I believe the leyline of sanctity bear might be better. Shuts off tendrils, targeted discard and burn.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbone2016
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I believe the leyline of sanctity bear might be better. Shuts off tendrils, targeted discard and burn.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbone2016
Shuts off liliana too.Quote:
Originally Posted by EpicLevelCommoner
I have been fish bowling with bug pod and I feel like it's got too many 2cc, I cut phantasmal image for a third AD, so the curve wasn't effected. And I am liking the look now. What do u guys think?
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I think Phantasmal Image is really, really, really good. Like, image is a necessary piece of glue from the 1 drops. Doubling Thragtusk, Glen Elendra, et al. is a very, very good 1->2 effect in the deck. You're pushing incremental battles with one drops to your 5 drops or even 6 drops. I think at least one clone effect is really necessary, if you think it's Phyrexian Metamorph or Clone or Image... I think in a deck like this, you really do want one to get the most value out of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by whatwas
It's something that's a lot better in practice than in goldfishing because it opens up tons of plays. Example.
Facing D&T. I was ahead by quite a bit (I had some really good cabal therapies), had an Explorer, 2 Baleful Strix's and Viridian Corruptor (and 1 Deed) on board. My opponent had a Pithing Needle naming Deed, Mom, Sword of Fire and Ice and Grafdigger's Cage. I had Man-o'-War and Phantasmal Image in hand (and a Thragtusk and 5 land?). My opponent was at 6 poison and 11 life.
I played Man-o'-War targeting Corruptor. Passed. Replayed Corruptor, and targeted Pithing Needle, played Phantasmal Image, copying Corruptor, targeting SoFI (the Grafdiggers didn't really matter). I had 4 poison on board (weirdly), and was only going to be stopped at that point by a mirran crusader or 2 of 4 Swords to Plowshares left in his deck (his opener was 2 StP, and I had found a second Cabal Therapy after naming Stoneforge Mystic with my first one).
My opponent probably over-boarded a bit with Rest in Peace, Grafdigger's Cage and Pithing Needle.. as he drew into all of them, and the great part about Bug Pod is the creatures that you board in usually don't dilute the gameplan of hitting them for 2 every turn. You're still getting action with the cards you bring in.
True Believer? But....it's not an enchantment.Quote:
Originally Posted by EpicLevelCommoner
I'll probably stick with either Nether Void or curse of exhaustion (quite a beating when you can rector/tower it out when there are going off) as my storm/elves hate.
Whoa. Didn't actually see the Aegis spoiled. Not shabby.
Yeah: unfortunately it's easily removed, so against 'fair' decks it's a little more than a hurdle. Still: a rector target that can be reasonably hardcast early on isn't shabby at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbone2016
Also, another bonus (albeit still temporary): it shuts down Jace 2.0 as a fateseal engine, Karn Liberated as a discard engine, Gitaxian Probe in general ...
I've been playing scapeshift lately and doing well with the deck. It feels a lot more competitive than the punishing fire version (I.E. actually has a real ability to end the game) based on my experiences. This is the list I'm going to be playing this weekend at SCG Detroit, barring any last minute changes. So far I've been pleased with the 75 and slaughter games has been a beast against combo. I noticed a weakness to graveyard decks so I added 2 extirpate in the board. So far it's helped. The scavenging ooze is definitely necessary as it gives you a game one against dredge that you wouldn't otherwise have. The most disappointing card so far has been primeval titan, it's eaten a swords to plowshares every time and doesn't impact the board at all when it comes down as you usually don't have enough mountains in play until you've attacked with it at least twice (which never happens). I haven't seen many people talk about the deck lately in here, it's mostly been pod. Let me know if you have any suggestions.
