[Deck] Dragon Stompy

Bonfire of the Damned and Zealous Conscripts are the two cards that interest me so far in the new set, and maybe even Reforge the Soul to a lesser extent. Tibalt doesn't seem to fit the shell too well though. Bonfire interests me the most of them all so far, and I don't think we can simply write it off before doing much testing. Thinking about it, we might be just about the only deck in Legacy that can hard cast it for its XXR cost effectively. Here's to hoping for an awesome 2R costing creature!

-3 Things
+3 Reforge the Soul

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Reforge the Soul 3RR
Each player discards his or her hand, then draws seven cards.
Miracle 1R

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I most DEFINITELY approve of this card. Man, WotC is definitely giving some love to Red this set, even if most of the cards thus far haven't been suitable for DS. The two key weaknesses with this deck have always been lack of decent targeted removal and lack of cantrips. Well, this card most definitely resolves the 2nd issue. Albeit the 3RR is somewhat expensive, however this deck has already proven we can reasonably cast Arc Slogger when necessary, so it is quite reasonable to hard cast this card when necessary.

The primary issue to keep in mind, however, is making sure that A) We pack the necessary hate in our SB for the meta, and B) We use this card smartly, not just blindly when we want 7 cards. Its important to remember that Maverick runs a full suite of threats. Now, while nearly their entire board is dedicated white creatures (Hierarch/Ooze being the only real exceptions) Anarchy is really our only solid answer to a board (I'm excluding Pyrokinesis/Flametongue Kavu, and Combust). Meaning that if we don't luck out on the draw we've potentially drawn them into either threats or removal.
Its also important to be wary when playing against UR/RUG Delver-Tempo that we don't provide them with the burn they require to kill us. Afterall, many lists are running 6-8+ burn spells with x4 Snapcaster for redundancy.

This card, however, most definitely shows promise in DS and I plan to playtest it promptly.

Forlorn Egoist

New land makes Chalice a lot weaker.

To be honest, the printing of the new land makes me kind of want to quit MTG after playing off and on since 1993.
I just realized it's been almost 20 years. Wow...

I wouldn't freak out about Cavern of Souls too much. It only weakens Chalice as much as it strengthens Moon effects.

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Originally Posted by whienot

I wouldn't freak out about Cavern of Souls too much. It only weakens Chalice as much as it strengthens Moon effects.

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I was also initially disappointed by the cavern's possible effect on DS but I had not thought of the Moon effects and now I am happy again

Well done Sir!

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Originally Posted by whienot

I wouldn't freak out about Cavern of Souls too much. It only weakens Chalice as much as it strengthens Moon effects.

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Indeed, and tribal decks (the decks that mostly benefit from this land) usually ran aeter vial anyway. Which is more problematic as moon didn't fix that + vial is better against trinisphere than the land will ever be.

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Originally Posted by heroicraptor

-3 Things
+3 Reforge the Soul

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Might it be time to switch up the lock pieces so they really can't capitalize on the draw-7 by using cards like Aether Flash?

The issue with Aether Flash is that Unless you draw into a rather accomodating hand chances are the opponent will of had time to drop creatures before Flash comes out (Mom, Thalia, Hiearch, Pridemage, Ooze, Stoneforge, even possibly KotR). That having been said, as all of the creatures with exception to Knight will ETB as 1 of 2 toughness creatures, Flash isn't entirely unreasonable later.

I've even been looking at Cursed Totem as a replacement for either my 3spheres or my Moons as this card can easily be cast off a Sol land T1 and it shuts off all relevant creatures in Maverick, and even has utility if you can't auto-drop it T1-2.

Forlorn Egoist

Use the Werewolf list and name humans -> Uncounterable moons and critters ^^

@ Gui:

I've nothing against the Werewolf list however the primary problems with running the land in said list are thus: Firstly, We're already running 8 nonbasics not to mention Moon effects, so not only would we be further opening ourselves up to nonbasic hate our own Moon effects would negate the land. Secondly, albeit counters are slightly more prevalent ala U/W Stoneblade/RUG-Tempo/UR Delver, they aren't so popular that I honestly consider counter suites our major priority. If we are going to lose against any of the DTB it will be, in my opinion, either due to RUG burning us to death or Maverick dropping too many threats.

