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I think most people move to the discord channel, which I find hardly readable.
From what I saw, most people remove NO to go in the grindy match. But it probably depends what are your silver bullets.
In my case, I have done some testing against Grixis Delver, and I find the match-up completely horrible. I don't understand how we are supposed to be favored. Cabal therapy is competely ruining my hand most of the time...
Glad I'm not the only one who thinks that.Quote:
Originally Posted by TiMeWaLk
Elves is favored against czech pile, I've also had a hard time when the deck appeared, but then I started to play more and more the MU, and I think elves is pretty favored in it. I like going to the value game, but elves really need to push their advantage between turns 2-4, also something important is that they have very few counterspells, but NO is pretty to achieve because they will be gunning all our elves, so I like to play the value game much more in g2/g3 taking all NO outs and bringing decay for Leovold or strange things they can have, in g1 I usually just try to combo off.Quote:
Originally Posted by parsimonious
There's a stream from julian playing this MU, not THAT long ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0diaB78xnw
We are pretty favored vs Grixis Delver, actually we are like not that soft to therapy like most other combo decks are. How are you playing/sideboarding for this MU?Quote:
Originally Posted by TiMeWaLk
Hello Raizen884,
I have tested without SB first, on 20 games. The version of Grixis I tested against was playing Cabal and Probe main deck. That was hurting me super hard, because it could remove the key cards. (NO and card advantage) I noticed I was having a hard time doing good glimpse if it was not in my opening hand... maybe I should keep more Elves in hand.
After SB I plan to remove NO completely and bring in Decay for Delvers, Choke and maybe Jitte if I put it in the 75.
Thanks,
TW
Picking up elves again for the first time in years..Can anyone explain a general strategy and some of the better lines to take against the current deck to beat section? Pre board and post board (using a typical sideboard) if possible...
for reference DnT, Eldrazi, Miracles, Dark depths, Czech pile Grixis tempo, sneak and show and elves are currently decks to beat.
Thanks !
Make creatures -> make mana -> resolve NO/Craterhoof Behemoth, rince & repeat.
Hey Blink, that's a big ask... I'd suggest you pop into the Discord channel for Elves and also read back about 20 or so pages (2017 forward). Echeleon's post, while a bit troll-ish, is generally correct. One of the strength of elves is that we have a clear game plan in 9/10 games we have the same goal-- make dudes, make mana, deal lots of trample damage. Sure not all games go that way, for example in some matchups we become a weird tempo/control deck by using a ton of discard or abrupt decays to slow the game down to a winnable pace.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blink
Again, my best advice is to read back and consume as much prior content as possible. Then jam lots of games and ask questions along the way--THEN, if after a few weeks you have more specific questions or are having trouble with certain decks, come back and ask away!!
How I got up to speed when i completed my elves deck:
1. watch videos of reid duke, julien and others playing elves.
2. Elves wants to race against other decks so goldfish and practice finding lines of combos and interactions between the elves.
3. read this thread.
4. just go out and play.
Well I never report, but since its fresh on my head I'll put here once :).
Went 3-1 on the store here,
Round 1 RB Reanimator (2-0): I'm on the play, opp mulls to 6, I know that I am playing vs reanimator and my hand was gsz, 2 fetches, quirion, DRS, heritage, gaea's. Perfect hand for a 20/80 mu g1. Opp mulls to 6, I open on DRS bayou, her hand was a t2 combo with TS possibly 1 if she did draw ritual or petal, so she scries to the bottom, but she doesn't have that extra mana to go entomb reanimate on the same turn, so she TS me, takes quirion and passes. On my turn I play a land, GSZ for 1 to get a quirion and then I stablish a hard lock when I untap because she doesn't play collective main.
SB: - 2 NO, - Craterhoof, - 2 heritage, - 2 nettle, -visionary, - Nissa
+ 2 Surgical, + 2 ThoughtSeize, + 3 Cabal Therapy, + 1 Mindbreak Trap, + Ooze
Round 2: My opening was 1 TS, 1 CT, GSZ, DRS, Fetch, Heritage, Mindbreak Trap. She starts, she goes fetch entomb petal reanimate, and I MBT her reanimate (that felt so good XD), from there I play TS, I prefered TS over DRS first because I wanted to get any other reanimation spell, and I discard exhume and t2 DRS... I just keep DRS up until I draw a second land, around t4 to play GSZ for quirion, then I CT for Dark Ritual because I saw one on her hand, and a way to lose this game was just going crazy on rituals and Grisel so I prefered hitting that over anything and its over.
