Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Nihil Credo
Lighthouse is a useful, well-balanced card and after seven years it finally atones for the awfulness that was Nivix, Aerie of the Firemind.
But I'm not seeing any Legacy deck particularly wanting that one. U/R decks aren't likely to have a lot of room for colourless lands, and U/R/x even less of course, and what sort of list would be more interested in 2UR: Loot than in one or more of the following: Wasteland, Mishra's Factory/Inkmoth Nexus/Mutavault, Rishadan Port, Academy Ruins, Crystal Vein, Kher Keep, Riptide Lab, etc. etc.
A midrangey deck. A lot of decks can't really use Wasteland effectively and don't particularly get a lot of use out of a small ground stompers. Port is terrible and I don't even know why you're bringing up Crystal Vein and Kher Keep. Riptide Lab and Academy Ruins are fine if you actually have the cards to support them.
I could see Uwr Blade Control running the card.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
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Originally Posted by
Tao
You can't play "X to all players" effects in a control shell.
....
Fair enough. Even so, X mana for X damage isn't really something that sees legacy play.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheInfamousBearAssassin
A midrangey deck. A lot of decks can't really use Wasteland effectively and don't particularly get a lot of use out of a small ground stompers. Port is terrible and I don't even know why you're bringing up Crystal Vein and Kher Keep. Riptide Lab and Academy Ruins are fine if you actually have the cards to support them.
I could see Uwr Blade Control running the card.
I can't imagine a deck, where Desolate Lighthouse could be generally better than Wasteland. Wasteland can punish greedy manabases and greedy opening hands. And you can protect more important Lands, that are in your hand. And you can destroy enemy lands, that would become a pain like Maze and Gradle.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
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Originally Posted by
TheInfamousBearAssassin
This actually seems worth playing. The non-Miracle cost isn't flat-out impossible, and I could see it work in something like an old U/r Landstill shell. Maybe next to Desolate Lighthouse. That card also seems super sweet.
http://i.imgur.com/mKzwt.jpg
lol, Awful card. Doesn't give card advantage, too slow for decks that might want this (Dredge), out of colors for some others (Reanimator). URG Tempo decks aren't going to have room, doesn't do much for Blade Control and would only hurt them more since it doesn't make colored mana.
Funny coming from you IBA: taking extra turns at CMC 2 is over-rated and/or bad, but a cycling land that needs 4 mana to tap MIGHT see play in legacy according to you?
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
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Originally Posted by
DragoFireheart
Funny coming from you IBA: taking extra turns at CMC 2 is over-rated and/or bad, but a cycling land that needs 4 mana to tap MIGHT see play in legacy according to you?
He did make a deck that runs Scrying Sheets and is half decent.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
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Originally Posted by
(nameless one)
If it was half decent, he would have played it at Grand Prix: Indy.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
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Originally Posted by
MGB
If it was half decent, he would have played it at Grand Prix: Indy.
No offense, but that's kind of a dumb thing to say. Decks can be objectively decent and still be a bad choice for a predicted metagame.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Zilla
No offense, but that's kind of a dumb thing to say. Decks can be objectively decent and still be a bad choice for a predicted metagame.
As much as I don't agree with IBA's bad choice in cards, Zilla is correct. However, I suspect his deck was good not because of Scrying Sheets: it is possible for good/decent decks to run a couple of bad cards and do well. Considering that Wasteland is everywhere, I don't think either card (Sheets or the Lighthouse) is powerful enough to warrant:
A- Running over Wasteland.
B- Running a more stable mana base.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Having playtested against IBA a great deal, I can say with some veracity that Sheets is a very important element of that deck. It generates a lot of card advantage throughout the course of a game.
Succeptibility to Wasteland isn't really an issue, because the deck's manabase is incredibly resilient. Trying to disrupt it isn't really a viable vector of attack against it.
As for manabase stability, I'd argue that Sheets' ability to keep you consistently playing a land every single turn even in the mid to late game makes it more stable, not less.
Sheets isn't an objectively strong card, but in the right deck it's quite potent. I don't know about Lighthouse, but if anyone can find an incredibly obnoxious board control deck in which to make it work, it would be IBA.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Zilla
Having playtested against IBA a great deal, I can say with some veracity that Sheets is a very important element of that deck. It generates a lot of card advantage throughout the course of a game.