If we honestly hope to survive this meta our primary goal should be, imo, to find ways of dealing with Maverick as that, ultimately, will be our Everest to climb. Even with burn Chalice @1/our creatures do a pretty good job of racing RUG tempo, we are already adept at handling Dredge/Solidarity, thusly finding ways to negate the Maverick's creatures (either by killing them or shutting off abilities) should be our primary focus.

EDIT: Y'know what I just realized? If Maverick (a deck filled with 1 and 2 drops) is such a big concern, why don't we consider Ratchet Bomb/Powder Keg once again? After all, nixes all of their permanants while leaving ours untouched, they are easily cast off Sol lands, and it is the best board reset we could ask for after Anarchy. Albeit it dies to Qasali, hover a Chalice @ 1 helps to negate GSZ and being as they only run 2 or so (with some bolder lists not even running GSZ) I definitely think we should consider returning to Bomb/Keg.

Note that in the context of the meta I think Keg would be the better option. Albeit it can't hit enchantments or planeswalkers, however I think this is a small sacrifice to pay in exchange for letting us pop the Keg in response to an attempted disenchant by the opponent (which we couldn't do if they got us off guard when we put a charge counter on the bomb).

Forlorn Egoist

"Chalice @ 1 helps to negate GSZ"

Only if they go for Dryad Arbor. While an X spell is on the stack, the X counts in CMC.

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Originally Posted by heroicraptor

"Chalice @ 1 helps to negate GSZ"

Only if they go for Dryad Arbor. While an X spell is on the stack, the X counts in CMC.

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Yeah.... thanks for catching that. o.O

Well, I think I'll definitely plan on taking DS to my Starcity this Saturday. What irks me, however, is that because I won't get the cards on time I can't play my MUD build so I have to go a different list.

As I've stated earlier the primary goal of what I am trying to metagame is Maverick. I am confident I can handle all other DTB including random decks, so Maverick is the contender. Here are a few cards I am contemplating for the MU:


Anarchy
Powder Keg
Ratchet Bomb
Firespout
Cinder Cloud
Cursed Totem
Nevinyrral's Disk
Sulfur Elemental

I'm still searching through my rather elephantine collection of cards but these are just a couple I've pulled out.

Anarchy is obviously already in the sideboard.
Powder Keg most likely will find a slot as well as its an affordable board clear (I prefer this over Ratchet because if they have removal such as Qasali I can at least Sac the Keg in response if we assumed the Ratched was tapped).
Firespout is a card I once loathed considering at the point it was popular I was sporting a Hellbent list meaning this card nixed all of my creatures as well but since obtaining Shatterskull/Moltensteel/Lodestone/BSkull I consider the effects of Spout to be essentially one-sided now. I may very well even MD this...
Cinder Cloud is hella expensive at 3RR and is the least likely candidate however noting how big KotR/Ooze can get this, assuming Mom isn't able to shield, will not only kill a creature but also hit the opponent for an average of 4/5+ damage.
Cursed Totem has similar arguments to 3sphere in that its the most amazing piece of hate you can play provided you drop it T1/2.
Nevinyrral's Disk, an EDH favorite, has possibilities as you can activate a board reset earlier than Keg/Bomb, however the issue being is that it ETB tapped so they can respond with a Qasali [b]AND[b] it removes all of your artifacts, not just 1 specific CMC like Keg/Bomb.
Sulfur Elemental seems nice in that he auto-kills Mom/Thalia although I am unsure if this is enough to warrant deckspace.

I'm still messing around with how I intend to beat the Maverick MU. I have some great card selections, but none of them are really auto-includes. I will have to force through a great deal of playtesting.

