[Deck] GW/x Maverick

If you're in a position where Toxic is going to ruin your board, you're -probably- ahead and don't need to cast it. Toxic is also really good in midrange matchups where you can wipe everything but leave your Knight as she's bigger than any threat a midrange deck can pull against you.

Side-Note: I love ZP so much but anyone else feel when WB for Zealous is the most awkward mana cost as basic forest -> any other land can't cast it (unless you next level them with filters lel) and a lot of the matchups where you want Zealous they have wasteland so getting your forest is really important, this usually stops me from playing more than 2 Zealous in the board. Just wondering if anyone felt that same odd feeling with such an awesome card.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rascalyote

If you're in a position where Toxic is going to ruin your board, you're -probably- ahead and don't need to cast it. Toxic is also really good in midrange matchups where you can wipe everything but leave your Knight as she's bigger than any threat a midrange deck can pull against you.

Side-Note: I love ZP so much but anyone else feel when WB for Zealous is the most awkward mana cost as basic forest -> any other land can't cast it (unless you next level them with filters lel) and a lot of the matchups where you want Zealous they have wasteland so getting your forest is really important, this usually stops me from playing more than 2 Zealous in the board. Just wondering if anyone felt that same odd feeling with such an awesome card.

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I can barely stand running Abrupt Decay let alone a WB card. But then again, I try to run as little black as humanly possible.

As for the Toxic discussion, I have lost many games where zealous was in my hand and I can't hurt their board unless they block or try to go wide against me. Toxic I've even sided in vs angel tokens, I've drawn it against a Truename equipped with batterskull, I've drawn it to clear their 3-4 Goyfs leaving my 1 Knight standing, its great versus eldrazi, great vs serra avengers, great vs enemy Mirran Crusaders, etc...

I wouldn't say its a strict upgrade to Zealous, but I definitely prefer it.

I like ZP as my main TNN killer. That said for the reasons others have already stated I like to pack at least 1 TD in the SB. It can hurt us, but is worth it if it imo especially with KOTR. I agree that hitting W/B is awkward. That's another big reason why I like DRS is the color fixing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

I can barely stand running Abrupt Decay let alone a WB card. But then again, I try to run as little black as humanly possible.

As for the Toxic discussion, I have lost many games where zealous was in my hand and I can't hurt their board unless they block or try to go wide against me. Toxic I've even sided in vs angel tokens, I've drawn it against a Truename equipped with batterskull, I've drawn it to clear their 3-4 Goyfs leaving my 1 Knight standing, its great versus eldrazi, great vs serra avengers, great vs enemy Mirran Crusaders, etc...

I wouldn't say its a strict upgrade to Zealous, but I definitely prefer it.

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First, Miracles arguments are no longer valid especially when they normally played EtA EoT to avoid sorcery speed removal.

Second, your examples are against good matchups that we have i.e. Goyfs(Abrupt Decay), Eldrazi, DnT(which you used twice also see: Abrupt Decay/ZP), where ZP is going to be better in harder matchups like BUG and Elves. Resolving Deluge against BUG might wipe their board, in your scenario, but you still have a batterskull to deal with. Deluge might be the best card to deal with {insert scenario} but I find that not getting in the terrible unwinnable scenario is a much better plan... i.e. extra pridemages to kill all equipment and have creatures that outclass 3/1's(Knight, Crusader, Sigarada, etc), or ways to kill 3/1's i.e. ZP.

If you are constantly in game states where the only thing that will save you is a mass removal spell to clear the whole board... something went wrong and there should be a better plan of attack. In the elves matchup, they can have all the 2/2's they want... it means they are running slow enough to get hatebears and equipment online which are our haymakers in the matchup. Most of the time they kill you and combo in the same turn and usually only have 1-3 elves in play before the combo turn... which is a case where deluge is worse than ZP.

An added bonus, ZP is faster against storm's goblin tokens and ZP can also save your creatures from opposing -1/-1 effects, obviously not dread of night, but from ZP and Golgari Charms or electrickery type effects.

I know that we can sit here and name situations where x is better than y or visa versa, but I hope we can all agree in a non-specific meta, the main reasons to splash black are thought seize, abrupt decay, zealous persecution and consistent DRS activation's not black sweepers that also clear our board or {random black card that is good against some tier 3 deck}.