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Wood Elves
1 Eternal Witness
2 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Thragtusk
1 Primeval Titan
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Burning Wish
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Scapeshift
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Thoughtseize
4 Taiga
2 Stomping Ground
3 Badlands
2 Mountain
2 Bayou
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Verdant Catacombs
3 Forest
2 Swamp
2 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
1 Phyrexian Tower
SB: 3 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 2 Thoughtseize
SB: 3 Slaughter Games
SB: 1 Scapeshift
SB: 1 Innocent Blood
SB: 1 Maelstrom Pulse
SB: 1 Toxic Deluge
SB: 2 Extirpate
SB: 1 Massacre
Good list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecstatic_Conch
I have replaced phyrexian tower with a lone karakas to better fight S&T, but this is rather a meta call.
I play 3 Huntmasters. The creature package is the same otherwise.
I'm usually playing 3 Cabal Therapy MD and one in the side, because I often find more relevant to wish for a CT rather than a TS.
I play 3 TS & 3 CT main deck in place of your 2 of Abrupt decay, but here again is rather a meta call (more combo.deck in my area so I like the extra discard MD)
2 Abrupt decay MD is a good call against an unknown (wide) field.
I would add a pyroclasm in your side, this card is bonker against tribal strategy & swarm.
I would also replace extirpate with surgical because T1 TS followed by surgical as won me non 0 amount of games against combo ! But I guess it is more a personal preference -> uncounterability or explosivity !
Here is my side:
SB: 2 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Pyroblast
SB: 1 Pyroclasm
SB: 1 Slaughter Games
SB: 1 Scapeshift
SB: 1 Innocent Blood
SB: 1 Maelstrom Pulse
SB: 1 Toxic Deluge
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 1 Cabal Therapy
SB: 1 Engineered explosives
SB: 1 Massacre
Hi. I still haven't had the time nor access to any of the cards to build nic fit :( Is anyone here still playing white? If so, do you have reports on Spirit of the Labyrinth? On the surface is still seems better than the new hatebears, just cause sneak and show sucks that way.
Athreos looks good. Very, very good.
I'm still playing Junk. I had SotL as a one of in my deck in Milwaukee. It would have been nice in round 8 but other then that it wouldn't have had much impact. I'll keep it in the main for a little while at least. Not sure about the enchantment creatures yet. If they had a black leyline creature....that would be awesome.Quote:
Originally Posted by pfiremc13
I replaced my copy of Phyrexian Tower with another fetch, seeing as getting the right colour of mana really is the achilles heel of this deck. The offchance of getting an insane turn 2 with tower/explorer really isn't worth it in this version.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecstatic_Conch
Going into such a wide meta and with the massive popularity of miracles it might be justified to replace the main deck abrupt decays for slaughter games. Having access to 2 slaughter games main and 1 in the sideboard is just brutal against that deck (although usually at my local meta I do play abrupt decays in these flex spots).
Consider replacing the thoughtseize for another thragtusk or huntmaster, as your creature count seems fairly low at the moment and these two value town creatures are of a higher impact that a singeton thoughtseize.
Apart from that, like Ralf said consider replacing the extirpates for surgical extractions (the no-mana investment does really outweigh the near uncounterability). I also second that pyroclasm.
Have fun crushing fair decks at the open! ;)
Thinking bout utilizing a singleton Cunning Wish in place of Diabolic Intent. How does this look for such a sideboard?
2 Sakura Tribe Elder
2 Pithing Needle
3 Duress
3 Surgical
1 Trickbind
1 Krosan Grip
1 Golgari Charm
1 Diabolic Edict
1 Echoing Truth
Ok...let me know how sotl does.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbone2016
Honestly, I don't really care that much about graveyard decks post-side except for the surgical extractions (which help against other decks as well obviously). Why do you think a lotv bear would help us when we already want des and scooze?
What do you think about athreos?
Interesting pod deck on camera.
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Missed it :( What was happening?
EDIT: Just watching the replay. Pretty sloppy play on both sides.
Yea - that botched CB trigger was pretty rough. I think the intent was: trigger cb, activate top flip, resolve first part of top and draw, trigger/resolve miracle, resolve cb trigger, finish resolving top flip and replace top on the deck.Quote:
Originally Posted by Philipp2293
Nothing resolves in between drawing a card and putting the top on your library. They are part of the same ability.Quote:
Originally Posted by anwei
Was that for the DRS resolution?
