[Deck] ANT (Ad Nauseam Tendrils) Storm Combo

Hi guys,

Ive been testing alot of different ANT builds lately.. I like the fact that if my opponents keep in removal for Xantid Swarm or Dark Confidant that I can blank that. Not giving them value from bad cards..
How do you like this list? I'd like some opinions from the more experienced players here.. I also feel that maxing out the cantrips runs way smoother then running some one offs like chrome mox/sdt..

2 Island
1 Swamp
2 Gemstone Mine
4 Polluted Delta
3 Scalding Tarn
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
1 Ad Nauseam
4 Brainstorm
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
2 Cabal Therapy
4 Duress
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Past in Flames
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
1 Tendrils of Agony
Sideboard
3 Carpet of Flowers
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Chain of Vapor
1 Cabal Therapy
4 Dread of Night
1 Tropical Island
1 Karakas

Greetz

Isn't that just the "SCG-special" list that was popular a little while ago? and you shouldn't be bringing xantid swarms against decks with removal anyway

Yes, the MD is Adam Prosak's. But that was my point aswell.. Why play Xantid Swarm if you dont even bring it in against decks like BUG,RUG,UWR,UR Delver / Miracles because they all have plenty removal and will most likely keep some number of LB/STP/decay whatever in the postboard games

You want xantid for decks like sneak attack and reanimator, Bob is more of a meta/personal call.

@rancOr_:
That's basically adam prosak's ant list a few years ago and a solid one to start with.
What i don't like are 16 cantrips,seems way to much.i tested the list when i started to play ant and often ended up cantripping in more cantrips into more cantrips...for a few turns.
The deck is a 2,8 turn deck which becomes a 3,5 deck with this amount if cantrips (and 2 islands)

@ cheerios:
Against Bug Delver with Lilianas i now board like this:

+ 3 Young Pyromancer
-1 Chrome Mox
-1 Ad Nauseam
-1 Lotus Petal

Young Pyrmancer becomes a real business here,just ask your opponent over and over again:"Do you have the answer?no?then you'll probably die very soon"




- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -

Has anyone tried TNT recently? I'm thinking something like Timo Schuneumann's list from Ghent: http://www.eternal-central.com/?p=3216

@Kai

Did you encounter any difficulties with the reduced number of red sources post-board?

Cheers

Now i have 1 volcanic island and 1 badlands so there isn't a problem at all.
Dropping pyromancer on turn 1 with lotus petal is also extremely good.


- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lordofthepit

Has anyone tried TNT recently? I'm thinking something like Timo Schuneumann's list from Ghent: http://www.eternal-central.com/?p=3216

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Yes, and I cannot recommend it. Burning Wish makes this deck cluncy and dependent on Volcanic/Badlands which aren't the usual fetch-targets.
Several other arguments speak against this build but also in favor like the possibilities to have Empty or Massacre preboard. BW helps also against Miracles, where it can search for additional Tendrils. In the end, the deck runs much smoother without Wish.

I've played extensively with Burning Wish ANT (or TNT if you prefer). If Maverick (read: Gaddock Teeg) ever becomes a significant factor in the meta again then that would be one argument for playing with Wishes. Other arguments along the same line are: a Wish sideboard gives you outs to awkward and otherwise very-hard-to-beat cards such as Leyline of Sanctity (through Reverent Silence) and troublesome artifacts like Sphere of Resistance and Chalice of the Void @1 or 2 (through Meltdown).

The arguments against running Wishes are primarily:

- The dissynergy between Burning Wish and Past in Flames where if you wish for PiF you don't get to re-use your wish as it is now exiled.
- The amount of clunky "rainbow" openers and draws you can get. Especially ones with multiples of Infernal Tutor and Burning Wish where you are looking at a turn 3-4 and beyond horizon.
- The extra sideboard slots you get when not running Wish.
- The strain on your mana base (I find this less of an issue tbh).

At the end of the day Burning Wish gives you more opportunities in the long game but also often forces you into those longer games. Running with no wishes generally just feels smoother to me.

Placed 3rd at SCG Knoxville with this list:

Lands (15)
1 Island
1 Swamp
1 Badlands
4 Polluted Delta
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island

Spells (45)
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Ad Nauseam
4 Brainstorm
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Duress
4 Gitaxian Probe
1 Grim Tutor
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Past in Flames
4 Ponder
2 Preordain
1 Tendrils of Agony

Sideboard
2 Defense Grid
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Dark Confidant
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Chain of Vapor
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Massacre
1 Pyroclasm
1 Karakas

Played against RUG Delver round 1. Won game 1 due to his flood of creatures and lands. Lost game 2 to double FoW when I went for Tutor discarding PiF with LED. Won game 3 racing with goblins into mini tendrils for a super close game.

