[Deck] Aluren

I already tried Divert ages ago, and it's awful, at least here. You need one in hand so badly that it warps your starting hand and mulligans, just to be ineffective in the long term.

Of all the strategies I've tested against discard decks, the best one so far has been 1 Volrath's Stronghold and 1 Life from the Loam alongside Intuition and Witness. That means abandoning the combo temporarily and going to the late game, where you are stronger because you recur all the cards they have spent the entire game trying to nullify. I've seen some Pikula players boarding out Sinkholes because of that.

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Originally Posted by Nonex

I already tried Divert ages ago, and it's awful, at least here. You need one in hand so badly that it warps your starting hand and mulligans, just to be ineffective in the long term.

Of all the strategies I've tested against discard decks, the best one so far has been 1 Volrath's Stronghold and 1 Life from the Loam alongside Intuition and Witness. That means abandoning the combo temporarily and going to the late game, where you are stronger because you recur all the cards they have spent the entire game trying to nullify. I've seen some Pikula players boarding out Sinkholes because of that.

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Would you recommend running the engine in sideboard? like 1 Volrath and 1 loam in sb, as I already play 2 Witness maindeck?

I played them all maindeck, but I understand your reasons to not do so. 1 Stronghold and 1 Loam SB are ok to me. They are your hate cards against specific decks, after all.

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Originally Posted by kiblast

I realized that black based control is a very though matchup. From rock, the gate, to eva green. They cast a Tourach and our percentages of winning are lowered of 50%. So I thought of Divert.

Divert let us disrupt opponent's gameplan. Divert your Tourach.Yeah,GG. Divert your Thoughtseize and discard that Sinkhole (and they still lose 2 life...). Seriously, this card can wreck their whole gameplan and tutelate us from their menaces. While Spell Pierce can only do the latter, and discard can only do the first thing, Divert seems optimal in Aluren where every single resource must be well played and used at its best. Losing landrops due to Tourach is awful, losing your Harpy on turn 3 due to a Thoughtseize could ruin your match. Think about it and let me know what doyou think.

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[card]Misdirect[/card]

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Originally Posted by kiblast

Divert your Thoughtseize and discard that Sinkhole (and they still lose 2 life...). Seriously, this card can wreck their whole gameplan and tutelate us from their menaces.

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If you Divert their Thoughtseize back at them, they still get to choose which card to discard.

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Originally Posted by Iranon

If you Divert their Thoughtseize back at them, they still get to choose which card to discard.

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Yep, you're definitely right. I overlooked the misdirection effect. Still very nice though.

@Swoop: you were suggesting Misdirection? I'd like to try that, but the pitch cost is too much for a deck playing 4 fows already.
I think that the only playable answer is the ''1 Volrath's Stronghold and 1 Life from the Loam + Intuition and Witness'' suggested by Nonex. I'll test.

I used to play MD in SB. but I never boarded it :)))

Are there any additions to Aluren in this block?

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Originally Posted by swoop

Are there any additions to Aluren in this block?

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Phyrexian revoker? Maybe?

I'd play it only in versions with recruiter I think.

I'm pondering again on putting in a meddling mage to my recruiter version "proxy" deck.

could be usefull.

Dunno, revoker sounds cool, but i doubt he'll find use actually.

@kiblast:

I like your list and it is extremely similar to what I've played and a mix of those cards is probably what's best for recruiterless aluren.
The other way to go is the 4xHarpy 4x Selkie HedgeMage version that some german played just before deckcheck closed down. That was also good but played out a little differently relying more on the power of cards like Force of will and Lim-dul's vault which I dont think fit as well in the classic deck.

The only complaint on your list is the lack of birds of paradise. That little flier is the best 1 drop that exists for these decks.