Round 2 Punishing RUG(1-2): G1 My hand was full mana, 2 Nettle, Heritage, 2 fetches, Quirion, Hoof. He starts the game, he plays scalding tarn pass. I start on basic forest nettle, he then plays another scalding and passes. I attack with nettle, play another fetch and another nettle and pass, he plays BS, another fetch and passes, I grab dryad, he bolts the dryad. I then attack for 4 play a bayou and quirion. He plays another lands and pfires quirion, I then untap, play heritage, tap 3, play wirewood, return heritage, replay heritage, tap for more 3 (4 floating), play wirewood, return the heritage replay the heritage, cradle for 5 tap the 3 elves and hoof him.
SB: -3NO - 2 heritage -nettle - Reclamation Sage - , +2 Surgical, + 2 Abrupt Decay, + 2 Choke, + 1 Rishkar
G2: His hand was perfect, I don't even remember my hand, I know he bolted my t1 creature, pfires the second creature, on the turn 3 he has grove + pfire and fows my attempt to play visionary with wirewood and pfires all my board to nothing.
G3: This one I got soooo mad, my hand was 1 lander with forest, with 2 nettle, heritage, visionary, abrupt decay, choke and nissa. It was perfect if I had another land, but then I decide to go because its harder to get much better at 6, he mulls to 6, my odds now was like 90/10, because he would need a lot of spot removals AND I don't draw any lands AND I don't draw quirion, guess what he had, he opened on bolt the nettle, bolt the second nettle, pfire heritage I play the drawn drs he has a second pfire on hand and I go 6 turns without seeing a second land or quirion or gsz or another drs, that was brutal.
Round 3 Merfolk(2-0): G1 I mull to 5 he mulls to 6, my hand was fetch, drs, 3 glimpse hahah... I guess I need to go, he starts, he plays island and passes I draw another drs, I play fetch forest and drs, he plays Silvergill draw a card, I draw a fetch, so I go for the glimpse it gets fowed, I play fetch and pass he then plays another silver and attacks for 2. My turn, I go for glimpse again xD, had just drawn a gaea's, resolves, play drs and then I draw another land... I play the fetch and pass. His turn, he plays another silver, attacks with the 2 and uses the sorcery that draws 2 if a creature dealt damage. I then draw heritage, play the third glimpse xD, this time heritage draws me into nettle, which draws me into quirion, then to gaea's I pass. He plays 2 lords and attacks with the 3 silver, now that was brutal, I chump blocked 2 with drs and nettle, because I needed to try to gain another turn putting creatures on gy for DRS in case I need that turn, he plays the merfolk that changes a land to island (ouch) and cursecatcher, he is now empty handed. THE TOP DECK, Natural Order, I go for it, I have heritage, Quirion dryad and drs, I sac the quirion, I give +1/+2 in response to hoof trigger to the heritage and hit for 25, he chump blocks and go to 1 life, I don't remember exactly the math and if I'm saying all the plays right hahah, but I'm only left with Hoof and heritage, I think it was right to sac the heritage instead of quirion, but the game was basically over with him almost with nothing and I having a hoof to swing every turn.
SB + 3 Abrupt Decay, -3 NO
Game 2: He opens on Vial, I don't remember my hand, but it was SICK, I had a very powerful t2 glimpse, and Rec Sage to answer the chalice, it was like 2 lands, DRS, wirewood, Rec Sage, Visionary and glimpse, I draw a 1 mana elf (don't remeber which) lead on fetch and DRS, he passes without a t2 play, I then go crazy with glimpse, I draw like 4-5 cards with 2 drs on the battlefield, nettle and wirewood. He top decks silver in which he puts into play with vial and draws a chalice to make it for 1, well one turn too late I guess xD. I just take the midrange plan with Visionary and wirewood until eventually I natural hoof him.
Round 4 Deathblade(2-0): G1 He starts, he was flooded a LOT, he plays T1 TS, my hand was very strange, but I decide to keep because it was a very likely t3, with 2 fetches, heritage, wirewood, hoof, cradle, NO, he takes wirewood and I get a little worried to what's going to happen hahah xD... I draw another fetch, I play fetch and pass, he brainstorms, my friend was there and said later he brainstormed into 3 lands.. ugh, and he keeps a fetch up, I go for bayou, because I really don't want to get fatal pushed, I would go for dryad. I draw nettle, I play it and a fetch and passes, he does nothing and passes, I go for another fetch and heritage and pass, he does nothing again (he was REALLY flooded hahah...), in my turn I play cradle do some mana to hardcast hoof, and he has nothing so gg.