@Rasca- I have said before that I find Maverick to have a way too fragile mana base to support a 3rd color in a wasteland meta without the use of Life from the Loam. This has been made less of a problem by DRS, but eating our own graveyards directly shrinks our Knights. So I don't play DRS or a splash color. If I was to play a splash, it would be black for Seize, Decay and Zealous.

EDIT:

TWO more top 8's!

// Deck file for Magic Workstation created with mtgtop8.com
// NAME : Maverick
// CREATOR : Jacob Kory
// FORMAT : Legacy
1 [FUT] Dryad Arbor
1 [US] Gaea's Cradle
1 [FUT] Horizon Canopy
1 [LG] Karakas
1 [UNH] Plains
2 [R] Bayou
2 [UNH] Forest
3 [R] Savannah
3 [KTK] Wooded Foothills
4 [TE] Wasteland
4 [KTK] Windswept Heath
1 [LRW] Gaddock Teeg
1 [CFX] Noble Hierarch
1 [] Scavenging Ooze
1 [TSP] Scryb Ranger
1 [AVR] Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 [SOI] Tireless Tracker
2 [ARB] Qasali Pridemage
2 [WWK] Stoneforge Mystic
3 [CMD] Mother of Runes
4 [RTR] Deathrite Shaman
4 [CFX] Knight of the Reliquary
4 [DKA] Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
1 [DS] Sword of Light and Shadow
1 [BOK] Umezawa's Jitte
2 [5E] Sylvan Library
4 [] Swords to Plowshares
4 [MBS] Green Sun's Zenith
SB: 1 [C14] Bojuka Bog
SB: 1 [C14] Tormod's Crypt
SB: 1 [M14] Ratchet Bomb
SB: 1 [CMD] Path to Exile
SB: 1 [NPH] Melira, Sylvok Outcast
SB: 2 [NPH] Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 [RTR] Abrupt Decay
SB: 2 [ARB] Zealous Persecution
SB: 2 [ALA] Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 [THS] Thoughtseize

and

// Deck file for Magic Workstation created with mtgtop8.com
// NAME : Punishing Maverick
// CREATOR : Erick Velasquez
// FORMAT : Legacy
1 [FUT] Dryad Arbor
1 [UNH] Forest
1 [FUT] Horizon Canopy
1 [LG] Karakas
1 [DK] Maze of Ith
2 [R] Taiga
3 [FUT] Grove of the Burnwillows
3 [R] Savannah
3 [TE] Wasteland
3 [KTK] Wooded Foothills
4 [KTK] Windswept Heath
1 [] Birds of Paradise
1 [LRW] Gaddock Teeg
1 [ARB] Qasali Pridemage
1 [] Renegade Rallier
1 [] Samut, Voice of Dissent
1 [] Scavenging Ooze
1 [TSP] Scryb Ranger
1 [SOI] Tireless Tracker
3 [CFX] Knight of the Reliquary
3 [WWK] Stoneforge Mystic
4 [CMD] Mother of Runes
4 [CFX] Noble Hierarch
1 [GTC] Domri Rade
1 [NPH] Batterskull
1 [BOK] Umezawa's Jitte
1 [5E] Sylvan Library
3 [CMD] Punishing Fire
4 [] Swords to Plowshares
4 [MBS] Green Sun's Zenith
SB: 1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
SB: 1 [9E] Circle of Protection: Red
SB: 2 [5E] Pyroblast
SB: 2 [M11] Pyroclasm
SB: 1 [C14] Bojuka Bog
SB: 1 [] Nissa, Vital Force
SB: 1 [C15] Krosan Grip
SB: 3 [DKA] Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
SB: 3 [M11] Leyline of the Void

so GWb and GWr both make an appearance!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lavafrogg

First, Miracles arguments are no longer valid especially when they normally played EtA EoT to avoid sorcery speed removal.

Second, your examples are against good matchups that we have i.e. Goyfs(Abrupt Decay), Eldrazi, DnT(which you used twice also see: Abrupt Decay/ZP), where ZP is going to be better in harder matchups like BUG and Elves. Resolving Deluge against BUG might wipe their board, in your scenario, but you still have a batterskull to deal with. Deluge might be the best card to deal with {insert scenario} but I find that not getting in the terrible unwinnable scenario is a much better plan... i.e. extra pridemages to kill all equipment and have creatures that outclass 3/1's(Knight, Crusader, Sigarada, etc), or ways to kill 3/1's i.e. ZP.