On the mana base I like your philosophy, but I think you can go further. In my recruiter build I play the following 21 lands:

2 tropical
1 taiga
1 bayou
1 UG sea

1 swamp
3 forest
3 island

4 Misty Rainforest
4 verdant catacombs
1 polluted delta

And that's the reason why the deck actually has pretty good game versus goblins and merfolk.

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Originally Posted by gottfrid

The only complaint on your list is the lack of birds of paradise. That little flier is the best 1 drop that exists for these decks.

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I like bop but it has two problems:

Land - Brainstorm - oracle is far better

and its green, not blue/green.

@gottfried - I agree re BoP.

My current list uses these and is playing really well, with consistent T3/4 kills with Fow or Cabal therapy backup. There are also T2 kills, although a little Magical Christmas Land. I have found T1 BoP so good that I have played a 'fifth' in the form of a Noble Hierarch, which is obviously less good as it can't make B (or R). Having one of these T1 enables you to tear through your deck for either the combo or disruption - but I do play the recruiter version. My current list:

4 Brainstorm
4 Intuition
4 Aluren
4 Force of Will
4 Imperial Recruiter
4 Cabal Therapy (brutal with intuition and birds / noble hierarch)
1 Cavern Harpy
2 Dream Stalker
1 Stern Proctor (could be something else)
1 Parasitic Strix
2 Lim Dul's Vault
1 Eternal Witness
4 BoP
1 Noble Hierarch
3 Ponder
1 Polluted Delta
3 Verdant Cacatombs
1 Forest
1 Island
4 Tropical Island
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Bayou
1 Taiga
3 City of Traitors

Sideboard currently has 19 cards... but definitely includes the natrual order transformation package. I am playing the wekend after this and will probably run with 3 or 4 NO, 1 dryad arbor,1 progenitus, 1 terastodon, 1 bone shredder, 2 deathmark, 2 duress, 2 or 3 krosan grip. And just avoid dredge, or race it.

This is obviously very combo focussed, and yes is pretty much dead to a resolved counterbalance / top, let alone Gaddock Teeg game 1. But much like ANT (which I was playing before mystical was banned) it is a fairly brutal combo deck and one can't give in to the fear too much. After all any hate has to get through Fow, avoid therapy, and be in place by turn 3 or 4, so let's not panic!

Any thoughts or suggestions?

[QUOTE=Cacks;520739
1 Stern Proctor (could be something else)
[/QUOTE]

This could be Sedraxis Alchemist. I used it to great success in my build, but I was running raven familiar's so satisfying the blue requirement was fairly easy for me.

Hey Cacks!

I also found BoP so good I added one off hierarch and have been happy with it. Seems we reached the same conclusion independently. =)

My list is:

4 aluren
4 imperial recruiter
1 parastitic strix
1 cavern harpy
1 dream stalker
1 arctic merfolk
1 eternal witness
3 coiling oracle
2 wall of blossoms
1 noble hierarch
4 birds of paradise
4 brainstorm
4 ponder
4 cabal therapy
2 duress
2 intuition

2 tropical island
1 underground sea
1 taiga
1 bayou
1 swamp
3 forest
3 island
4 misty rainforest
4 verdant catacombs
1 polluted delta

SB:
3 tormod's crypt
4 disfigure
3 krosan grip
2 pithing needle
3 spell pierce


I don't think stern proctor or bone shredder are necessary in MD or SB.
If you intend to use a recruiter to get proctor you will need to find a new one to win. I generally think it's better to use the krosan grip a lot! I bring them in as soon as I suspect one of the following cards:

Pithing needle/chalice of the void/trinisphere/engineered plague/leyline of sanctity/pyrostatic pillar/sulfuric vortex/counterbalance/runed halo/solitary confinement/arcane laboratory/rule of law/aura of silence

Sometimes I board in krosan grip and it's dead but I find that doesn't matter because I usually win those matches anyway.

Disfigure is very important in the board I think. Good against goblins and sligh and necessary against zoo/gw postboard. needle is good as a complement to grip against counterTop and also good against decks with vial and wasteland/port
spell pierce and tormod's crypt is so we have a fighting chance against combo and dredge.

