required, room is a problem too.

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Originally Posted by deadlock

So your opponent never knows if he must keep the spot removal and if yes for how many Sowers?

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Yeah but I've felt most 'spot removal' people sides in against me is Krosan Grip, and incidentally that's no good against Sower of Temptation

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Originally Posted by pippo84

I tried to play with the Vedalken Shackles months ago, quite similar to Sower of Temptation but cutted them off. It'not what the deck needs.

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I think that Sower would perform much better in this deck than Shackles would. Reason being the amount of non-islands this deck runs(7-8) isn't really the hottest thing for Shackles.

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Originally Posted by pippo84

I agree with cutting Standstill, but not Mishra's Factory.

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Cutting Standstill is the worst thing that you could ever do. Dreadstill is a deck that was designed to abuse the tempo gained from dropping either a Standstill or an early Dreadnought. If you cut Standstill, and rely on Dark Confidant to get massive card advantage, you better have a backup plan against decks like The Rock where Standstill shines and Bob blows. I probably like Bob more than any other magic player, but there is no way he can play the role of Standstill better than Standstill(especially in Dreadstill).

Also, if you do cut Standstill, cut Factory as well. It wouldn't make much sense to have a weaker manabase than neccesary.

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Originally Posted by pippo84

And I also agree with playing a full set of CB/Top: the GP shows the results.
I don't think we also need Ponder: BS and SDT are enought library manipulation but I think we need another threat but Stalker is too "heavy" with confidant around. With the black splash there could be Hunted Horror, but it kinda sucks really.. Better splashing green for Tarmo and Krosan Grip.

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You don't need 4 Tops unless you cut Trinket Mage. I personally splashed green for Goyf, but I could easily see a list with 4 Factory, 4 Dreadnought, 3 Trinket, and 2-3 Sower being a serious contender in a tournament.

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Originally Posted by pippo84

I ask it again: anyone thinks Cunning Wish could fit the Board?

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Cunning Wish is to slow and clunky. Before the new errata of Dreadnought came in this deck ran like a bad version of MUC. It ran Show and Tell Colossus, N. Disk, FoF and C. Wish. But ever since the Dreadnought combo was added to the deck Cunning Wish juat didn't make the cut. IMO it's just to slow, conditional, clunky, and plain uneeded. What are you planning to wish for anyways some bounce spell?

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Originally Posted by HammafistRoob

You don't need 4 Tops unless you cut Trinket Mage. I personally splashed green for Goyf, but I could easily see a list with 4 Factory, 4 Dreadnought, 3 Trinket, and 2-3 Sower being a serious contender in a tournament.

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My thoughts exactly, I'll be trying this in the near future. One of the other reasons to play Sower over both Threads of Disloyalty and Vedalken Shackles is the fact that it doesn't die to Krosan Grip, and everybody boards in Grips against Dreadstill.
Playing Sower instead of splashing for Goyf means I'll have a more stable manabase and retain the advantages of playing UR. As a side note, it takes care of Tombstalker which is thé card I've died to the most recently. UR has few things before boarding against a resolve Tombstalker.

Keep us updated on how your testing with Sower ends up. I'm really interested in him to.

Tombstalker is a pain in the ass game 1, but he doesn't get along with Echoing Truth very well.

Submerging it in response to a cracked Fetchland is priceless :)

I don't really like Echoing Truth. True, it costs two and that makes it stronger with CB, but paying that two mana is often daunting when there's so many other things you want to do with the mana.

I agree that Sower is better than Shackles, but you don't need to steal any creature playing a 12/12 trampler.

I was thinking of Cunning Wish to find answers at what we don't have MB: enchantments/artifacts, but I agree probably it's to slow.
Anyway seeing how many CB where played at the GP and also to fight Humility/Moat I'll try and cut 2 spaces in the MB for 2 Echoing Truth or Wipe Away. I don't like these cards much but they are the only answers an UB version which I play can have.
I will try some matches playing Stalker, even though I don't think it's really good with CB and Bob, but I'll give it a try.
I'll also try the Sower btw.

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You don't need 4 Tops unless you cut Trinket Mage. I personally splashed green for Goyf, but I could easily see a list with 4 Factory, 4 Dreadnought, 3 Trinket, and 2-3 Sower being a serious contender in a tournament.

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Roob, I'm curious why you wouldn't want to maximize use of Counterbalance + Top by running 4 Top with or without Trinket Mage? Can't we all agree that Turn 1 or Turn 2 SDT is better than Turn 3 Trinket Mage (for SDT), Turn 4 SDT?

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Originally Posted by URABAHN

Roob, I'm curious why you wouldn't want to maximize use of Counterbalance + Top by running 4 Top with or without Trinket Mage? Can't we all agree that Turn 1 or Turn 2 SDT is better than Turn 3 Trinket Mage (for SDT), Turn 4 SDT?

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But what would you cut for the third and fourth SDT. Trinket mage is still very important in this deck, since it can search SDT/DreadNought and EE (i play two EE mainboard). Having to tops, and having the ability to search for one is still as good. I would not want the 3 and 4 top in this deck, since they are dead cards when you already have one on the table. I would rather draw a trinket mage than a top when i have a top on the table.

@Maykol
playing with sowers is a good idea. Especially creating a manabase which is stronger against manadisruption. Although the problem is, it's 4 mana, so it will take a while to see play. Goyf is a turn 2 drop, and has helped me a lot recently. I'm playing the URG version now, and i like it better than the UR version because it runs goyf's and you can create the illusion that you play threshold g1.

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Originally Posted by Muppet86

But what would you cut for the third and fourth SDT. Trinket mage is still very important in this deck, since it can search SDT/DreadNought and EE (i play two EE mainboard). Having to tops, and having the ability to search for one is still as good. I would not want the 3 and 4 top in this deck, since they are dead cards when you already have one on the table. I would rather draw a trinket mage than a top when i have a top on the table.

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The idea of running 2 Sensei's Divining Top because you don't want to find another one and you'd rather have Trinket Mage instead is weak. Have you seen the 2nd Day Decklists from the GP that took full advantage of Counterbalance + Top? If you did, you'll notice a whole mess of people running 4 copies of Top. Obfuscate Freely explains the power of Top a little better with these comments from the Landstill thread

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At that point in the game, a redundant Top is rarely worse than the best card on top of your library.

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...an extra Top will simply convert itself into the best card in the top three of your library, for just :1:

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Trade the Top for the best card on top of your deck, then shuffle it away with a fetchland. Seems pretty good, right? I'm sure you can manage to fit two more Tops in just about any build of Dreadstill.

Here's a fairly typical core set of cards for Dreadstill

3-4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
3-4 Counterbalance
2-4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Standstill
4 Stifle
4 Daze
0-1 Trickbind
3-4 Polluted Delta
3-4 Flooded Strand
4 Mishra's Factory
2-3 Trinket Mage

That's 32-40 cards before adding just about any combination of the following cards:

Volcanic Island
Tropical Island
Tarmogoyf
Tundra
Swords
Basic Island
Wasteland
Underground Sea
Dark Confidant (you can cut Standstill and Mishra's Factory if you want to rely solely on DC's card advantage)

Are you really going to tell me that in your 60, you can't find room for 4 Tops?

Not to mention that having 2 tops in play isn't exactly bad. It's great to be able to cash one in to counter a 1 drop while still having the ability to manipulate your top 3 cards.