Succeptibility to Wasteland isn't really an issue, because the deck's manabase is incredibly resilient. Trying to disrupt it isn't really a viable vector of attack against it.
As for manabase stability, I'd argue that Sheets' ability to keep you consistently playing a land every single turn even in the mid to late game makes it more stable, not less.
Sheets isn't an objectively strong card, but in the right deck it's quite potent. I don't know about Lighthouse, but if anyone can find an incredibly obnoxious board control deck in which to make it work, it would be IBA.
All of this.
You can't always just jam a card in a deck and make it good. The deck will have to be built to take advantage of it. If anyone is capable of pulling that off, I'm sure it would be IBA.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Shucks. It's a good point you all are making about how awesome I am.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ignithas_
I can't imagine a deck, where Desolate Lighthouse could be generally better than Wasteland. Wasteland can punish greedy manabases and greedy opening hands. And you can protect more important Lands, that are in your hand. And you can destroy enemy lands, that would become a pain like Maze and Gradle.
A lot of decks that don't win particularly fast and don't have a way to abuse Wasteland in particular just don't get that much utility out of it. In fact in decks that want to run out cards like Batterskull or Jace, throwing away a land for a land is rarely going to work out to a significant advantage.
Other utility lands offer you actual effect when you're grinding it out. Rather than try to react to what their utility lands are doing you can just get some free spell slots out of your manabase yourself. This card seems very potent in a mid-range deck because it lets you churn through all those worthless extra lands and, very likely, other graveyard-enabled cards in order to get more gas, without requiring you to run a spell slot.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
From MaRo's Reddit AMA:
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As you will see when all the Avacyn Restored cards are public we've started to define how red looting is different from blue. (Hint: different order of the effects.)
The obvious guess is that Red will get a "discard, then draw" effect, which in rotating Constructed is pretty cool as it's basically a non-keyworded Hellbent mechanic (removes the drawback if you have no cards in hand), but when you put it in Eternal formats that still have Dredge cards, it could get real interesting.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Cool. Discard then draw would be fun to toy around with. There are drawbacks but there are drawback to draw, then discard. It would be uniquely Red and has synergy with many archetypes.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Zilla
Sheets isn't an objectively strong card, but in the right deck it's quite potent. I don't know about Lighthouse, but if anyone can find an incredibly obnoxious board control deck in which to make it work, it would be IBA.
- But is it Legacy potent? (Either card).
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Holy crap I just realised Skrillex 2nd ability is -4. I thought it was -1. Oh my gawd what a terrible walker. Worst ever printed IMO. What a waste of a mythic slot.
New looters land looks decent. Too slow for legacy probably. Busted in standard reanimator. Faithless looting on a land in a set of insane fatties? Standard seems interesting now. Legacy control has better colourless lands like mishra's/wastelands/dustbowl/riptide.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
DragoFireheart
- But is it Legacy potent? (Either card).
The power threshold on utility lands is much lower than that on spells, since utility lands have the benefits of being uncounterable, free, and tapping for mana.
So yes.
I mean no one wants to pay one mana every turn to attack with a Grizzly Bear, or two to block with a Trained Armodon. Except if it's a land, why not? There's a lot to be gained from squeezing more function out of your manabase, if your deck can support it.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
I'm just hoping White gets another Miracle and that it's Balance.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
I'm just hoping black gets a Miracle too and that it's Yawgmoth's Will.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
death
I'm just hoping black gets a Miracle too and that it's Yawgmoth's Will.
Except they already said black's not getting any miracles.
Re: Avacyn Restored Card Discussion [GENTLE SHITBREEZE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ivanpei
Holy crap I just realised Skrillex 2nd ability is -4. I thought it was -1. Oh my gawd what a terrible walker. Worst ever printed IMO. What a waste of a mythic slot.
New looters land looks decent. Too slow for legacy probably. Busted in standard reanimator. Faithless looting on a land in a set of insane fatties? Standard seems interesting now. Legacy control has better colourless lands like mishra's/wastelands/dustbowl/riptide.
Dude, -1 would be fucking incredible.