If you are constantly in game states where the only thing that will save you is a mass removal spell to clear the whole board... something went wrong and there should be a better plan of attack. In the elves matchup, they can have all the 2/2's they want... it means they are running slow enough to get hatebears and equipment online which are our haymakers in the matchup. Most of the time they kill you and combo in the same turn and usually only have 1-3 elves in play before the combo turn... which is a case where deluge is worse than ZP.

An added bonus, ZP is faster against storm's goblin tokens and ZP can also save your creatures from opposing -1/-1 effects, obviously not dread of night, but from ZP and Golgari Charms or electrickery type effects.

I know that we can sit here and name situations where x is better than y or visa versa, but I hope we can all agree in a non-specific meta, the main reasons to splash black are thought seize, abrupt decay, zealous persecution and consistent DRS activation's not black sweepers that also clear our board or {random black card that is good against some tier 3 deck}.

@Rasca- I have said before that I find Maverick to have a way too fragile mana base to support a 3rd color in a wasteland meta without the use of Life from the Loam. This has been made less of a problem by DRS, but eating our own graveyards directly shrinks our Knights. So I don't play DRS or a splash color. If I was to play a splash, it would be black for Seize, Decay and Zealous.

EDIT:

TWO more top 8's!

// Deck file for Magic Workstation created with mtgtop8.com
// NAME : Maverick
// CREATOR : Jacob Kory
// FORMAT : Legacy
1 [FUT] Dryad Arbor
1 [US] Gaea's Cradle
1 [FUT] Horizon Canopy
1 [LG] Karakas
1 [UNH] Plains
2 [R] Bayou
2 [UNH] Forest
3 [R] Savannah
3 [KTK] Wooded Foothills
4 [TE] Wasteland
4 [KTK] Windswept Heath
1 [LRW] Gaddock Teeg
1 [CFX] Noble Hierarch
1 [] Scavenging Ooze
1 [TSP] Scryb Ranger
1 [AVR] Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 [SOI] Tireless Tracker
2 [ARB] Qasali Pridemage
2 [WWK] Stoneforge Mystic
3 [CMD] Mother of Runes
4 [RTR] Deathrite Shaman
4 [CFX] Knight of the Reliquary
4 [DKA] Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
1 [DS] Sword of Light and Shadow
1 [BOK] Umezawa's Jitte
2 [5E] Sylvan Library
4 [] Swords to Plowshares
4 [MBS] Green Sun's Zenith
SB: 1 [C14] Bojuka Bog
SB: 1 [C14] Tormod's Crypt
SB: 1 [M14] Ratchet Bomb
SB: 1 [CMD] Path to Exile
SB: 1 [NPH] Melira, Sylvok Outcast
SB: 2 [NPH] Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 [RTR] Abrupt Decay
SB: 2 [ARB] Zealous Persecution
SB: 2 [ALA] Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 [THS] Thoughtseize

and

// Deck file for Magic Workstation created with mtgtop8.com
// NAME : Punishing Maverick
// CREATOR : Erick Velasquez
// FORMAT : Legacy
1 [FUT] Dryad Arbor
1 [UNH] Forest
1 [FUT] Horizon Canopy
1 [LG] Karakas
1 [DK] Maze of Ith
2 [R] Taiga
3 [FUT] Grove of the Burnwillows
3 [R] Savannah
3 [TE] Wasteland
3 [KTK] Wooded Foothills
4 [KTK] Windswept Heath
1 [] Birds of Paradise
1 [LRW] Gaddock Teeg
1 [ARB] Qasali Pridemage
1 [] Renegade Rallier
1 [] Samut, Voice of Dissent
1 [] Scavenging Ooze
1 [TSP] Scryb Ranger
1 [SOI] Tireless Tracker
3 [CFX] Knight of the Reliquary
3 [WWK] Stoneforge Mystic
4 [CMD] Mother of Runes
4 [CFX] Noble Hierarch
1 [GTC] Domri Rade
1 [NPH] Batterskull
1 [BOK] Umezawa's Jitte
1 [5E] Sylvan Library
3 [CMD] Punishing Fire
4 [] Swords to Plowshares
4 [MBS] Green Sun's Zenith
SB: 1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
SB: 1 [9E] Circle of Protection: Red
SB: 2 [5E] Pyroblast
SB: 2 [M11] Pyroclasm
SB: 1 [C14] Bojuka Bog
SB: 1 [] Nissa, Vital Force
SB: 1 [C15] Krosan Grip
SB: 3 [DKA] Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
SB: 3 [M11] Leyline of the Void

so GWb and GWr both make an appearance!