SB: I actually thought it was Aluren I was playing with, but I wasn't sure also, I just put in 2 Abrupts and Rishkar because I didn't had much idea what it was, I thought it wasn't control because of the turns doing nothing (didn't know he was flooded until after the round). I took out NO, heritage and 1 nettle.
G2: my hand was nasty, he started on ponder, I had DRS glimpse, quirion, nettle, 1 forest, 1 fetch and wirewood. I play DRS with forest and pass, he plays t2 Stoneforge, I go for the t2 glimpse, resolves (he had Fow on hand, YOU CAN'T BELIEVE ELVES WILL NOT GO CRAZY WITH GLIMPSE RIGHT XD), I draw like 4 cards, one of which is glimpse, he plays t3 True-Name, and I go for the t3 glimpse that resolves again and just go crazy, he fows the hoof which I thought he would, but whatever, I am drawing my whole deck and NO him to death.
Well that's basically it, my list is a stock one with 1 birch/4 heritage, 3NO/1 Nissa, I just have Rishkar, Peema Renegade as a SB niche tech against cheap board wipes and a little more protection vs jitte.
Wow, Rishkar ! That seems cool, how would you comment about it ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raizen884
Rishkar right now has been very good, synergizes with wirewood and nettle sentinel, protects our guys from liliana the last hope, marsh casualties, pyroclasm, rough/tumble, pfire, jitte. He is possibly only one mana if you have unsickness creatures, and also puts 4 power on the board which helps vs other agressive decks like delver. He comes in vs any black-red control/aggro/midrange (deathblade, delver variants, pfire variants, 4c control). He does help a lot in those mu. The negative part about him is that he is good in most positive or even mu, which sometimes we are ok to face it without him.
@Raizen884 This is a real Brainstorm, thank you ：）
Dears,
I have a single question for all of you.
I'm playing 61 standard list with 2 silver bullet and I'm looking for a nice trade off for a delver meta and midrange meta.
What is your opinion?
a) :2: Nissa Vital Force
b) :1: Nissa Vital Force & :1: Scavenging Ooze
c) :1: Nissa Vital Force & :1: Garruk Relentless
My main doubt is between b) & c) because from one side I would like to play a maindeck removal + pw vs terminus + potential chunkblocker generator and from the other one I know how big can be ooze vs ugr & grixis especially if cradle is on the board.
My side is:
3x abrupt decay
2x choke
2x pithing needle
4x thoughtseize
1x cabal therapy
3x surgical extraction
Thanks for your opinion!
I would say play 60 cards hahah xD.
Anyway, agressive decks like delver decks, Ooze is much better, slower decks like stoneblades, 4c control Nissa is better.
To tell you the truth I'm not really convinced Nissa is that good, I feel she lacks a lot, I still play one, but she was only really good in the 4c control meta, now that is kind of gone because is not hyped anymore so I'm even thinking cut her out completely on my deck... for now I would go with 1 ooze and 1 nissa because of the meta you said, garruk is even worse, I wouldn't touch that.
Hey new to the thread, long time elf player. I’ve been playing 3 leyline of the void in my sideboard since eternal weekend, and they are great. Much better than surgical.
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Could anyone send the discord code or invite? Thanks
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In a deck that draws as much as elves and that is playing both DRS, thoughtseize and cabal therapy, that is a bold statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by JRussell
Care to elaborate? Because outside of rea and lands, I do think I prefer surgical.
https://discordapp.com/channels/3100...88020189642752
Welcome :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRussell
So the reason I want to play extra graveyard hate is because the reanimator and storm matchup can be so bad,and lands can be quiet difficult sometimes. Plus in the US and mtgo there is a TON of b/r reanimator mostly bc it cheap and good. Against reanimator and storm surgical isn’t that great. Reanimator plays chancellor and storm plays duress to disrupt you. So its nice to have a card that can’t be disrupted and can be turn zero wins. It is also fairly easy to cast. I haven’t lost to reanimator since I added it to the deck.Quote:
Originally Posted by dte
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Hey could you send the invite again? It expired and wouldn’t let me join thanksQuote:
Originally Posted by grizzlybears