It's not the best removal but Blessed Alliance meets those requirements and the untap mode is fairly relevant with Knights and Deathrites.Quote:
Originally Posted by Megadeus
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It's not the best removal but Blessed Alliance meets those requirements and the untap mode is fairly relevant with Knights and Deathrites.Quote:
Originally Posted by Megadeus
Blessed alliance is one I have tried as well. Getting rid of Marit Lage is pretty sick without giving them life. I turned everyone at my local on to the card when it first came out because there were like 3 people playing turbo True name derp blade decks. I never loved it as much in practice like I did in theory though.
Managed to pull off a 5-0 with the same list.
Grixis Delver: 2-0
Grixis Control: 2-1
Grixis Delver: 2-0
BUG Delver: 2-1
Burn: 2-0
I got really lucky g3 against BUG Delver with him bricking on green mana, and me beating a lili with 8 counters (and THAT is why you play punishing fire folks!)
The more I play this list the more I love it. It is basically a slightly different D&T, with many games decided by a Stoneforge. P Fire combo is nuts vs all the tempo as well, not to mention every time you cast Swords you can just recur P fire without grove.
How does the miracles match feel? I feel like their best plan is to get early CB lock against you and you don't have decay too answer
Miracles is probably our thoughest matchup, is always a matter of can you disrupt and give enough damage before they lock you down?
Punishing Fire variants can give you a big edge because you attack on many angles however I prefer to play the D&T version of the deck.
To fight against them my plan currently is: Choke, Teeg, Phyrexian Revoker, Thoughtseize if on the play, Prelate on 1 or Prelate on 6 - sometimes Council's Judgment can screw up this plan.
Added Aether Vial + Recruiter and can say is the nuts as it allows for a deeper range of plays.
Current list that I have been testing:
3 Mother of Runes
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Deathrite Shaman
2 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Recruiter of the Guard
2 Sanctum Prelate
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Aether Vial
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Karakas
1 Horizon Canopy
2 Bayou
2 Savannah
1 Scrubland
1 Tropical Island
SB: 3 Thoughtseize
SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution
SB: 2 Choke
SB: 1 Council's Judgment
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1 Qasali Pridemage
SB: 1 Phyrexian Revoker
@warai that list is totally awesome! I want to give it a try when I can.
Miracles is certainly a tough one, particularly non-ponder variants, because they spend less time tapping out in the early turns with reduces the efficacy of all of our permanent-based answers, primarily Choke, and has led me to consider cutting Choke for Armageddon or Tsunami. I think we need some angle of a huge blowout, as we often don't win a grindy 1-for-1 war. I do like bringing in Choke as a hedge against delver and blade/shardless however, and more expensive cards would surely be worse here.
My boarding plan vs Miracles is this:
-4 Swords to Plowshares
-1 Mother of Runes
-1 Deathrite Shaman/Noble/BoP depending on how I feel
-1 Knight of the Reliquary
I am unsure of the creatures to cut, but my reasoning here is that I want to get blown out by Terminus less, and Knight is sort of slowly and clunky.
+1 Chandra, Pyromaster (main reason for her inclusion is Miracles, but also Strix decks/Elves, grindy)
+1 Choke (Same as Chandra, but tempo and grindy blue)
+1 Pithing Needle (obvious)
+1 Phyrexian Revoker (obvious)
+1 Rec Sage (CB, Moon, in rare cases top under Needle or Revoker)
+2 Banishing Light (Jace, CB, Blood Moon)
It is certainly possible that I should cut Jitte or Batterskull too, but I kind of like all equipment on deck for getting max value out of SFM and turning each dork into a threat. Batterskull also a castable threat under an early blood moon. Also, they will answer the first couple of equip sometimes, and having that 3rd go the distance can happen. Maybe even cutting the 4th P Fire could work, but I like having as many as possible for pressuring Jace, answers mentor sometimes etc.
I would say my biggest weakness is lack of answers for CB. I was thinking about K Grip, but it seemed too narrow. Ancient Grudge is a legit way to grind out D&T and Shardless, so that's why that is there.
I think Miracles is a 45% matchup, but certainly winnable, moreso if you include more hate. I haven't been running into it much though, I am facing way more delver and shardless currently in the leagues.
Got to end a game 3 vs eldrazi with 77 life
http://i.imgur.com/mNajVGy.jpg
Eldrazi seems to be a easy match up to me. I tested against white drazi earlier and got turn 1 thought knotted on the draw and won pretty easily. I did draw three green Sun though. Displacer is real hard to beat though.