---

The reason I like toxic over zealous is because I don't like sideboard cards that only help me when I'm winning/even. If I'm siding it in--it's to pull me out out of unwinnable game states, and not because it would be a cool combat trick. Also, zealous is not that great against elves unless they're a fairy shitty elf player. I've seen them come back from 2-3 resolved terminuses. Sweepers alone is not the answer to elves.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

The reason I like toxic over zealous is because I don't like sideboard cards that only help me when I'm winning/even. If I'm siding it in--it's to pull me out out of unwinnable game states, and not because it would be a cool combat trick. Also, zealous is not that great against elves unless they're a fairy shitty elf player. I've seen them come back from 2-3 resolved terminuses. Sweepers alone is not the answer to elves.

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lavafrogg

First, Miracles arguments are no longer valid especially when they normally played EtA EoT to avoid sorcery speed removal.

In the elves matchup, they can have all the 2/2's they want... it means they are running slow enough to get hatebears and equipment online which are our haymakers in the matchup. Most of the time they kill you and combo in the same turn and usually only have 1-3 elves in play before the combo turn... which is a case where deluge is worse than ZP.

I know that we can sit here and name situations where x is better than y or visa versa, but I hope we can all agree in a non-specific meta, the main reasons to splash black are thought seize, abrupt decay, zealous persecution and consistent DRS activation's not black sweepers that also clear our board or {random black card that is good against some tier 3 deck}.

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Let me keep it simply then in regards to your comments on elves.

If sweepers is your primary plan on elves, then you will never consistently beat elves. Sweepers that happen to be in your sideboard is also okay to bring against elves, but that in and of itself doesn't do anything against elves.

If you're going to run sweepers--run the sweepers that you need to 180 the match. If it does not 180 the match you need it in, then it is useless.

There is only 2 reasons you want to run black in Maverick. Discard and Deathrite. Everything else is meh at most, and only useful should you expect a very specific metagame.

Abrupt Decay is only good against Miracles as it allows you to shut off a part of their game plan. Outside of miracles its either a bad krosan grip or a bad fatal push.

Zealous Persecution is another card that is only useful in super specific game states, and is overall bad every other time. For example, why bring it in vs a Truename list when it can only hit 1 of those decks creatures? It doesn't hurt either Deathrite or Leovold, it doesn't hurt flipped delvers, it doesn't hurt goyfs, shardless agents, and it doesn't even hurt Mirran Crusaders. If you only play opponents who don't kill your board and hence the +1/+1 can matter--then you most likely don't even need zealous, but if you drew it then its gravy.

Zealous Persecution kills DnT's active Mother of Runes. This reason alone is sufficient for its inclusion in the sideboard.

Plus even if it doesn't totally wipe Elves board it definitely buys you time which is much better then cards that just do nothing. That time can help you reach a more relevant hatebear or win condition. I think TNN is also popular enough that having it as a clean answer to him is good to have in your arsenal.

Zealous is not a bad card. Calling it a card worth splashing black for is folly. When you've already splashed black, you can definitely think about adding it in. But to call it strictly better than other options out there is dishonest. One could just as easily run Engineered Plague, Marsh Casualties, Toxic Deluge, Golgari Charm, and a host of many other sweepers. But when putting together a sideboard I don't look at those 15 cards and think "but what if there's a mothers mirror?"

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

Zealous is not a bad card. Calling it a card worth splashing black for is folly. When you've already splashed black, you can definitely think about adding it in. But to call it strictly better than other options out there is dishonest. One could just as easily run Engineered Plague, Marsh Casualties, Toxic Deluge, Golgari Charm, and a host of many other sweepers. But when putting together a sideboard I don't look at those 15 cards and think "but what if there's a mothers mirror?"

