UBg Death's Shadow

No zero DoN is far away from being standard, because D&T is one of our thoughest matchups. My thoughts behind this decision was having Toxic Deluge as a versatile Sweeper against all types of aggro. It`s even a tech against Etw Goblin tokens. But D&T is everywhere now and yes I would like to add 2 of them. Sideboard isn`t fix, so feel free to experiment, I do it too. Also I would like to ad a Library for a bit of recovery, which the deck also need. So board could look something like this:

3 Extraction
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Liliana the last Hope
1 Sylvan Library
1 Winter Orb/ 2 Winter Orb
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Diabolic Edict
2 Hymn to Tourach
2 Dread of Night

A single Toxic Deluge main doesn't seem awful as it's great with Shadow (pretty much always a one-sided wrath) and hits one of the worst MUs while breaking stalemates vs. almost anything. Of course, 3-drops in a deck this light on mana and low on curve are pretty miserable, which is probably why it isn't being included in the stock lists in the first place, but the miser's copy in a deck with the ability to go through its cards so fast seems rather worthwhile.

Does anyone have a link to the discord please?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by polski

Does anyone have a link to the discord please?

---

https://discord.gg/rd6DpVC

The primer should be updated, it still shows probe. Currently I'm on a list that is similar to the UB Death's Shadow list that's floating around:

14 creatures:
4 delver
4 death's shadow
2 gurmag angler
4 street wraith

28 spells:
4 Force
4 Daze
4 Thoughtseize
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
2 Reanimate
2 Stubborn Denial
2 Snuff out
2 Push/Dismember

18 lands:
4 wasteland
3 watery grave
3 underground sea
4 delta
4 strand

Sideboard:
2 Diabolic Edict
3 Dread of Night
3 Hymn to Tourach
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Null Rod
1 Pithing Needle
3 Surgical Extraction

I shifted away from this list a bit since I found some matchups to be pretty horrible, namely against lockpiece decks with Chalice, Ensnaring Bridge, Counterbalance etc., but also against decks like lands where a threat like mongoose or TNN is key. Mongoose is also great against swords, shadow's natural enemy!
Therefore I switched the Anglers and Stubborn Denials for 4 Mongooses (great with wraith and proactive discard compared to RUG's reactive playstyle) and the 4 removal spells for 4 decays: This deck just folds to Chalice on 1 unless you specifically have Angler which is awful imo.

I also cut the Hymn to Tourach in the sideboard for more blue cards against combo and cut the Liliana for Toxic Deluges: Both deal with Strixes, but TNN, Mentor and Mirran Crusader are very awkward cards that the UB deck has troubles dealing with!

My current BUG list is the following:

16 creatures:
4 delver
4 mongoose
4 death's shadow
4 street wraith

26 spells:
4 Force
4 Daze
4 Thoughtseize
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
2 Reanimate
4 Decay

18 lands:
4 wasteland
2 Watery Grave
1 Breeding Pool
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Underground Sea
1 Tropical Island
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Polluted Delta

Sideboard:
1 library
2 push
2 dismember
2 edict
2 deluge
2 surgical
2 hydroblast
2 Flusterstorm

I really like this variation of the deck: The decays are great imo at killing stuff that would just make me lose the game like Chalice, Bridge and Moon (when I have 2 mana open) while serving as creature-removal as well! I tried swapping 2 of the decays for 2 dismember, but against some decks the decays are just a million times better while the difference between dismember and decay against creatures is often times quite marginal.
The two hydroblast might seem weird, but burn is not necessarily a great matchup, you just need that one counterspell when you're low on life to remain at 5-8 life as you smash down their gates! It's also great against decks where a t1 FoW can be crucial like TES, Mono-R stompy, Belcher while having applications against S&S as well!
Overall I like the list quite a bit!

I'm considering the decklist.

I will be happier with a UBG list better than just UB.
I agree that Abrupt Decay is a need and it is more flexible than sideboarding Throne of Geth just for the Chalice.
Not sure about Nimble Mongoose... because I like the big zombie fish a lot and probably Delver of Secrets will work better with 28 instants and sorceries.