Went 4-0 in local I guess tonight. Beat aluren basically by mana denial with waste, thalia, and scooze against deathrites. Feels like a pretty easy match up I think. I was debating playing a second canonist in the board, but meh. Otherwise I beat deathblade as well. Game 1 presented a quick jitte on thalia and denied him his jitte. Game two he bricked on lands and I kept him off of deathrite with scooze and choked him. I really want to play a second scooze main again, but dunno what to cut. Definitely don't want to go below 2 pridemage which already feels low. I like new Thalia as a 2 of. Feels like the right number. Tried Dromokas command. Boarded it against aluren but didn't draw it. It's probably terrible. Might try to get some testing in tomorrow. I surprisingly haven't really missed SoFaI. Maybe a bit against BUG, but skull has been fine.
Huh interesting. Sofai started out for TNN for me, but I quickly realized it is big game in the Miracles matchup. Recently I just started using same package as D&T, because I figure those dudes have it solved. Skull auto-wins so many games it's ridiculous. SoLaS is great with hatebears vs Miracles, but I think skull takes priority right now, especially in punishing.
3-2 in today's league:
Eldrazi: 2-1
Dredge: 2-1
Storm: 2-0
Omnisneak: 0-2
Omnisneak: 0-2 (same guy, jpa93 who wrote the sneak and show primer)
Pretty much no hope in the omnisneak matchup. Rec sage gets blown out by cunning wish on the omnitell, also you have to try and guess which "combo" he is going to put in (if you have Knight in hand and Canonist/Rec Sage/Needle you can only put 1, if you play them before that you risk them getting countered).
Regular show and tell is fine, but this version is optimized to beat hatebears, which is pretty much our only mountable defense.
Omniderp is pretty rough. You need Thalia just to slow them down and hope they don't just have it all. It's another reason I'm debating a second canonist in my board
Yeah, in my game 2 I even showed in canonist, he puts in omni, passes back to me, I play Knight, he goes cunning wish eot for something, plays emrakul on his turn and I'm dead.
Whats everyones plan vs Eldrazi? It feels like a 60-40 if they don't get a turn 1 chalice and 40-60 if they do. I just can't ever keep up when they play turn 1 chalice.
Get a big Knight or Scavenging Ooze.Quote:
Originally Posted by CRich3
Don't lean too heavily on DRS/Hierarch hands if you're on the play.
Side out all your Moms G2/G3.
Tricks with Knight and Scryb Ranger to power out Wastelands can put them real far behind.
Having Batterskull in your equipment package helps, too.
Scooze, Stoneforge (if you play BSkull), Knight are all MVPs. New Thalia does some fucking work. Don't think I've lost a sanctioned match against the deck, but it is something I like having something for in the sideboard. I don't think I've lost a game I've gotten an active KOTR though. Do watch out for All is Dust out of the board. I did lose an unloseable game where I didn't think I could lose so I didn't waste him and he got 7 mana and dusted me.
They are really weak to wasteland. Don't feel bad if you lose to the nut draw, we all do.
Sorry to spam this thread, but I figured I would share my results from another league:
Storm: 2-1
Death and Taxes: 1-2 (Super close game with a crucial deciding turn where I punted and tapped out)
Shardless: 0-2
Shardless: 2-0 (same dude)
Eldrazi: 2-0
Here is the turn from the D&T match:
http://i.imgur.com/LY6diQr.jpg
So my opponent used recruiter to fetch up Orzhov Pontiff (castable via Cavern, which I didn't realize at the time).
My options:
1) Hold up Punishing Fire and play knight (SMART)
2) Hold Up Punishing Fire and hold up b skull vial mana (LESS SMART, BUT NOT HORRIFICALLY STUPID)
2) Play Batterskull for 5 mana (HORRIFICALLY STUPID)
For some reason I go with option number three (really can't explain why I thought to do this) and get completely blown out.
Had I left up p fire, he goes pontif. My Revoker and mom die. If he goes to equip, I can p fire something in response, saving me for 1 more turn, during which I can tutor up a grove and kill his last two creatures, and my knight is out of Jitte Kill range. This should have been a 4-1, but I was a dingus :3
On the plus side, I am 55.55% win rate, which means at least I am not losing money by continuing to play ^_^
Last post for the day I promise!
So I updated my list:
3 Deathrite Shaman
1 Noble Hierarch
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Mother of Runes
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Scryb Ranger
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Punishing Fire
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
2 Savannah
2 Taiga
1 Plateau
1 Bayou
1 Forest
1 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
3 Wooded Foothills
3 Wasteland
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Karakas
1 Horizon Canopy
Sideboard
2 Pyroblast
2 Choke
2 Banishing Light
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Pithing Needle
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Containment Priest
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Crop Rotation
I believe this to be much closer to a "perfect" list, and then I popped my Miracle cherry!
http://i.imgur.com/jSINYp8.jpg
The trick is to try and avoid getting blown out by blind flips. Example, I played a Scryb Ranger, he revealed some non 1 mana spell, and I pyroblasted the cb after. Sometimes you have to jam into it, but it can be avoided with smart play sometimes.
Looks like your opponent was either unlucky or bad. I think 80% of my games against miracles I don't get to wasteland them before turn 4 or 5
Either way, i'll take what I can get.