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Is anyone saying that's the sole reason they splash black for? Honestly asking.

I run black for a lot of reasons so for me fitting zp in the SB is no problem.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

Is anyone saying that's the sole reason they splash black for? Honestly asking.

I run black for a lot of reasons so for me fitting zp in the SB is no problem.

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I said that the main reasons to splash black in Maverick are Abrupt Decay, Zealous Persecution, Thoughtsieze and DRS activations.

The 3 have the black splash that have top 8'd since the banning have all played Zealous and Thoughtsieze, two of them have played Abrupt Decay but the third used Engineered Plauge as its only other black card.

I am not saying these are the only cards, just the main/first cards that should be considered.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

Is anyone saying that's the sole reason they splash black for? Honestly asking.

I run black for a lot of reasons so for me fitting zp in the SB is no problem.

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If you go to the top of the conversation, I informed LavaFrog that I prefer Toxic over Zealous. He then spent multiple pages telling me that Zealous is one of several reasons to run black. I continually restate to him that my choice of black sweepers comes from both testing and a core logic that I find important. He continues to restate that its one of the reasons to run black.

I don't disagree with him that along with black comes access to sweeper effects that are better than either Retribution of the Meek or Holy Light. I simply don't agree that Zealous is the primary one to pick among those sweepers. I have layed my reasons for why my testing has shown Toxic Deluge to be superior as a reliable sweeper that is useful in many more game states, matchups, and hits many more targets than a simple one time -1/-1 effect. I gave several scenarios that I have faced where relying on a small sweeper effect in insufficient are turning around a game.

Frog, to his credit, suggested I simply don't get put into bad positions. I rebutted that if I'm going to run a sideboard card, I want ones that are able to 180 bad positions otherwise what's the point of wasting a sideboard slot on an effect that is not good if you're in a losing position.

The discussion is not on whether Maverick should or shouldn't run Sweeper effects. The discussion is that its possible that Zealous Persecution is not the best possible sweeper effect that you can run in Maverick and that there are times you would prefer other sweepers instead.

Where you place yourself in this discussion is up to you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TMagpie

If you go to the top of the conversation, I informed LavaFrog that I prefer Toxic over Zealous. He then spent multiple pages telling me that Zealous is one of several reasons to run black. I continually restate to him that my choice of black sweepers comes from both testing and a core logic that I find important. He continues to restate that its one of the reasons to run black.

I don't disagree with him that along with black comes access to sweeper effects that are better than either Retribution of the Meek or Holy Light. I simply don't agree that Zealous is the primary one to pick among those sweepers. I have layed my reasons for why my testing has shown Toxic Deluge to be superior as a reliable sweeper that is useful in many more game states, matchups, and hits many more targets than a simple one time -1/-1 effect. I gave several scenarios that I have faced where relying on a small sweeper effect in insufficient are turning around a game.

Frog, to his credit, suggested I simply don't get put into bad positions. I rebutted that if I'm going to run a sideboard card, I want ones that are able to 180 bad positions otherwise what's the point of wasting a sideboard slot on an effect that is not good if you're in a losing position.

The discussion is not on whether Maverick should or shouldn't run Sweeper effects. The discussion is that its possible that Zealous Persecution is not the best possible sweeper effect that you can run in Maverick and that there are times you would prefer other sweepers instead.

Where you place yourself in this discussion is up to you.

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Ah I see. Thank you for catching me up to speed, somewhere in the thread I got lost. Right now I am packing 2x zp in the sb mainly for TNN + other applications and 1x TD for Elves and of course other scenarios it's good. I don't think one is strictly better than the other. If I had to cut a sweeper though I would cut one of the ZP just because I like to try and keep sb slots as diverse as possible.

Admittedly I was more worried about Elves/TNN in the new meta which is why I packed 3.

If those decks don't see as much play I could see going down to 2.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Luthiereisfun

Ah I see. Thank you for catching me up to speed, somewhere in the thread I got lost. Right now I am packing 2x zp in the sb mainly for TNN + other applications and 1x TD for Elves and of course other scenarios it's good. I don't think one is strictly better than the other. If I had to cut a sweeper though I would cut one of the ZP just because I like to try and keep sb slots as diverse as possible.