Hey guys, I'm brand new to Nic Fit (I've been playing burn since I got into Legacy a few months back), and I'm trying to do writeups of events I play just to sort of track and better focus my learning the deck. I posted it on my local forum but figured I'd cross-post it here and see if you guys had any thoughts. I'd definitely appreciate any comments/criticism on plays I made and/or how to improve upon these writeups!
Attempt #1: Pat's Games 4/19/14~10 people
Ran a list that looked something like this:
2 Swamp
2 Forest
2 Mountain
2 Bayou
1 Badlands
1 Taiga
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Volrath's Stronghold
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Huntmaster of the Fells
2 Eternal Witness
1 Primeval Titan
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Thragtusk
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Thoughtseize
3 Liliana of the Veil
4 Punishing Fire
3 Pernicious Deed
2 Abrupt Decay
Sideboard (Note that the SB was still mostly stuff I threw together at the last minute)
3 Red Elemental Blast
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Golgari Charm
1 Viridian Shaman
1 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Slaughter Games
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Blood Moon
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Innocent Blood
Here's how it went:
Round 1 vs Jason w/ Esper Deathblade
Game 1: He plays an Underground Sea and a Deathrite Shaman, I Cabal Therapy and hit one Brainstorm, planning to play Veteran Explorer on my second turn and sac it to CT, but it gets exiled by DRS. That puts me behind and he ends up getting way out ahead on the board, landing a Jace the Mindsculptor that I can't find a way to deal with (I don't get the Punishing Fire-Grove of the Burnwillows engine online), and manages to get out a Truename Nemesis and I think a Batterskull or perhaps a Umezawa's Jitte. I land a Pernicious Deed and wipe the board (except for Jace), and manage to cast Primeval Titan, who promptly ate a Swords to Plowshares. With that, Jace continues to fateseal me until he ults and wins the game.
I can't really remember what I boarded in or out, but I know I brought in Slaughtergames and REB
Game 2: I mull to 5 and keep an iffy hand in an attempt to have some cards in hand. I land a Veteran Explorer to gets Swords to Plowshares'd and then I land another who managed to swing for like 5 damage over a few turns of do-nothing grindiness. This all sort of builds to a climactic moment where I cast Thragtusk into a Force of Will and stumble a bit (note that Rest in Peace was in play, hosing my Eternal Witness rescue party). I somehow know he has a Batterskull in hand (I think he had just stoneforged it into his hand?) and make what feels like a misplay:
I'm without a red source and spin Sensei's Divining Top, seeing: Slaughtergames, Grove of the Burnwillows, Verdant Catacombs. I set them back Grove, Slaughtergames, Catacombs, and draw Grove for the turn. With that in mind, I then could have drawn a card with Sensei's Divining Top to get (and cast) Slaughtergames naming Batterskull. Jace The Mindsculptor would then have, of course, fatesealed the top away, but I don't feel I have a great answer to Batterskull, and when he ended up resolving it on his next turn, things got bad and I wasn't able to draw into any answers.
Matches: 0-1, Games: 0-2
Round 2 vs Ryan w/ ???
Round two I play against Ryan with some kind of crazy Charge Counters shenanigans combo deck? We only play one game and I don't really do anything because I couldn't draw into an answer for Ensnaring Bridge, before he took like 10 turns in a row and ulted Tezzeret the Seeker and attacked me for 25.
Matches: 0-2, Games: 0-3
Round 3 vs Sarah Lynn w/ American Delver/Stoneblade/Something?
I had sort of a headache after round 2 so my memory here is pretty iffy and my notes aren't all that helpful, but we'll see what I can do
Game 1: She resolves a Batterskull pretty quickly and I manage to wipe the board with Pernicious Deed (I think?). She follows up not long after with a Truename Nemesis equipped with Umezawa's Jitte, who closes things out pretty quickly.