Agrippa, I can definitely understand main deck inclusion of Decay over Push for a number of reasons, but I think completely cutting Dismember/Snuff Out is really limiting your ability to lower your life total sufficiently and at instant speed. It also pretty seriously raises the mana curve. I'd recommend at least a split of Dismember + Decay main board in your type of configuration. Not having 0/1 mana removal is a big deal, there are still threats like Mother of Runes which will wreck this type of removal strategy.

If only they had a 2 mana enchantment that let you pay up to 8 life a turn and draw 2 cards after an opponent cast a removal spell that resets your life total at 13. Also if they had a 1 mana instant that could kill an enemy creature while jumping up the damage it dealt by two times. :wink:

after some games with UB and UBg shell i can write some words. Now i am testing this version with mangooooose <3
16 creatures:
4 delver
4 mongoose
4 death's shadow
4 street wraith

26 spells:
4 Force
4 Daze
4 Thoughtseize
4 Brainstorm
4 Stifle
3 Ponder
2 Fatal push
2 Decay

18 lands:
4 wasteland
2 Watery Grave
1 Breeding Pool
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Underground Sea
1 Tropical Island
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Polluted Delta

Sideboard:
1 library
2 dismember
2 edict
1 deluge
2 surgical
1 hydroblast
2 liliana of the last hope
2 dread of night
2 hymn to tourach

So, guys! Stifle is one of best card in my deck. i just love put our build to maximum disrupt. Stifle fetch and wasteland + daze is a cruel thing. Add to this Thoughtseize and we have best options to totally ruin their hands and gameplan. than we have best fellow in strategy, untouchable Mangoose, Fast Delver and Big Shadow. Dont forget that stifle ruin Storm Trigger so we have more good slots in SB.

Now i test Version without Dismember in MD. Always we can back to Dismember in md and FP to SB. I know that reanimate is super cool combo but i had very bad games with reanimate. only against Reanimator this card shine. otherwise..naaaah

You really want Snuff Out and Angler in this deck. I know Decay works differently, but that should be a sideboard card at best, regardless if Chalice is a fear. Snuff Out is free and drives Death's Shadow into the stratosphere, while also bolstering Delve for Angler. I think Eldub mentioned that earlier.

Snuff Out is okay, but Dismember has been much better imho. Griselbrand and Gurmag are two key reasons to not play Snuff Out.

A resolved Chalice is a beating that you scoop to if you don't play Decay.

I love Stifle, but there is no room and it can be a weak strategy as well as a bad topdeck and I think there are better ways of interacting for this deck.

I really don't like snuff out: Not only does it not hit strix and angler which can be big problems, it's also very bad in the later stages of the game when you can't pay the 4 life since 4 mana is a loooot in this deck. Dismember not only kills angler, street wraith etc., but also can easily be cast for 2 or 3 mana when you're in a close racing situation.

I cut the 2 libraries for 2 reanimates because I wanted to try out that card, but I was NOT impressed with it. Sure, the times it worked it was great, but the only time I actually got the t1 street wraith was against Miracles while it was just stuck in my hand without good targets way too often for my liking. I very narrowly lost to both Miracles decks I played in that league, going 3-2 and really wishing I had some libraries (I won against Elves, S&S and MonoR painter). I'll try a similar list, but with 1 library and 1 deluge main next. Both cards are very good against decks I can otherwise struggle against, Miracles and Weenie strategies like D&T and Elves. Having a mainboard answer to TNN, Mirran Crusader and swarms of creatures that decay is too inefficient against or can't target is just great. Plus nobody expects the maindeck wrath from the delver deck xD

I don't like Berserk in a list with 4 mongooses since it's really only good against shadow, but if they have no removal for it I'm in a pretty good shape anyways, in general feels too much win-more to me. Similar to reanimate and stubborn denial it has an incredibly high ceiling, but also a very low floor which I personally don't like because you might unconsciously forget all the times it was bad, remembering that one time where you got to denial a blood moon or terminus or discarded an opponent's griselbrand before reanimating it.