Basically apart from the sideboard our decks differ very little. You play FoW which I have replaced by 2 duress, a ponder and coiling oracles/wall of roots. You also play A LOT of tutors. Is it worth the clunkiness? I find that ponders and oracles make the deck play really smoothly and I consistently draw into the combopieces naturally while haveing more fodde for therapy and chumpblockers. I guess it's a tradeoff since it from time to time actually happen I dont find the combo in time and lose.
I don't like force since already with therapies and birds the blue count is too low. (you can never pitch harpy or strix and only sometimes merfolk or dream stalker) I really dislike the NO package SB since it occupies way to much space and still does not get around much hate.

With 4 anti hatebear cards in disfigure and 5 anti countertop in needle and grip I think the sideboard strategy is really consistent.

EDIT:
What do you think of the manabase?
Dont you lose a lot of games against wasteland,(I don't), and is city of traitors really any good?

@kkoie - I'd never thought of the alchemist, but you'r right I do need the blue.

@goffrid - our decks are very similar, but show a little distinction in emphasis. I've gone pretty much all out for speed / disruption, whereas you have a little more by way of consistency. Although I used to play aluren when it was legal (and good) in extended, and so am therefore well familiar with chump blocking forever or even winning with 'draft deck beatdown' when the combo goes wrong, I prefer the more inherently powerful (but yes, less consistent) approach in legacy. But I can see the merits either way. I tried coiling oracles a while ago, and almost loved them, but also found that often your turn 2 was little more than 'cycle a 1/1', which wasn't so hot. I do love my glut of tutors, and it can get clunky draws, but frequently can just explode too. They also make a lot more sense if one runs city of traitors. I only tried these out as I'd seen that various (former) pro players (aka Cedric Phillips) used them a while ago, and (rather contrary to my expectations) I find them the nuts. T1 brainstorm/ponder/therapy, T2 intuition, turn 3 win is very frequently doable. Obviously one has to mulligan a bit more, but not as much as you might fear - and you can quite happily do a T3 win with Fow or double therapy backup from a mulligan to 5 anyway! I'd strongly advise trying them, but if you were to do so, do it in a shell like mine. In your build they hardly help cast anything save aluren, and would just get in the way! You are clearly aiming for a slightly longer game (if only a turn or two)

On the other hand, your mana base is sooo wasteland resistant!

And I am sure I am being stupid, but what is the advantage of arctic merfolk over dream stalker? Is it just the point of power? I realise that the bounce is a cost, rather than going on the stack, but when does that come up - a good player with some way of attacking your combo will either try to get you when you play your first IR or (mostly) when cavern harpy is on the stack, not when you are casting dream stalker / arctic merfolk.

Arctic Merfolk by itself sucks as much as Dream Stalker, but at least you can hardcast it with no drawbacks from turn 2 onwards. The fact that nothing except Meddling Mage interferes with its effect is also a bonus. My Recruiter versions have always had 2 Arctic Merfolks and no Dream Stalkers. The less things passing through the stack, the better.

Thanks Nonex. I often end up pitching a stalker to Fow, and find the fact that dream stalker is 'immune' to one piece of burn (as opposed to path or swords) useful in itself. But I take your point.

Tested again my version of Aluren with 3 recs 2 int/2impulse and rest is basically old school Kiblast version.

Beat aggro loam 3:0 solidly, and 2:1 over PT Junk. (presb) post SB they can/could use Krosan Grip only.

Again strongest parts were manowar, ldv, brainstorm, coiling oracle and FoW.

Rec are too good, but not worth 1 000$

the +1 power (sometimes) of arctic merfolk is not nearly as relevant as being able to play it on t2 as a guy to sac to therapy now or later. the only reason Im not running two is double bolt or stupid things like volcanic fallout. The dream stalker is still a necessary evil