I am definitely intrigued by Totem as it shuts of ALL creatures in Maverick which leads me to consider taking out Revokers for it. I know, this seems like blasphemy as I am removing my ability to answer cards like Deed as well as certain combo pieces. However, looking at the meta what are the decks which have been popping up most prominently? Maverick, U/W Stoneblade, UR Delver/Canadian Thresh, Combo (Reanimator/Dredge/Solidarity) with some misc. stuff. Of all these decks the most prominent abilities we need to negate are creature abilities which Totem handles quite nicely. As a DS player I understand quite fully the power of Revoker not only in the utility of his Needle effect but in having an extra beater, however, its also important for us to look at the field and figure out exactly which cards we're afraid of, which NEED to be dealt with, and which we can play around.
Looking at the DTB and the Starcity deck reports I think its most important we deal with creature threats of which Totem handles in one fell swoop. True, we're losing our ability hit cards such as equipment (which is rampant in the meta) but that is the reason my list (as well as many others) also run Shattering Spree.

I'm not saying this is necessarily the route I will take for this Saturday however as I am modifying my deck I am looking at each and every card choice and attempting to decide exactly how important it is and frankly its Revokers turn. So, please feel free to provide arguments for or against its removal. I wish to know exactly which cards you consider mainstream that can't be answered by other hate we run or played around.

Forlorn Egoist

4x Falmetongue Kavu
4x Umezawa's Jitte
4x Anarchy (Sideboard)

=Better Maverick matchup.

Also, I've been thinking that Risky Bet might be better than Reforge the Soul. Fervent Cathar also interests me a little.

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Originally Posted by Zupponn

4x Falmetongue Kavu
4x Umezawa's Jitte
4x Anarchy (Sideboard)

=Better Maverick matchup.

Also, I've been thinking that Risky Bet might be better than Reforge the Soul. Fervent Cathar also interests me a little.

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How did I forgot FTK? Man, I think I may just run those MD over those friggin Shatterskulls.

Risky Bet definitely seems like a rather reasonable card for drawing.

@ Fervent Cathar: We kind of already have creatures which do that if you're interested: Goblin Rimerunner and Goblin Shortcutter. Albeit neither of these two has Haste, however at least as far as the Rimerunner goes I think there are few enough situations where Haste would be that relevant.

Forlorn Egoist

Hey guys,

I've been inactive after taking a break from mtg last year, but holy crap. wizards seems to be doing DS some big favors with this new set. Yes, chalice is significantly weakened, but malignus, archwing dragon, bonfire of the damned, and reforge the soul all contribute to really interesting additions that could make dragon stompy fairly strong. plus, uncounterable moons definitely shifts some matchups back into our favor.

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Originally Posted by ForlornEgoist

How did I forgot FTK? Man, I think I may just run those MD

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I have 4 MD and with the Meta the way it is I think it is a must. They help shore up many tough match ups like Maverick.

Here's what I've been running for a little while now, and it seems to be doing well in this rough meta:

4x Flametongue Kavu
4x Rakdos Pit Dragon
4x Magus of the Moon
4x Simian Spirit Guide
4x Lord of Shatterskull Pass

4x Blood Moon
2x Seething Song

4x Umezawa's Jitte
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Trinisphere
4x Chrome Mox

4x City of Traitors
4x Ancient Tomb
10x Mountain

Sideboard:
4x Anarchy
4x Pyrokinesis
4x Phyrexian Revoker
3x Manriki-Gusari

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Originally Posted by Zupponn

Here's what I've been running for a little while now, and it seems to be doing well in this rough meta:
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I ran a very similar list in some tournaments with decent results too. have u tried out moltensteel in place of RPD? if so, do u prefer RPD a lot more?

Yeah, I've tried out Moltensteel, but I really have little love for it. RPD is just more explosive and doesn't cost life which can be the deciding factor in games, especially when we're also running Ancient Tomb. Others here have tried Moltensteel and like him over RPD, so it's really a personal preference.