Admittedly I was more worried about Elves/TNN in the new meta which is why I packed 3.

If those decks don't see as much play I could see going down to 2.

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Yeah, we just have a way of arguing and agreeing at the same time.

We both feel that you need more than sweepers to beat elves.

He likes deluge where you need to clear the whole board, I like ZP where you just wipe certain threats from the opponent and leave your board alone.

I am not sure where the white sweeper discussion came from because we never touched those :p but my personal favorite anti-fair card is Blessed Alliance as it come in against burn as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lavafrogg

my personal favorite anti-fair card is Blessed Alliance as it come in against burn as well.

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And every MU with big dumb untargetable creatures: S&S, lands, Turbo Depth, BR Reanimator...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lavafrogg

Yeah, we just have a way of arguing and agreeing at the same time.

We both feel that you need more than sweepers to beat elves.

He likes deluge where you need to clear the whole board, I like ZP where you just wipe certain threats from the opponent and leave your board alone.

I am not sure where the white sweeper discussion came from because we never touched those :p but my personal favorite anti-fair card is Blessed Alliance as it come in against burn as well.

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Yeah, my non-magic life got stressful and it started bleeding into my argument. For that I apologize.

Both Blessed Alliance and Gerard's Verdict are on my watch list of cards to add to my sideboard to improve my burn matchup while being useful outside of Burn. Gerard's Verdict primarily to be hate against both Burn and combo.

Another weird sideboard card I keep being tempted to run is Cabal Therapy over Thoughtseize.

Yesterday I went to GP Richmond and went 7-3-2 in total between 3 legacy challenges. Since Top was banned, I've been try out some spicy cards and trying to find a good shell that I can pilot for GP Vegas. This is the list that I ran at the end of the day after extensive testing that I felt comfortable playing.

4x Deathrite Shaman
1x Bird of Paradise
4x Mother of Runes
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
1x Scavenging Ooze
4x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Renegade Rallier
1x Courser of Kruiphix
1x Dryad Arbor

4x Sword of Plowshares
3x Green Sun's Zendith
2x Collected Company
1x Sylvan Library
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Umezawa's Jitte

4x Windswept Heath
3x Verdant Catacombs
2x Bayou
2x Savannah
1x Scrubland
4x Wasteland
2x Forest
1x Plains
1x Horizon Canopy
1x Gaea's Cradle
1x Karakas

SB:
3x Thoughtseize
1x Surgical Extraction
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Winter Orb
1x Choke
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Toxic Deluge
1x Pithing Needle.

Challenge 1
R/G Lands - 2-0 Win
BR Reanimator - 2-1 Win
Esper Deathblade - 1-2 Lost
Belcher - Drew (but lost in fun games)
Winning record (2-1-1).

Challenge 2
4C Delver - 2-0 Win
BR Reanimator - 2-0 Win
Bant Deathblade - 2-0 Win
Death and Taxes - Drew (Didn't play it out)

Challenge 3
Esper Stoneblade - 1-2 Lost
Enchantress - 1-2 Lost
I can't remember this matchup but I won lol.
TES Storm - 2-1 Win

Some Notes After
1.) Running Courser Feels good. Fixes awkward draws and Idc if my opponent see what card I'm drawing. Pairs well with Library.
2.) There wasn't a game where I needed Abrupt Decay to help me win. I realize that any permanent can be solved with a Pridemage or a Sword, with the exception of opposing Planeswalkers. That's why Pulse is there. It also serves as a catch all spell for pesky cards as well.
3.) Winter Orb is a complex card. I like it, but it really depends on the board state. I board this in against Deathblade variants and it works phenomenal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thunderknight

Yesterday I went to GP Richmond and went 7-3-2 in total between 3 legacy challenges. Since Top was banned, I've been try out some spicy cards and trying to find a good shell that I can pilot for GP Vegas. This is the list that I ran at the end of the day after extensive testing that I felt comfortable playing.