I think a key to this deck (at least the way I'm playing it) is taking your times if you don't have a t1 delver, against other aggressive decks this also means fetching your basics and setting up: You have tons of stuff to trade 1-for-1 with which is exactly what you want because that way you can go to a low life total and/or get threshold, meaning when you're both at 2 lands on turn 4 it's great because now you can play a loose goose or a shadow. It also puts you into positions where you both have no more cards in hand and you drop a 7/7 basically saying "you better topdeck something good or lose on the spot".
Now, this of course only works with a version that has decays because you don't have to be afraid to lose the game on the spot to a counterbalance, chalice or ensnaring bridge.

Snuff out isn`t good. It`s unflexible, doesn`t hit opponent`s Angler and other big creatures. Further sometimes it`s uncastable, when you need a removel (sacraficing 4 life isn`t always possible in this deck, where you burning lifepoints really fast, approched to zero :wink:). Berserk is great is not win more, it`s just Upps I win the game out of nowhere. 2 aren`t necessary I think, but I would leaf it in as a 1-off, that`s not bad I think, with all the Cantrips your often able to find it, when needed.

Don`t know if it`s discussed before, but has someone considered good old Bob? It seems that he would fit perfectly in the deck, because his drawback, the lifeloss isn`t one for, it pushes our strategy forward. I mentioned it in the Slot of Street Wraith. Yes it slows down the deck a bit, but give you recovery, real card advantage which is nice against miracles and other controll I think, even like Library out of the board. And yes he dies to all but if a Swords would hit him I am happy with that, one less for my Shadow`s. Further we could cut the Reanimates and have + 2 room for other stuff like 3. Angler or 2. Berserk. I haven`t it tested so far, it was just an instant idea, so feel free to blame and hate me out :wink:, but I really love this deck and so I am exicted about improving it and still trying to make Shadows better and better over the time :smile:

Annother questions on the manabase; do you like the one :bg: mana (Bayou or Tomb) in the main, I have situations where I catched a Wasteland and then was topdecked it and was screwed from our main color U, but also had many situation were I wanted double :b: with :g:. For example casting Death`s Shadow protected with Thoughtseize. So what are your meanings about the right mana base?

Greetz

Sinkhole

I like one overgrown tomb alongside trop, breeding pool, usea and two watery grave. This deck is playing quite a lot of black spells and I really wanted 3 green lands to dodge wasteland. On the other side black on the first turn for thoughtseize can be quite important.

I don't like Bob for the reasons I don't like Bitterblossom: The lifeloss is uncontrolled which is really awkward when you're either at a low life total or racing. On the other side it's just really, really slow for an aggro deck. It could be great against combo for sure, but that's already the archetype we're best against. I could see it in a meta where Grixis control takes overhand, but reanimate seems just better there since Street Wraith can be a 1-mana TNN against them.

Honestly, Death's Shadow should be pushing through damage wherever possible. I played a few options at GP Richmond (side events and the main event): Shadow Rift and Apostle's Blessing.

Both were potent, and give you reach in the mirror, as well as against aggro and Swords-based decks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Michael Keller

Honestly, Death's Shadow should be pushing through damage wherever possible. I played a few options at GP Richmond (side events and the main event): Shadow Rift and Apostle's Blessing.

Both were potent, and give you reach in the mirror, as well as against aggro and Swords-based decks.

---

Those are pretty slick choices. I've been interested in Berserk, but I do really like Apostle's Blessing also.

If anyone feels up to writing a primer I would be happy to move you to Established.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dice_Box

If anyone feels up to writing a primer I would be happy to move you to Established.

---

I'll write something. Should I just post it in this thread?

What do you think about the new format staple Assasin`s Trophy? For a tempo deck it seems unplayable, because of the free land for our opponent, but we aren`t a real tempo deck in the first turns and maybe it`s playable in the board, provided that you are on a BUG list. Further if the card would see so much play is it valid, trying to incorporate a basic?

@aedrew: I am really looking forward to read your primer! :smile:

It's probably pretty good out of the board.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by aedrew

I'll write something. Should I just post it in this thread?

---

I know the OP so they can edit their top level post with your primer (and attribute it to you). Or a new thread can be created since the (g) has fallen by the wayside and the deck is pretty straight UB now.