-1 Sensei's Divining Top
-2 Thoughtseize
+1 Viridian Shaman
+2 Golgari Charm
Game 2 I mull into a meh hand again, and land a T1 Veteran Explorer, who gets Swords to Plowshares'd immediately. This puts me behind again, and she manages to get way out in front on the board, with something like a Stoneforge Mystic withUmezawa's Jitte a Truename Nemesis and a Delver of Secrets. I draw a Pernicious Deed and wipe the board which buys me a little bit of time. We go back and forth on topdecks, she plays a delver, I golgari charm it, etc. I cast a Cabal Therapy naming Brainstorm, and see a Batterskull, Sword of Feast and Famine, and a Lightning Bolt. I have a Viridian Shaman in hand and panic a bit. So I play it (with no artifacts on board to destroy) and sac it to Cabal Therapy to take out the skull. She finally plays a Stoneforge Mystic and lands a Sword of Feast and Famine and I make a sort of lame play of waiting until AFTER she equipped it to cast Punishing Fire, which of course did nothing (should have played it in response to equipping). The sworded Stoneforge took me down to 6, then 3, then I died to a bolt.
Matches: 0-3, Games: 0-5--After that, I had a bunch of research to take care of for a paper so I dropped.
So, not my best showing, but I didn't really expect it to be, given that these were my first 5 games with the deck.
As far as what I could learn, it seems like I really need to pay attention to what hands are keepable and not, and how to sideboard different matchups. There were some sloppy plays for sure, and I think I need to work on getting into a more "control"-y mindset, and maybe focus a little less on playing proactively like I did with Burn? Wasting the Viridian Shaman was a pretty lame play. It seems like the point of strength in control is to be responding to things, but I guess I worry a bit about being a control deck with no counters? Maybe the way to go is to focus on removal and hand control until you know you can get your finishers through?
What worked:
-Pernicious Deed was definitely the all-star of the day, and ultimately helped me stabilize a bunch of times
-Sensei's Divining Top, when I had it, was pretty sweet. Feels a little awkward drawing more than one, but perhaps having multiples in play isn't the worst thing? (some degree of insurance?)
What didn't work:
-I feel like once I stabilized by wiping the board, I wasn't ever really able to land any kind of meaningful finisher? Maybe that's just bad luck with Primeval Titan and Thragtusk getting Swords'd or Forced, and maybe some bad luck in not drawing them (or Green Sun's Zenith when I needed them? Kessig Wolf Run could definitely find a place in the MB, but I'm not really sure what I'd cut for it.
-Veteran Explorer getting exiled a bunch of times was a total pain, but I guess that's just going to happen sometimes? Leading with a Cabal Therapy feels better, but for some reason I just hardly ever drew them?
-I hate Batterskull
Overall though, it seems like a really fun deck and I'm looking forward to getting some more games in and hopefully figuring this beast out.
I hate Batterskull as well ^_^, especially in Death and Taxes where Veteran Explorer gives them enough mana to reliable cast it and "protect" it. My advice against this would be to run Wickerbough Elder or another GSZ target with a Naturalize activated ability WITHOUT a tap cost. That way, you can destroy the token, GSZ for the Elder, and from there play it by ear (if they don't bounce the Skull in response to the GSZ, you can activate the ability in response to that, and if they do, you can potentially followup with Liliana 2.0/Therapy).Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRealQuin
Veteran Explorer is definitely one of the most crucial--and vulnerable--aspects of Nic Fit. Just gonna happen sometimes when you're just not gonna set one off because of bounce or exile effects. Definitely run at least 2 Sakura Tribe Elder in your 75 though: definitely useful against Swords to Plowshares or even Batterskull (block, sacrifice before damage is dealt: no damage so no lifelink).
Anyhow, from my experience, non-Scapewish Nic Fit is a special kind of control: our most powerful control elements (Therapy, GSZ and Deed) are fairly proactive, but powerful nonetheless. We also do not close out a game easily: instead, we frequently switch from the control role to the beatdown role and attempt to decrement the opponent's life total gradually (hence why Batterskull is the devil) before returning to the control role. Can't offer much more advice than that, as I'm still attempting to learn the various matchups myself.