Round 2 was Manaless Dredge. Game 1 he durdled turns 1 and 2 and I killed him on my turn 3. Game 2 he started ripping my hand apart right away. Game 3 I lead with a Grafdigger's Cage and easily assembled a tutor chain to kill with while he could do nothing.

Round 3 was Belcher. He won the roll and kept his 7 so I figured I was dead, but he was a mana short and didn't draw it turn 2 so I got him on my turn 2. Game 2 he mulled to 5 and scared me by starting to go off, but was again short on mana to activate belcher. Surprisingly easy 2-0

The fourth round was against UWR delver. Game 1 I took his only blue card to go with his FoW and played around Bolt to PiF into cantrips for the kill. Game 2 I Duressed into Defense Grid into the easy PiF kill.

Next was Deathblade. Won the roll and killed him on my turn 2 as he whiffed on his BS. Game 2 I punted forgetting to draw with my Top before casting tutor. Game 3 I lead Bob turn 1 and built up my hand as he had Meddling Mage on the board. Checked his hand saw 1 FoW, cast Defense Grid into it to get it countered, cast Massacre for the easy win from there.

Round 6 was BUG Delver. Played through a Daze to kill him on my turn 2. Didn't board anything in and Duressed him on turn 2 into tutor chain.

Double drew into top 8 from here.

Round 1 of the top 8 was Junk Deadguy. Game 1 he taps his Deathrite to Vindicate my land on his turn 2. I had another in hand and easily won from there since he had no disruption. Game 2 he locks me out and I see no anti hate cards nor combo cards to gain any traction. Game 3 was really good since he led Cage into Thalia into Deathrite + RiP. I have a Turn 1 bob that is just ripping me a ton of cards. Eventually he attacks with everything putting me down to 3. I check my SB and see that I have 2 cards that kill me on the spot left in my deck, PiF had been exiled and Tendrils was in my hand. I flip a Pyroclasm to go to 1, kill the Thalia and easily cast the next 7 spells plus Tendrils for the kill.

Round 2 of the top 8 was a nightmare, since the UR painter deck was running 4 FoW, 2 Flusterstorm, 1 Swan Song, 4 REB, and 2 Pyroblast all in the main as well as a Tormod's Crypt. The one redeeming thing from game 1 was that I got to Cabal Therapy 3 Intuition out of his hand in 1 turn. I hit 8 out of my 15 lands and still could have killed him but got Tormod's Crypt activated on me the turn before I could. Game 2 I land an early bob to start the beats and attempt to kill him after checking his hand, but he flips top and casts intuition for 2xFlusterstorm and Swan Song. I proceed to beat him to death with bob and the bird, while holding CoV just in case. Game 3 my hand never really comes together, but I still manage to make 16 Goblins turn 3 due to naturally drawing EtW. I was a turn off of killing him as he activates Grindstone. The tail end of this match is on Twitch.

Really liked my list all weekend, only thing I would change would be the English Top for a German one.

Also the discussion of YP seems interesting and I will be trying them out. Also whomever said that BW would be good again if Mav made a comeback, I agree 110%.

If anyone would like more detail just ask.

Also PS never cast Ad Nauseam all day.

Congrats and a big high 5 from germany !

Interesting that you board in Empty the warrens against Painterdecks,especially with welder and intuition.
It should be really easy for your opponent to get rid of the green dudes because he can simply intuition for ratched Bomb.
But anyway


I'm interested in Defense grid,why do you think it's better than xantid swarm right now?


- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lordofthepit

Has anyone tried TNT recently? I'm thinking something like Timo Schuneumann's list from Ghent: http://www.eternal-central.com/?p=3216

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I've played a ton with this style of deck in general and just put it back together on MTGO and have had pretty good results. I believe it to be the best storm variant. It has the smooth manabase of ANT (so long as you don't splash green on top of burning wish) with the tutor density of TES. I like you don't have to play preordain; you dick around a lot less and just kill them way more often. Also, having access to Wish->Massacre saves a lot of unwinnable game 1's against hatebears while also giving you access to empty without needing a mainboard slot for it.

I don't see why you would ever run grafdigger's cage over surgical extraction or even extirpate in this archetype. Our main engine is shut off by cage. Cards you care about out of dredge: cabal therapy and dread return if they reach critical mass for return to kill you via FKZ or something like it. Against reanimator surgical is far better as well since if we strip a FoW out of their hand and surgical it even if they have griselbrand in play they have to draw 2 additional copies of FoW in order to stop us then and it isn't uncommon for them to show and tell against us so we could never surgical their reanimation target anyways.