4x Deathrite Shaman
1x Bird of Paradise
4x Mother of Runes
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
1x Scavenging Ooze
4x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Renegade Rallier
1x Courser of Kruiphix
1x Dryad Arbor

4x Sword of Plowshares
3x Green Sun's Zendith
2x Collected Company
1x Sylvan Library
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Umezawa's Jitte

4x Windswept Heath
3x Verdant Catacombs
2x Bayou
2x Savannah
1x Scrubland
4x Wasteland
2x Forest
1x Plains
1x Horizon Canopy
1x Gaea's Cradle
1x Karakas

SB:
3x Thoughtseize
1x Surgical Extraction
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Winter Orb
1x Choke
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Toxic Deluge
1x Pithing Needle.

Challenge 1
R/G Lands - 2-0 Win
BR Reanimator - 2-1 Win
Esper Deathblade - 1-2 Lost
Belcher - Drew (but lost in fun games)
Winning record (2-1-1).

Challenge 2
4C Delver - 2-0 Win
BR Reanimator - 2-0 Win
Bant Deathblade - 2-0 Win
Death and Taxes - Drew (Didn't play it out)

Challenge 3
Esper Stoneblade - 1-2 Lost
Enchantress - 1-2 Lost
I can't remember this matchup but I won lol.
TES Storm - 2-1 Win

Some Notes After
1.) Running Courser Feels good. Fixes awkward draws and Idc if my opponent see what card I'm drawing. Pairs well with Library.
2.) There wasn't a game where I needed Abrupt Decay to help me win. I realize that any permanent can be solved with a Pridemage or a Sword, with the exception of opposing Planeswalkers. That's why Pulse is there. It also serves as a catch all spell for pesky cards as well.
3.) Winter Orb is a complex card. I like it, but it really depends on the board state. I board this in against Deathblade variants and it works phenomenal.

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We have to ask: how were the collected companies? What are your thoughts about the card/ the value you get from it?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Thunderknight

Yesterday I went to GP Richmond and went 7-3-2 in total between 3 legacy challenges. Since Top was banned, I've been try out some spicy cards and trying to find a good shell that I can pilot for GP Vegas. This is the list that I ran at the end of the day after extensive testing that I felt comfortable playing.

4x Deathrite Shaman
1x Bird of Paradise
4x Mother of Runes
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2x Stoneforge Mystic
2x Qasali Pridemage
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Scryb Ranger
1x Scavenging Ooze
4x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Renegade Rallier
1x Courser of Kruiphix
1x Dryad Arbor

4x Sword of Plowshares
3x Green Sun's Zendith
2x Collected Company
1x Sylvan Library
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Umezawa's Jitte

4x Windswept Heath
3x Verdant Catacombs
2x Bayou
2x Savannah
1x Scrubland
4x Wasteland
2x Forest
1x Plains
1x Horizon Canopy
1x Gaea's Cradle
1x Karakas

SB:
3x Thoughtseize
1x Surgical Extraction
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Winter Orb
1x Choke
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Toxic Deluge
1x Pithing Needle.

Challenge 1
R/G Lands - 2-0 Win
BR Reanimator - 2-1 Win
Esper Deathblade - 1-2 Lost
Belcher - Drew (but lost in fun games)
Winning record (2-1-1).

Challenge 2
4C Delver - 2-0 Win
BR Reanimator - 2-0 Win
Bant Deathblade - 2-0 Win
Death and Taxes - Drew (Didn't play it out)

Challenge 3
Esper Stoneblade - 1-2 Lost
Enchantress - 1-2 Lost
I can't remember this matchup but I won lol.
TES Storm - 2-1 Win

Some Notes After
1.) Running Courser Feels good. Fixes awkward draws and Idc if my opponent see what card I'm drawing. Pairs well with Library.
2.) There wasn't a game where I needed Abrupt Decay to help me win. I realize that any permanent can be solved with a Pridemage or a Sword, with the exception of opposing Planeswalkers. That's why Pulse is there. It also serves as a catch all spell for pesky cards as well.
3.) Winter Orb is a complex card. I like it, but it really depends on the board state. I board this in against Deathblade variants and it works phenomenal.

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Congrats on the good result!

I double lavafrogg's comment: how did the companies do?
Also, do you think that Sword of L&S and second Teeg are really required since the Miracles are gone?
Is just 1 graveyard hate slot (surgical) in sb really enough? I see though that you did really well against both Reanimators.
And lastly, how do you find Birds of Paradise vs Noble Hierarch slot?