Young pyromancer is interesting to be sure. It is indeed insane in this deck if you resolve it postboard as they are unlikely to beat an army of 1/1's. I like that it laughs in the face of flusterstorm, swan song, and spell pierce. It's like a different kind of empty the warrens really that isn't as all in as you typically have to infernal with a hellbent hand to make empty a line of play/it doesn't dodge countermagic as after past in flames was printed all the good players counter infernal tutor.

Wish -> massacre is indeed absurd. I can attest to that having played DDFT recently where massacre has been an all star to wish for. I'm not sold on wish in here though over grim tutor. The problem with wish has always been that it doesn't really find business or a way to kill the opponent that turn. When I played wish it was often finding grim tutor and 2RBB, pay 3 life: Find a single card in your maindeck isn't exactly efficient. As well as the wishboard taking up space issue as well since the sideboard is already tight enough.

Yep People,test Young Pyromancer and please also give me your feedback,would really appreciate it for future deck-building.

And of course a big thank you for your feedback and comments on pyromancer so far guys !



- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sawatarix

Yep People,test Young Pyromancer and please also give me your feedback,would really appreciate it for future deck-building.

And of course a big thank you for your feedback and comments on pyromancer so far guys !



- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -

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Hey Kai.

Well I got the Young Pyromancers inc with the mail so will test them out soon :smile: Am a little concerned that they won't work as well in my build with Empty the Warrens in the main as in a non-trivial amount of matches my opponent will have seen (and hopefully lost to) Empty during game 1 and will therefor be more aware of keeping/bringing in wrath effects.

I might have to try your double Ad Nauseam tech a try :smile:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sawatarix

Interesting that you board in Empty the warrens against Painterdecks,especially with welder and intuition.
It should be really easy for your opponent to get rid of the green dudes because he can simply intuition for ratched Bomb.
But anyway
- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -

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I was also curious about this, and I was wondering what the contents of the brainstorm on your combo turn game 3 was.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cuthbertthecat

I've played a ton with this style of deck in general and just put it back together on MTGO and have had pretty good results. I believe it to be the best storm variant. It has the smooth manabase of ANT (so long as you don't splash green on top of burning wish) with the tutor density of TES. I like you don't have to play preordain; you dick around a lot less and just kill them way more often. Also, having access to Wish->Massacre saves a lot of unwinnable game 1's against hatebears while also giving you access to empty without needing a mainboard slot for it.

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Been seeing you a bit more lately on MTGO and I'm a fan of you running these crazy combo deck variations! Congrats for having guts and running them!

I've always thought Burning Wish was pretty decent in ANT just because of more Tutor action. In the US there are lot of Esper Stoneblade / BUG decks running targeted discard (basically Thoughtseize), and it's extremely hard to find another tutor after they discard one of them. Very frustrating actually. I top 32'd a SCG and lost 2 games due to not being able to find a tutor against Stoneblade-esk decks and dying to a single Stoneforge Mystic :( Not running Abrupt Decay does hurt the Miracle matchup but it allows us to win game 1s against D&T almost instantly once we find a BW. So I guess there are give/take factors here for that. That's what I'm split between, basically a more consistent mana base + Decay. But thanks for your input, I love seeing you on MTGO!

In my testing I've almost never won against a single Hymn to Tourarch (BUG Delver I'm speaking of). Dark Confidant says to mitigate this a bit but I'm almost certain from my testing that it's not a guaranteed out to it. Running Ignorant Bliss is almost laughable in my opinion.

Also I have not been a fan at all of Ad Nauseam in ANT lately, I've never cast it to win, because you're usually using 1-2 LED / Petals to find them and have 1 or no mana floating after resolving it. Then you're up to their mercy to see if they have the cards in hand to deal with your new 7 basically. I think Ad Nauseam is only optimal if your list has more free mana sources (Chrome Mox) to support it. Paying 10-12 life to draw 7-10 cards and not killing them 70% of the time (estimate) is not good enough in my mind. Empty the Warrens may be a better option against various fair decks in the US. Has anyone else had this frustration w/ Ad Nauseam?

Right now I'm torn between ANT (my pet deck of choice for a long time) and Shardless BUG for the invitational in Columbus next month. The meta here is a lot of Esper Stoneblade, BUG Delver, D&T, most likely miracles and I'm expecting a small number of combo for this tournament. So I'm going to target my deck to try to beat these fair decks w/ discard. Anyone have any advise with the mindset I should have with this tournament?

Thanks and congrats to all the BoM ANT players w/ their finish!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jessenator

Anyone have any advise with the mindset I should have with this tournament?

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Play what you love to play and know best.